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So, was it worth the wait?

Gomff said:
Let's face it, they're never going to make a cheaper mid range tower that cannibalizes sales from iMacs and Mac Pro's, it just doesn't make good business sense.
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So it makes business sense to alienate Mac users that find Apple doesn't make what they want to purchase? I won't buy an all in one, they just don't make sense. I don't want a laptop or pad or tablet. That leaves the mini which is really a laptop without the lap or the expensive Mac Pro. So Apple wants Mac users like me to accept less than they want by getting the mini or spending more than they have for the Mac Pro. Apple might find these Mac users opting for choice three. They could end their loyalty to Apple and change platforms.

The two groups you hear the most complaining about what they need/want from Apple are the Mac Pro crowd and the ones that want a mid range Mac. With the barely an upgrade Mac Pro that Apple just announced it sounds like Apple isn't listening to either group or just doesn't care.
 
slughead said:
It's not just fees. From what I gather, the bluray jerks want DRM built into the OS to ensure some level of copy protection.

Otherwise you could just get a 3rd party bluray disc player program for mac.
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Exactly. This all comes down to copy protection BS. I believe that's the bag of hurt Steve is referring to. All the hardware has to be HDCP-compliant. As usual, copy-protection only screws those who actually want to buy the product.
 
The dual processor mac pro jumps from 3500$ 8 core straight to 5000$ 12 core, so the 6 core probably fits somewhere between there.

If they were planning on keeping the 3700$ price tag from the 3.33 quad core, we would have seen 2.66 hexacores for 2500$, wouldnt we?
 
CaptainChunk said:
Steve thinks Blu-ray is a big bag of hurt because of licensing fees and (the part he won't admit) the fact that Blu-ray would potentially cut into iTunes movie sales. It's not about starting a moral rebellion, it's about profits. Plain and simple.
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I don't think that's true. I think Steve is just a stubborn guy who doesn't like the idea of copy protection. I gotta say, I don't like it, either.
 
Ravich said:
The dual processor mac pro jumps from 3500$ 8 core straight to 5000$ 12 core, so the 6 core probably fits somewhere between there.

If they were planning on keeping the 3700$ price tag from the 3.33 quad core, we would have seen 2.66 hexacores for 2500$, wouldnt we?
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No.

Assuming you're talking about SP systems, the W3680 is the only Hex core part that's currently available to use. Since the W3580 and W3680 are the same price, it's possible that SP model will remain the same in terms of MSRP (basically get an extra pair of cores, 1333MHz RAM, and improvements to the graphics and HDD subsystems for free). Apple approximately still gets the same margin out of it (assuming there's little to no variance between the actual parts costs with the selections for the 2010's v. 2009 costs in terms of GPU, HDD, and RAM). As those budget areas are typically set rather firmly, I doubt there's been much change at all in terms of production costs.

DP parts are more expensive just for the additional QPI channel, but the Hex core versions are quite pricey ($996 for the 2.66GHz model IIRC - and that's each BTW). Combine those with the rest of the system and Apple's idea of a sufficient margin, you get a $4999USD Dodeca machine. Releasing a Hex system off of a DP processor is just a waste of money.
 
Not exactly a waste of money unless you give up on the idea of server boards entirely. Then there is a debate. But since Apple only offers this you have no choice if you want 6 cores and 6 is better than 4. It's a balance of speed and # of cores. Really depends on what you do on your box mostly. The winner will vary.
 
Ravich said:
The dual processor mac pro jumps from 3500$ 8 core straight to 5000$ 12 core, so the 6 core probably fits somewhere between there.

If they were planning on keeping the 3700$ price tag from the 3.33 quad core, we would have seen 2.66 hexacores for 2500$, wouldnt we?
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A 6 core 3.33 from Intel is $1000 a copy in quantity.
 
Ravich said:
Ah, thanks for the explanation. What exactly do you mean by your last sentence? That the single hexacore is a bit silly?
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Using a DP processor in an SP configuration (you can run a DP processor in an SP board in this case to keep the board cost the same).

Look at it this way:
$996 gets you the DP 2.66GHz Hex core (X5650)
$999 gets you the SP 3.33GHz Hex core (W3680)

You get a faster clock for a whopping $3 !:eek: :D

In other cases, where the clocks are the same, the additional QPI channel pushes up the price of the DP models by a noticable amount compared to the SP versions.

The X5680 (3.33GHz Hex core DP part), is $1663USD each. So the increase is $664 just for the second QPI channel, and is per processor (makes a significant cost increase to produce a Dodeca model). I don't know about you, but I don't consider that cheap. :p

* Please note the prices used are from Intel's published Quantity Pricing, not necessarily what Apple actually pays.
 
You can have ECC with Phenom II. Server stuff is only needed for more than 6 cores.
 
cube said:
Server stuff is only needed for more than 6 cores.
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It's not dependent on the cores, but the usage.

For example, lets consider 3D rendering. The calculations aren't critical, even if they're iterative (same process over and over again, but the previous result isn't used to determine the successive until the end result is reached). So without ECC you could end up with a bad pixel, but it's not going to matter in the final result (not life or death situations depending on the accuracy).

In cases where the process does involve calculations based on the previous output, called recursive calculations (Result of A used to determine B, and continues infinitely or until the process ends), then ECC would be warranted. Such an example would be space navigation (think high level of cosmic radiation), as a mistake is the difference between getting it back in tact, or destroyed/lost. Definitely Life and Death if it's manned. And for this function for example, a single core is sufficient (take a look back at the early manned space missions - those computers were calculators by current standards).
 
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