Problems with EFI Boot

[MriX]

I have installed Windows 10 on my Mac Pro 4.1 (upgraded to 5.1) in EFI mode, so that I have AHCI enabled.
Windows runs fine, but I have one problem:
I can boot into Windows when I press the ALT-key and select EFI boot, but when I try to boot into Windows with the startup disk selector, I get the error message "No bootable device -- insert boot disk and press any key".
So this is really annoying, because I upgraded to a new graphics card (so no boot screen) and now I cannot use the ALT-key method.
I thought I could navigate through the boot menu without seeing it, but that does not work. It seems that the boot menu only works when you have a Mac-graphics-card installed.

It would be nice when somebody can help me. I have already tried a PRAM and SMC reset.

 

[MarkC426]

Do you have the installs on seperate drives?
You could remove the mac drive and restart your mac, forcing it to load the windows system.
Maybe there is a problem with this install of windows, and once booted to that drive it may fix it (or it should instruct you on what needs sorting, booting into safe mode or something).

If you dont have an efi gpu you cannot get the boot screen.

 

[MriX]

Do you have the installs on seperate drives?
You could remove the mac drive and restart your mac, forcing it to load the windows system.
Maybe there is a problem with this install of windows, and once booted to that drive it may fix it (or it should instruct you on what needs sorting, booting into safe mode or something).

If you dont have an efi gpu you cannot get the boot screen.

Yes they are on different drives. macOS is on a SM951 in the PCIE Slot and Windows is on a SATA SSD.

When I removed the macOS drive and restarted, I got the same error message, because the macOS drive is set as default. After doing a PRAM reset it booted successfully from the Windows drive.
But the problem remains, when I try again to set the Bootcamp drive via the startup disk selector.

I knew already that I won't get a boot screen, but I thought the ALT-key menu would exist and I only cannot see it. And then it would be no problem to select the correct drive blindly.

 

[MarkC426]

https://forums.macrumors.com/threads/broken-firmware-after-high-sierra-upgrade.2084529/
There maybe something in this thread that helps!

 

[MriX]

Not really. But the issue that the startup disk selector don't work as expected, is since El Capitan.
Can you boot via the startup disk selector to a "EFI boot" option?

 

[h9826790]

Not sure if it help, but did you try BootChamp?

 

[MriX]

No that doesn't work too.
I think there is a general problem with Bootcamp EFI boot options. I installed Windows 10 on a separate drive via EFI and the installation was also not bootable via the startup disk selector.

 

[fendersrule]

Disable SIP.

Use bootcamp to get back to MacOS.

Use Bootchamp to get to windows.

Problem solved.

Problem is SIP, not EFI.

 

[MriX]

Disable SIP.

Use bootcamp to get back to MacOS.

Use Bootchamp to get to windows.

Problem solved.

Problem is SIP, not EFI.

Yeah that would work, but I think disabling SIP isn’t really a solution.

 

[h9826790]

Yeah that would work, but I think disabling SIP isn’t really a solution.

Why?

 

[owbp]

Yeah that would work, but I think disabling SIP isn’t really a solution.

Disabling SIP is the only option if you don't want to use Option key on boot. Startup Disk on MP5,1 is looking at different boot file, so it won't get you to Windows installed in uEFI mode.
BootChamp will boot into EFI install, but SIP has to be disabled.

SetBoot in Terminal is another option but hardly easier way and SIP has to be disabled too.

 

[Dr. Stealth]

Disable SIP.

Use bootcamp to get back to MacOS.

Use Bootchamp to get to windows.

Problem solved.

Problem is SIP, not EFI.

This IS the solution.... I do it every day without issues.

 

[MriX]

Disabling SIP is the only option if you don't want to use Option key on boot. Startup Disk on MP5,1 is looking at different boot file, so it won't get you to Windows installed in uEFI mode.
BootChamp will boot into EFI install, but SIP has to be disabled.

SetBoot in Terminal is another option but hardly easier way and SIP has to be disabled too.

You can use this, so that you only have to disable the part of SIP that is needed for BootChamp:
csrutil enable --without nvram

Then you have the rest of the “security” that comes with SIP.

But why does the Startup Disk selector point to a different boot file?

 

[devon807]

SIP must be disabled in its entirety to effectively use BootChamp

 

[MriX]

SIP must be disabled in its entirety to effectively use BootChamp

For me it works also when I only disable NVRAM.

 

[MriX]

By the way, how do you get from Bootcamp back to macOS?
When I try “restart in OS X”, in the Bootcamp utility, it does not work because I have macOS High Sierra on an APFS Volume.

 

[h9826790]

By the way, how do you get from Bootcamp back to macOS?
When I try “restart in OS X”, in the Bootcamp utility, it does not work because I have macOS High Sierra on an APFS Volume.

Use BootChamp (with SIP disabled)

 

[MriX]

Use BootChamp (with SIP disabled)

I already use that in macOS, but what do you use in Windows?
BootChamp sets my Bootcamp drive as default boot volume, so that I cannot switch back to macOS.

 

[fendersrule]

I don't have experience with the APFS drive, but what fixed it for me from Windows to MacOS was downloading the correct bootcamp drivers.

In addition, just simply restarting the computer should put you back into MacOS, does it not?

 

[MriX]

I don't have experience with the APFS drive, but what fixed it for me from Windows to MacOS was downloading the correct bootcamp drivers.

In addition, just simply restarting the computer should put you back into MacOS, does it not?

Which are the correct drivers? Because the Apple Software Update Tool doesn’t find newer updates, I always look them up manually.

No when I restart the computer it will boot again to Windows.

 

[h9826790]

Which are the correct drivers? Because the Apple Software Update Tool doesn’t find newer updates, I always look them up manually.

No when I restart the computer it will boot again to Windows.

BootChamp will make you only boot to Windows ONCE automatically. As long as you don't touch any boot setting. After you boot to Windows, the next boot will automatically go back to MacOS. No need to do anything.

And no, there is no driver for Windows to "see" APFS partition.

You can, however, install a 10.12.6 just for this purpose. So that, you can reboot back to 10.12.6 in Windows. And then further select 10.13.1 as your next boot drive.

 

[MriX]

BootChamp will make you only boot to Windows ONCE automatically. As long as you don't touch any boot setting. After you boot to Windows, the next boot will automatically go back to MacOS. No need to do anything.

And no, there is no driver for Windows to "see" APFS partition.

You can, however, install a 10.12.6 just for this purpose. So that, you can reboot back to 10.12.6 in Windows. And then further select 10.13.1 as your next boot drive.

For me, BootChamp sets it permanent. I will try a SMC and PRAM reset tomorrow.

 

[h9826790]

For me, BootChamp sets it permanent. I will try a SMC and PRAM reset tomorrow.

May be when you try the "restart in OSX" option accidentally screw up the BootChamp setting.

PRAM reset will bring you back to MacOS, but will re-enable SIP as well.

 

[DearthnVader]

I don't know about BootChamp, but you installed Windows 10 in Uefi mode, that means the disk windows is on is GUID. Apple's StartUp Disk expects a MBR disk to boot Windows, it's not finding the first stage bootloader in the disks MBR, that's why it won't work. The only solution if you want to be able to boot Windows 10 with Apple's StartUp disk, is you must find a way you install Windows in Legacy Bios mode.

I'm not sure Windows 10 is supported on a 5,1, for Bootcamp, so you may need to hack the Bootcamp.app to make a Windows 10 USB key that you can use to install Windows in Legacy Bios mode.

Really Windows 10 runs better in Uefi mode, tho the 5,1 has a custom EFI that is not fully UEFI compliant.

What I would do is create a Shell Script that "Blesses" the Windows Boot Manager EFI file, it should be on the hidden EFI partition of the disk you installed Windows to. All you would have to do, in the macOS, if you wanted to boot Windows is run the Shell script.

As to booting the macOS from Windows, when the MacOS is installed on APSF, you just need to update the Windows drivers for the ones from a newer Mac that Supports Windows 10. Used to be you could edit Bootcamp's info.plist, aand just add your Mac to the section of a mac that supported Windows 10, and bootcamp would download the later drivers and Startup disk utility for Windows, that should support APFS disks. I think Apple changed the bootcamp info.plist so it's not as easy to edit.

I'm on the road, so I don't have any mac's with me, but when I get home I'll see if I can figure out how to edit bootcamp's info.plist to "Support" your mac.

I'll check and see if I can help you with the correct syntax for a shell script to Bless Windows boot manager.
[doublepost=1510049681][/doublepost]You may need to Disable CSR, and run this command in a Terminal session:

systemsetup -liststartupdisks

See what it returns.

To disable CSR you'll have to boot from you macOS Recovery partition, there are some instructions for doing it blind, for people with PC Graphics card roms.

Do a search of the forums and you should be able to find it.
[doublepost=1510052161][/doublepost]

sudo bless -device /dev/disk0s1 -mount /Volumes/EFI -setBoot -nextonly

I think this command is what is needed, but you'll need to run:

diskutil list

To find the proper EFI partition, assuming you installed Windows on it's own disk, and it is formatted GUID, replace disk0s1 with the disk that diskutil list says has a "Microsoft Basic Data" partition type. You don't want to bless that partition, that should just tell you what disk. So, for example if you see a "Microsoft Basic Data" partition on disk2sX then you want to bless /dev/disk2s1, as "s1" should always be the EFI partition, it just means the first partition of disk2.

Like I say, you must use crsutil --disable from your macOS recovery partition first, because in El Cap and later the NVRAM is protected, and can't be written to, even by the root user, unless you disable it.

 

[h9826790]

I don't know about BootChamp, but you installed Windows 10 in Uefi mode, that means the disk windows is on is GUID. Apple's StartUp Disk expects a MBR disk to boot Windows, it's not finding the first stage bootloader in the disks MBR, that's why it won't work. The only solution if you want to be able to boot Windows 10 with Apple's StartUp disk, is you must find a way you install Windows in Legacy Bios mode.

I'm not sure Windows 10 is supported on a 5,1, for Bootcamp, so you may need to hack the Bootcamp.app to make a Windows 10 USB key that you can use to install Windows in Legacy Bios mode.

Really Windows 10 runs better in Uefi mode, tho the 5,1 has a custom EFI that is not fully UEFI compliant.

What I would do is create a Shell Script that "Blesses" the Windows Boot Manager EFI file, it should be on the hidden EFI partition of the disk you installed Windows to. All you would have to do, in the macOS, if you wanted to boot Windows is run the Shell script.

As to booting the macOS from Windows, when the MacOS is installed on APSF, you just need to update the Windows drivers for the ones from a newer Mac that Supports Windows 10. Used to be you could edit Bootcamp's info.plist, aand just add your Mac to the section of a mac that supported Windows 10, and bootcamp would download the later drivers and Startup disk utility for Windows, that should support APFS disks. I think Apple changed the bootcamp info.plist so it's not as easy to edit.

I'm on the road, so I don't have any mac's with me, but when I get home I'll see if I can figure out how to edit bootcamp's info.plist to "Support" your mac.

I'll check and see if I can help you with the correct syntax for a shell script to Bless Windows boot manager.
[doublepost=1510049681][/doublepost]You may need to Disable CSR, and run this command in a Terminal session:

systemsetup -liststartupdisks

See what it returns.

To disable CSR you'll have to boot from you macOS Recovery partition, there are some instructions for doing it blind, for people with PC Graphics card roms.

Do a search of the forums and you should be able to find it.
[doublepost=1510052161][/doublepost]

I think this command is what is needed, but you'll need to run:

diskutil list

To find the proper EFI partition, assuming you installed Windows on it's own disk, and it is formatted GUID, replace disk0s1 with the disk that diskutil list says has a "Microsoft Basic Data" partition type. You don't want to bless that partition, that should just tell you what disk. So, for example if you see a "Microsoft Basic Data" partition on disk2sX then you want to bless /dev/disk2s1, as "s1" should always be the EFI partition, it just means the first partition of disk2.

Like I say, you must use crsutil --disable from your macOS recovery partition first, because in El Cap and later the NVRAM is protected, and can't be written to, even by the root user, unless you disable it.

The APFS driver for Windows is already avail from Apple?