TB MBP - will you use your return window?

[New_Mac_Smell]

I just

I just meant USB C is becoming the norm these days
The 2015 may not be as future proof

It's just different cables though. USB-C is based on USB though, so it's always backwards compatible. It's unlikely you'll see mass adoption of the Thunderbolt 3 side of things (That you should focus on) as this will be more costly. It's only now most things are USB-3, but very few USB-3 speeds. So what I mean is you can still buy and use USB-C devices, just may not be able to take full advantage of it.

 

[jmebbk]

It's just different cables though. USB-C is based on USB though, so it's always backwards compatible. It's unlikely you'll see mass adoption of the Thunderbolt 3 side of things (That you should focus on) as this will be more costly. It's only now most things are USB-3, but very few USB-3 speeds. So what I mean is you can still buy and use USB-C devices, just may not be able to take full advantage of it.

Oh and buy a USB to USB C dongle?

 

[therealseebs]

Stupid, maybe (really). Stubborn? yes. They are just of a strong opinion about it. Can't blame them. You don't like it, don't buy it. Dongles blow, but at least I get to write 'dongles' 50 times. That's something.

"You don't like it, don't buy it" works pretty well in the PC world, where you have a lot of options, so you can pick a thing you do like. In the Mac world, there's only one vendor, and they have only one portable product line (it has many product names, but they're all "the really thin machine with limited ports and weaker hardware that can't run at full throttle for long"), so if you don't like it, and don't buy it... You're sort of out of the market.

And that's why I'm now looking for a refurb mini or something to be my last MacOS machine and run a few apps on the occasions when I run into stuff I need to export to another system or new apps.

They've had the "macbook pro" name since 2006. In that time, do you know how many MBPs have ever shipped with a mid-range or better GPU that didn't overheat, fail, or have serious thermal throttling issues affecting its performance? Zero that I know of. They just never quite took that side of the market seriously. They dropped matte screens. They dropped Ethernet. They dropped Magsafe. And every time they do that, a few more people say "well, nevermind then".

And it's great for them that they have this really focused audience of people willing to pay premium prices for hardware that's no longer even close to premium, but it's not great for them that they're losing a lot of developer sorts.

 

[Mr. Bean]

Apple is not listening to their customers. Customers don't want dongles. Customers want to use their legacy devices. Apple really needs to listen to what their customers want as Apple doesn't have Steve's intuition available to tell them where that puck is going to.

We so miss you, Steve.

“A lot of times, people don't know what they want until you show it to them.”— Steve Jobs

Apple has always wanted to lead instead of follow. Adopting the technology of the future whenever they could, regardless of what the competitions are doing. This was one of Jobs' philosophy and vision. I'm not seeing how the latest move deviates from that. They did the same things in the early days of USB ports. The iMac G3 in 1998 removed all the PS/2 ports and adopted the USB ports, whilst the rest of the industry was still using PS/2 to connect their peripherals. They also removed the floppy disk drive. Lots of people were horrified and complained about it due to incompatibility with the mouse/keyboard they already owned, and their inability to use floppy disks. As it turns out, the iMac G3 helped turned Apple's fortune around.

History is repeating itself.

Think what you will of the dongles or MBP, but that Verge video is stupid as hell. This is, what, the 10th article they have on dongles, and they even made a video now? Clickbait Verge, same as always. No one will use that many adapters, no one charges their phone and listen to music and they are basically ridiculing some users to cater to the majority of haters out there.

Agreed. This is what was written last year
"USB-C has already won"

Source (don't bother clicking on it unless you want to help them):
http://www.theverge.com/2015/6/2/8704551/usb-type-c-is-the-future

It's an old, tried and true formula. They know that there's a vocal group with strong opinions about something. They then create something to support that group. That group then in turn keep referring to the Verge as "evidence" from an authoritative source. More click, more revenue.

 

[therealseebs]

Thing is, when Jobs did it, he'd show people stuff, they'd see it, and they'd say "hey that's really cool, I could use one of those". It didn't take long at all for the iPhone to demonstrate that it had utility.

I've been buying Mac and NeXT stuff for a long time, and I have absolutely seen that work. But I've also seen cases where Apple dropped a thing I wanted, and that didn't magically change the world so I didn't want the thing.

Jobs understood that there were different users, and you had to have product differentiation and meet the needs of more than one group of users.

Also, no, the iMac G3 didn't remove even one PS/2 port, because there weren't any PS/2 ports on the Mac. It did drop other ports, and some of them were ports that were hard to replace; I had an ADB-based gizmo that needed a dongle, for instance. But for the most part, USB solved problems I cared about and made things better. It replaced a broad range of unrelated ports with a single standard port, and allowed hubs, and that was an upgrade.

USB type C doesn't do as much of that. Yeah, arguably, it is now merging power and video... But that turns out not to buy me as much. Replacing multiple kinds of serial ports, and the special ADB ports, and so on, did help some. But in that case, any given Mac might not need any serial gizmos, for instance. Losing USB type A means that basically nothing I own can be used with the new mac without specialized cables. So now I have a Type C to DisplayPort cable. DisplayPort cables worked with a bunch of different computers; the new one works only with one specific subset of Macs. The cable has no other utility. If I'm not hooking up one of the small set of USB-C macs to a displayport cable? Useless. Contrast with a USB 3 cable, which works with every computer I own *except* the USB-C Macs (that's at least a half-dozen machines including three previous macs), and works with a few dozen different devices I have. A couple of phones, at least one camera, some tablets, some external drives, you name it.

So it doesn't really feel like much of an improvement.

(That said, if it had been just the cables, I'd probably have kept the machine. But the cables, the glossy-only display option, the crappy keyboard, the loss of any kind of future-proofing upgrades down the line, losing magsafe... That was too much.)

 

[dogslobber]

“A lot of times, people don't know what they want until you show it to them.”— Steve Jobs

Apple has always wanted to lead instead of follow. Adopting the technology of the future whenever they could, regardless of what the competitions are doing. This was one of Jobs' philosophy and vision. I'm not seeing how the latest move deviates from that. They did the same things in the early days of USB ports. The iMac G3 in 1998 removed all the PS/2 ports and adopted the USB ports, whilst the rest of the industry was still using PS/2 to connect their peripherals. They also removed the floppy disk drive. Lots of people were horrified and complained about it due to incompatibility with the mouse/keyboard they already owned, and their inability to use floppy disks. As it turns out, the iMac G3 helped turned Apple's fortune around.

History is repeating itself.

What happened before doesn't necessarily show the future direction. That is a trap people always fall into and reason for Steve's genius. He'd have already recognized USB-C would take years to achieve success or failure and would plan accordinlgly. Apple has been short sighted to believe they can force it through. Right now computers are pleataued.

 

[New_Mac_Smell]

What happened before doesn't necessarily show the future direction. That is a trap people always fall into and reason for Steve's genius. He'd have already recognized USB-C would take years to achieve success or failure and would plan accordinlgly. Apple has been short sighted to believe they can force it through. Right now computers are pleataued.

It's not like USB-C was launched yesterday, It's been around for a few years. It's already in multiple devices and is growing strong from what I can see, with pretty much all modern devices sporting the port. How are computers plateaued at the moment?

 

[pmau]

Apple offers Thunderbolt with USB-C connectors.
That's the main difference. You need to rely on the TB chipset and the adapter itself to make everything work.
Other vendors simply use USB-C connectors to drive, USB, DisplayPort, etc.
In TB3 there are at least 3 different modes to transfer video signals for example.
Just the fact that USB-C has been here for a while does NOT mean that Apple with TB3 only will cause its very own issues.

 

[therealseebs]

It's not like USB-C was launched yesterday, It's been around for a few years.

No, it really hasn't. The spec was finalized just a tiny bit over two years ago. I don't think anything using it showed up until sometime in 2015. And I didn't see all that many type C ports while browsing non-Mac laptops the other day.

I do agree that USB-C will almost certainly succeed, I just don't think it's remotely ready to be the only port on a machine yet.

 

[macmyworld]

The 2015 isn't future proof tho. No USB C's

I rarely use the ports on my MacBooks, my iMac handles that. If USB C was a concern, I still wouldn't buy the new MacBook Pro, just don't like the keyboard and trackpad.

I do not see USB C becoming dominant for years, way too much legacy stuff out there, especially in the PC world.

 

[Mr. Bean]

Thing is, when Jobs did it, he'd show people stuff, they'd see it, and they'd say "hey that's really cool, I could use one of those". It didn't take long at all for the iPhone to demonstrate that it had utility.

I've been buying Mac and NeXT stuff for a long time, and I have absolutely seen that work. But I've also seen cases where Apple dropped a thing I wanted, and that didn't magically change the world so I didn't want the thing.

Jobs understood that there were different users, and you had to have product differentiation and meet the needs of more than one group of users.

Also, no, the iMac G3 didn't remove even one PS/2 port, because there weren't any PS/2 ports on the Mac. It did drop other ports, and some of them were ports that were hard to replace; I had an ADB-based gizmo that needed a dongle, for instance. But for the most part, USB solved problems I cared about and made things better. It replaced a broad range of unrelated ports with a single standard port, and allowed hubs, and that was an upgrade.

USB type C doesn't do as much of that. Yeah, arguably, it is now merging power and video... But that turns out not to buy me as much. Replacing multiple kinds of serial ports, and the special ADB ports, and so on, did help some. But in that case, any given Mac might not need any serial gizmos, for instance. Losing USB type A means that basically nothing I own can be used with the new mac without specialized cables. So now I have a Type C to DisplayPort cable. DisplayPort cables worked with a bunch of different computers; the new one works only with one specific subset of Macs. The cable has no other utility. If I'm not hooking up one of the small set of USB-C macs to a displayport cable? Useless. Contrast with a USB 3 cable, which works with every computer I own *except* the USB-C Macs (that's at least a half-dozen machines including three previous macs), and works with a few dozen different devices I have. A couple of phones, at least one camera, some tablets, some external drives, you name it.

So it doesn't really feel like much of an improvement.

(That said, if it had been just the cables, I'd probably have kept the machine. But the cables, the glossy-only display option, the crappy keyboard, the loss of any kind of future-proofing upgrades down the line, losing magsafe... That was too much.)

Thank you for a thoughtful contribution instead of "one of those" which we have seen far too often lately.

My bad. It's true that they did not "removed" the PS/2 ports, since it was the first generations of its kind. What they did was still revolutionary though, and given that USB was only about one year old at the time. Along with the floppy disk drive, which was around for quite a bit.

Honestly, the problem Apple is facing right now compared to back then is that the legacy USB ports have become so ubiquitous because it has been around for so long that it makes it difficult for people to accept the change, hence all the hate on so-called "dongle". The same can be said of all the other non-USB ports, and here lies the problem. The technology available now - Thunderbolt3/USB-C - is good enough for years to come to make switching worthwhile. They have all converged to an agreed form factor such that you could say one size fits all. Imagine if they don't do anything and continue to support the legacy ports. The entire industry will continue dragging its feet, and consumers will continue buying/using devices that use the legacy ports because there are more options available. Basically the longer they leave it, the harder it will be to change. I'm guessing Apple has already factored all this in as part of their decision making, and have prepared to receive the hate in the short term.

I understand what you are saying regarding the machine meeting your requirements. There have been times when Apple released something that was a hit with others but a miss for me, and vice versa. In my opinion, this is not a must-have MBP for most people. If anything, it's more of an upgrade for those with a 4+ years machine. Otherwise there's really not much "wow-factor" improvement in terms of internal specifications compared with machines built in the last couple of years. If legacy ports are must-haves for some people, the 2015 model is a really solid machine which is still available.

What happened before doesn't necessarily show the future direction. That is a trap people always fall into and reason for Steve's genius. He'd have already recognized USB-C would take years to achieve success or failure and would plan accordinlgly. Apple has been short sighted to believe they can force it through. Right now computers are pleataued.

It's true that what happened before does not necessarily show the future direction, but it is a good lesson nonetheless. It's why we study history - to avoid past mistakes whilst replicating successes if possible.

I don't normally like bringing Steve Jobs into any discussion because it can potentially descend into one of the "Steve would or would not have done this", but since you brought him up originally, I just wanted to point out that this is not the first time where Apple defied the convention regarding ports, and Steve Jobs did not necessarily liked to follow the customers' demands. These days nobody can say for certain Steve Jobs would or would not have done something other than Steve Jobs himself. If anyone know exactly what Steve Jovs would have done, they would be better off getting into the computer-making business instead of speculating.

What I am saying is that Apple has not deviate from Jobs' vision of simplicity and accessibility regarding computers. Whether the latest decision is correct is still unknown, but hindsight is always 20-20 vision. As many have already said, there are plenty of options out there.

I do not see USB C becoming dominant for years, way too much legacy stuff out there, especially in the PC world.

I think this is why Apple is doing what they're doing now. If they drag their feet like everybody else, it'll take longer to convert, and even more difficult because people will just keep buying and using legacy stuff. They are essentially betting on USB-C by using their massive influence to drag everyone in the industry into the same standards. It is a big gamble because they're already receiving a lot of vocal negative feedback, but the future should be a better indicator of whether they've made the right decision.

 

[codelode84]

I can honestly say the whole port thing seems overblown to me. I haven't hooked one thing up to my MacBook Pro early 2015 version. The whole dongle rant is getting tired to me. I can say Apple seems to be fascinated with making it smaller and smaller. I not pressed with that either but Apple is the leader and all of the others will now follow apples lead.

 

[Ghost31]

Apple is not listening to their customers. Customers don't want dongles. Customers want to use their legacy devices. Apple really needs to listen to what their customers want as Apple doesn't have Steve's intuition available to tell them where that puck is going to.

We so miss you, Steve.

Customers won't even need dongles forever. What with wireless tech going big in most devices and USB c being used for everything else. Gotta be more forward thinking man.

 

[bopajuice]

But wouldn't that be a temporary situation as USB-C is being adopted?

How much more will you be carrying since you seem to be using a lot of peripherals anyways

Do you kind of feel like Apple is force feeding us USB-C? Or do you see it being adopted industry wide?

It might be a long road of dongles and may not go as smooth for those who continue to use SD cards, external drives, printers, standard headphones, HDMI or Displayport monitors, etc.

 

[fs454]

I thought I would given the insane price, seemingly equal performance to my Late 2013 and lack of SD card slot as my career basically revolves around it, but it's growing on me a lot.

Having 1TB of 3GB/sec storage - I was constantly storage managing the 512 - is huge. The keyboard is actually great, the bigger trackpad is great, the GPU is a big jump from the 750M. I think honestly what sealed the deal was traveling home for Thanksgiving and still being able to play Battlefield 1 and Overwatch at 60fps on very respectable settings, which would have been a slideshow on the Late 2013 I have. I haven't done extensive back-and-forth testing yet but it seems to be much quicker with 4K XAVC-S footage in Premiere. Not insanely so, but enough to make me not want to go back if I can avoid it. Also, seems like the storage for swap is so ridiculously fast that I'm not going to mind working with 16GB RAM for the next few years. It will for sure hurt if we see a 32GB option next year.

Then you pile on Thunderbolt 3, the space gray finish, the half pound weight savings, the better display, great speakers, Touch ID, and the ability to top off the notebook via USB battery bricks - it feels like a big jump. The Touch Bar is cool, but the verdict is still out.

I still think the removal of the SD slot is incredibly dumb. If you use any device with removable storage, it's most likely SD. I'm constantly dumping stills and footage from the Sony a7SII,a7RII, GoPros, drones, my Fujifilm bodies, etc and to call it an underused and deprecated medium is beyond words - omitting it on an absolute behemoth of a device (by Apple standards) like the 15" MacBook Pro is nuts.

 

[symphara]

Honestly, the problem Apple is facing right now compared to back then is that the legacy USB ports have become so ubiquitous because it has been around for so long that it makes it difficult for people to accept the change, hence all the hate on so-called "dongle". The same can be said of all the other non-USB ports, and here lies the problem. The technology available now - Thunderbolt3/USB-C - is good enough for years to come to make switching worthwhile. They have all converged to an agreed form factor such that you could say one size fits all. Imagine if they don't do anything and continue to support the legacy ports. The entire industry will continue dragging its feet, and consumers will continue buying/using devices that use the legacy ports because there are more options available. Basically the longer they leave it, the harder it will be to change.

I think the problem is that there's no compelling argument to switch to USB-C, where before there was a compelling argument to switch to USB.

Most - almost all - peripherals come with USB compatibility and USB-A connectivity out of the box. I was looking for a new good webcam last week I think and I actively looked for USB-C, couldn't find anything. If you want USB-C you have to make sure to buy one with a replaceable cable and also buy a new cable, or use a dongle.

The major advantage of TB3-enabled USB-C is plugging it into a monitor. However there are very few monitors using this connectivity around, and on the desktop side of things, this is going nowhere. There's no desktop graphics card outputting over USB-C, and I don't think there will be any next year. They're moving to DP1.4, not USB-C.

It's also hard to take Apple's commitment to USB-C seriously when their newest iPhone uses their proprietary connector instead, and they ship a cheap, gimped USB-C cable with the new Macbooks.

This is another big one with USB-C: problems. Cables which work for charging and badly for data. Different speed cables. You have Google people putting out spreadsheets of what fries your hardware and what not. Come on, you don't expect the average user to shift through all this crap just to adopt USB-C when USB-A was good enough to begin with.

 

[aevan]

I think the problem is that there's no compelling argument to switch to USB-C, where before there was a compelling argument to switch to USB.

If you look at it that way - there would never a compelling argument to switch to anything. I mean - speed, universal application, reverseable, smaller - if these are not compelling arguments, I can only imagine what would be compelling in your opinion. Maybe if $10 were added you your credit card whenever you plugged something in.

I'm not saying that people should be happy and accept what is given to them. You don't have to like it. But there are very compelling arguments for USB-C. Whether Apple should've included USB-A alongside C or not, that's a different discussion about transition and progress (a very old discussion that repeats itself throughout history, from big things to small). But saying there is no compelling argument to switch to USB-C is just wrong. The "why" is very strong - there are plenty really good reasons, the only question is "when" and "how". And, as I said, throughout history, people more often agree on the "why", then on the "when" and "how". "Too soon" and "too aggressive" were always the arguments against progress. And, to be honest, sometimes, they were even good arguments - maybe sometimes progressing too fast is wrong. But in the case of a few ports and few adapters - I think it's quite safe to press the pedal to the metal. No jobs will be lost, no people will be left on the streets, no major uncomfort will happen, people will buy a few adapters for a year or so. In fact, I wish this happened more often in tech world.

 

[symphara]

If you look at it that way, there's never a compelling argument to switch to anything. I mean - speed, universal application, reverseable, smaller - if these are not compelling arguments

Speed? For what? Connecting a mouse, keyboard, webcam, external hard-drive, printer, scanner, headset, anything I can think of except for a monitor, USB 3.0 is good enough. This argument is not compelling. You have too few situations in which the speed of TB3-enabled USB-C is actually required, and this is rather niche. As in, it's nice to be able to connect to a monitor, but there are very few that accept this kind of connection, and this kind of connection is not compatible with desktop PCs.

Universal application? You had 99% of that before.

Reverse-able and smaller are nice features, but this doesn't make it compelling. The USB-A connector is small enough and easy enough to insert.

Compelling means solving real problems, like not needing drivers. This was extraordinarily nice with USB. Compelling means taking serial, parallel, PS/2, SCSI away and giving people a simple, unified connector. With the added advantage that many more types of devices were able to connect to the new port.

It's not that USB-C isn't good. It's good and I very much like it. It's just not good enough to be adopted anywhere as quickly as USB was. It's a nicer USB, but that's not compelling. And unlike USB, it comes with problems (bad cables, bad adaptors, generally poor standard compliance), which isn't helping at all.

I'm not saying that people should be happy and accept what is given to them. You don't have to like it.

You're wholly misunderstanding this. I do like it. I wish that tomorrow we'd have USB-C on everything, but that's not going to happen.

And you (and many others) are telling people they should be happy and accept it, because, well, future. This doesn't mean anything to anybody. It's marketing speak.

The bad news is that this USB-C future isn't going to come anywhere as fast as you think. Whoever buys a new Macbook Pro today doesn't buy into the future of unified USB-C connectivity - the machine will be obsolete by the time that future comes about. You buy into a future of inconvenience and dongles.

PS: Apple itself is showing this with its very latest products. It doesn't use this futuristic port on its latest iPhone, and its latest iPhone cannot be connected to its latest Macbook Pro (both released only a couple of months apart) without users purchasing something extra. This is in a nutshell why people hate this unnecessary 4xUSB-C connectivity and don't buy into the "future" argument.

 

[aevan]

It's not that USB-C isn't good. It's good and I very much like it. It's just not good enough to be adopted anywhere as quickly as USB was. It's a nicer USB, but that's not compelling.

Well, we can debate about that all day. I disagree. I think these things solve real problems, you think otherwise, let's leave it at that.

The bad news is that this USB-C future isn't going to come anywhere as fast as you think. Whoever buys a new Macbook Pro today doesn't buy into the future of unified USB-C connectivity - the machine will be obsolete by the time that future comes about. You buy into a future of inconvenience and dongles.

This could be true, and there's certainly sound logic behind this statement. But I think you misunderstand what people mean when they speak about the future. No, it may not come during the lifetime of this computer. The thing is - it is influencing the future to come faster for the NEXT computer, at the cost of some (minor) comfort to users. It's true that by the time USB-C becomes prevalent, I may have a new computer. But I'm sure if Apple didn't do this, by that time I'd have THREE. So, I'm happy to carry a few dongles - not because I'll live in the future with THIS computer, but because that will allow me to live in that future with the NEXT one (as opposed to a much longer period of time). This is what, I think, a lot of people saying "we live in today" don't get. And again - I'm not saying people should make some hard sacrifices here in the name of tomorrow (it's not like it's WWIII or anything). It's just a few adapters. A small inconvenience for better computing, faster.

By the way, even with all that - I don't think this future is so far off. Wacom just announced some amazing, professional tools that connect to USB-C and use all the benefits. Just look at the new MobileStudio Pro and Cintiq Pro - where you once needed three clunky big cables, now you need just one. A this is not some distant future, they are coming out THIS year. Yup, 2016. I can only imagine what 2017. brings.

 

[SoyCapitanSoyCapitan]

There was a reason the USB 3.1 specification called for

- Type A and Type C ports to make the transition easy
- Cables that can transmit data up to 800MB/s and provide charging up to 100W. Not 'charging cable' separate from data cable.

These were all shown off in demonstrations for almost two years. It's manufacturer's fault for not complying with the standards.

My PC's Gigabyte Gaming 7 motherboard not only complies with the standard (Type A and Type C ports supporting USB 3.1 and Thunderbolt 3) but went an extra mile by providing USB 2 and 3 ports. There's even a damn PS/2 port (presumable for engineers).

 

[symphara]

Well, we can debate about that all day. I disagree. I think these things solve real problems, you think otherwise, let's leave it at that.

You can disagree all you like, but I don't think you have arguments. The truth is that most peripherals just don't need (all HID and audio classes) or cannot utilize the speed improvement that TB-3 over USB-C brings to the table. For most things where speed is of some concern, i.e. USB network adapters/scanners/external drive, USB 3.0 was good enough. That's the reality. USB-C just doesn't scratch a real itch.

This could be true, and there's certainly sound logic behind this statement. But I think you misunderstand what people mean when they speak about the future. No, it may not come during the lifetime of this computer. The thing is - it is influencing the future to come faster for the NEXT computer, at the cost of some (minor) comfort to users. It's true that by the time USB-C becomes prevalent, I may have a new computer. But I'm sure if Apple didn't do this, by that time I'd have THREE. So, I'm happy to carry a few dongles - not because I'll live in the future with THIS computer, but because that will allow me to live in that future with the NEXT one (as opposed to a much longer period of time). This is what, I think, a lot of people saying "we live in today" don't get. And again - I'm not saying people should make some hard sacrifices here in the name of tomorrow (it's not like it's WWIII or anything). It's just a few adapters. A small inconvenience for better computing, faster.

I understand your point, I honestly don't prize this USB-C connectivity so much to be happy about being inconvenienced now, in the hope of a later pay-off.

My major disagreement here is that I don't believe that Apple has the pull to move things. They sell far too few computers. I know that Apple fans like to believe that Apple made the floppy drive obsolete and the USB port a success, but I strongly disagree. In my opinion they simply jumped quickly on a fast-moving train.

And as I said before, Apple itself doesn't believe in this USB-C future. Asking us to do it - at entirely our expense - is fairly cynical.

 

[New_Mac_Smell]

As soon as I see the "Can't connect Apples newest iPhone to the computer" argument I feel it's time to give up. I haven't had to connect my iPhone to my laptop since wireless syncing worked, and now I just use Apple Music. iOS devices use a different connector and I'm fine with that, it doesn't signal anything to do with their computer side of things.

If you don't want USB-C then stick with your current machine, simple. But stop plucking nonsense arguments out of the air to justify a distain for the new MBP.
[doublepost=1480074455][/doublepost]

My major disagreement here is that I don't believe that Apple has the pull to move things. They sell far too few computers. I know that Apple fans like to believe that Apple made the floppy drive obsolete and the USB port a success, but I strongly disagree. In my opinion they simply jumped quickly on a fast-moving train.

And as I said before, Apple itself doesn't believe in this USB-C future. Asking us to do it - at entirely our expense - is fairly cynical.

I believe Apple are usually in the top 5 PC manufacturers in the world, with the other top 4 using USB-C on their high end devices. Ergo all high end computers are getting equipped with USB-C. Your speed arguments make no sense, a mouse cannot take advantage of the speed of USB-C the same it couldn't USB-1, doesn't matter, it's about the connector in those cases. And there is no evidence to suggest Apple doesn't believe in USB-C, and seeing as they just equipped all their MBP's with USB-C only, I'd indicate that as strong evidence they do believe in it. I'm out, this argument is pointless and stupid.

 

[symphara]

I'm out, this argument is pointless and stupid.

What can I say, it was a fitting conclusion to your tirade.

 

[NickPhamUK]

Nope, perfectly happy with my non-TB 13" (no upgrades whatsoever) machine. But again, I'm a casual user with my on-the-road laptop, I have a desktop at home to do the raw beating. Professionals who rely on one machine for their living might not find the 15" really attractive though.

 

[Mr. Bean]

It's true that Apple is not the top selling computer maker compared to the Windows competitors, but they still wield influence nonetheless. Since their name has become so big, if they're doing something, it will surely generate attention and publicity. I agree with the earlier statement that this MBP might not be part of the future, but it has surely caused a massive splash and possibly motivated the industry into picking up the speed.

As for the potential speed being excessive for what we have available, I must disagree. Indeed, we might not ever need all that bandwidth with the current devices such as printers, etc. but it's still better to have the facility available because who knows what good ideas might be born from it. The tech industry is an extremely creative one, but they need the tools to realise their potential. Let's assume that once upon a time everyone thought the speed of dial-up internet was sufficient for the tasks at hand at the time - email, browsing, and so forth. If that mindset was kept, we wouldn't be where we are today.

Using another lateral example closer to my heart - research in science. Mega projects like space exploration or finding the Higgs boson. They are big projects with a goal, but during the journey to reach that goal, many innovations were realised to help solve the puzzles along the way in order to reach the final answer. These innovations along the way turn out to become extremely beneficial for the general public, even though nobody initially set out to create those specific innovations with a purpose to serve the general public.

So yes, the bandwidth provided might not be fully utilised with what's currently available, but if it's there, maybe some clever folk can play around and figure out how to make something useful with it. Demands indeed drive innovation, but given the right tools available, innovations can also happen without demand, and that would definitely make a bigger splash than usual because nobody would have expected it. As I've mentioned in an earlier post, Jobs was a master at doing the latter.