Swithcing to Nikon, advice on new gear and setup

[leighonigar]

They are the same Nikon AF module, exactly. What may be different about the AF performance (slight as that may be) is the dual x-speed chip of the D3 compared to the single chip on the Dxxx series.
The battery grip increases the fps for the D300/D700, but hardly has anything to do with autofocus speed. I'm sure the current/voltage applied to the AF processor and module is highly regulated internally, and not user controllable by throwing on a battery pack.

From Thom Hogan's D700 review:

"For those not yet in the know, the D300 autofocus system uses a slightly less beefy CPU and tends to have a bigger hesitation prior to locking in initial focus than does the D3. The answer is that the D700 seems much more like the D3 than the D300, though it clearly seems to be between them in performance. My D3 snaps into initial autofocus faster than my D700, which does so faster than my D300. In terms of following subjects, the D700 and D3 seem to be equal there, with the D300 being very slightly less capable."

but they all have the CAM3500.

 

[peskaa]

From Thom Hogan's D700 review:

"For those not yet in the know, the D300 autofocus system uses a slightly less beefy CPU and tends to have a bigger hesitation prior to locking in initial focus than does the D3. The answer is that the D700 seems much more like the D3 than the D300, though it clearly seems to be between them in performance. My D3 snaps into initial autofocus faster than my D700, which does so faster than my D300. In terms of following subjects, the D700 and D3 seem to be equal there, with the D300 being very slightly less capable."

but they all have the CAM3500.

I quoted that EXACT thing half a page back. Do you guys not read other posts? The fact of the matter is that Nikon use the same sensor across their higher end cameras, but the processors are different which leads to a real-life difference in speed between the models.

 

[pdxflint]

I quoted that EXACT thing half a page back. Do you guys not read other posts? The fact of the matter is that Nikon use the same sensor across their higher end cameras, but the processors are different which leads to a real-life difference in speed between the models.

Get over yourself... if you want credit, fine. You quoted it first.

 

[peskaa]

Get over yourself... if you want credit, fine. You quoted it first.

More that the "argument" seems to be going round in circles...

 

[pdxflint]

More that the "argument" seems to be going round in circles...

Agreed. It's kind of like beating a dead horse. Sorry about my last comment.

 

[Razeus]

I decided to stick with my Canon setup and wait for the 60D. Nikon cameras are ridiculous and deciphering their lens codes is insane. With Canon, it's way more clear cut.

 

[pdxflint]

I decided to stick with my Canon setup and wait for the 60D. Nikon cameras are ridiculous and deciphering their lens codes is insane. With Canon, it's way more clear cut.

I happen to like my 'ridiculous' Nikon and my difficult to understand AF f/2.8 and f/4 pro lenses. But I'll admit, it's got to be hard to know a pro-quality lens from a basic consumer lens without a big initial tacked onto the name. With the Nikkors you have to actually go based on comparing build quality, optical quality and not a certain designation. Anyway, you undoubtedly made the right choice.

 

[Westside guy]

I decided to stick with my Canon setup and wait for the 60D. Nikon cameras are ridiculous and deciphering their lens codes is insane. With Canon, it's way more clear cut.

I think you made the right choice, given your initial situation - although I do think the last two sentences come across as rather silly and fanboy-ish.

 

[deep diver]

Great options.... though I have reason to beleive that 18-105 is better optical option (optically) than the 18-200.... I haven't used the latter, but heard bad things about its performance at the ends. 18-105 seems to be a marginally better walk-around.

Please correct me if I'm wrong.

OP, if you decide to go with Nikon, this would be a solid starting point. Good Luck!!

I use my 18-200 almost exclusively. It is not pro glass and was never intended to be. It is a very good lens. I have had no problems at the ends. The negative comments I've seen are from people that are generally dismissive of lenses that are not professional quality.

Razeus -- you are more than experienced enough. You are not going to make a bad choice.

 

[jbernie]

I decided to stick with my Canon setup and wait for the 60D. Nikon cameras are ridiculous and deciphering their lens codes is insane. With Canon, it's way more clear cut.

Based on your signature I am wondering if your lens choice may or may not have been the best for your needs, regardless of the issues you have the 50D body.
- 50mm 1.8 (not bad, but you get what you pay for)
- 28-105 f/4
- 70-200 f/4 (non IS? can't tell, IS would be a much better option)

Either way, $$ you can't win selling these lenses and then going out and buying Nikon ones unless you buy used to keep your price down,

Also, could you have the body serviced by Canon? Is that even an option for the banding issue you describe? (asking as I don't know)

For now sitting tight is the better option, if Canon & Nikon are approaching the release of new gear you are much better off waiting it out and saving more money so whatever you end up doing is at least a more informed decision.

 

[sidewinder]

I decided to stick with my Canon setup and wait for the 60D. Nikon cameras are ridiculous and deciphering their lens codes is insane. With Canon, it's way more clear cut.

Why can't you make a decision without bashing the brand you chose against?

What exactly is ridiculous about Nikon cameras? What is so hard about understanding Nikkor lens nomenclature?

S-

 

[wheelhot]

I decided to stick with my Canon setup and wait for the 60D. Nikon cameras are ridiculous and deciphering their lens codes is insane. With Canon, it's way more clear cut.

Hmm, the question now is, what will the 60D be, the 550D is way close to the 7D in terms of specs and many say it has similar IQ, seriously, I don't get why Canon give in my opinion a 60D spec (minus the all cross points found on xxD series) on a 550D.

And I agree that Nikon terms is a bit hard to understand but after awhile you'll get use to it, on the other hand, the lens names in my opinion is getting more standardize don't you think?

Nikkor AF-(S/D) (Focal Length) (Aperture) (ED/VR/N - and the rest of Nikon terms)

AF-S means it is those new Nikkor lenses that allows FTM, loses Aperture ring
AF-D is the older Nikon lens which has an aperture ring.

The last bracket, ED/VR/N - rest of Nikon terms and not to confuse you, but you can ignore it for now until you understand Nikon terminology more.

So basically the most important stuffs to understand when looking for Nikon glass is if it's AF-S or AF-D and if it matters, VR listed in the lens name. The rest of the tags like IF, ED and etc. usually is not important unless you got some needs.

 

[H2Ockey]

And I agree that Nikon terms is a bit hard to understand but after awhile you'll get use to it, on the other hand, the lens names in my opinion is getting more standardize don't you think?

Nikkor AF-(S/D) (Focal Length) (Aperture) (ED/VR/N - and the rest of Nikon terms)

AF-S means it is those new Nikkor lenses that allows FTM, loses Aperture ring
AF-D is the older Nikon lens which has an aperture ring.

The last bracket, ED/VR/N - rest of Nikon terms and not to confuse you, but you can ignore it for now until you understand Nikon terminology more.

So basically the most important stuffs to understand when looking for Nikon glass is if it's AF-S or AF-D and if it matters, VR listed in the lens name. The rest of the tags like IF, ED and etc. usually is not important unless you got some needs.

Um... not to be nitpicky but no.

AF-S is "Auto Focus - Silent Wave Motor" the Lens has an internal focusing motor.

AF-D is Auto Focus - (I don't recall what the D is for exactly but was an upgrade at one point) can still find some of the same lenses as AF and AF-D such as the 80-200mm.

'G' lenses with the G at the end of the whole mess of a name is the designation for the lacking Aperture ring. Many of the kit lenses which happen to be AF-S lenses are also G lenses which may be the source fo the confusion.

ED is the designation for the low dispersion glass coating. Flare prevention.

IF is internal focusing. Nothing external moves or extends during focus (this does not mean nothing moves during zooming however) I have a 24-85 IF but the barrel of the lens moves during zoom but not focus. I have a 28-80mm G with which the barrel of the lens moves in and out for zoom AND focus.

VR is vibration reduction, same as canon OS and Sigma IS or did I get that reversed.

Oh and DX for the use on cropped sensors... handiest piece of info to have in the name if you have a film/full frame camera.

 

[SLC Flyfishing]

Nikon lens jargon isn't hard to understand. But what might seem confusing for a Canon minded person is that they don't designate between their "Pro" and "Non-Pro" lenses. But I mean come on, can't you tell by looking at the specs and the price which ones are "Pro" oriented lenses and which one's aren't?

I guess that with Nikon there's just not that big of a disconnect between lens grades, and no need to say "this one's much higher quality than that one, it says L on it". All Nikon glass, outside the consumer kit lenses, is top notch.

Either way, you've probably made the right choice with staying put. Hopefully your 60D (when it's announced and arrives) doesn't have banding issues as well.

SLC

 

[pdxflint]

Well, to make it a bit more accurate on the Nikkor nomenclature: basically their lineage works in this order:

There are basically two general types of Nikkor AF lenses; original screw drive lenses (AF) and later built-in motor drive lenses (AF-I/AF-S.)

1) AF = Autofocus lens (screw drive) - first AF lenses from Nikon.

2a) AF-I = Autofocus lens with an integrated coreless motor. These were the first Nikkors with integrated AF motors (1992) and were D-types (see 'D' below.)

2b) AF-S = Autofocus lens with built in 'silent wave' AF motor. Basically an update to the AF-I (1996.) These are newer designs and also include distance information to camera. They may or may not have aperture rings. (Two examples are the AF-S 17-35mm f/2.8 'ED' (w/ aperture ring) and the AF-S 17-55 f/2.8 G 'ED' 'DX.' (no aperture ring - G designation, see below.))

--------------------------------------------
Within the two basic types of AF lenses listed above, are several acronyms that can either be included in the lens name, or can be seen on the lens as gold letters; 'D', 'G', 'ED', 'N', 'DX', 'VR' and others. They can apply to various distinguishing characteristics of the lenses, such as 'distance' communication, aperture design, extra-low dispersion lens elements, etc...

'D' = AF lenses (screw drive or AF-I) with (D)istance information transmitted electronically to camera, works with 3-D metering, flash, etc. This is usually seen on older design lenses of the screw-drive type, although many are still currently available new. (AF Nikkor 80-200mm f/2.8 D is an example.)

'G' = AF lenses without aperture ring. These would be like Canon AF lenses, everything is electronic. All the newer lenses, kit and pro, are AF-S lenses with 'G' designation. 'G' lenses also transmit distance information electronically to the camera (replaced 'D' in newer lenses.)

'VR' = vibration reduction. Same thing as image stabilization.

'DX' = AF lenses designed for DX bodies (crop sensor.)

'ED' = extra-low dispersion lens elements in the lens.

'N' = nano coating on lens elements. This is newer.

There are other acronyms like 'IF' for internal focusing, 'RF' for rear element focusing, 'DC' for defocus control which may be seen on some specialty lenses. The designation 'FX' hasn't been actually used on lenses yet, but it has informally been used to describe lenses that will cover a full-frame (FX) sensor with their image circle. If it doesn't have a 'DX' on it, it's basically a non-labeled 'FX' lens. All original film (35mm) lenses are, of course, 'FX' if you use this informal designation for "full frame."

Yes, it's a bit confusing when you are confronted with all the variations, but it also can be understood once you know more about how the Nikon AF lenses developed over the years. Every lens tells a lot about it by its name and the designation labels on it.

BTW, for trivia's sake: older Nikkor manual lenses often had a letter which designated the number of lens elements in the lens, but that's no longer the case.

 

[wheelhot]

Um... not to be nitpicky but no.

AF-S is "Auto Focus - Silent Wave Motor" the Lens has an internal focusing motor.

AF-D is Auto Focus - (I don't recall what the D is for exactly but was an upgrade at one point) can still find some of the same lenses as AF and AF-D such as the 80-200mm.

'G' lenses with the G at the end of the whole mess of a name is the designation for the lacking Aperture ring. Many of the kit lenses which happen to be AF-S lenses are also G lenses which may be the source fo the confusion.

ED is the designation for the low dispersion glass coating. Flare prevention.

IF is internal focusing. Nothing external moves or extends during focus (this does not mean nothing moves during zooming however) I have a 24-85 IF but the barrel of the lens moves during zoom but not focus. I have a 28-80mm G with which the barrel of the lens moves in and out for zoom AND focus.

VR is vibration reduction, same as canon OS and Sigma IS or did I get that reversed.

Oh and DX for the use on cropped sensors... handiest piece of info to have in the name if you have a film/full frame camera.

Yeah, u and pdxflint wrote it better then I did and u got the OS and IS thing reversed

These days, I think Nikon is starting to get their lens name standardized, so everything will be ok in the future I hope

 

[Westside guy]

I think Nikon uses the "gold ring" to indicate what they consider their pro glass.

Nikon does like to use a lot of initials in their lens names - I think there are advantages and disadvantages to that. Thom Hogan has an excellent and thorough explanation of Nikon's lens acronyms.

 

[Ruahrc]

I don't know if Nikon has any more acronyms and symbols than Canon, but for some reason they tend to hang on in people's descriptions of lenses vs. Canon where a lot of people cut them off, only really using IS and L with any regularity.

 

[pdxflint]

I think Nikon uses the "gold ring" to indicate what they consider their pro glass.

Nikon does like to use a lot of initials in their lens names - I think there are advantages and disadvantages to that. Thom Hogan has an excellent and thorough explanation of Nikon's lens acronyms.

That might be true on their latest crop of pro lenses, but my 80-200 f/2.8 (still being sold) doesn't have the gold ring and neither does my 300mm f/4, which is an older design, but definitely still a pro quality lens in build quality and optical quality. Maybe they've started using a gold ring more recently to differentiate 'pro' quality vs. consumer lenses, but it certainly hasn't been a tradition in the past, unlike the red ring and "L" with Canon.

 

[OreoCookie]

Nikon cameras are ridiculous and deciphering their lens codes is insane. With Canon, it's way more clear cut.

??
Just because Canon has an official designation for `pro' lenses doesn't mean it's more confusing or less confusing. Unless all you look for is L. Within the Canon pro line-up, the lenses all have different features, e. g. some lenses have weather seals while other L lenses don't. The easiest differentiator is still the price, though

 

[compuwar]

That might be true on their latest crop of pro lenses, but my 80-200 f/2.8 (still being sold) doesn't have the gold ring and neither does my 300mm f/4, which is an older design, but definitely still a pro quality lens in build quality and optical quality. Maybe they've started using a gold ring more recently to differentiate 'pro' quality vs. consumer lenses, but it certainly hasn't been a tradition in the past, unlike the red ring and "L" with Canon.

It doesn't matter much in either case- you still need to evaluate each lens on a case-by-case basis. For instance, Nikon thinks the 80-400VR and Canon thinks the 100-400IS are both "Pro" lenses, despite them being variable aperture and relatively soft (I've shot with both and own one, they're "Prosumer" lenses which don't hold a candle to the actual pro lenses at the long end of their focal lengths other than being about 1/7 the price.)

Just because they're not top-of-the-line doesn't mean you can't get great images out of them, but they're noticeably less sharp than the 400/2.8s or in the case of Nikon even the 200-400/4 and Canon the 400/5.6 that are the "pro" tier lenses at 400mm.

Paul

 

[sidewinder]

...Nikon thinks the 80-400VR and Canon thinks the 100-400IS are both "Pro" lenses...

Nikon, and no one else but you it seems, thinks the 80-400mm is a Pro lens.

S-

 

[pdxflint]

Nikon, and no one else but you it seems, thinks the 80-400mm is a Pro lens.

S-

Maybe go back and read compuwar's post a little more carefully... he said it was a prosumer lens. Honest.

Besides, does Nikon actually call it a "pro" lens? I don't think they make that distinction for the customer with a special designation, unlike Canon. That's why some non-Nikon people are confused about Nikkor lenses due to their not having some tell-tale visual designation or 'initial.' But if you simply check out their lineup and consider your needs, as a pro would do, you'll easily see which lenses make the grade, even without a label.

 

[leighonigar]

I quoted that EXACT thing half a page back. Do you guys not read other posts? The fact of the matter is that Nikon use the same sensor across their higher end cameras, but the processors are different which leads to a real-life difference in speed between the models.

Evidently I did not read every word. I tend to skim-read, and mistakenly assume that 'quotes' are quotes from the thread. My apologies. It is a good, clear quote though.

 

[compuwar]

Nikon, and no one else but you it seems, thinks the 80-400mm is a Pro lens.

S-

Perhaps you should try READING what I posted, I'm pretty sure I didn't use any big words.

I own the 80-400VR- and I called it a prosumer lens. Nikon put a gold ring on it- but it's not (in my opinion) worthy of being called a "Pro" lens. I also own the 400mm f/2.8 AF-S II, which IS a pro lens. I'm quite aware of the differences, currently owning and having shot quite a bit with both lenses.

Paul