Verizon iPhone, No Thanks!

[abijnk]

Someone mentioned earlier that is true "multi-tasking."

In the consumer sense of the word, yes. But multi-tasking is actually a technical concept, not just "can it do more than one thing at a time?"

As someone said up top, no phone is perfect for everyone. If this particular feature is an issue for you, then stick with the piece of technology that works best for you. *shrug* End of story.

There's not a hack for that because it's a limitation of CDMA.

That's the biggest difference. Its not like Verizon won't allow it, it can't be done.

 

[Applejuiced]

I know, theres a hack to enable it for AT&T for free though.

There's not a hack for that because it's a limitation of CDMA.

 

[yg17]

I know, theres a hack to enable it for AT&T for free though.

You don't need a hack to enable simultaneous data and voice. It's allowed right out of the box on an iPhone or any other AT&T 3G phones.

 

[Applejuiced]

You actually need a hack to enable internet tethering on the iphone cause AT&T still hasnt provided that to US customers.
They anounced that they will over a year ago and still nothing.

You don't need a hack to enable simultaneous data and voice. It's allowed right out of the box on an iPhone or any other AT&T 3G phones.

 

[kzoojason76]

To clarify the incorrect information in this thread:

... My neighbor works for their corporate office in DC as an attorney and told me last year before I even thought of anyone working on 4G.

So an attorney would knowing break confidentiality? Don't think corporate would like that too much.

 

[nateo200]

I could have sworn the issue of simaltanious voice and data was a priority issue that could be fixed...*sigh too bad verizon didn't go with EVDV would elminate this issue. I wonder if it's possible to do voice over EVDO though...Maybe kdarling can enlighten me here...?..

 

[samab]

I could have sworn the issue of simaltanious voice and data was a priority issue that could be fixed...*sigh too bad verizon didn't go with EVDV would elminate this issue. I wonder if it's possible to do voice over EVDO though...Maybe kdarling can enlighten me here...?..

Precisely --- Qualcomm created ev-dv to fix this "weakness".

But the carriers said that this is an academic weakness that doesn't affect real people in the real world --- so the whole ev-dv development was dropped.

You can do VoIP-over-EV-DO rev A.

 

[nateo200]

Precisely --- Qualcomm created ev-dv to fix this "weakness".

But the carriers said that this is an academic weakness that doesn't affect real people in the real world --- so the whole ev-dv development was dropped.

You can do VoIP-over-EV-DO rev A.

My my that sure is coming to bite them in the ass! VoIP over EVDO is a good alternative and I could see verizon adding that into there dialer once 4G comes out leaving the network EVDO/LTE and hopefully upgrading the remaing 1xRTT towers to EVDO.

 

[kdarling]

As I've mentioned, a new Simultaneous Voice and EVDO standard (SVDO) has just been ratified, as part of CDMA2000 Advanced, which itself increases the normal CDMA voice capacity (quadruples, I believe).

_If_ Verizon were to implement CDMA Advanced, then it could come mid-summer, which could coincide with a combo GSM+CDMA iPhone using chips that have already been announced for this purpose.

Lotta "ifs" there I give it even odds.

Otherwise, yeah, VoIP is the other way around the limitation. I've tried it with Skype. Works surprisingly well and is very clear. Also apparently Skype uses ActiveSync to push the phone call notifications. I've gotten calls while listening to Pandora and while web surfing.

I didn't get the VoIP notifications while watching YouTube, but if I had forwarding enabled, Skype could've rung my real cell number and allowed me to choose to interrupt that.

I really need to try out Google Voice sometime, to see if this can all be tied together easier.

 

[nateo200]

As I've mentioned, a new Simultaneous Voice and EVDO standard (SVDO) has just been ratified, as part of CDMA2000 Advanced, which itself increases the normal CDMA voice capacity (quadruples, I believe).

_If_ Verizon were to implement CDMA Advanced, then it could come mid-summer, which could coincide with a combo GSM+CDMA iPhone using chips that have already been announced for this purpose.

Lotta "ifs" there I give it even odds.

Otherwise, yeah, VoIP is the other way around the limitation. I've tried it with Skype. Works surprisingly well and is very clear. Also apparently Skype uses ActiveSync to push the phone call notifications. I've gotten calls while listening to Pandora and while web surfing.

I didn't get the VoIP notifications while watching YouTube, but if I had forwarding enabled, Skype could've rung my real cell number and allowed me to choose to interrupt that.

I really need to try out Google Voice sometime, to see if this can all be tied together easier.

That's good to hear. Would the new SVDO rev need a new chipset? Also how difficult would this be to implement nationwide on every base station? If its going to require both new chipsets/tower upgrades I think verizon incorporating VoIP into there phones as part of the dialer would be easier don't you think? Customers wouldn't even know the difference and since a new phone comes out every 6 months it wouldn't be a nasty transition software wise.

 

[RexTraverse]

While I have no actual documented proof of this as of yet, I've heard from some of the Verizon Service Technicians that they are prepping their network by adding LTE to all of their towers before they make the switchover. They're still going to run the test markets to test how it's going to work, but will prep their entire network for the rollout. Then, when they decide to roll it out nationwide, all they have to do is flip a switch and they have the exact same 4G network coverage as they did with 3G.

That would be quite ambitious of Verizon to try that - and since AT&T is guaranteed NOT to take that same route, by making sure every one of their towers is LTE ready before launch, I don't see how they could possibly beat AT&T in launching LTE, even with their head start.

 

[thetexan]

My my that sure is coming to bite them in the ass! VoIP over EVDO is a good alternative and I could see verizon adding that into there dialer once 4G comes out leaving the network EVDO/LTE and hopefully upgrading the remaing 1xRTT towers to EVDO.

Not really, geeks who populate Macrumors do not represent the general population. Lots of people would buy the iPhone on Verizon and not give a crap about being able to do data and voice at the same time. Verizon's ass will be fine.

 

[bstpierre]

Yes, this is a limitation of EVDO (CDMA). One possible use case would be to answer a call and while on the call, try to look up information online. You could do that with an iPhone using safari but not on a "multi-tasking" Palm Pre or a Droid on Verizon or Sprint.

A more frequent use case for me is trying to call my wife while she is surfing the web. The call goes straight to voicemail. I upgraded her iPhone from the original to a 3Gs a couple of months ago so that isn't a problem for me anymore.

 

[kdarling]

A more frequent use case for me is trying to call my wife while she is surfing the web. The call goes straight to voicemail. I upgraded her iPhone from the original to a 3Gs a couple of months ago so that isn't a problem for me anymore.

Yes, that's the way that GSM works when not on 3G.

However, Verizon's CDMA network is set up to always give incoming voice calls priority, so the user gets notified even if they're surfing the web.

Does someone know if it is technically possible for Apple to produce iPhone which supports CDMA and GSM altogether ? The phone which could be used on the Verizon and in Europe.

Yes, that's exactly what everyone is talking about.

Verizon already has multiple "world" phones from RIM, Samsung and HTC that have both GSM and CDMA radios.

One difference with a dual mode iPhone model is that Verizon will usually unlock the GSM side of their world phones if asked. Apple probably wouldn't allow giving owners that freedom.

 

[GSMiller]

I don't really see much point in chatting and using data at the same time. I mean sure I suppose it could come in handy from time to time, but would it seriously hinder you that much?

 

[cababah]

I don't really see much point in chatting and using data at the same time. I mean sure I suppose it could come in handy from time to time, but would it seriously hinder you that much?

I am an internet junkie (reason why I got the iPhone) so yes, it would hinder me and make me feel constrained. Before the people chime in saying stuff about how they would rather have reliable calls and no internet than dropped calls, let me say that I happen to be in an area that is blanketed with 3G coverage and I see full bars almost everywhere I go.

 

[samab]

I am an internet junkie (reason why I got the iPhone) so yes, it would hinder me and make me feel constrained. Before the people chime in saying stuff about how they would rather have reliable calls and no internet than dropped calls, let me say that I happen to be in an area that is blanketed with 3G coverage and I see full bars almost everywhere I go.

If you read over all the pro-Apple journalists (like Mossberg) who reviewed and trashed all the Verizon iphone killers --- none of them actually mentioned this "weakness" (therefore it's largely an academic issue that has no real relevence to real life usage).

 

[tempusfugit]

To clarify the incorrect information in this thread:

The rumors and leaks are stating that Apple is working on an iPhone for Verizon's LTE network. The LTE network is the 4G network which has been in the works for over a year. My neighbor works for their corporate office in DC as an attorney and told me last year before I even thought of anyone working on 4G.

Companies are not stupid, they are years ahead of consumers. So, again...IF there is an iPhone on Verizon it is NOT the current iPhone but a new one make specific for Verizon's 4G network.

I don't think Apple will make another exclusivity agreement with future iPhones, personally. I think they've figured out the pitfalls of such an endeavor. As for a 4G iphone? Not in 2010 IMO. LTE will have to be a much more widely used technology before apple decides to dump a platform they're making obscene amounts of money in. Apple thinks worldwide, which we can see from the fact that all iPhones are GSM at this point in time. Much more likely we will see another 3G-based model before LTE. However, I wouldn't be surprised if Apple releases a carrier-independant hybrid CDMA/GSM model to truly be worldwide.

 

[smithrh]

As I've mentioned, a new Simultaneous Voice and EVDO standard (SVDO) has just been ratified, as part of CDMA2000 Advanced, which itself increases the normal CDMA voice capacity (quadruples, I believe).

_If_ Verizon were to implement CDMA Advanced, then it could come mid-summer, which could coincide with a combo GSM+CDMA iPhone using chips that have already been announced for this purpose.

Lotta "ifs" there I give it even odds.

Waaay way less than even odds.

Regardless of whether or not a spec's been ratified, you need to have:

* Infrastructure vendors offering it

* Handset vendors offering it

Verizon's not really investing in CDMA at this point, so there's really no incentive for the infrastructure vendors to spend the time, money and effort involved in bringing it to the marketplace.

You also get a chicken-and-egg problem with handsets and infrastructure. No handsets? Infrastructure vendors don't want to build. No infrastructure? Handset vendors don't want make devices.

 

[bruinsrme]

To clarify the incorrect information in this thread:

The rumors and leaks are stating that Apple is working on an iPhone for Verizon's LTE network. The LTE network is the 4G network which has been in the works for over a year. My neighbor works for their corporate office in DC as an attorney and told me last year before I even thought of anyone working on 4G.

Companies are not stupid, they are years ahead of consumers. So, again...IF there is an iPhone on Verizon it is NOT the current iPhone but a new one make specific for Verizon's 4G network.

The south east corridor has had an extensive verizon lte network for some time that has been tested and now isready to go.

 

[STEVESKI07]

I am an internet junkie (reason why I got the iPhone) so yes, it would hinder me and make me feel constrained. Before the people chime in saying stuff about how they would rather have reliable calls and no internet than dropped calls, let me say that I happen to be in an area that is blanketed with 3G coverage and I see full bars almost everywhere I go.

I see full bars everywhere I go too, but I still get dropped calls. I would happily give up my ability to browse the internet while in a call to not have dropped calls anymore. Especially because I would gain the ability to use the Internet and make calls on the metro (not just a select few stops) here.

 

[Applejuiced]

It was pretty usefull a few times when I need it though.
Im on the phone and need to find out something thru email. I put the call on speaker, connect and download email to get the information I need and let the caller know without having to hang up and call back again.
Or receiving phone calls while Im tethering a connection to my laptop.
So its definetelly a great feature to have over CDMA networks.

I don't really see much point in chatting and using data at the same time. I mean sure I suppose it could come in handy from time to time, but would it seriously hinder you that much?

 

[kdarling]

Regardless of whether or not a spec's been ratified, you need to have:

* Infrastructure vendors offering it
* Handset vendors offering it

Right you are. Therefore I wouldn't have brought up SVDO and a timeframe without having some facts to base a guess on.

The change to the towers is a plug-in card. They're predicted to be available en masse by mid-2010.

The change to the handsets is a chip with SVDO support. Those are shipping soon.

Verizon's not really investing in CDMA at this point, so there's really no incentive for the infrastructure vendors to spend the time, money and effort involved in bringing it to the marketplace.

From what I've read, going to 1X Advanced and adding SVDO is worthwhile if the CDMA network is going to be in place at least five years.

Since Verizon's said they're keeping CDMA for at least voice for another decade, it's likely that they would upgrade their equipment along the way, just as ATT is upgrading their 3G even while thinking of adding LTE.

You also get a chicken-and-egg problem with handsets and infrastructure. No handsets? Infrastructure vendors don't want to build. No infrastructure? Handset vendors don't want make devices.

Good points, but no different from moving to 3G or LTE.

Qualcomm is pushing for handsets to include SVDO capability starting ASAP, so that devices would be in place.

 

[fid]

I am an internet junkie (reason why I got the iPhone) so yes, it would hinder me and make me feel constrained. Before the people chime in saying stuff about how they would rather have reliable calls and no internet than dropped calls, let me say that I happen to be in an area that is blanketed with 3G coverage and I see full bars almost everywhere I go.

OP, I agree. It is amazing. I've had an iPhone 3GS since released. I've had exactly one dropped call and yet live in a large city (regardless of what others state). No resets, no battery pulls (for blackberry junkies) ... nothing.

What I have been able to do is instruct people remotely while using voice & data. I recently helped my wife who was having a problem with a web site while duplicating steps myself.

However, I've especially enjoyed being able to remote back into my workstation and then securely VPN into client's systems without any problems WHILE talking with users. Other than needing a power cord for extended sessions, this one device is AMAZING.

I've never been able to do anything REMOTELY like this with stock equipment before on Sprint or Verizon.

If this is what I can do with GSM then I'm glad Verizon rejected the deal...

 

[kdarling]

If this is what I can do with GSM then I'm glad Verizon rejected the deal...

I think there would've been a GSM model even if Verizon had said yes to Apple, so you'd still have your choice.