Surface Devices

[TSE]

I have never used a Chromebook. Is the OS any good?

Honestly, as an outsider looking in, Microsoft is a little late to the party with cloud based OS, but they already have such strong infrastructure and cloud application ecosystem that I can see them blowing past Chrome. It depends on where ChromeOS is right now and how much effort MS wants to put into developing relationships with school systems.

 

[The_Interloper]

What do you guys think about the new Surface Laptop SE starting at $249? The base model has similar specs to the Samsung Chromebook 4 that's on sale at Micro Center for $50.

https://www.windowscentral.com/surface-laptop-se-announcement-education-pc

https://www.microcenter.com/product/624044/samsung-chromebook-4-116-laptop-computer-silver

To me, it just looks like low end tat for the education market. I think they're cheapening the Surface brand by putting the name on it. The base spec is abominable, especially the lousy screen.

 

[Pezimak]

The M1 runs games like WoW, Cities Skylines and SCII very well so anything released yesterday should be significantly better. That said they run best on Windows.

I use my M1 MM to play all of the above titles on a 34" display, no issues.

Out of interest Lee what resolution and settings do you run StarCraft 2 at?
My mind is flip flopping on what to get, but if I buy an ARM Mac I 'may' be tempted with the new 24" iMac but wait for the M2, I would want to run the MS Office suite that was from Intel Macs, StarCraft 2, Crysis which I would need to rebuy the GOG version of to run in Crossover, and then titles like Half Life 2 and 1 which I think will run in Crossover?

 

[sracer]

What do you guys think about the new Surface Laptop SE starting at $249? The base model has similar specs to the Samsung Chromebook 4 that's on sale at Micro Center for $50.

https://www.windowscentral.com/surface-laptop-se-announcement-education-pc

https://www.microcenter.com/product/624044/samsung-chromebook-4-116-laptop-computer-silver

(That Samsung chromebook is now $130 there ...still a good price IMO, but $50 was a no-brainer steal of a deal)


Back in June during Amazon's Prime Day sales, I picked up a Lenovo Chromebook 3 with the same CPU, 4GB Ram/64GB storage for $170. As a chromebook it is more than capable. Love it.

I have two Asus Vivobooks (E203MA w/ 2GB RAM, 32GB storage) and (L203MA w/4GB RAM, 64GB storage) both have a Celeron N4000 processor and run Windows 10. These are great little notebooks, love them too.

I mention these devices because they are very similar to the Surface Laptop SE.

Out of the box, the chromebook runs great. No tweaks necessary to get things running well.

For the Vivobooks, out of the box, they offer an adequate experience... not great, but adequate. But by tweaking, cleaning, and locking down updates, they are greatly improved.

All that to say, I'm excited about the Surface Laptop SE and hope to pick one up. I suspect that it'll be a dog out-of-the-box. Microsoft has demonstrated an unwillingness or inability to trim down Windows to run well on that level hardware. Because of that, it'll be DOA in the education market against chromebooks.

Yeah, yeah, I know... Microsoft's press release talks about Windows 11 SE that is supposed to be designed specifically for this hardware. Fool me once, shame one me... trying to fool my 12 times...

I have never used a Chromebook. Is the OS any good?

Honestly, as an outsider looking in, Microsoft is a little late to the party with cloud based OS, but they already have such strong infrastructure and cloud application ecosystem that I can see them blowing past Chrome. It depends on where ChromeOS is right now and how much effort MS wants to put into developing relationships with school systems.

The OS is great... for the things it is designed to do. I work in higher ed and my daughter is an elementary school teacher and we both use chromebooks in those capacities and nothing comes close.

Microsoft will fail against chromebooks in the education space. Whatever they offer will be dead on arrival. Windows has so much enterprise legacy functionality (originating from the Windows NT days) that drags Windows down... preventing it from being as nimble as it needs to be for the education market.

Microsoft can't (or won't) do the hard work to remove that functionality.

 

[LeeW]

Out of interest Lee what resolution and settings do you run StarCraft 2 at?

On the M1 Mac Mini it was running on medium settings, 3440x1440. It was ok, but not great.

 

[Pezimak]

On the M1 Mac Mini it was running on medium settings, 3440x1440. It was ok, but not great.

Hmm maybe one to wait for the M2 chip for. Unless the MB Pro's tickle my fancy when I see them in the flesh.

 

[LeeW]

Hmm maybe one to wait for the M2 chip for. Unless the MB Pro's tickle my fancy when I see them in the flesh.

Also bear in mind that quite a few developers have said they are not developing or converting for Apple Silicon, specifically Activision/Blizzard have said they have no plans to convert SC2 or other titles to Apple Silicon. That may change in the future of course but at the moment support will come to end when Rosetta2 goes.

 

[Queen6]

Also bear in mind that quite a few developers have said they are not developing or converting for Apple Silicon, specifically Activision/Blizzard have said they have no plans to convert SC2 or other titles to Apple Silicon. That may change in the future of course but at the moment support will come to end when Rosetta2 goes.

I like to think that will change, equally I can see the concerns & cost of developing for a minority within a minority. I do think that the Mac will grow, yet not significantly. TBH if any major change is to occur it has to be driven by Apple, incentivising developers to deliver Apple Silicon etc.

Rosetta2 Apple will keep as long as it needs and unless there is a significant pickup in development for Apple Silicon could well be a long while. As let's be straight for many if Rosetta2 goes away so will the Mac...

Q-6

 

[eltoslightfoot]

I like to think that will change, equally I can see the concerns & cost of developing for a minority within a minority. I do think that the Mac will grow, yet not significantly. TBH if any major change is to occur it has to be driven by Apple, incentivising developers to deliver Apple Silicon etc.

Rosetta2 Apple will keep as long as it needs and unless there is a significant pickup in development for Apple Silicon could well be a long while. As let's be straight for many if Rosetta2 goes away so will the Mac...

Q-6

I am not sure that Apple Corporate cares about the people they will lose when they drop Rosetta 2.

 

[Pezimak]

Also bear in mind that quite a few developers have said they are not developing or converting for Apple Silicon, specifically Activision/Blizzard have said they have no plans to convert SC2 or other titles to Apple Silicon. That may change in the future of course but at the moment support will come to end when Rosetta2 goes.

I didn't know that, still they'll always run in Crossover or Parallels I guess. But I don't think Apple will plan to drop Rosetta 2 anytime soon as they'll lose customers hand over fist if they did currently.

 

[LeeW]

they'll lose customers hand over fist if they did currently.

right now, still in the transition period yes, but this;

I am not sure that Apple Corporate cares about the people they will lose when they drop Rosetta 2.

Apple has clearly signalled the direction they are going in and for me at least their message is clear. Get on or get off. The middle ground provided by Rosetta won't last too long. Apple can't afford for users to get too dependent on it or it will become too difficult to take away and they want to take it away.

 

[Jacoblee23]

I purchased the I3 Surface Pro 7 plus at Walmart with the keyboard on sale for $599. This machine is pretty fast and I am very happy with it so far.

 

[Mendota]

I have never used a Chromebook. Is the OS any good?

Honestly, as an outsider looking in, Microsoft is a little late to the party with cloud based OS, but they already have such strong infrastructure and cloud application ecosystem that I can see them blowing past Chrome. It depends on where ChromeOS is right now and how much effort MS wants to put into developing relationships with school systems.

Chromebook is fine if you use Google services. If you want to use anything else it gets dicey, and this includes Android. Google does a good job of hiding what goes on behind the scenes so, I have no idea how resources are allocated. But I can tell you that running intensive apps using the Android support is very much hit and miss. Small apps run fine, but large applications and games have issues. Clip Studio runs perfectly fine on my Samsung Galaxy 8 and 7. On Chromebook there are issues, and it stutters and crashes. I am forced to keep files sizes down. The same with larger games. I even had some issues with MS Office. Mind you I was using the top-of-the-line Samsung Chromebook with 8 gigs of ram and 256 SSD. An actual SSD. I thought the sky would be the limit with that setup... Not so much. I like to have all systems, but I just haven't been able to get as much out of the Chromebook as I had hoped.

 

[GSWForever8]

I have never used a Chromebook. Is the OS any good?

Honestly, as an outsider looking in, Microsoft is a little late to the party with cloud based OS, but they already have such strong infrastructure and cloud application ecosystem that I can see them blowing past Chrome. It depends on where ChromeOS is right now and how much effort MS wants to put into developing relationships with school systems.

Chrome book is just terrible. Everything is crazy slow, boot times take forever, and it’s just a pain to use(or at least at my school). I would recommend an iPad or a PC over it.

 

[TSE]

Chrome book is just terrible. Everything is crazy slow, boot times take forever, and it’s just a pain to use(or at least at my school). I would recommend an iPad or a PC over it.

I'm not in the market for a Chromebook, they don't line up with my usage at all. But as someone that hasn't been around education or government sectors (the industries that chromebooks look like they are doing well), it's just interesting to me that they sort of leapfrogged Macs in education, and Windows in government.

 

[mi7chy]

Chrome book is just terrible. Everything is crazy slow, boot times take forever, and it’s just a pain to use(or at least at my school). I would recommend an iPad or a PC over it.

Schools tend to buy dirt cheap Chromebooks so the experience isn't going to be great. iPad is useless if you need a full desktop browser which Chromebooks offer. PC can be overkill if the requirement only needs to access cloud based services.

 

[eltoslightfoot]

The public school system where my kids go to school use old intel macbooks. They are SLOWWWWWWWWWWW. But still better than Chromebooks. LOL.

 

[MiniApple]

(gorgeous) satin/matte black Surface Go 3 LTE to be released

If I ever need an out and about tablet or all in one device again, it will be a black surface go, hopefully ARM based by then though.

 

[sracer]

(gorgeous) satin/matte black Surface Go 3 LTE to be released

If I ever need an out and about tablet or all in one device again, it will be a black surface go, hopefully ARM based by then though.

I agree. That looks really nice. (I agree with your ARM hopes) I still have a soft spot in my heart (some would say, in my head) for the Surface RT. It was the Zune tablet that many of us Zune fans were waiting for. The Metro UI (then Modern UI) of Win 8 was the logical successor to the UI on the Zune. Then with a tap of the screen, it converted to a desktop UI.

 

[grmlin]

wrong thread

 

[coffee06]

I’ve got a Surface Pro 4 and like pretty much everything about it except the battery. It drains when it’s off and nothing seems to help. So, it goes thru battery cycles fast, resulting in killing the battery. I have about 40 min on a full charge now. It’s always absolutely dead when I pick it up to use unless it’s plugged in. Just love the size and the keyboard though. It’s not my daily driver but nice for trips.

 

[eltoslightfoot]

That is legitimately the one thing I really miss about the macbook and ipad solution I was using. The battery life. Then I realized I am plugged in at my desk most of the time...still I keep hoping the Surface Pro 9 will give me some real battery life.

 

[Technerd108]

I have never used a Chromebook. Is the OS any good?

Honestly, as an outsider looking in, Microsoft is a little late to the party with cloud based OS, but they already have such strong infrastructure and cloud application ecosystem that I can see them blowing past Chrome. It depends on where ChromeOS is right now and how much effort MS wants to put into developing relationships with school systems.

To answer your Chrome OS question is the OS any good, yes it is great depending on what you want to do with it.

Chrome OS has several advantages over other Operating systems like the fact that it is by design much more secure than MacOS or Windows, It has a Debian Linux base so you can install Linux and use Linux applications like Libre Office and Gimp or install Steam and play games if the hardware allows. The OS is instant on and backs everything you do up to the cloud in real time. Getting set up with a new Chromebook takes a few minutes with all updates included on the first run! Once set up the device is pretty much instant on. Updates are quick and new features are added all the time.

Comparatively speaking if you do your homework you can find a decent Chromebook with as good or better specs than a comparably priced Windows Laptop. All new hardware Chromebook get 8 years of software updates, and new features. Don't go cheap. Get an Acer spin 713 or any Chromebook with at least an 11th gen i5, 8gb ram, and ssd storage and NOT Emmc!!

Now the software limitations that ChromeOS has. It is extremely secure but not very private. If privacy is a major concern then a Chromebook is probably not the best although I personally think this is an overblown problem. Some hardware peripherals do not work well with Chromebook and file structure is not very mature. You can't do a lot of things that you can in Windows.

That being said 99% of people could do 99% of their work and play on a Chromebook as their only device with little problems.

I still prefer Windows and if I could only choose between ChromeOS or Windows it would be Windows although the 8 years of support it really good.

 

[Thysanoptera]

I saw the news that Micron came up with 2TB single sided 2230 ssd, and I bought 7+ to complement my MBP 14. From Costco, with keyboard/pen for 900, base i5/8/128, it was on sale earlier but at that moment I didn't think 1TB is going to cut it for me. That concludes my experiment with minipc to get x86 VMs running. I went with 7+ instead of 8 because it is lighter and has USB-A. Just setting it up in an airport bar, neat little machine. Flight delayed, got a little too many beers I guess.

 

[kave]

Two years ago I bought a Surface Book 2 to use as a Windows notebook. From time to time I pick it up but get really tired of the tablet usage. As a notebook its ok, but tablet use is horrible. I forced install Windows 11 on it because it wasnt supported ?!?! and now the tablet mode is gone, which was more or less crap anyway. As an avid Mac and iPad user the UI is so terrible. Until you cant use it you never realise how often all the shortcuts in the iPad os is used, like adjusting the screen brightness. In win11 it returns to 100% every time the screen is rotated needing adjustment from the control panel. I would never buy one again.