Possible major blow for Huawei Smartphones

[Tsepz]

I said it before, there's a whole lot of hypocrisy around all of this and it has become even more evident in the last few days.

 

[michael9891]

It was always going to get resolved within the 3 month extension. Now to see what the Mate 30 Pro will bring.

I'd be more concerned about Trumps comments regarding end to end encryption.

 

[Healer Flame]

that anyone takes this Trump serious is beyond me.
Trump is, imho, (one of) the most unreliable world leaders, as well as business men.

First let sh*ts loads of outlets spread news about spying and other ''dangerous stuff'' and all of the sudden on a Saturday we start doing business again with this company, as if nothing happened.

No, this US president is an absolute joke. I would feel embarased/ashamed to have a president like him.

If tomorrow Trump starts a ''spying''-campaign towards the company of Samsung (like he obvious did with Hauwei the last few months) ; any time later and half of US would believe him and stop buying Samsung smartphones.
He just needs to use the proper news outlets to put out garbage about Samsung.
He has THAT much power, that's quite scaring (and dangerous the whole world!!)

resume:

this whole circus has to do with money ans money alone. NOTHING (like security) else!

Its regretting now days such

that anyone takes this Trump serious is beyond me.
Trump is, imho, (one of) the most unreliable world leaders, as well as business men.

First let sh*ts loads of outlets spread news about spying and other ''dangerous stuff'' and all of the sudden on a Saturday we start doing business again with this company, as if nothing happened.

No, this US president is an absolute joke. I would feel embarased/ashamed to have a president like him.

If tomorrow Trump starts a ''spying''-campaign towards the company of Samsung (like he obvious did with Hauwei the last few months) ; any time later and half of US would believe him and stop buying Samsung smartphones.
He just needs to use the proper news outlets to put out garbage about Samsung.
He has THAT much power, that's quite scaring (and dangerous the whole world!!)

resume:

this whole circus has to do with money ans money alone. NOTHING (like security) else!

On the other hands Trumps has made the biggest advertisement for Huawei. This saga will probably benefit Huawei in many ways.

 

[Healer Flame]

I thought so

https://www.businessinsider.com.au/...giving-huawei-free-publicity-2019-5?r=US&IR=T

 

[jamezr]

Huawei tentatively allowed to continue dealing with US companies again

It looks most likely that Trump was advised that the ban would do just as much, if not more, damage to American companies as it would to Huawei, and damaging China wasn’t worth the trade-off to the Googles and Intels of the world. However, this ban has already done some damage to Huawei’s fiscal year, and the impact on their brand is certainly going to take some time to recover

https://www.talkandroid.com/341455-huawei-tentatively-allowed-to-continue-dealing-with-us-companies-again/?utm_source=feedburner-ta&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed:+AndroidNewsGoogleAndroidForums+(TalkAndroid)

 

[mclld]

Huawei being allowed to be sold here is good news for everyone regardless of what phone you prefer. Who wouldnt want these companies to keep one upping each other?? That only makes them all work hard and advance

 

[jamezr]

The truth always comes out eventually



Huawei Personnel Worked With China’s Military on Research Projects

Several Huawei Technologies Co. employees have collaborated on research projects with Chinese armed forces personnel, indicating closer ties to the country’s military than previously acknowledged by the smartphone and networking powerhouse.


https://www.bloomberg.com/news/arti...rked-with-china-military-on-research-projects

 

[JPack]

The truth always comes out eventually



Huawei Personnel Worked With China’s Military on Research Projects

Several Huawei Technologies Co. employees have collaborated on research projects with Chinese armed forces personnel, indicating closer ties to the country’s military than previously acknowledged by the smartphone and networking powerhouse.


https://www.bloomberg.com/news/arti...rked-with-china-military-on-research-projects

Another double standard clickbait article from Bloomberg. I guess their credibility can’t sink any further since the Supermicro/Apple article.

Microsoft, Amazon, and Google have signed billions of dollars of contracts with DoD/Pentagon. Not a peep but when Huawei does it, it’s treason! LOL.

 

[jamezr]

Another double standard clickbait article from Bloomberg. I guess their credibility can’t sink any further since the Supermicro/Apple article.

Microsoft, Amazon, and Google have signed billions of dollars of contracts with DoD/Pentagon. Not a peep but when Huawei does it, it’s treason! LOL.

Not exactly..... Huawei has denied having ANY ties to the Chinese government. The other companies you mentioned make no such claim.

 

[JPack]

Not exactly..... Huawei has denied having ANY ties to the Chinese government. The other companies you mentioned make no such claim.

“In addition, researchers sometimes put their employer’s name on papers without notifying the company, or wait till the paper comes out before doing. That’s because there’s a good chance some papers may never get published.”​

“In the U.S. they have similar arrangements as well. The U.S. has military grants,” Wong said. “There are many sources of funding, including from the military for research.”
​

Much ado about nothing. Researchers have multiple jobs and write papers for multiple employers. I’m sure this never happens in the U.S.

 

[Tsepz]

“In addition, researchers sometimes put their employer’s name on papers without notifying the company, or wait till the paper comes out before doing. That’s because there’s a good chance some papers may never get published.”​

“In the U.S. they have similar arrangements as well. The U.S. has military grants,” Wong said. “There are many sources of funding, including from the military for research.”
​

Much ado about nothing. Researchers have multiple jobs and write papers for multiple employers. I’m sure this never happens in the U.S.

 

[jamezr]

“In addition, researchers sometimes put their employer’s name on papers without notifying the company, or wait till the paper comes out before doing. That’s because there’s a good chance some papers may never get published.”​

“In the U.S. they have similar arrangements as well. The U.S. has military grants,” Wong said. “There are many sources of funding, including from the military for research.”
​

Much ado about nothing. Researchers have multiple jobs and write papers for multiple employers. I’m sure this never happens in the U.S.

Again...not exactly.... The Huawei CEO has deep ties to the Chinese military. His employees worked with the Chinese military for 10 years for 10 different projects. What Huawei didn't know? C'mon.... They knew the whole time. So they denied the whole thing? What did you expect them to say?

These weren't just researchers working for grant money....but Huawei employees


Then the research format and grants are totally different in the US than China.
The US has an OPEN academic environment...China does not.
Then it is very well known that corporations like Huawei have very tight control over its employees.
They are very strict and controlling of their employees. Now to claim they didn't know.......

Huawei workers have reportedly collaborated with China's military on at least 10 research projects without the company's knowledge. Employees of the embattled Chinese telecommunications equipment maker worked with parts of the People's Liberation Army on projects linked to areas such as artificial intelligence and radio communications over the past decade, Bloomberg reported Wednesday.

 

[JPack]

Again...not exactly.... The Huawei CEO has deep ties to the Chinese military. His employees worked with the Chinese military for 10 years for 10 different projects. What Huawei didn't know? C'mon.... They knew the whole time. So they denied the whole thing? What did you expect them to say?

These weren't just researchers working for grant money....but Huawei employees


Then the research format and grants are totally different in the US than China.
The US has an OPEN academic environment...China does not.
Then it is very well known that corporations like Huawei have very tight control over its employees.
They are very strict and controlling of their employees. Now to claim they didn't know.......

So you've gone back to the talking points of the hawks.

Ren Zhengfei has "deep" ties to the military even though he was a technologist without a rank?

Huawei employs double the number of employees compared to Google. Huawei knew the actions of each of their 180,000 employees, including terminated employees?

You realize researchers work for money? They will put their employers names on papers often without their knowledge in order to promote themselves.

 

[ramram55]

Ren Zhengfei has "deep" ties to the military even though he was a technologist without a rank?

CEO Ren himself a son of teacher, under Mao he was treated as a outcast in the military, as the 'undesirable' during Cultural Revolution, his military rank did not qualify him as a cook, so he was sent to China Northern provinces to work on network. I believer he is wary of the leadership too.
[doublepost=1562084841][/doublepost]Watch out those who has Swiss bank account, the Chinese is after you,

The US has expressed concern over the use of Chinese technology in Switzerland, suggesting it may be used for espionage, reports the Sonntagszeitung newspaper.
https://www.swissinfo.ch/eng/us-chi...o-drop-chinese-telecom-giant-huawei-/44830056

 

[jamezr]

So you've gone back to the talking points of the hawks.

Ren Zhengfei has "deep" ties to the military even though he was a technologist without a rank?

Huawei employs double the number of employees compared to Google. Huawei knew the actions of each of their 180,000 employees, including terminated employees?

You realize researchers work for money? They will put their employers names on papers often without their knowledge in order to promote themselves.

So you have gone to the party line talking points......

These employees were still working for Huawei when they were doing research for the Chinese military.
You do realize that Huawei has very tight control over their people. Especially people in high places with this kind of information.

You do realize that the Chinese government has repeatedly stepped in to promote Huawei over the years as far as internal use of Huawei products and forcing other countries to use Huawei products or face the wrath of the Chinese government in China as far as tariffs and so forth.

China keeps very tight control over internal companies...and external investments as well.
Here is one such example....

Marriott fired an employee in Nebraska at China’s request because he had accidentally liked a post from a Tibetan separatist group that praised Marriott for naming Tibet as an independent country in a survey.

https://foreignpolicy.com/2018/10/11/if-the-u-s-doesnt-control-corporate-power-china-will/

Sorry but it is very hard to imagine a country that has this tight a control over internal and foreign investments would not know what Huawei and its employees (researchers) were doing. It would be just as easy then make the small leap that this was directed by the Chinese government and military. That Huawei and the military shared information after denying this publically.

There already is proof that Huawei leaves intentional backdoors in it network devices to spy
Given the ties to the military....the rest is easy to figure out.

 

[JPack]

So you have gone to the party line talking points......

These employees were still working for Huawei when they were doing research for the Chinese military.
You do realize that Huawei has very tight control over their people. Especially people in high places with this kind of information.

You do realize that the Chinese government has repeatedly stepped in to promote Huawei over the years as far as internal use of Huawei products and forcing other countries to use Huawei products or face the wrath of the Chinese government in China as far as tariffs and so forth.

China keeps very tight control over internal companies...and external investments as well.
Here is one such example....

https://foreignpolicy.com/2018/10/11/if-the-u-s-doesnt-control-corporate-power-china-will/

Sorry but it is very hard to imagine a country that has this tight a control over internal and foreign investments would not know what Huawei and its employees (researchers) were doing. It would be just as easy then make the small leap that this was directed by the Chinese government and military. That Huawei and the military shared information after denying this publically.

There already is proof that Huawei leaves intentional backdoors in it network devices to spy
Given the ties to the military....the rest is easy to figure out.

Just asking for proof. All you've offered so far are hand waving arguments.

The U.S. gov is really good at hacking, so where's the proof of financial links between Huawei and the Chinese government? Everything boils down to money.

So far, there's zero proof of backdoors. Huawei has vulnerabilities, just like Apple does. If you want to label vulnerabilities as "intentional backdoors" that's your choice.

 

[jamezr]

Just asking for proof. All you've offered so far are hand waving arguments.

The U.S. gov is really good at hacking, so where's the proof of financial links between Huawei and the Chinese government? Everything boils down to money.

So far, there's zero proof of backdoors. Huawei has vulnerabilities, just like Apple does. If you want to label vulnerabilities as "intentional backdoors" that's your choice.

read the thread....I have posted proof. I have shown enough evidence....whether you chose to see it is up to you. There doesn't have to be a financial link...there are data sharing going on between them. China as a country demands control over its people and censors information. One would have be extremely naive to think it doesn't exact the same control over business as well.

Did you see this today?
China has been secretly installing spyware on some tourists’ Android phones
Border agents in the region have been requiring tourists to hand over their phones and passcodes before entering, according to the reports. The agents will then disappear with the phones in order to snoop through them. For iPhones, that reportedly includes plugging them into a machine that scans through the phone’s contents. For Android phones, it goes further, with border agents installing a spyware app that scans the phone and collects data.
https://www.theverge.com/2019/7/2/20679053/china-spyware-tourists-android-phones-xinjiang

 

[JPack]

read the thread....I have posted proof. I have shown enough evidence....whether you chose to see it is up to you. There doesn't have to be a financial link...there are data sharing going on between them. China as a country demands control over its people and censors information. One would have be extremely naive to think it doesn't exact the same control over business as well.

Did you see this today?
China has been secretly installing spyware on some tourists’ Android phones
Border agents in the region have been requiring tourists to hand over their phones and passcodes before entering, according to the reports. The agents will then disappear with the phones in order to snoop through them. For iPhones, that reportedly includes plugging them into a machine that scans through the phone’s contents. For Android phones, it goes further, with border agents installing a spyware app that scans the phone and collects data.
https://www.theverge.com/2019/7/2/20679053/china-spyware-tourists-android-phones-xinjiang

Thanks, so no proof. Certainly not enough to satisfy the Europeans either.

 

[Tsepz]

Thanks, so no proof. Certainly not enough to satisfy the Europeans either.

Nope.

It gets more hilarious though....
Phone and laptop searches at US border 'quadruple'

Searches of travellers' laptops and mobile phones at the US border have nearly quadrupled since 2015, digital rights groups have claimed in a federal lawsuit.

The searches are often warrantless and therefore "unconstitutional", allege the plaintiffs.

The lawsuit says that border agents are attempting to enforce laws beyond their purview of customs and immigration.

However, US officials say the agents do have a wide investigative remit.

There were 33,295 searches of travellers' devices in the 2018 financial year.

They were carried out for a broad range of reasons - including intelligence gathering, tax enforcement and criminal investigations - according to the rights groups EFF and American Civil Liberties Union (ACLU), which filed the lawsuit.

'Fellow travellers targeted'

It is also alleged that friends, relatives or associates of travellers targeted for searches were often told to surrender their devices.

"The government cannot use the pretext of the 'border' to make an end run around the Constitution," the ACLU said in a statement.

Government agencies appear to be taking a different view of the situation.

https://www.bbc.com/news/technology-48118558


......

 

[Tsepz]

ANYWAY.....now that we have concluded that China and the USA are pretty much doing the same things and the endless hypocrisy in this topic, let’s move on....



Back to the topic at hand.


When Huawei got hit, everyone got hit it seems:

Samsung's chip business was hit hard by U.S. ban on Huawei

According to Reuters, Samsung Electronics is expected to release a preliminary look at its second-quarter earnings report this coming Friday. The numbers should show that the South Korean manufacturer was negatively affected by the U.S. ban that prevented Huawei from obtaining U.S. parts and software. Samsung's shipments of memory chips to Huawei were down sharply during the three month period that covers April through June. This has led to a backup in supplies of Sammy's DRAM and NAND chips forcing the manufacturer to cut prices in order to move its inventory. Since 67% of Samsung's profit comes from selling chips, Huawei's purchases have a lot of influence over how well the manufacturer does in any given quarter.

https://www.phonearena.com/news/Sam...ort-huge-drop-in-Q2-operating-income_id117245

 

[jamezr]

Thanks, so no proof. Certainly not enough to satisfy the Europeans either.

too lazy to find it or just hasn't even READ the thread lol

Here is the proof everyone said didn't exist....

“Summary
Huawei has been accused of maintaining backdoor access to networks, but until now, little evidence has been available to support or refute those claims. Finite State’s automated system analyzed more than 1.5 million unique files embedded within 9,936 firmware images supporting 558 different products within Huawei’s enterprise networking product lines — many of which could be used within the core of 5G networks. Our analysis looked for risks including hard-coded backdoor credentials, unsafe use of cryptographic keys, indicators of insecure software development practices, and the presence of known and 0-day vulnerabilities.
The results of the analysis show that Huawei devices quantitatively pose a high risk to their users. In virtually all categories we examined, Huawei devices were found to be less secure than those from other vendors making similar devices.”

https://finitestate.io/wp-content/uploads/2019/06/Finite-State-SCA1-Final.pdf

 

[jamezr]

ANYWAY.....now that we have concluded that China and the USA are pretty much doing the same things and the endless hypocrisy in this topic, let’s move on....



Back to the topic at hand.


When Huawei got hit, everyone got hit it seems:

Samsung's chip business was hit hard by U.S. ban on Huawei

https://www.phonearena.com/news/Sam...ort-huge-drop-in-Q2-operating-income_id117245

Ohhhh...the hypocrisy of it all!! So this thread was about Huawei copying and stealing other companies IP and spying and back doors and such YOU said did not exist. I have posted exact information that proves what I have said.


You on the other hand have tried in vain to say..... It's ok if Huawei steals from other companies because other companies have done it... Maybe you should start a thread about that then?


Now when they have been caught leaving intentional back doors so they can spy.....its ok because the US does it....

WOW...nice way to try to deflect! Nice way to try to change the topic!


You asked for proof and I have provided proof.....
You just don't want to believe the truth......
Your brand loyalty and Huawei fanboyism has clouded your judgement

 

[JPack]

too lazy to find it or just hasn't even READ the thread lol

Here is the proof everyone said didn't exist....

“Summary
Huawei has been accused of maintaining backdoor access to networks, but until now, little evidence has been available to support or refute those claims. Finite State’s automated system analyzed more than 1.5 million unique files embedded within 9,936 firmware images supporting 558 different products within Huawei’s enterprise networking product lines — many of which could be used within the core of 5G networks. Our analysis looked for risks including hard-coded backdoor credentials, unsafe use of cryptographic keys, indicators of insecure software development practices, and the presence of known and 0-day vulnerabilities.
The results of the analysis show that Huawei devices quantitatively pose a high risk to their users. In virtually all categories we examined, Huawei devices were found to be less secure than those from other vendors making similar devices.”

https://finitestate.io/wp-content/uploads/2019/06/Finite-State-SCA1-Final.pdf

No one is responding to you because you clearly don't know the difference between a vulnerability and a back door.

Copying and pasting the same thing again doesn't help.

 

[jamezr]

No one is responding to you because you clearly don't know the difference between a vulnerability and a back door.

Copying and pasting the same thing again doesn't help.

you said it didn't exist......

Then it goes to show you have no clue what all that means.....

You did not follow the link and read the data.....

You can leave an unpatched exploit by design so you can use it. Nice way to leave a backdoor...when you know it is there and unpatched.
This is a well known way to compromise systems.

Through analysis of device firmware, we discovered that there were hundreds of cases of potential backdoor vulnerabilities

improper default configurations that could allow Huawei or a malicious attacker to covertly access a user’s device.

our research uncovered a substantial lack of secure development practices resulting in significant numbers of vulnerabilities. In some cases, engineers chose to use 20-year-old versions of software libraries rather than current, secure alternatives. Huawei engineers wrote insecure functions with misleading names indicating that the function was safe from conditions such as buffer overflows when in fact it was not.

https://finitestate.io/wp-content/uploads/2019/06/Finite-State-SCA1-Final.pdf

So either Huawei software and hardware engineers are complete idiots or they leave these things on purpose.

Backdoor Access Vulnerabilities Out of all the firmware images analyzed, 55% had at least one potential backdoor. These backdoor access vulnerabilities allow an attacker with knowledge of the firmware and/or with a corresponding cryptographic key to log into the device. • 29% of all devices tested had at least one default username and password stored in the firmware, enabling access to the device if administrators don’t change these credentials. • We identified 76 instances of firmware where the device was, by default, configured such that a root user with a hard-coded password could log in over the SSH protocol, providing for default backdoor access. • 8 different firmware images were found to have pre-computed authorized_keys hard coded into the firmware, enabling backdoor access to the holder of the private key. • 424 different firmware images contained hardcoded private SSH keys, which can enable a man-in-the-middle to manipulate and/or decrypt traffic going to the device

2. Pattern of Security Flaws Huawei devices were shown to have a high number of known security vulnerabilities. Despite the fact that many of these vulnerabilities have been public knowledge for years, Huawei continues to make firmware updates without addressing them. These vulnerabilities increase the likelihood that attackers can compromise these devices. •

 

[JPack]

you said it didn't exist......

Then it goes to show you have no clue what all that means.....

You did not follow the link and read the data.....

You can leave an unpatched exploit by design so you can use it. Nice way to leave a backdoor...when you know it is there and unpatched.
This is a well known way to compromise systems.

The Finite State report was written in June 2019. Yet the report uses Huawei router firmwares dated 2016 and 2017.

Yup, it's an "unpatched" exploit. LOL.

You keep posting click bait links thinking it will fool people. Not sure what your real aim is.

Do you always post stuff without reading it?