So is it completely IDIOTIC to buy a M1 Max/Ultra Mac Studio now?

[Mac-key]

I'm a professional photographer and videographer. However, 70% of my revenue is video and I spend the majority of my time editing video in Premiere. For years I worked on an old 2017 iMac up until last August when I bought the Mac mini M2 Pro 16/512 - 10CPU/16GPU. For the most part this box does the job, but many times I'm using something crazy like 25GB of RAM when exporting out of premiere using media encoder. My memory pressure is yellow. Also I'm finding some non-smooth playback in my timeline especially with speed ramps on drone footage.

I've been poking around online and have found (thru ipoweresale a couple interesting M1 Mac Studio's

Both BRAND NEW

M1 Max - 64/1TB with 10CPU/32GPU for 1399 - NO sales tax

M1 Ultra - 64/1TB with 20CPU/65GPU for 2399 - No sales tax.

I can sell my Mac mini for 415 thru sellyourmac.com.

Yes I get that it's a 3 year old machine, but it's brand new and comes with a full one-year warranty.

I know the M4's are around the corner, BUT the idea of getting WAY more RAM (which I need) and a helluva lot more GPU cores for half the original price is enticing.

Thoughts?

 

[apostolosdt]

You are a pro, therefore cost should be of less deciding factor than among "mortals". And Minis, whatever the version and/or specs, are not pro-grade (God knows how many times I've said that!)

However, since the M4-run Studios are just a few months away, you could wait a bit--or content yourself, just for now, with a Studio M1 Max, but get the 32-core GPU model; you won't regret and I'm talking from experience here!

 

[EugW]

I am suspicious of the brand new claim. If they were legit then the prices would be good, but there are some pretty bad reviews of ipoweresale out there.

Is the 1-year warranty actually from Apple? Can you verify that before purchasing?

 

[mcnallym]

The M1 Studio is still a good machine. If looking at a 1k outlay
Will solve the memory pressure, much more disk space and double the number of media engines, providing the software can use them both.
It will still last a fair few years left in them in terms of support from Apple.

Don’t know about the reliability of the seller so cannot comment there beyond as other say just check the warranty, etc.

 

[Mac-key]

You are a pro, therefore cost should be of less deciding factor than among "mortals". And Minis, whatever the version and/or specs, are not pro-grade (God knows how many times I've said that!)

However, since the M4-run Studios are just a few months away, you could wait a bit--or content yourself, just for now, with a Studio M1 Max, but get the 32-core GPU model; you won't regret and I'm talking from experience here!

You are correct my friend! The M2 Pro Mac mini is not a professional machine, no matter how much YouTubers wanna tell you it is. It's a solid computer yes, but I find it lacking. Since I was moving from an iMac I also needed a new display, trackpad and keyboard. I was trying to save some $$. Yes my business does well, but I'm a tight ass either way

Thanks for the input. I'll probably wait - the M4 Mac Studio should be dropping by June - I HOPE!

 

[Mac-key]

I am suspicious of the brand new claim. If they were legit then the prices would be good, but there are some pretty bad reviews of ipoweresale out there.

Is the 1-year warranty actually from Apple? Can you verify that before purchasing?

Good question - and they SAY it's from Apple and still even eligible for Apple Care. That seems hard to believe though. As far as Ipowerresale - I have bought from them in the past and had a good experience.

 

[EugW]

The M2 Pro Mac mini is not a professional machine, no matter how much YouTubers wanna tell you it is. It's a solid computer yes, but I find it lacking. Since I was moving from an iMac I also needed a new display, trackpad and keyboard. I was trying to save some $$. Yes my business does well, but I'm a tight ass either way

My friend who has been a web design lead for various billion dollar multinational companies, currently does his design work on a non-Pro Mac mini.

For his usage he feels his 24 GB M4 Mac mini is faster than his previous 32 GB M1 Max Mac Studio. He has little need for GPU speed for his work, however.

 

[Mac-key]

My friend who has been a web design lead for various billion dollar multinational companies, currently does his design work on a non-Pro Mac mini.

For his usage he feels his 24 GB M4 Mac mini is faster than his previous 32 GB M1 Max Mac Studio. He has little need for GPU speed for his work, however.

Yeah I do mostly video editing, color correction, graphics and such which has a greater need for GPU speeds. Also my Mac mini is the base model M2 pro with only 16GB of RAM.

 

[EugW]

Yeah I do mostly video editing, color correction, graphics and such which has a greater need for GPU speeds. Also my Mac mini is the base model M2 pro with only 16GB of RAM.

In that case, don't get the M1 Max Mac Studio, despite the low price. In CPU, M2 Pro is faster than M1 Max, and for hardware video encoding and Metal, M1 Max is only about 30% faster than M2 Pro roughly.

It seems a more reasonable upgrade for you might be M1 Ultra, or else M4 Max this summer.

 

[bubbahotep68]

The challenge with this question and similar questions is the point of view from which the question is asked and answered.

In terms of raw processing power, an M1 Max processor is about even with an M2 Pro in almost every category. The M1 Max slightly outperforms the M2 Pro in a couple of GPU related benchmarks/tasks; however, the M2 Pro equals or bests the M1 Max in every other benchmark/task. In terms of raw processing power alone, it would not make much sense to invest in an M1 Max based Mac Studio.

In terms of raw processing power, an M1 Ultra processor crushes an M2 Pro in almost every category. While the M2 Pro does better in some single core processing benchmarks/tasks, the M1 Ultra does better in just about every benchmark/tasks requiring multicore CPUs or GPUs. The M2 Pro has a higher clock rate which explains why it does better at single core benchmarks/tasks. However, the M1 Ultra has 8 more CPU cores and 45 more GPU cores as well as a higher memory bandwidth. The M1 Ultra ends up scoring 2-3 times higher in benchmarks. In terms of raw processing power alone, it might make sense to invest in an M1 Ultra based Studio. It certainly should render video more quickly than the M2 Pro Mac mini. How much faster is difficult to answer.

At this point, the question though really becomes more esoteric and complex. Let's say the M1 Ultra based Studio renders your videos on average 3 minutes faster than your Mac mini. Let's say you render five videos per day. You have saved 15 minutes of rendering time. How valuable is this time to you? The question here is at what point does this impact your workflow and either reduce costs or increase income? How many minutes of saved rendering time do you need to accumulate until the cost of the Studio is paid off?

Similarly, when an M4 based studio comes out, a similarly spiced M4 Ultra will most likely cost $4000 or more. This is at least $1700 more than the M1 Ultra available now. How long will it take for the time saved from its faster rendering times to offset this additional cost?

 

[EugW]

The challenge with this question and similar questions is the point of view from which the question is asked and answered.

In terms of raw processing power, an M1 Max processor is about even with an M2 Pro in almost every category. The M1 Max slightly outperforms the M2 Pro in a couple of GPU related benchmarks/tasks; however, the M2 Pro equals or bests the M1 Max in every other benchmark/task. In terms of raw processing power alone, it would not make much sense to invest in an M1 Max based Mac Studio.

In terms of raw processing power, an M1 Ultra processor crushes an M2 Pro in almost every category. While the M2 Pro does better in some single core processing benchmarks/tasks, the M1 Ultra does better in just about every benchmark/tasks requiring multicore CPUs or GPUs. The M2 Pro has a higher clock rate which explains why it does better at single core benchmarks/tasks. However, the M1 Ultra has 8 more CPU cores and 45 more GPU cores as well as a higher memory bandwidth. The M1 Ultra ends up scoring 2-3 times higher in benchmarks. In terms of raw processing power alone, it might make sense to invest in an M1 Ultra based Studio. It certainly should render video more quickly than the M2 Pro Mac mini. How much faster is difficult to answer.

At this point, the question though really becomes more esoteric and complex. Let's say the M1 Ultra based Studio renders your videos on average 3 minutes faster than your Mac mini. Let's say you render five videos per day. You have saved 15 minutes of rendering time. How valuable is this time to you? The question here is at what point does this impact your workflow and either reduce costs or increase income? How many minutes of saved rendering time do you need to accumulate until the cost of the Studio is paid off?

Similarly, when an M4 based studio comes out, a similarly spiced M4 Ultra will most likely cost $4000 or more. This is at least $1700 more than the M1 Ultra available now. How long will it take for the time saved from its faster rendering times to offset this additional cost?

This forgets the 64 GB vs 16 GB part of the equation. 16 GB can be limiting in some professional workflows. Even if isn't a huge time difference, the annoyance difference can be significant. Once swap files become bigger, there are more and more pauses in the OS.

My other concern is longevity though, not from a performance perspective but from the perspective of macOS support.

 

[Mac-key]

The challenge with this question and similar questions is the point of view from which the question is asked and answered.

In terms of raw processing power, an M1 Max processor is about even with an M2 Pro in almost every category. The M1 Max slightly outperforms the M2 Pro in a couple of GPU related benchmarks/tasks; however, the M2 Pro equals or bests the M1 Max in every other benchmark/task. In terms of raw processing power alone, it would not make much sense to invest in an M1 Max based Mac Studio.

In terms of raw processing power, an M1 Ultra processor crushes an M2 Pro in almost every category. While the M2 Pro does better in some single core processing benchmarks/tasks, the M1 Ultra does better in just about every benchmark/tasks requiring multicore CPUs or GPUs. The M2 Pro has a higher clock rate which explains why it does better at single core benchmarks/tasks. However, the M1 Ultra has 8 more CPU cores and 45 more GPU cores as well as a higher memory bandwidth. The M1 Ultra ends up scoring 2-3 times higher in benchmarks. In terms of raw processing power alone, it might make sense to invest in an M1 Ultra based Studio. It certainly should render video more quickly than the M2 Pro Mac mini. How much faster is difficult to answer.

At this point, the question though really becomes more esoteric and complex. Let's say the M1 Ultra based Studio renders your videos on average 3 minutes faster than your Mac mini. Let's say you render five videos per day. You have saved 15 minutes of rendering time. How valuable is this time to you? The question here is at what point does this impact your workflow and either reduce costs or increase income? How many minutes of saved rendering time do you need to accumulate until the cost of the Studio is paid off?

Similarly, when an M4 based studio comes out, a similarly spiced M4 Ultra will most likely cost $4000 or more. This is at least $1700 more than the M1 Ultra available now. How long will it take for the time saved from its faster rendering times to offset this additional cost?

here's the thing - I don't care about export speeds - I mean how often are we exporting? Not often. I care about an EXTREMELY smooth playback/scrubbing in my timeline. I care about a super responsive move from editing in premiere to color correction in premiere. I don't want to have to wait for it to switch and then take forever when I click on the clip to begin color correction. Right now, it can sometimes take several seconds for it to respond when I click on the clip to color correct. I want more memory head room - right now with 16GB of RAM I'm in the yellow and getting TONS of swap. Even with an M1 outfitted with 64 GB of RAM would be an improvement, don't you think. Also I have 16 GPU cores - the M1 max would double that to 32GPU - even on an older chip that would be better right?

I mean faster export is fine and all, but not my top priority.

 

[Mac-key]

This forgets the 64 GB vs 16 GB part of the equation. 16 GB can be limiting in some professional workflows. Even if isn't a huge time difference, the annoyance difference can be significant. Once swap files become bigger, there are more and more pauses in the OS.

My other concern is longevity though, not from a performance perspective but from the perspective of macOS support.

THIS ^^^ - is another reason I'm considering it - because even with the M2's and probably the upcoming M4 release - I'm certain the base Mac studio will only have 32GB of RAM. With this one I'm getting 4 times the memory I currently have.

 

[SammyG7]

I'm just a guy, but I say "No" to purchasing a brand new M1 Studio. However there are some great deals on used ones, which would seem to be a good fit!

 

[EugW]

I'm just a guy, but I say "No" to purchasing a brand new M1 Studio. However there are some great deals on used ones, which would seem to be a good fit!

At the prices shown, the so-called brand new M1 series Studio would actually be cheaper than used. I'm still suspicious of that store's brand new claim though.

 

[Mac-key]

At the prices shown, the so-called brand new M1 series Studio would actually be cheaper than used. I'm still suspicious of that store's brand new claim though.

Me too - you're telling me it's been sitting in a box unopened for 2-3 years??? I guess that's possible.

 

[filterdecay]

i recently bought a m1 ultra with 128gb of ram and only 200 hours on it for $2300. If you are a pro having a computer that is 2 years old is nice as you dont need to worry about software being on the cutting edge and all the problems that come with that. I think I will always want the best 2 year old computer.

 

[Mac-key]

i recently bought a m1 ultra with 128gb of ram and only 200 hours on it for $2300. If you are a pro having a computer that is 2 years old is nice as you dont need to worry about software being on the cutting edge and all the problems that come with that. I think I will always want the best 2 year old computer.

Yeah I'm fine with 2 year old computers - I started my business on a 2011 15 inch MacBook Pro - then in 2018 bought a used 27 inch 2013 iMac, replaced that a few laters with a 2017 iMac. This Mac mini I bought last august was the 1st NEW computer I had bought in a LONG time! I do need to stay up to date with my software though as I use the adobe creative suite.

 

[Eduardot]

Go for it. A 2 year old NEW computer, has gotten all the kinks out of it in this forum. And it will most surely comply with your needs and more.

 

[throAU]

I would not buy an M1 generation machine for those prices.

M1 ultra has performance issues scaling with some things and an M4 pro will beat an M1 Max in terms of raw performance.

Those prices are still too high for what they are, IMHO.

vs. newer generation you are giving up 3-4 years of software support timeframe, new cpu instructions in the CPU that help with ML/AI, much weaker NPU, and no RT support in the GPU.


That said, if you're still set on it, I'd skip the ultra and go with the Max. I haven't kept fully up to speed with the M1 ultra but do recall a lot of reports of performance issues in software, possibly due to software being written for the other M series parts that aren't essentially 2 units glued together.

 

[Mac-key]

I would not buy an M1 generation machine for those prices.

M1 ultra has performance issues scaling with some things and an M4 pro will beat an M1 Max in terms of raw performance.

Those prices are still too high for what they are, IMHO.

vs. newer generation you are giving up 3-4 years of software support timeframe, new cpu instructions in the CPU that help with ML/AI, much weaker NPU, and no RT support in the GPU.


That said, if you're still set on it, I'd skip the ultra and go with the Max. I haven't kept fully up to speed with the M1 ultra but do recall a lot of reports of performance issues in software, possibly due to software being written for the other M series parts that aren't essentially 2 units glued together.

Great feedback - thank you! Luckily my m2 Pro is getting the job done. I think I'm leaning toward waiting for the M4 studio's and HOPING they make the base model m4 max with 64GB of RAM as opposed to 32GB. I think if they do that and keep the price at 1999 - I'll be a day one buyer. Last fall I was so close to buying the m2 Max Mac studio, but since I was also getting an apple display, keyboard and mouse - I was just trying to save some $$. Plus I knew the m2 Pro Mac mini would be a major improvement over my 2017 i5 iMac - and it has been. I'm just a little bummed I didn't get more RAM on the front end. I won't make that mistake again.

 

[throAU]

Also, I think if you were to go from an M2 generation machine to an M1 generation you'd certainly notice a reduction in single thread/interactive performance. A max or ultra would be capable of far heavier workload but in general usage, the m2 will be more responsive.

I have an M1 based iPad and an A15 based iPhone 13 mini (m2 has a15 generation cores in it) and the difference is noticeable - the iPhone 13 is snappier in light usage!

 

[throAU]

Oh and I still have an M1 Pro machine in the house (my old laptop, handed down to gf). My m4 max is ridiculously snappier with the newer generation chip in it.

Because that's what you're considering here really - an m4 based machine vs. a cheap m1 based machine. Its no contest.

The m1 series is still good, but its getting old now and its not just the performance you're giving up, the software support window too.

 

[Ctrlos]

As it stands I’d buy the M4 Pro Mac Mini and spec it up from Apple. Give it a whirl and if it’s not what you expected take it back for a refund. An M4 Pro 14C/16G 64gb RAM 1Tb SSD is the same cost as the Ultra studio you’re considering directly from Apple themselves.

This probably isn’t what you need for such a workflow but it would let you get the measure of whether or not its worth waiting for the M4 Studio or not.

 

[throAU]

As it stands I’d buy the M4 Pro Mac Mini and spec it up from Apple. Give it a whirl and if it’s not what you expected take it back for a refund. An M4 Pro 14C/16G 64gb RAM 1Tb SSD is the same cost as the Ultra studio you’re considering directly from Apple themselves.

This probably isn’t what you need for such a workflow but it would let you get the measure of whether or not its worth waiting for the M4 Studio or not.

At this point with the imminent release of a new studio (surely) and they have a working machine... hold.