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MRU

macrumors Penryn
Aug 23, 2005
25,370
8,952
a better place
The Verge:

Google sets its sights on the iPhone with HTC deal

Google is becoming Apple faster than Apple can become Google
The idea of Google going to war with the iPhone. Seriously the Verge editing staff are smoking something wild.

Yes they spent 1.5 billion in buying some staff and a venue.

A design team doesn't equate to built devices.

By comparison, Apple has spent multi billions in just Display technologies alone. Let alone billions on chipsets and such.

There is a gaping disparity between essentially the baby steps Google has made and the reality of the investment needed and Apple has invested to get where it is.

Let alone the elephant in the room. Google makes money from services and licencing. If it ever was a potential threat to Apple, it would be a far greater threat to the myriad of OEMs producing Android handsets. Do we really believe Google is ready to take a big bite at the hand that feeds it.
 

epicrayban

macrumors 604
Nov 7, 2014
6,517
5,353
The idea of Google going to war with the iPhone. Seriously the Verge editing staff are smoking something wild.

Yes they spent 1.5 billion in buying some staff and a venue.

A design team doesn't equate to built devices.

By comparison, Apple has spent multi billions in just Display technologies alone. Let alone billions on chipsets and such.

There is a gaping disparity between essentially the baby steps Google has made and the reality of the investment needed and Apple has invested to get where it is.

Let alone the elephant in the room. Google makes money from services and licencing. If it ever was a potential threat to Apple, it would be a far greater threat to the myriad of OEMs producing Android handsets. Do we really believe Google is ready to take a big bite at the hand that feeds it.

Agree with a lot of what you said. It's going to be a while before we see Google's plan come to fruition.

Regarding the bolded: I think Google believes they're ready to go there. The Pixel hasn't made a dent in Samsung's sales (has it?).
 
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MRU

macrumors Penryn
Aug 23, 2005
25,370
8,952
a better place
I think Google believes they're ready to go there. The Pixel hasn't made a dent in Samsung's sales (has it?).
How many pixels sold ? Something like 1.5 million we are led to believe. Outside of the techies; who really knows what a Pixel phone is ? Samsung sold how many phones last year. Heck when even One Plus sold more phones last year.

We will see how serious Google are on announcement day, and whether the Pixel 2 devices are actually available to buy outside of a limited 4 or 5 countries. I would be genuinely surprised if they are.

Every year we hear Google is getting serious, heck after the 12.5 billion in Moto all the tech blog sites were claiming they were ready to take on the competition and yet what really happened there.

Essentially the blog sites have no clue about Google's strategy as much as we do not know it.

And sometimes I wonder if Google even know their own strategy ....
 
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spinedoc77

macrumors G4
Jun 11, 2009
11,488
5,413
The Verge:

Google sets its sights on the iPhone with HTC deal

Google is becoming Apple faster than Apple can become Google

Interesting article, I was particularly fascinated by the part about why this is different than Motorola. I guess back then Google was still tip toeing around the oems, but now they don't care. I say BRAVO, screw the oems, they will find a way to sell phones anyway. I've always advocated Google ramp up and become a hardware company, not necessarily to make a profit (although at 649-849 they will make a profit), but to better streamline their software to the hardware. F the oems with their 8 month OS update schedules I say.

But in any event it will be more competition, which means everyone will step up their game. Maybe on the other end Apple will step up its game with its services, maybe they will improve maps or gain something unique like Waze has, or maybe they will open up their walled garden a bit.

The only caveat is HTC, sigh why freakin HTC? They've proven they can't make a modern phone with their latest set of bricks, they are even ruining the smaller pixel 2. We can only hope with an infusion of money and management their phones designs may improve, at least we can say goodbye to their OS overlay.
[doublepost=1506028123][/doublepost]
They aren't selling their entire mobile division. Just the part of it allocated to Pixel production. For all intents and purposes HTC mobile division for its own branded devices is still very much intact.

Which only makes the whole exercise even more curious.

Oh I didn't realize this, how odd. So HTC phones will continue to exist? Basically they just bought out all the pixel employees and technology.
[doublepost=1506028352][/doublepost]
The idea of Google going to war with the iPhone. Seriously the Verge editing staff are smoking something wild.

Yes they spent 1.5 billion in buying some staff and a venue.

A design team doesn't equate to built devices.

By comparison, Apple has spent multi billions in just Display technologies alone. Let alone billions on chipsets and such.

There is a gaping disparity between essentially the baby steps Google has made and the reality of the investment needed and Apple has invested to get where it is.

Let alone the elephant in the room. Google makes money from services and licencing. If it ever was a potential threat to Apple, it would be a far greater threat to the myriad of OEMs producing Android handsets. Do we really believe Google is ready to take a big bite at the hand that feeds it.

I think it may be what Google is doing, but you bring up some great and very valid points. But Google seems like a company that wants to do certain things and allocates some resources towards those ends, but then doesn't follow through and lets that objective rot away on the vine. A lot of what they do doesn't make sense, and almost seems like some manager or board member coming up with an idea and the rest of the board saying "hey we gotta spend money somewhere".

But if Google were doing this they would have to start really big. For them to piss off the oems, and to cause Apple to withdraw its Google software on its devices, well they better be ready for world war 3.
[doublepost=1506028466][/doublepost]
Interested to see the U11 Plus design. Perhaps HTC can be competitive in design this year. If the bezel-less design of the U11 Plus is impressive, it'll give me hope for future Pixel devices.

Rumor: HTC U11 Plus coming soon, near-bezel-less screen included
https://www.phonearena.com/news/HTC-U11-Plus-features-rumor_id98282

^ Emphasis on the rumored "near bezel-less" screen

Sigh, another 18:9 display. PLEASE someone make a freakin 16:9 display!!!! Bravo though, I wish HTC luck and hope they design a killer phone and make a comeback.
 

jamezr

macrumors P6
Aug 7, 2011
16,074
19,069
US
How many pixels sold ? Something like 1.5 million we are led to believe. Outside of the techies; who really knows what a Pixel phone is ? Samsung sold how many phones last year. Heck when even One Plus sold more phones last year.

We will see how serious Google are on announcement day, and whether the Pixel 2 devices are actually available to buy outside of a limited 4 or 5 countries. I would be genuinely surprised if they are.

Every year we hear Google is getting serious, heck after the 12.5 billion in Moto all the tech blog sites were claiming they were ready to take on the competition and yet what really happened there.

Essentially the blog sites have no clue about Google's strategy as much as we do not know it.

And sometimes I wonder if Google even know their own strategy ....
^^^^^^ this is pure gold^^^^^^^

Google has no long term strategy for the Pixel or mobile phones in general. We hear every year how the big G is going to get serious about mobile phone hardware and every year the same thing.....
 

epicrayban

macrumors 604
Nov 7, 2014
6,517
5,353
Not to go off topic, but T-Mobile and Sprint might merge. Reports say an announcement could come in October.
 
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co.ag.2005

macrumors 68020
Jun 17, 2009
2,365
1,810
Fort Worth, TX
Not to go off topic, but T-Mobile and Sprint might merge. Reports say an announcement could come in October.

Yep: http://www.tmonews.com/2017/09/t-mobile-sprint-reportedly-close-agreeing-terms-merger/

As a recently new T-Mobile customer, I assume this is good... get Sprint's cellular assets (the good bits) and help bolster T-Mobile's already good offering. And if they keep T-Mobile and Legere at the helm, I assume it'll be more of a "business as usual" for current T-Mobile customers.
 

S.B.G

Moderator
Staff member
Sep 8, 2010
26,679
10,464
Detroit
Not to go off topic, but T-Mobile and Sprint might merge. Reports say an announcement could come in October.

Yep: http://www.tmonews.com/2017/09/t-mobile-sprint-reportedly-close-agreeing-terms-merger/

As a recently new T-Mobile customer, I assume this is good... get Sprint's cellular assets (the good bits) and help bolster T-Mobile's already good offering. And if they keep T-Mobile and Legere at the helm, I assume it'll be more of a "business as usual" for current T-Mobile customers.

Will this be a good, bad or indifferent move for Project Fi?
 

spinedoc77

macrumors G4
Jun 11, 2009
11,488
5,413
Not to go off topic, but T-Mobile and Sprint might merge. Reports say an announcement could come in October.

Lol that's crazy, so poor reception merging with even worse reception? I wonder what will happen to Sprint's CDMA, will they abandon it and get everyone on Tmobile's GSM but maybe use some of Sprint's spectrum for rural areas? Will be interesting and may give both companies the boost they need, and more competition for Verizon/ATT.
 

Rum_Becker

Suspended
Sep 1, 2017
154
924
Canada
Lol that's crazy, so poor reception merging with even worse reception? I wonder what will happen to Sprint's CDMA, will they abandon it and get everyone on Tmobile's GSM but maybe use some of Sprint's spectrum for rural areas? Will be interesting and may give both companies the boost they need, and more competition for Verizon/ATT.

I think most Sprint phones can work on GSM so it would make sense to kill CDMA, refarm the spectrum to GSM and give their customers GSM sims cards. With all the 600 MHz spectrum that T-Mobile has coming online soon, I think a Sprint/T-mobile merger can bring many benefits.
 

Michael Goff

Suspended
Jul 5, 2012
13,329
7,422
Lol that's crazy, so poor reception merging with even worse reception? I wonder what will happen to Sprint's CDMA, will they abandon it and get everyone on Tmobile's GSM but maybe use some of Sprint's spectrum for rural areas? Will be interesting and may give both companies the boost they need, and more competition for Verizon/ATT.

I don't know if the CDMA matters so much as Sprint's LTE coverage.
 

Fernandez21

macrumors 601
Jun 16, 2010
4,840
3,183
Man, I hope that doesn’t happen, that means well be down to only 3 National carriers. We need more competition, not less.
 

Rum_Becker

Suspended
Sep 1, 2017
154
924
Canada
Man, I hope that doesn’t happen, that means well be down to only 3 National carriers. We need more competition, not less.


3 can be better than 4 in some cases. ATT and Verizon are just too big for the other 2. Given enough time, Sprint or T-Mobile will go under, most likely Sprint. Once Verizon dumps CDMA (2019/2020), companies my stop making CDMA phones and Sprint will be screwed as Sprint has no intention to switch to GSM. Sprints would spiral down into bankruptcy enabling Verizon or ATT to pick up the the spectrum and put T-Mobile in an even worse position.

Long story short, it's better to have 3 healthy companies than just 2 which could happen with the current market dynamic.
 
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co.ag.2005

macrumors 68020
Jun 17, 2009
2,365
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Fort Worth, TX
Man, I hope that doesn’t happen, that means well be down to only 3 National carriers. We need more competition, not less.

I'm just curious if you can actually count Sprint as "competition". They are just so far behind in coverage and speed than the other 3. I know they're making good strides but most people wouldn't touch them with a 10ft pole.
 

spinedoc77

macrumors G4
Jun 11, 2009
11,488
5,413
I don't know if the CDMA matters so much as Sprint's LTE coverage.

Wouldn't some of their CDMA coverage be strong in rural areas. No doubt not as good as Verizons, but for a while back in the 90s I remember Sprint being bett
3 can be better than 4 in some cases. ATT and Verizon are just too big for the other 2. Given enough time, Sprint or T-Mobile will go under, most likely Sprint. Once Verizon dumps CDMA (2019/2020), companies my stop making CDMA phones and Sprint will be screwed as Sprint has no intention to switch to GSM. Sprints would spiral down into bankruptcy enabling Verizon or ATT to pick up the the spectrum and put T-Mobile in an even worse position.

Long story short, it's better to have 3 healthy companies than just 2 which could happen with the current market dynamic.

Can't wait for Verizon to ditch CDMA so I can import phones.
 

Michael Goff

Suspended
Jul 5, 2012
13,329
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Wouldn't some of their CDMA coverage be strong in rural areas. No doubt not as good as Verizons, but for a while back in the 90s I remember Sprint being bett


Can't wait for Verizon to ditch CDMA so I can import phones.

In the short run, you're right. But everyone is trying to turn their networks into LTE only. I could see TMo using the towers Sprint has and the spectrum they've bought and actually being competitive.
 

Rum_Becker

Suspended
Sep 1, 2017
154
924
Canada
In the short run, you're right. But everyone is trying to turn their networks into LTE only. I could see TMo using the towers Sprint has and the spectrum they've bought and actually being competitive.


I have read somewhere that Sprint/T-Mobile and the 600 Mhz spectrum of T-mobile is on Par with the big two, if not better.
 

Fernandez21

macrumors 601
Jun 16, 2010
4,840
3,183
I'm just curious if you can actually count Sprint as "competition". They are just so far behind in coverage and speed than the other 3. I know they're making good strides but most people wouldn't touch them with a 10ft pole.
T-Mobile was in the same spot a couple years ago, and look at them now, and their aggressive tactics have also forced at&t and Verizon to respond. So whose to say Sprint cant turn things around?
 

Fernandez21

macrumors 601
Jun 16, 2010
4,840
3,183
3 can be better than 4 in some cases. ATT and Verizon are just too big for the other 2. Given enough time, Sprint or T-Mobile will go under, most likely Sprint. Once Verizon dumps CDMA (2019/2020), companies my stop making CDMA phones and Sprint will be screwed as Sprint has no intention to switch to GSM. Sprints would spiral down into bankruptcy enabling Verizon or ATT to pick up the the spectrum and put T-Mobile in an even worse position.

Long story short, it's better to have 3 healthy companies than just 2 which could happen with the current market dynamic.
But i dont see how those 3 will be healthy competition. You think t-mobile will continue being this aggressive once they're on par with at&t and verizon? And we've all seen how Verizon and at&t try to compete with each other (just think back a couple year when t-mobile was also in trouble). If t-mobile and Sprint merge, then who is left to be the aggressor and drive competition? Remember, this persona John Legere shows is just an act, we was an executive at at&t and was a normal business man. What he's doing now is just marketing, and while it's working, I don't trust he'll continue to be as aggressive once t-mobile is part of the club with the big 2.
 

co.ag.2005

macrumors 68020
Jun 17, 2009
2,365
1,810
Fort Worth, TX
T-Mobile was in the same spot a couple years ago, and look at them now, and their aggressive tactics have also forced at&t and Verizon to respond. So whose to say Sprint cant turn things around?

Because they have been trying for years and not getting close enough. And bleeding subscribers at the same time.

But maybe if they have more time? I just know SoftBank has been wanting to merge or get bought out for some time now. Seems like they don't have confidence in Sprint either.
 

JaySoul

macrumors 68030
Jan 30, 2008
2,629
2,865
Google can't compete.

They basically can't hide anything, they have to share everything planned in roadmaps, so Samsung and co can replicate it.

Therefore Google will always have a hard time differentiating. You have to assume they won't (any time in the next 10 years) be genuinely serious about making the Pixel a true market leader. Very little chance of that.
 

Fernandez21

macrumors 601
Jun 16, 2010
4,840
3,183
Because they have been trying for years and not getting close enough. And bleeding subscribers at the same time.

But maybe if they have more time? I just know SoftBank has been wanting to merge or get bought out for some time now. Seems like they don't have confidence in Sprint either.
The CEO of SoftBank was talking about merging with another company if this merger deal falls through again, and rumors are it's with charter. I think this would be much better, not only strengthen Sprint, but also give more competition to the at&t/direct TV combo, and verizon/FiOS service. It also keeps T-Mobile as the agressive under dog disruptor.
 
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