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Preliminary Impressions of Nikon Z7 Mirorless
- Thread starter HDFan
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True, but it was the only FF mirrorless in town when it came out. The Z doesn’t have that luxury.
True and if the EOS-R appears next week and it is a good one, then they may actually be in trouble.
I don’t know how much trouble they may or may not be in next week, but their three year road map is not awe inspiring.
I thought the EOS-R was still a few months out.
I wonder why it takes so long to develop and release a lens? Surely there is nothing Nikon and Canon don't know about lens development.
No kidding! At least throw out a few of the majors:
24 f1.4 or maybe 35 f1.4
50 f1.4
85 f1.4 or the 105 f1.4
Would it be that hard to 'convert' existing lenses? Even if you can't roll out the zoom trinity immediately, have them on the road map early.
Hmm, imagine if they offered those existing, high end lenses converted to Z mount at cost parity to the F mount. Change the focus point to account for the shorter flange distance and shorten the lens a little. Even build them on a demand basis to order to test the waters. Apparently, they sold out and back-ordered both Z models for a couple of months, so SOMEONE was excited.
Oh there's plenty of excitement. I'd imagine every camera purchased will also have bought the adaptor.
If I were to speculate it is that Nikon wanted to release affordable lenses first. If I were them, I would have added one unicorn lens to the initial line-up, though. A lens that has the potential to become a legend in addition to more down to earth lenses for mere mortals. Canon went the other direction and released perhaps too many unique, but expensive lenses (if the leaks are to be believed). To me the gem will be their 28-70 mm f/2 lens: if it is priced like a f/2.8 standard zoom, they have a winner on their hands.
I think this is Nikon's (and Canon's) biggest problem: apart from offering ergonomics that appeal to existing customers, they offer nothing groundbreaking and are fairly conservative. The biggest problem IMHO is mass appeal, though: they insisted on going full frame and thereby priced a huge portion of potential customers out of the market. Nor did they opt for larger than full frame sensors like Fuji did — which they could have done. Honestly, I think Fuji's asymmetric competition seems like a much smarter move than what Nikon and Canon are doing now.
Just the price alone makes my response somewhat meh: I know I won't be able to afford to get into Nikon's Z-mount system — ditto for all competitors.
When there is a technology shift, the old established players have a difficult time changing gears and going full bore with the new tech. Sony really didn't have a long established (AFAIK) DSLR business line, but Nikon and Canon does. They've been working to preserve that segment, even as it shrinks. Other companies embraced mirrorless with great success.
I may be getting caught up in fake news hype but this week seems to be the big reveal for the EOS-R. We will know soon enough.
Maybe their road map is on a slow burn because they think they are retaining existing DSLR users who have the glass they want already and will get a Z and the adapter initially, buying them time to work on the lens designs?
Don't know, it was a bit of an anticlimax though.
If memory serves, Sony bought Minolta, but who knows how much Minolta there is left inside Sony. You're exactly right, though, the Big Two have been complacent and afraid of cannibalization. And now they are paying the price for it.
kenoh wrote above:
"True and if the EOS-R appears next week and it is a good one, then they may actually be in trouble."
Complete specs of the EOS-R:
Go here:
https://drive.google.com/file/d/1CAZOijAyrUJcOMWNHbjFpGq2CznrIAoN/view
(this is a google page with a download link)
Click the downward-pointing arrow (up top) to download.
Looks impressive.
Perhaps even more than Nikon's new design.
Canon will have an adapter that accommodates BOTH EF (full frame) and EF-s (APS-c) lens lines.
Since I believe the majority of Canon DSLR users are using APS-c, this gives them an easy upgrade path towards the "R" cameras.
Hmmm... will the Nikon "z-line" also have an adapter that allows usage of existing APS-c lenses for their users? (sorry, the last Nikon I owned was an "FTn" in the 70's !)
"True and if the EOS-R appears next week and it is a good one, then they may actually be in trouble."
Complete specs of the EOS-R:
Go here:
https://drive.google.com/file/d/1CAZOijAyrUJcOMWNHbjFpGq2CznrIAoN/view
(this is a google page with a download link)
Click the downward-pointing arrow (up top) to download.
Looks impressive.
Perhaps even more than Nikon's new design.
Canon will have an adapter that accommodates BOTH EF (full frame) and EF-s (APS-c) lens lines.
Since I believe the majority of Canon DSLR users are using APS-c, this gives them an easy upgrade path towards the "R" cameras.
Hmmm... will the Nikon "z-line" also have an adapter that allows usage of existing APS-c lenses for their users? (sorry, the last Nikon I owned was an "FTn" in the 70's !)
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Can't find the link now, but I did read somewhere that Nikon have plans for crop sensor Z600 etc.
With the Nikon Adapter, you can use any Nikon F mount lens. Given how the past APSC lenses have worked, I would imagine this will continue. That was one of the big things for Nikon: They used the same mount since Fred Flintstone first photographed the meteor that killed the Dinosaurs.
This is all a very smart play by Canon. Let Nikon do all of the marketing, wait until they announce 2 cameras and then leak impressive specs of your own camera at a very low price point. Canon releasing 1 entry level camera here is very smart as well as they will be able to iron out the bugs and then release a higher end model. DPAF, internal 480Mb/s and articulating screen will cause this thing to sell like hotcakes.
From what I learned from a Nikon event yesterday, the lenses sound like they very much are reasons why people may want to switch. The rep who was presenting said that the Z-mount glass is better than any of their equivalent counterparts in F-mount.
He intimated that lenses like the 24-70mm f4 that everyone is yawning about is a much bigger deal than anyone understands because of the corner to corner sharpness, lack of distortion, and low chromatic abberation that you have difficulty getting at the 24-70mm focal length. All of this is thanks to the new 16mm flange distance and 55mm mount.
These aren't uninspiring rehashes of existing lenses that they have. They're entirely new creations right down to the controls. The lenses no longer have a "focus" ring. It's now a control ring. You can program it to do different things so if having manual focus isn't important to you, you can change the purpose of the ring. Also with the larger mount diameter, they have more room to design additional electronics into the lens and can now consder larger and more complex motors for better autofocusing performance.
I left that event feeling much more impressed about the new Z6/Z7 line than I did going in... well the lenses in particular. I still don't feel like I really need a Z6 or a Z7, but I'm drooling over the potential of Z-mount glass and I may eventually have to switch just to get my hands on those lenses. I don't like EVFs so that's the only thing holding me back at this point. I much prefer an optical viewfinder over an electronic one.
I hope you’re right. But if true, why not weather seal it and make it like their other pro lenses?
I spoke with a Nikon rep prior to the announcement, and he said that they were told internally that ‘Sony isn’t ready for what we are about to release.’ They weren’t given specifics, but that the new cameras would be well beyond what was currently available.
This does not seem to be the case.
Not sure where you're gettting the info that the new 24-70 is not weather sealed. It is.
https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/1431708-REG/nikon_20072_nikkor_z_24_70mm_f_4.html
Sounds like a lot of marketing propaganda to me. I'm not wanting to buy f4 lenses at this stage. Not unless they are on a 300mm lens!
It may be, but some of the performance charts I've seen suggest that the glass that they're producing for the Z-mount is going to be a different paradigm above and beyond F-mount glass. The physics of it make sense. You just have a lot more room for error with larger mount diameters and shorter flange distances. Canon lenses are often regarded as superior to Nikon lenses and I suppose a lot of this may be due to that Canon EF mount has a 54mm mount diameter. You just don't have to bend and unbend the light as much to get it to the sensor.
It's funny that Nikon decided on 55mm as the mount diameter for their new Z-mount lens. They said that they decided on that because their engineers found that it was the best compromise between being large enough, but not so large as to create hardware that would be too large to handle. I wonder if the real diameter they wanted to use was 54mm, but didn't want to look like they were copying Canon so they bumped it up to 55mm.
Look at what Canon announced. That is exactly the kind of thing Nikon should have done with their lenses.
But now, Canon has beat them to the punch.
Which sucks. Because I like Nikon cameras more than Canon.
But now, Canon has beat them to the punch.
Which sucks. Because I like Nikon cameras more than Canon.
What did they announce?
Why is everyone posting that Northrup video? Who are they anyway? I never would have known who they were if they didn't post a Canon R review from their all expenses paid trip to Haiwaii from Canon. Nikon should have done that too... bribe the influencers with free vacations. Then the camera industry would be just like the American medical device and pharmaceutical industry.
Nikon did the exact same thing. Tony and Chelsea Northrop have a million followers on Youtube and are well known within the industry.