Surface Pro X

[Queen6]

That's poorly written IMO

Probably as many have quite low power USB-C chargers on their phones where Samsung standard fast charger is similar output to my GO charger

Same for the pro it will only trickle charge if your USB-C charger is a low power unit compared to the one supplied

80% charge in one hour rather makes it all redundant, given this notebooks charger (230W) likely weighs in same as if not more than the X 😄

Q-6

 

[TomOSeven]

Why aren't any of you talking about the ludicrous upgrade prices?
Not even Apple has the audacity to charge 300 € for a 128 GB SSD upgrade in 2019. That's completely ridiculous.

 

[dwig]

I've yet to see, or been able to find, anything from MS detailing what services are supported by the USB-C ports. It's known that TB3 is not supported, but they are vague about other services. They imply DisplayPort Alt Mode, they offer an 3.5mm audio adapter/dongle and it's safe to assume USB data, but is it 3.1gen1 or 3.1gen2? Also, they don't mention USB-PD. The rumor is that PD is supported, but their new "fast charge, 80% in an hour" is via the Surface connector only, but there's no statement from MS to confirm.

The big deal breaker for me, other than the price, is the lack of support for 64 bit x86 apps. Maybe in a few years the apps I need will be available as native ARM, but they aren't there now.

 

[maflynn]

The big deal breaker for me, other than the price, is the lack of support for 64 bit x86 apps. Maybe in a few years the apps I need will be available as native ARM, but they aren't there now.

This is my issue as well without the apps I need, I won't be considering the X

 

[SteveJUAE]

Why aren't any of you talking about the ludicrous upgrade prices?
Not even Apple has the audacity to charge 300 € for a 128 GB SSD upgrade in 2019. That's completely ridiculous.

Maybe for many who do not have to buy a MBA+IPP and saving > $500 the $100 pales in to insignificance

 

[booksbooks]

So what're your thoughts on this one? This really has piqued my interest and I can see it as a replacement for my iPad and can double up quite successfully as a laptop. Moreso than the surface pro 7.

Big 13 inch screen, 3 by 2 aspect (which I love)
8 or 16GB DDR4
Up to 512GB SSD
LTE
Runs standard Windows 10, although I believe it comes with Pro as it is more aimed at business
Swap out the SSD with ease

But, the SQ1 chip, there must be limitations there, just not sure what they are yet. I suspect though it should be a good performer and push the battery to last more than than the pro.

This unit just seems a bit more like a proper tablet/laptop hybrid than the Surface Pro or in fact, the iPad will ever be.

The Surface Pro X is killing the iPad Pro.

1. The built in Stylus to the keyboard cover.
2. The slick design.
3. The built-in stand.
4. The Stylus with eraser on the back.
5. The keyboard cover is so much better than Apple's or anything available for Apple's, from a materials standpoint and also it has a decent trackpad and keyboard backlighting. The trackpad only makes sense here because of the software.

I hate Windows but wish Apple was at this point with design: Microsoft's design is simply better in many respects. The iPad is at a breaking point here mainly because it has no built in kickstand. This is a big part of what makes the Surface Pro line so much better as it makes the device much more usable out of the box. The iPad struggles with crappy keyboard covers and ugly, awkward stands that don't even come close to the degrees of freedom of the built in Surface Pro stand.

The blank slate iPad was cool, and got us a long way... but at this point, the iPad design needs to be more functional... and so far, Apple is just behind the curve.

 

[thejadedmonkey]

Yeah, I would be looking at mid-2020 anyway, happy with the S940 and the iPad for now, if it was intel rather than arm I could have changed that but I am not keen on being an early adopter. There has to be a translator between Windows and the CPU and I would want to see how that fairs at someone elses expense

That's the HAL layer, which allows Windows to run on any CPU architecture. I think what you mean is the translation layer that's part of the silicon, that will translate (not emulate, emulation is slower) 32bit x32 calls into ARM API calls. This means any 32bit software can work, although low level software such as drivers probably won't.

 

[TomOSeven]

The Surface Pro X is killing the iPad Pro.

1. The built in Stylus to the keyboard cover.
2. The slick design.
3. The built-in stand.
4. The Stylus with eraser on the back.
5. The keyboard cover is so much better than Apple's or anything available for Apple's, from a materials standpoint and also it has a decent trackpad and keyboard backlighting. The trackpad only makes sense here because of the software.

I feel like those points are mostly valid if you consider the tablet a laptop replacement and not an addition to a laptop. That's certainly how Apple is marketing the iPad, but that's not what it was originally intended for. There's no question that the Surface line does the 'one device for everything' thing better than the iPad line does, but as someone who does 85% of his work on a laptop, it's a much closer race.

 

[LeeW]

That's certainly how Apple is marketing the iPad, but that's not what it was originally intended for.

To be fair, the iPad is a great tablet, it is also a great laptop replacement for some but now it is also great for creatives and some other groups as an extended display for a number of applications. I saw a friend do a video where she started a drawing in affinity, then via sidecar did some pen work, then a bit more on the desktop and so on. She says it makes a significant difference in how refined her work is. Not that she couldn't do that before, now it is so much more fluid.

Its got versatility, I can appreciate that on the iPad.

 

[Mendota]

So what're your thoughts on this one? This really has piqued my interest and I can see it as a replacement for my iPad and can double up quite successfully as a laptop. Moreso than the surface pro 7.

Big 13 inch screen, 3 by 2 aspect (which I love)
8 or 16GB DDR4
Up to 512GB SSD
LTE
Runs standard Windows 10, although I believe it comes with Pro as it is more aimed at business
Swap out the SSD with ease

But, the SQ1 chip, there must be limitations there, just not sure what they are yet. I suspect though it should be a good performer and push the battery to last more than than the pro.

This unit just seems a bit more like a proper tablet/laptop hybrid than the Surface Pro or in fact, the iPad will ever be.

I think I will be picking it up. I still have my Surface 3 that I use for mobile computing and run apps mostly from the store. It works quite well and the Office from the store is fully functional and Affinity Photo also has a store app. There is actually a lot on the Microsoft store despite what the haters say. And at least most of it is non freemium.

 

[SteveJUAE]

To be fair, the iPad is a great tablet, it is also a great laptop replacement for some but now it is also great for creatives and some other groups as an extended display for a number of applications. I saw a friend do a video where she started a drawing in affinity, then via sidecar did some pen work, then a bit more on the desktop and so on. She says it makes a significant difference in how refined her work is. Not that she couldn't do that before, now it is so much more fluid.

Its got versatility, I can appreciate that on the iPad.

I can see where you are coming from but from a SP perspective you can be using your chosen prog (eg Adobe) and finish the entire project on your device or use it as a second screen and finish or use complimentary prog on a Mac or Win10 laptop/desktop etc.

With just one KB/Mouse etc, up to 15 I think linked cross platform devices are allowed at one time

IPP has very few highs and many lows compared to full OS devices an these little niche and limited conveniences are reliant on single source purchases

Step in to full OS combo and there are far more options for all professionals and creatives.

Lets not forget the IPP are not a budget device and while it has many apps it has limited progs and structure where most of us working lives live in

 

[Queen6]

Lets not forget the IPP are not a budget device and while it has many apps it has limited progs and structure where most of us working lives live in

That my issue as I'd ultimately be reaching for a system with a full OS at the end of the day. If I did opt for an IPP it would very likely just be used mostly for consumption or someone else would snag due lack of use. (been there done that 😄)

W10 2in1's are evolving at pace, with the likes of Surface Pro X & Neo being at the forefront...

Q-6

 

[LeeW]

You know I was saying how the only device I have left with macOS was the Mac Mini and that it was the the best of bad lot? Yeah...

Catalina causing issues with HDMI

Just for those that are having issues with HDMI - HDMI video connections after upgrading to Catalina, eventually managed to get beyond basic support level and spoke to someone who appeared way more knowledgeable. Many are having issues getting a basic HDMI connection to work at all or only...

forums.macrumors.com

 

[skaertus]

So what're your thoughts on this one? This really has piqued my interest and I can see it as a replacement for my iPad and can double up quite successfully as a laptop. Moreso than the surface pro 7.

Big 13 inch screen, 3 by 2 aspect (which I love)
8 or 16GB DDR4
Up to 512GB SSD
LTE
Runs standard Windows 10, although I believe it comes with Pro as it is more aimed at business
Swap out the SSD with ease

But, the SQ1 chip, there must be limitations there, just not sure what they are yet. I suspect though it should be a good performer and push the battery to last more than than the pro.

This unit just seems a bit more like a proper tablet/laptop hybrid than the Surface Pro or in fact, the iPad will ever be.

This looks promising. It is probably the closest thing to a hybrid laptop/tablet which I have heard of.

Apple has advanced considerably with the introduction of the iPadOS. However, Microsoft's offering seems to be more compelling. It has built-in LTE, and runs Windows 10 like a PC. And it should be priced similarly to the 12.9-inch iPad Pro, while offering the power of a real PC.

I will not buy one right away. ARM on Windows is still on its infancy. We will probably see better options as time goes by. Other manufacturers will jump in, and Intel will certainly counter-attack. And it is yet unclear to me which route Apple will take with the Mac (Apple will have to offer better battery life and LTE support shortly, otherwise the Mac will fall behind). And dual screens seem to be coming for real. I will wait a little bit to see what will happen before making a choice, as the PC landscape may significantly change in a very short period of time.

 

[KarmaRocket]

Surface Pro X design looks quite impressive. I'd be a little concerned how Windows software runs on the new ARM chip. Might need some time for devs to update their apps to run on it smoothly.

Surface Pro X with Intel Ice Lake would be very tempting though.

 

[csurfr]

I’m not sure if the X is in stores yet, and I’ve not checked our store on campus, but I’ve seen a couple people on the way to work using the X, and I’m really liking it.

The bezels are quite thin and the screen was very bright, charging the pen in the keyboard is slick. I’m curious as to how it runs with the new architecture.

 

[kazmac]

I think it's due in stores on the 5th (though I've also seen the 19th - maybe the 19th is 3rd party sellers?)

I would have loved this myself, but the Arm chip isn't something I want to dive into yet, especially until I am more familiar with Windows.

 

[TomOSeven]

Microsoft should really offer a dirt cheap Surface Go X to get as many people as possible interested in Windows on ARM again. Tech junkies still remember the Surface RT disaster, and likely don’t want to get burned again. Normies, on the other hand, likely don’t want to invest 1500 in a god damn tablet.

I’m still not entirely clear on what will run on this. At first you thought it’s safe to assume that any app that has a a 32 bit version would run, but now I hear that OpenGL and directX aren’t supported.

I need VSCode, a full version of Firefox (with Unlock), Youtube-DL, Löve2d, Asesprite, etc. A Udemy app on the Windows Store would be a dream, also.

 

[maflynn]

Microsoft should really offer a dirt cheap Surface Go X

Interesting concept, I've been re-thinking my tablet choices lately. I was all set to eventually upgrade to the newer iPad pro when they come out, but with my iPad pros dealing with white spots, and current models bending so easily. I'm probably going to pass on it. Besides, I was having difficulty integrating the iPad into my workflow in the office, it was not behaving like a computer (limitations of iPadOS) and I felt perhaps something that can run windows and office would be better.

Long story short, a cheaper Surface Go X, would certainly fit the bill.

 

[kazmac]

Interesting concept, I've been re-thinking my tablet choices lately. I was all set to eventually upgrade to the newer iPad pro when they come out, but with my iPad pros dealing with white spots, and current models bending so easily. I'm probably going to pass on it. Besides, I was having difficulty integrating the iPad into my workflow in the office, it was not behaving like a computer (limitations of iPadOS) and I felt perhaps something that can run windows and office would be better.

Long story short, a cheaper Surface Go X, would certainly fit the bill.

All solid reasons to skip. I picked up another Air for art, but intend to start learning/using cross platform art programs. My goal is eventually switch over to a PC and a Surface Pro or a Wacom tablet.

Rethinking upgrading OS for my Apple stuff and there's no way I'd buy an iPad Pro due to build quality, buggy software and that excessive price point.

Not a fan of MS copying those Apple price points either.

That said, I am curious to hear what you pick up.

 

[Bodie CI5]

Dieter Bohn at The Verge gave 6.5/10 for Surface Pro X

Surface Pro X Review - The Verge

Unlike previous attempts at ARM, Windows itself runs quite well on the Surface Pro X. But like previous attempts, Microsoft hasn’t done enough to offset the compromises this aspirational computer asks of customers.

 

[kazmac]

Boy, that review is more disappointing than expected. And a cracked screen to boot. Tune in next year...maybe?

 

[cardfan]

Dieter Bohn at The Verge gave 6.5/10 for Surface Pro X

Surface Pro X Review - The Verge

You already knew the story and could basically write this review upon hearing it was 64bit arm.

What is surprising is to see the shock or dismay going around. Even Microsoft office won’t run natively on it.

And so the basic problem is who is going to spend money to develop apps for an architecture that hardly anyone will buy? Not when you have a cheaper intel version that runs everything.

 

[kazmac]

To be fair, I know very little about Arm chips and Windows.

My only experience is with Apple's Arm chips which hasn't been always been smooth. So I appreciate reviews like the Verge which clearly point out what more exoerienced users already know.

 

[skaertus]

You already knew the story and could basically write this review upon hearing it was 64bit arm.

What is surprising is to see the shock or dismay going around. Even Microsoft office won’t run natively on it.

And so the basic problem is who is going to spend money to develop apps for an architecture that hardly anyone will buy? Not when you have a cheaper intel version that runs everything.

Well, other reviews are out as well, and they do not seem to be as negative as this one.

Microsoft Surface Pro X Review: Powerful Computer, but So-So Tablet (Published 2019)

With its new Surface, Microsoft has made progress blending the best of mobile devices and personal computers. But it falls short in offering a fingertip-friendly experience for tablets.

www.nytimes.com

Microsoft Surface Pro X review: Sleek, but software hasn't caught up yet

A sharp Surface redesign with a clever hidden stylus, but price and compatibility may be red flags.

www.cnet.com

Surface Pro X review: Gorgeous hardware marred by buggy software

For years now, the Surface Pro has been the best Windows 2-in-1. It delivers a useful, familiar desktop environment for multitasking in a lightweight tablet body. But the line hasn't changed much physically since the Pro 4. A serious redesign is beyond overdue, and thankfully Microsoft is ready...

www.engadget.com

Microsoft's Surface Pro X Goes Full Batman

From the moment I opened up the Surface Pro X, I got the sense that Microsoft had entered a new chapter for its homegrown hardware. Gone are the huge

gizmodo.com

Most of reviewers complain about the poor performance, software incompatibility, and high price for the package.

It looks like a beautiful machine, and a shift to ARM is perhaps inevitable, as these processors become increasingly more powerful and efficient, while Intel is still struggling to improve its architecture.

Apple is clearly moving towards ARM, it just has not yet announced any ARM Mac yet. There are Windows machines already, but perhaps it is still a little too early to adopt it.

I remember when Microsoft first unveiled the Surface back in 2012, and it was poorly received. Everybody was ready to deem it as a huge failure. It eventually got much better, and now Microsoft managed to create a reasonably successful line of Surface devices. It is not a huge hit, but it has its reputation.

That is to say that the Surface Pro X does not seem bad at all, but perhaps it is the first step in a move to ARM. It may not make sense now, as ARM processors are evolving fast, and 5G Internet is not widely available in these devices. But in a few years, it is possible that ARM Windows computers take over (and ARM Macs as well).