The 2023-2024 Football Thread

[laptech]

What value would a years worth of Kane’s goals be worth to Spurs though? If the qualify for Europe with him that helps offset the lack of sale value no?

Not worth a lot considering he was the leagues 2nd top goal scorer with 30 goals season just gone and Spurs still failed to qualify for Europe. Considering the poor season they just had, not qualifying for Europe even with the leagues 2nd highest goal scorer in the team, Spurs would be taking a huge huge gamble and major risk if they rejected Bayern's 4th offer thinking that Kane's goals would get them into Europe this new season when they knew his goals failed to get them into Europe the season gone.

Kane is already on record stating he wants the transfer sorted before the start of the new season which happens to be this coming Saturday (is in the article i linked to in my previous post) which does not leave the club long to get a deal done. If they do accept Bayern's 4th bid, the club then need to find themselves another decent striker before the transfer window closes on September 1st. In that same article it mentions that Spurs have offered Kane £400,000 a week wages but he hasn't accepted it. That same article also mentioned that Kane has stated that he wants to leave the club but there has been nothing said from Kane's camp as to where his preferred move lies. Levy went on record stating he would not sell Kane to a rival PL club which put United out of the running for him and as far as I know no other clubs apart from United and Bayern have shown serious interest in him.

It will be interesting to see how this Kane transfer pans out.

 

[Apple fanboy]

Looks more and more likely McGuire and Ward-Prowse will be coming to West Ham.
Could have done without City showing an interest in Paqueta though. Hope that comes to nothing!

 

[laptech]

Looks more and more likely McGuire and Ward-Prowse will be coming to West Ham.
Could have done without City showing an interest in Paqueta though. Hope that comes to nothing!

At the time, the worlds most expensive defender at £80 million when United bought him in 2019. 4 years later now could be leaving for £30 million. oh how he has devalued over the years.

 

[Apple fanboy]

At the time, the worlds most expensive defender at £80 million when United bought him in 2019. 4 years later now could be leaving for £30 million. oh how he has devalued over the years.

I think most of that went last year! But the truth is values are based on length of contract, age, potential for selling on.
At 30 we are unlikely to see any return on our investment except minutes on the pitch.
Anyway hopefully he’s a good signing for us.

 

[HandsomeDanNZ]

https://www.bbc.com/sport/football/66448957

Done deals. Hammers landing their targets late.
Saints closing in on £100m of sales revenue this window with plenty more to come.

Saints losing to Gillingham 3-1 in the cup has given a few players a wake up call.
Manager Russell Martin said a few things that needed saying.

"It is the most disappointed I've been in my six weeks of being here," said Martin.

"We have nine players on the pitch who played in the Premier League and I presume they still deem themselves to be Premier League level players - they have to be better than that."

Time to move some dead wood on, methinks.

 

[Apple fanboy]

https://www.bbc.com/sport/football/66448957

Done deals. Hammers landing their targets late.
Saints closing in on £100m of sales revenue this window with plenty more to come.

Saints losing to Gillingham 3-1 in the cup has given a few players a wake up call.
Manager Russell Martin said a few things that needed saying.

"It is the most disappointed I've been in my six weeks of being here," said Martin.

"We have nine players on the pitch who played in the Premier League and I presume they still deem themselves to be Premier League level players - they have to be better than that."

Time to move some dead wood on, methinks.

Sorry you’ve lost your captain. I know how that feels. Hopefully he’s a good fit for us. I rate him as a player.
I don’t think he’ll feature this weekend (assuming the medical goes without a hitch). Think it’s a bit too soon.
Shame we couldn’t have sorted this a few weeks ago. Especially as the delay seems to have been of our own making.

 

[Scepticalscribe]

Commiserations to @HandsomeDanNZ (and congratulations to @Apple fanboy) on the sale (purchase) of James Ward-Prowse; I also rate him as a player.

Re Harry Maguire, I think that he will be a good fit for West Ham, and I don't buy the argument that he has "devalued" in quite the way that @laptech suggests, apart from crude financial measurements.

The thing is, Maguire does not really suit the sort of football that Manchester United hope to evolve into playing; however, he is a solid, old school defender, - which is not what ETH wants or requires - and I think that this will suit both the preferences of Moyes and West Ham.

Incidentally, @Apple fanboy, there is a good piece in today's Guardian about Moyes and West Ham; well worth a read.

 

[Apple fanboy]

Commiserations to @HandsomeDanNZ (and congratulations to @Apple fanboy) on the sale (purchase) of James Ward-Prowse; I also rate him as a player.

Re Harry Maguire, I think that he will be a good fit for West Ham, and I don't buy the argument that he has "devalued" in quite the way that @laptech suggests, apart from crude financial measurements.

The thing is, Maguire does not really suit the sort of football that Manchester United hope to evolve into playing; however, he is a solid, old school defender, - which is not what ETH wants or requires - and I think that this will suit both the preferences of Moyes and West Ham.

Incidentally, @Apple fanboy, there is a good piece in today's Guardian about Moyes and West Ham; well worth a read.

Sometimes when a player leaves a ‘bigger’ club like Utd where things haven’t quite worked out, they can be motivated and have a point to prove. Sometimes the opposite. Hopefully McGuire can get back to his best form in a team where he is wanted.

 

[Scepticalscribe]

Sometimes when a player leaves a ‘bigger’ club like Utd where things haven’t quite worked out, they can be motivated and have a point to prove. Sometimes the opposite. Hopefully McGuire can get back to his best form in a team where he is wanted.

While Maguire hasn't quite worked out in Manchester United, I have long thought that some of the United fan base have an (unrealistic) attitude of entitlement, an automatic expectation of success, (obviously, the influence of, and extended period of success that they enjoyed under the legendary Sir Alex Ferguson served to make this tendency even more pronounced) and worse, an expectation that this success will come about through playing stylish, attractive football, which means that they tend to take it out on players that cannot meet their fantasies.

They spent £80million on Maguire and, moreover, appointed him team captain; and now, to make him a clear scapegoat for the evident failings and lapses of the team over the past several seasons is manifestly unfair.

Actually, I think he will do well at West Ham, and, as you say, he will also have a point to prove; he will suit Moyes, and the type of football that West Ham will play, instead of attempting the impossible with the delusions of Manchester United.

 

[Apple fanboy]

While Maguire hasn't quite worked out in Manchester United, I have long thought that some of the United fan base have an (unrealistic) attitude of entitlement, an automatic expectation of success, (obviously, the influence of, and extended period of success that they enjoyed under the legendary Sir Alex Ferguson made served to this tendency even more pronounced) and worse, an expectation that this success will come about through playing stylish, attractive football, which means that they tend to take it out on players that cannot meet their fantasies.

They spent £80million on Maguire and, moreover, appointed him team captain; and now, to make him a clear scapegoat for the evident failings and lapses of the team over the past several seasons is manifestly unfair.

Actually, I think he will do well at West Ham, and, as you say, he will also have a point to prove; he will suit Moyes, and the type of football that West Ham will play, instead of attempting the impossible with the delusions of Manchester United.

I have everything crossed that he does. We need some good players to fill the gaps.

 

[HandsomeDanNZ]

Sometimes when a player leaves a ‘bigger’ club like Utd where things haven’t quite worked out, they can be motivated and have a point to prove. Sometimes the opposite. Hopefully McGuire can get back to his best form in a team where he is wanted.

As much as I have been highly critical of Maguire at United, you can't deny that if he performs to the levels that he has in an England shirt, Hammers are getting a very good player indeed.
I just hope Moyes is there long enough to see his new recruits do the business - this friction between him and the DoF has the potential to turn quite toxic quite quickly.

It'll be interesting to read what Saints fans have to say about JWP's move - some are already being quite gracious while others are being a little unfair.
I think what will hurt the most is seeing him break Beckham's free kick goal-record in another team's colours. Really wanted that to happen in a Saints shirt, but it is what it is. He's been with Saints since he was 8. He's earned the right to go off and play Top Flight and European football with a team who has the capability to do well and challenge for honours.

Amazing to see the ins and outs of each Premier League club in this article:

Premier League done deals: Deadline day moves and every transfer this summer

The 2023 Premier League summer transfer window has slammed shut following months of big-money deals. Here are all the confirmed ins and outs across the top-flight… Arsenal In Declan Rice [Wes…

talksport.com

So many clubs with MUCH longer out lists than in...still lots of business to be done in this window, methinks.

 

[Apple fanboy]

As much as I have been highly critical of Maguire at United, you can't deny that if he performs to the levels that he has in an England shirt, Hammers are getting a very good player indeed.
I just hope Moyes is there long enough to see his new recruits do the business - this friction between him and the DoF has the potential to turn quite toxic quite quickly.

It'll be interesting to read what Saints fans have to say about JWP's move - some are already being quite gracious while others are being a little unfair.
I think what will hurt the most is seeing him break Beckham's free kick goal-record in another team's colours. Really wanted that to happen in a Saints shirt, but it is what it is. He's been with Saints since he was 8. He's earned the right to go off and play Top Flight and European football with a team who has the capability to do well and challenge for honours.

Amazing to see the ins and outs of each Premier League club in this article:

Premier League done deals: Deadline day moves and every transfer this summer

The 2023 Premier League summer transfer window has slammed shut following months of big-money deals. Here are all the confirmed ins and outs across the top-flight… Arsenal In Declan Rice [Wes…

talksport.com

So many clubs with MUCH longer out lists than in...still lots of business to be done in this window, methinks.

Indeed there is. I think a few clubs are still negotiating. Or waiting for funds to come in!

 

[Scepticalscribe]

As much as I have been highly critical of Maguire at United, you can't deny that if he performs to the levels that he has in an England shirt, Hammers are getting a very good player indeed.
I just hope Moyes is there long enough to see his new recruits do the business - this friction between him and the DoF has the potential to turn quite toxic quite quickly.

It'll be interesting to read what Saints fans have to say about JWP's move - some are already being quite gracious while others are being a little unfair.
I think what will hurt the most is seeing him break Beckham's free kick goal-record in another team's colours. Really wanted that to happen in a Saints shirt, but it is what it is. He's been with Saints since he was 8. He's earned the right to go off and play Top Flight and European football with a team who has the capability to do well and challenge for honours.

Amazing to see the ins and outs of each Premier League club in this article:

Premier League done deals: Deadline day moves and every transfer this summer

The 2023 Premier League summer transfer window has slammed shut following months of big-money deals. Here are all the confirmed ins and outs across the top-flight… Arsenal In Declan Rice [Wes…

talksport.com

So many clubs with MUCH longer out lists than in...still lots of business to be done in this window, methinks.

That is a fascinating list, thank you for sharing it - I've taken the time to look through it closely.

 

[HandsomeDanNZ]

Indeed there is. I think a few clubs are still negotiating. Or waiting for funds to come in!

Actually that raises a good point...how many deals are actually done in instalments, which causes a chain effect for the clubs being paid, when they want to negotiate for players?
We talk about clubs having oodles of money to spend after selling, but do they really?

 

[Apple fanboy]

Actually that raises a good point...how many deals are actually done in instalments, which causes a chain effect for the clubs being paid, when they want to negotiate for players?
We talk about clubs having oodles of money to spend after selling, but do they really?

I think most deals have some element of delayed payment. But not just because they have cash shortages. It's just good business sense to keep millions in your bank rather than your competitors.

 

[pachyderm]

We advance!

 

[laptech]

......

They spent £80million on Maguire and, moreover, appointed him team captain; and now, to make him a clear scapegoat for the evident failings and lapses of the team over the past several seasons is manifestly unfair.

......

Maguire has come in for a lot of criticism and complaint from United fans because during the last 3 to 4 years of his contract he has played poorly for United but excelled when he's playing for England. United fans have always wondered why can he do it for England but not United. Worst still for Maguire is him being captain but not performing the on field responsibilities of a captain. For years it has been pointed out not only by fans but football sports journalists as well that United lack leadership on the field. Time and time again there have been games were some players have gone sloppy or not back tracked to defend or not go in for a tackle or just be too lazy to move around too much which is when you need the club captain to step in an run the riot act over them, just like past captain's used to do (Bryan Robson and Roy Keane) but Maguire never did this.

Many many times as well Maguire has been caught out of position, he's put himself in position's that make the defensive line ineffective. He's not marked players properly, he's not chased after players properly. He's was the team captain and a highly experienced defender but for to many times he acted like he was a rookie defender and when the club spends £80 million on him, the fans expect a lot more than what they got.

Whilst this problem can be put at Maguire's feet, he is not entirely blameless in this because the manger(s) are to blame as well for not removing an ineffective captain.

 

[laptech]

https://www.bbc.com/sport/football/66448957

Done deals. Hammers landing their targets late.
Saints closing in on £100m of sales revenue this window with plenty more to come.

Saints losing to Gillingham 3-1 in the cup has given a few players a wake up call.
Manager Russell Martin said a few things that needed saying.

"It is the most disappointed I've been in my six weeks of being here," said Martin.

"We have nine players on the pitch who played in the Premier League and I presume they still deem themselves to be Premier League level players - they have to be better than that."

Time to move some dead wood on, methinks.

A couple of family members are Gillingham fan's and they buzzing after the game. Yes the club has a new owner and bought a number of players in but the core nucleus of the team is still the same one's that was one of the worst performing teams in the league. So to go out and beat a team that has premiership quality players in it was something else. Even when Gillingham was at their worst they still managed to beat premier league team Brentford in penalties in the same competition last year.

All I can think of is that Gillingham wanted it more than Southampton.

 

[Scepticalscribe]

Maguire has come in for a lot of criticism and complaint from United fans because during the last 3 to 4 years of his contract he has played poorly for United but excelled when he's playing for England. United fans have always wondered why can he do it for England but not United. Worst still for Maguire is him being captain but not performing the on field responsibilities of a captain. For years it has been pointed out not only by fans but football sports journalists as well that United lack leadership on the field. Time and time again there have been games were some players have gone sloppy or not back tracked to defend or not go in for a tackle or just be too lazy to move around too much which is when you need the club captain to step in an run the riot act over them, just like past captain's used to do (Bryan Robson and Roy Keane) but Maguire never did this.

Many many times as well Maguire has been caught out of position, he's put himself in position's that make the defensive line ineffective. He's not marked players properly, he's not chased after players properly. He's was the team captain and a highly experienced defender but for to many times he acted like he was a rookie defender and when the club spends £80 million on him, the fans expect a lot more than what they got.

Whilst this problem can be put at Maguire's feet, he is not entirely blameless in this because the manger(s) are to blame as well for not removing an ineffective captain.

These days, for a variety of reasons, (partly, because the quality of players available to national teams rarely exceeds that of the very best of the club teams, and, not least, because they don't get all that long to play together and train together), national teams tend to play a less sophisticated and more direct form of football.

In that context, I think that Maguire will do pretty well at West Ham, and it would not surprise me to see him appointed team captain at some stage.

While he was not the best fit at Manchester United, the failures of the team, and inability - or reluctance - of a bunch of highly paid individual players to take responsibility for their own actions and sections of the pitch - cannot solely be placed at the feet of Maguire.

Last season, (and the season prior to that), Manchester United were a collection of individual players, some of them very good, others excellent, still others out of their depth, but they were in no way a serious team with a collective pride and vision. That is not solely down to Maguire.

 

[laptech]

......

While he was not the best fit at Manchester United, the failures of the team, and inability - or reluctance - of a bunch of highly paid individual players to take responsibility for their own actions and sections of the pitch - cannot solely be placed at the feet of Maguire.

Last season, (and the season prior to that), Manchester United were a collection of individual players, some of them very good, others excellent, still others out of their depth, but they were in no way a serious team with a collective pride and vision. That is not solely down to Maguire.

Not everything was solely down to Maguire but as the team captain he should take a huge chunk of the responsibility because whilst the manager can guide and bark orders from the managers box, it is solely the responsibility of the captain to make sure that what happens on the pitch works. If player is not behaving like a team player on the pitch then it is up to the captain to put that player right. If a player is making mistakes then it is up to the captain to point it out and put it right. If there is total breakdown on the pitch and players are behaving individually then it is the responsibility of the captain to sit down with the manager and explain to him the problems that are going on.

it is clear this was not going on because the same mistakes were taking place time and time again. A club functions well when you have a captain who take take charge, Maguire could not do this and thus the team suffered time and time again on the pitch.

Roy Keane was not liked by a number of players during his time because of how he behaved as a captain, basically doing his job BUT he was very much respected as a player and captain because of how he handled his responsibilities as a captain. Rightly or wrongly, if he felt an opposition player was going after one of his players, hard tackling, pushing about, being verbal, Keane would always react and go after that opposition player to show them that if you mess with one of my players, I am going to mess with you. He took his job as captain very seriously, sometimes too seriously but when players see their captain looking out for his fellow players, it want's them to work harder and smarter.

Rashford, Martial and Bruno great players but oh my when they slack of oh boy do they slack off and they have done so in many games but did we see Maguire run them the riot act when their passes were too sloppy or they failed to back track to help in defense, no but he should be and when fans do not see that happening they start to question the ability of their captain.

The problem with United fans is that they were very spoiled in having such an outstanding captain in Roy Keane and the fans miss that. The fans were also spoiled in having such a strong manager in Sir Alex Ferguson who would run the club with an iron fist. Anyone trying to behave as an individual was dealt with fast and firm. Anyone screwing up on the pitch was dealt with fast and firm. That is no longer the case because individual behavior has crept into the squad which is something that was never talked about or seen during Sir Alex Ferguson's time as manager.

Look at City, they have a captain that behaves as a captain, they have a manager that is strict but firm, players do not behave as individuals and what do we see as a result of it, a persistent winning team. United were once like that and now look at them, what a mess.

 

[Mitthrawnuruodo]

According to The Athletic, Tottenham and Bayern have agreed on terms for Harry Kane, and it's now up to Kane himself if he wants the move or not...

Probably more to follow...

 

[laptech]

According to The Athletic, Tottenham and Bayern have agreed on terms for Harry Kane, and it's now up to Kane himself if he wants the move or not...

Probably more to follow...

ooooooo, so Spurs have accepted the 4th bid of £94 million. Now all our questions will be answered, does Kane actually want to move to a club abroad rather than a club in the UK given the fact that the club owner has stated he will not allow Kane to be sold to a rival PL club which would severely limits Kane's moving options.

Edit: Makes me wonder now, if United had persuade Kane and put in an offer close to £100 million, would Levy have still turned it down because of it being a rival PL club.

 

[Scepticalscribe]

According to The Athletic, Tottenham and Bayern have agreed on terms for Harry Kane, and it's now up to Kane himself if he wants the move or not...

Probably more to follow...

Kane has wanted to leave Spurs for at least the past year, and Spurs would be fools to turn down a sum approaching £100million, (not least, as Kane could stroll away on a free transfer next year), so, yes, it will be interesting to see what happens.

 

[Scepticalscribe]

What value would a years worth of Kane’s goals be worth to Spurs though?

Very good point.

If the qualify for Europe with him that helps offset the lack of sale value no?

Another very good point, but the thing is, I am not sure that the team - in its current incarnation - has the quality (any longer) to qualify for the CL in Europe, and, equally, I am not sure that Kane is interested in having the responsibility for delivering a good season for Spurs on his shoulders for much longer.

If anything, in recent years, until last season when reality finally - and belatedly - caught up with them, Spurs had overachieved.

 

[sinango]

With the Community Shield, formerly the Charity Shield, a game that is traditionally the curtain raiser to a new season, due to take place tomorrow, this means that tomorrow heralds the start of a fresh football season.

Thus, I think it that it is time to start a thread where we can discuss the coming season, even though the we are still in the middle of the WWC, a competition that won't come to a conclusion for another few weeks with the WWC Final.

With that, herewith a new thread where everything to do with the Season of 2023-2024 can be discussed.

Absolutely, it's an exciting time for football enthusiasts! While the Women's World Cup is captivating, the anticipation for the upcoming football season is undeniable. From league predictions to player transfers and match analyses, this thread offers a perfect platform to delve into all things related to the 2023-2024 season. Let's share our thoughts, insights, and excitement as we gear up for another thrilling year of football action