The real MBP 14/16 buying guide

[lambertjohn]

I think they're both way overpriced. I'm guessing Apple does too, which is why there's talk of a cheaper MBP coming out sometime in 2022.

 

[ctjack]

I think they're both way overpriced. I'm guessing Apple does too, which is why there's talk of a cheaper MBP coming out sometime in 2022.

i think for what they offer, new macs are worth the price. Unified memory equals to very rare DDR5 speeds, M1 CPUs score 1740 in single core geekbench, while AMD will only come up with a 1600 score CPU very soon.
Sure the addons are overpriced, but that is the price to keep the base low.

 

[TriApple]

i think for what they offer, new macs are worth the price. Unified memory equals to very rare DDR5 speeds, M1 CPUs score 1740 in single core geekbench, while AMD will only come up with a 1600 score CPU very soon.
Sure the addons are overpriced, but that is the price to keep the base low.

Not to mention the screen. Color accuracy, refresh, resolution, brightness.

 

[Sanpete]

Twice fast only in certain video tasks, which involves "double decoders/encoders, prores".

Twice as fast for whatever intensively uses the GPU cores, which may also include photo editing. Video and photos are mainstream tasks for MBPs.

You also mentioned about power cut in the max model for 14" - why pay the same price if it performs less than the same 16 inch.

Because some prefer the smaller package. There's no fully objective standard for best value.

Right, but let's say Artisright channel on Youtube have shown that MBP 16 with 16gb of RAM lags in pano edits with LR, while base 14 with 32gb ram did not.
So nobody said that the difference would be obvious and all time present - but it will be there for you to appreciate it from time to time when the extra +16gb of ram will kick in.

Same is true of the other features that affect performance, such as the larger GPU in the Max. RAM isn't special that way. Most people will never notice a difference.

It is all up to you. If watching 14" screen 8-10 hours a day for most of the year works fine for you then why not. But it is not the most logical decision at that price point ($2400) because money wise external display instead of 32gb of ram or jumping to base 16 will be more beneficial.

Not a fully objective or merely logical matter what matters most to people. An external display is generally no substitute for a portable built-in.

Aren't limiteds already coming with double cab and normal bed at its' base config?

Yes, but a larger bed is available. Point is it's a very nice vehicle, and the differences here are not about the power train but room and storage.

 

[clevins]

Actually, in thinking about this topic I wanted to make another point... If someone isn't sure how how much power they need, they should consider whether they need a Pro at all. Not 'want' a Pro. That's a personal decision. But usually if someone has higher end needs, they know what they have to have - they need lots of RAM for something they do or as much GPU power as they can get, etc.

But for those of you coming from older Intel machines, if you don't have a firm need for more than 16gig RAM and/or multiple screens (the Air supports only one external screen), the Air (and lower end 13" Pro) are FAST. They match and exceed i9s in most cases.

So, consider what you really need both now and for the next ~3-4 years. It's perfectly possible that the entry level Pro or the Air are plenty powerful. Comments like this:

I think they're both way overpriced. I'm guessing Apple does too, which is why there's talk of a cheaper MBP coming out sometime in 2022.

miss the point. The 14 and 16" Pros are NOT overpriced for what they are.... but almost no one really needs that kind of laptop power. I mean, go watch MKBHD's quick take on them - his take on performance starts at about 12:30 into that video. He compares their video editing performance to his $50,000, 28 core Mac Pro (the new one, not the 'can) and they hold up really really well. They actually beat it in one specific video export task. But I and most of you don't actually need that kind of power to edit a few minutes of 1080 or 4K video.

Bottom line - the Pro machines are once again actually for professionals who challenge the limits of what high end computers can be. The other ~90% of us will be fine with the Air/entry Pro for the most part.

 

[Sanpete]

Actually, in thinking about this topic I wanted to make another point... If someone isn't sure how how much power they need, they should consider whether they need a Pro at all. Not 'want' a Pro.

When they introduce a 16" Air, I'll take a good look.

 

[clevins]

When they introduce a 16" Air, I'll take a good look.

Yeah, that's the rub. I have a friend who really only needs an Air in terms of power but also wanted a 16" screen so he grabbed an entry model 16" M1.

 

[Love-hate 🍏 relationship]

haha,actually considering 16" 32gb 512 .i'd be already overspending,and whilst it'd make sense to get 1tb,i just cannot justify it

unlike the ram and the size,the storage i find very hard to justify

 

[MrAverigeUser]

I want to purchase a MBP M1 perhaps in at least 1 year from now - since apple had always problems with not-so-brilliant design, think of grilled GPUs from 20108-2014,
failing keyboards over many yearsm, the Desaster of the „trash can“ MP and a lot of other mismanagement of the R&D Dep.

always claiming for years that „You‘re holding it wrong“ or waiting for years and many class suit action to be lost until they confessed to have been wrong..

Ok, thank god Joni „form over function“ Ive is now history and function seems to be something to think about now.
But I will still wait.

As for if was me to buy soon, I‘ wait for the new MBA tomcome this year soon.

Maybe I want to purchase this, or the MBP 14/16 - or I will purchase the MBA THEN because it’s price will get even lower than now. If the MBA 2020 is enough for someone, this might lead to a „Best Buy“ when purchasing the MBA THEN.

At home I have still the OWC Thunderbolt 2 dock, so at Home no problem with lack of connection…

A friend of mine purchased the MBA M1 2020 some weeks ago and is very happy with it.

So - waiting for the claimed enormous change in design of the MBA and lower prices or just be more sure that this time apple dis do it right with their new MBP 14/16….

cheers

Yes, very true, that if you are able to, and do, wait until new M2 MBA released (presumably later this year), even if you decide you're happy with the 2020 M1 MBA, prices for the latter should go down so you can save money by waiting. Most likely, you won't be able to get directly from Apple, but as you said plenty of other big-box retailers (eg. Best Buy) and on the secondary market should start blowing out a bunch of stock.

I've done this a few times, eg. with my 11" 2018 iPad Pro (came out Oct 2018), I didn't buy until the newer 2020 11" iPad Pro came out (released Mar 2020, which was a very modest upgrade with dual-camera / LIDAR which meant nothing to me, and A12Z vs A12X processor). Saved a bunch of money buying a new-in-box 2018 iPad Pro because I was able to wait.

All that to be said, as @clevins said, if you're in the market for an MBA and you're able to wait, it makes more sense to do so now than at other times, given we're on the cusp of a likely model-redesign.

To report what I did since my posting in January 2022:

I did wait indeed until now - and purchased in February a wonderful MBP 15" mid 2015 (!) 16 GB in perfect condition GB built-in an NVME-adapter and a 4 TB Samsung SSD.
This machine is very nice and absolutely calm, has a very good screen.

AND NOW I am considering to buy a MBP 16" and NOT a 14" because: You get a wonderful, big display, much better sound, 35% more battery-life compared to the 14" under real-life conditions, and a machine which does NOT grill the M1 like it is the case with the 14" MBP, because the cooling fans of the 16" are 2-3 times more efficient than those little things in the 14". PLUS due to the bigger housing, the passive heat exchange of the 16" is much better.
There have tests been made with exact the same system with the 14" and the 16" MBP under "max performance" conditions that had bad results: The M1 cores of the 14" have been grilled at about 100-105 degrees celsius albeit the fans already at full action (and loud) while the fans of the 16" MBP were still at 60% max action and the cores of the 16" MBP at 86-89 degrees.

Apple ignored since the very beginning of the Intel-CPU years (about 2005) the heat problem and favored NOT to cool correctly, but pretend that their MBP needs only a little bit of cooling. This killed hundreds of thousands if not more motherboards, especially the discrete GPUs until about 2014 (at least). The customers felt comfortable because of near-to-none noise, but in reality the electronic parts suffered at long term (= after 3-4 years these machines died). I was victim of two (!) total losses of MBP (both after 3 years) and I was NOT amused.

Now there is better cooling, the M1 is a big step forward, but even the very efficient M1 produces a lot of heat if at max performance. I cannot imagine that the long-term reliability of the wonderful M1/2 machines is save if these processors are regularly grilled at 100 degrees. But apple still starts too late with more cooling and still makes the customers believe that everything is ok - but it is NOT if you demand full performance over a longer period. Maybe you will pass two or three years without problems, but maybe there will be a "déjà-vu" effect in some years if you do nothing to protect your machines yourself, because apple does NOT (historically, with the dead MBP 2006-2011, they denied for many years the overheating of the discrete GPUs until there was a class action suit which forced them to accept their bad design). There are hundreds of Threads here at MacRumors about these older problems...

So - my recommendation is: download at least for the high-end 14" MBP but better also for the high-end 16" MBP one of the apps which give you the chance to establish better cooling by starting softly much sooner more cooling (when the temperature is still acceptable) and reaches a max sooner. This will prevent the M processor from being grilled and even prevent often enough that the max rpm are even necessary. So - even the noise will be more comfortable for 14" users. One of those apps I used from the third MBP with discrete GPU was MacFanControl. Once correctly customized by me, there were zero problems (still use these old MBP from 209-2011) and the GPU and CPU were MUCH better cooled.

I will purchase this year a new MBP 16" M because I like to do more postproduction in photography. And one of the first apps I will install will be one for optimizing the fan rpm to prevent overheating and to guarantee a long-term reliability of the nice 16"...

Bottom-line:
There are at least 2 very important facts to face when choosing one of the 2 M1 or future M2 MBP:
- NOISE caused by wildly (but too late) working fans of overheated 14" MBP if in max performance and
- long-term reliability of these machines if regularly pushed to their max performance.


cheers

 

[maerz001]

To report what I did since my posting in January 2022:

I did wait indeed until now - and purchased in February a wonderful MBP 15" mid 2015 (!) 16 GB in perfect condition GB built-in an NVME-adapter and a 4 TB Samsung SSD.
This machine is very nice and absolutely calm, has a very good screen.

AND NOW I am considering to buy a MBP 16" and NOT a 14" because: You get a wonderful, big display, much better sound, 35% more battery-life compared to the 14" under real-life conditions, and a machine which does NOT grill the M1 like it is the case with the 14" MBP, because the cooling fans of the 16" are 2-3 times more efficient than those little things in the 14". PLUS due to the bigger housing, the passive heat exchange of the 16" is much better.
There have tests been made with exact the same system with the 14" and the 16" MBP under "max performance" conditions that had bad results: The M1 cores of the 14" have been grilled at about 100-105 degrees celsius albeit the fans already at full action (and loud) while the fans of the 16" MBP were still at 60% max action and the cores of the 16" MBP at 86-89 degrees.

Apple ignored since the very beginning of the Intel-CPU years (about 2005) the heat problem and favored NOT to cool correctly, but pretend that their MBP needs only a little bit of cooling. This killed hundreds of thousands if not more motherboards, especially the discrete GPUs until about 2014 (at least). The customers felt comfortable because of near-to-none noise, but in reality the electronic parts suffered at long term (= after 3-4 years these machines died). I was victim of two (!) total losses of MBP (both after 3 years) and I was NOT amused.

Now there is better cooling, the M1 is a big step forward, but even the very efficient M1 produces a lot of heat if at max performance. I cannot imagine that the long-term reliability of the wonderful M1/2 machines is save if these processors are regularly grilled at 100 degrees. But apple still starts too late with more cooling and still makes the customers believe that everything is ok - but it is NOT if you demand full performance over a longer period. Maybe you will pass two or three years without problems, but maybe there will be a "déjà-vu" effect in some years if you do nothing to protect your machines yourself, because apple does NOT (historically, with the dead MBP 2006-2011, they denied for many years the overheating of the discrete GPUs until there was a class action suit which forced them to accept their bad design). There are hundreds of Threads here at MacRumors about these older problems...

So - my recommendation is: download at least for the high-end 14" MBP but better also for the high-end 16" MBP one of the apps which give you the chance to establish better cooling by starting softly much sooner more cooling (when the temperature is still acceptable) and reaches a max sooner. This will prevent the M processor from being grilled and even prevent often enough that the max rpm are even necessary. So - even the noise will be more comfortable for 14" users. One of those apps I used from the third MBP with discrete GPU was MacFanControl. Once correctly customized by me, there were zero problems (still use these old MBP from 209-2011) and the GPU and CPU were MUCH better cooled.

I will purchase this year a new MBP 16" M because I like to do more postproduction in photography. And one of the first apps I will install will be one for optimizing the fan rpm to prevent overheating and to guarantee a long-term reliability of the nice 16"...

Bottom-line:
There are at least 2 very important facts to face when choosing one of the 2 M1 or future M2 MBP:
- NOISE caused by wildly (but too late) working fans of overheated 14" MBP if in max performance and
- long-term reliability of these machines if regularly pushed to their max performance.


cheers

Well i think u exaggerated. The big problem with failed GPU was the 2011 model.
The 2019 gets loud but to cool it down. I don’t see hundreds of threads about dead MBPs.

the new M models are already more efficient, thicker and heavier with better cooling. While u say the 14“ gets loud yes thats what apple needs to do to cool.
So your app also revs up the fan and makes the machine even louder.

For a laptop it’s always a compromise between size and performance.

If u want a longterm powerhouse a laptop was never the best choice. The Mac studio is for that

 

[MrAverigeUser]

Well i think u exaggerated. The big problem with failed GPU was the 2011 model.
The 2019 gets loud but to cool it down. I don’t see hundreds of threads about dead MBPs.

the new M models are already more efficient, thicker and heavier with better cooling. While u say the 14“ gets loud yes thats what apple needs to do to cool.
So your app also revs up the fan and makes the machine even louder.

For a laptop it’s always a compromise between size and performance.

If u want a longterm powerhouse a laptop was never the best choice. The Mac studio is for that

You are not correct:

1) There are a LOT of Threads about how to reanimate dead MBP and how to prevent them to die by overheating. I know what I am talking about. Just have a look at these threads. To "see" them, you must be willing to find them. Just use a search engine...

2) apple denied for many years this problem. And the repair-program to which apple did not come by itself, but only forced by a class-suit-action (!!!) included Not only the 2011 models, but further model.

3) Please read again what I wrote above. Using the apps starts (if you do a good customer-configuration) much sooner the fans AT LOW RPM, which is nearly silent or not uncomfortable at all. You have to admit, that this prevents the extreme loudness of LATER STARTING FANS which will occur with the TOO LATE starting fans of the standard-program by apple. Evidently you did NEVER use these apps or at least not the right way. So please don't tell me about the use of these apps without using them. I do since many years and I know about loud and less loud fans, you do not.

4) You tell me that I'd do the wrong decision if I buy these machines? In some ay this might be correct, if you don't carry a MBP with you, but if you do, you surely agree, that carrying a Mac studio with you is definitely Not an alternative?

5) If you tell me that these MBPs are useless for the demanded performance they can deliver:
WHY then does apple produce them and promises they could deliver the performance? You realize that your argument is absolutely absurd?

6) I wrote about long-term reliability of the new and very interesting 14/16" MBP. we still have to wait some years until we know for sure if there will be a (less frequent, but still existing) dead M1 models because they overheat up to 105 degrees celsius if the customer tries to them according to apples promised performance-data.

I think I did NOT exaggerate, I write this after having had my bad experiences with this everlasting ignorance of apple about the overheating problems and their method to sacrifice reliability of their very expensive products just by tolerating far too high temperatures for many years with older models.

There are methods to deactivate and activate the dGPUs of older models (I-Stat) and so you can prevent the death of these machines, because the dGPU is still discretely on the motherboard. If there is an accidental overheating of the dGPU while using the MBP mostly this is nevertheless a total loss economically because you have to exchange the whole motherboard.
The new M1 models are "System on chip" - so it might be that there will be a total loss anyway if the overheating over years will find its end by a dead SoC 14" which costs a lot of money.

So - I think it is very friendly by me to inform people about the possibility to configure a free app to get a "life insurance " for their beloved 14" MBP.... as long as apple still ignores the overheating problem - although they worked about ist. But still not enough. Future will tel us about the significance of this problem. Might only be frequent for more heavy users - but also THEY are customers who will face a big loss of money (perhaps 4.000-6.000 USD) , if this scenario happens.