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@zebity

Great, I am personally very happy with my CPU upgrade. I still have no need for thunderbolt. And I can use either an Nvidia Card or AMD depending on what I am working on. I am awaiting for Apple to hopefully update the Nvidia drivers on Yosemite so that I do not have to mess around with driver updates and cuda packages after each and every OS update or security patch when using Nvidia Card, GTX 980 is a good card. Also awaiting to see what 390X brings to the table:p
 
If you mean to drop 2015/2016 GPU into 2013 nMP – you won't be able to do it, even if the connector will remain the same. 2013 won't have EFI drivers and BIOS for other GPUs than D300/500/700 in its firmware.

I want to understand this, so the question is:
For example, how Apple HD 5770 / 5870 even work on MP1.1/2.1/3.1 ?
These GPUs are much younger than Mac Pros listed....there is no chance for these Mac Pros to have anything in their EFIs about 5770/5870.
 
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I want to understand this, so the question is:
For example, how Apple HD 5770 / 5870 even work on MP1.1/2.1/3.1 ?
These GPUs are much younger than Mac Pros listed....there is no chance for these Mac Pros to have anything in their EFIs about 5770/5870.

Very simple explanation.

In machines that are all 1 piece, Apple doesn't bother to have EEPROM chips on all the pieces. The main boot rom for the machine has all EFI drivers for the parts included.

I have not looked over the D300s in my nMP but it is likely that they have no EEPROM chips. If so, their rom is in main boot rom.

There will likely never be any way to add new GPUs internally to nMP. The genuflecting apologists would like to believe otherwise but reality has become rather clear.
 
I have not looked over the D300s in my nMP but it is likely that they have no EEPROM chips. If so, their rom is in main boot rom.

That is critical information.

Do you know what is role of this green chip ? (photo from iFixit)
Fairchild Semiconductor DD30AJ

tQROJZ2QBRp2kDFh
 
That is critical information.

Do you know what is role of this green chip ? (photo from iFixit)
Fairchild Semiconductor DD30AJ

Image

Looks like a power FET, most serial eeproms have a part number starting with a "25"

Blacksheep may know, he once posted the roms for the D700s, I'm pretty sure that he got them from a 6,1 EFI update.

Which would mean no GPU updates without a new EFI for the 6,1.

Good catch.
 
Looks like a power FET, most serial eeproms have a part number starting with a "25"

Blacksheep may know, he once posted the roms for the D700s, I'm pretty sure that he got them from a 6,1 EFI update.

Which would mean no GPU updates without a new EFI for the 6,1.

Good catch.

Oh, well, we will keep looking and be patient. I am fine with D300s, but if it could be upgraded down the road it would be great.
 
Balance Performance

cMP Users,

there is a lot of discussion on performance of nMP vs. cMP.

Having upgraded my 2012 Mac Pro to Dual 3.46GHZ (Westmere) I did some performance testing on areas which cause major issues with me and that is copying of large amounts of data for editing, back up and managing iTunes library.

In addition to Mac Pro 2012 I have an Xserve (early 2009) with dual 2.93GHZ CPUs which is connected to Promise Fibre Channel array which contains my large back up and file store library.

Anyone who has used an Xserve, will let you know that these are very very noisy and not something you can really include in a working environment. I keep mine with disk array down in basement and it is connected via Small Tree 10Gbe using Netgear 10Gbe switch (XS712T), which in turn is connected via dual aggregated links to Netgear Gigabit switch. As the Xserve/Promise is only required when loading / transferring files, it is generally not powered on and I can do this via remote power switch.

I mention this as while there is no doubt that upgrading the Mac Pro to dual 3.46GHZ provides near nMP performance, one of the major failures of nMP is its networking options. If you want better than 1GBe with nMP you need to purchase unwieldy and expensive Thunderbolt to 10Gbe conversion box. This is another example of how value-less Thunderbolt is. To do anything with it your always have to purchase an special protocol converter.

With each successive and incremental update I have made to my Mac Pro, I have measured the impact this has had on I/O & network bandwidth. I have found that tools like "Blackmagic Speed Disk Test", really do not provide me with any value in determining the impact of change. Rather I have a couple of simple tests:

1. Using Carbon Copy Cloner to backup entire disk (4TB) or iTunes library (500GB) - this tests combines read/write in real world context
2. Playing different encoded version of 4K video (Cineform & ProRes)

Here is % different that various upgrades make:

1. Upgrade from aggregated 1Gbe links on Mac Pro & Xserve to aggregated 1Gbe on Mac Pro and Small Tree 10Gbe on Xserve - 20% network throughput improvement

2. Turn on Jumbo Ethernet packets on all parts of network chain - 1% degradation of network throughput (from 1. Above) & a lot of stuffing about.... Summary Jumbo Packets add no value once you have TCP offload capabilities within network interface

3. Upgrade from dual 3.06GHZ to dual 3.46GHZ CPUs (internal 6Gbs SATA to 6Gbs SATA RAID 5 with Areca ARC-1882i) - 10% I/O throughput improvement

4. Upgrade Mac Pro to 10Gbe using Small Tree single port card with x4 PCIe - 84 % improvement (from aggregated 2x1GBe) and network throughput only 20% less that native internal disk to disk (via Areca).

In summary: moving to End to End 10Gbe has the largest impact on throughput performance. As large file copies take a very long time and this time gets cut in half, it really makes a difference, in productivity , much more so that the increase in CPU performance.

This also highlights a key failure of nMP, given that lack of internal expansion the most important and simplest way to get data on and off the box is via the network and nMP does not have in-built 10Gbe. Ethernet is way more useful and supports everything (storage, remote compute, remote access etc..) and has a vast market of vendors providing compatible products while Thunderbolt has very little.

I think the death of Thunderbolt in its current form seems inevitable, as there is no market for Thunderbolt displays outside of Apple and everything else it is supposed to provide is available via Ethernet or USB. I think move to Thunderbolt on nMP is a bigger mistake than the closed shop graphic adaptor one.

As mentioned my other test is for 4K video outputs and currently with Areca 1882 series adaptor and "6Gbs traditional disks" I can easily play ProRes 4k on my Mac Pro... but not CineForm 4k.

I am in process of moving to Areca 1883 12Gbs adaptor and have now got single 12Gbs SAS 6TB drive which I will test with on both Carbon Copy Cloner and 4K play. I am curious to see if 12Gps will provide sufficient bandwith to allow my old Mac Pro to play CineForm 4K without need for SSD...

Zebity
(Mac Pro 2012 with 2 x 3.46Gz, Small Tree 10Gbe, Areca 1882 & Nividia Titan)
 
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cMP Users,

I think the death of Thunderbolt in its current form seems inevitable, as there is no market for Thunderbolt displays outside of Apple and everything else it is supposed to provide is available via Ethernet or USB. I think move to Thunderbolt on nMP is a bigger mistake than the closed shop graphic adaptor one.

Zebity
(Mac Pro 2012 with 2 x 3.46Gz, Small Tree 10Gbe, Areca 1882 & Nividia Titan)

Of course, much better solution to connect expansion chassis is over USB-C hahahahahaha.....
 
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Hmm now where do I find a 15TB USB-C

Bax2003,

you are right!

I just need to find an at least 15TB USB-C solution ;-)

with redundancy as well... so that means at least around 20TB .

It is need for large storage volumes that keeps forcing me to use old solutions like spinning disks and RAID as SDD at these volumes are simply way way way beyond affordable.

I read that 4TB SSD are now available at 10 x cost per byte of 4TB spinnings disks.

Trivial aside I do think that USB-C is likely to supplant Thunderbolt.

Cheers,

Zebity
(Clunky old Mac Pro, tired spinning disks and creaking cuda cranker)
 
For Q3 2015:

Thunderbolt: 40 Gbit/s speed, PCI-e 3.0, HDMI 2.0, DP 1.2, USB 3.0, 100 W power delivery (compatible with USB Power Delivery) presumably 18V, 5,5 A and some type of converter [71] all that while using 50% power in the simplest implementation.

I don´t think that USB-C or USB-X will supplant Thunderbolt anywhere soon.
 
For Q3 2015:

Thunderbolt: 40 Gbit/s speed, PCI-e 3.0, HDMI 2.0, DP 1.2, USB 3.0, 100 W power delivery (compatible with USB Power Delivery) presumably 18V, 5,5 A and some type of converter [71] all that while using 50% power in the simplest implementation.

I don´t think that USB-C or USB-X will supplant Thunderbolt anywhere soon.

It will for the majority of mainstream users needing to connect mainstream hardware for high speed data transfer at an affordable price. For those with deep wallets and specialized needs (like zebity), there is always room for expensive niche technology like TB3. TB costs too much to make/license and after all these years, still hasn't become popular.
 
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