Walmart Still Doesn't Accept Apple Pay in U.S. Despite Many Customer Requests

[monstermash]

Simple lesson: don't shout. 'nuff said.

What the hell Are you talking about?

Actually, you said, "It's the store's information ABOUT you." The error is presuming that the store owns the information. Why would you presume that?

Among other reasons, they developed it, they possess it and they buy and sell it at will. That's a pretty strong case for ownership.

Systems like ApplePay should be available from all sellers; the government should take enforcement actions to ensure that such systems are available.

I completely disagree, but that isn't a surprise. I don't think retailers should be required to accept credit cards or debit cards, let alone ApplePay.

Do you appreciate tech like iCloud Private Relay? Do you understand what that brilliant service is providing for people? Or are you also complacent about that?

Maybe, I dunno. What is it?

More complacency. We get you're complacent -- there's no need to keep repeating yourself.

wanna go ahead and call me racist too?

The Walmarts of the world ARE NOT ENTITLED to harvest information about our transactions.

As it stands right NOW, in the U.S., they are.

Walmart would be smarter to simply adopt services like ApplePay. At some point soon, they will have no choice.

Actually, you're too complacent to be running anything.

You may not like that, but those changes will happen. There are lobbyists for pro-harvesting laws, but the number of companies (and their lobbyists) .....Paying cash IS a terrible option. Did you really not know that?

that's certainly one opinion. Others vary. I know mine does. when I had a retail business, I ALWAYS preferred cash to any other payment options. I also didn't take checks.

You think a pro-privacy policy—supporting ApplePay type services—would be unpleasant? That is a bizarre attitude. Can you explain?

I could...but it would probably be deleted for being political. Too bad. But bottom line: not a problem requiring govt intervention.

Talk is cheap. Nobody has any worry about your hypothetical. You are waaaaaay too complacent to ever actually perform any of the stalking behaviors you described.

it was a "for instance"..

That's just ignorant. Cash is a terrible option,

so you've said...speaking of repeating yourself...

No. You are angry.

thanks for telling me how I feel. That's so omniscient of you! I wish I could do that.

Do you think these complaints about iCloud Private Relay are ridiculous, or do you think regulators should be able to block this privacy-enhancing feature?

No idea, since you didn't provide any kind of summary. I'm not gonna open some other window, read whatever, and come back here. Too much hassle on a phone. If you want a better response, post the complaint rather than a link to it.

but having no idea what the feature is, I would say no, since I don't think regulators should be able to block anything absent some compelling case to do so. In this instance, you have not said what the complaints are or described the feature, or why anyone may want to block it.

If you dunno, follow the link and educate yourself.

I'll get right on that.

By your logic, ISPs should be entitled to harvest all the metadata from their users. That's a sad (and obsolete) attitude.

Is that what you think? Are you also complacent about ISPs scraping metadata?

Yes.

Do you think that the iCloud Private Relay service should be blocked? If so, explain why.

I don't know what it is, so I can't offer any opinion about it.

 

[monstermash]

Walmart not allowing Apple Pay hurts their business.

That's up to be decision makers at Walmart to determine. I have to think they have a lot more data upon which to base a decision than we do.

But even if it does hurt Walmart, it's choosing to take the hit, for whatever reasons it may have.

As for RCS, not anything I want or need. I hope Apple doesn't spend resources on it.

 

[monstermash]

Proof it’s hurting Walmart. Went to one today, 4 of 17 registers open. 😂😂😂

It will probably be out of business by next week.

 

[dba415]

Walmart not allowing Apple Pay hurts their business. Apple not implementing rcs is strategic for their value added product.

Not having to pay fees and getting people to use the Walmart app is strategic for their product. It’s the same thing

 

[I7guy]

That's up to be decision makers at Walmart to determine. I have to think they have a lot more data upon which to base a decision than we do.

But even if it does hurt Walmart, it's choosing to take the hit, for whatever reasons it may have.

As for RCS, not anything I want or need. I hope Apple doesn't spend resources on it.

Whether apple supports rcs has no practical impact on me. Walmart not supporting Apple Pay means I don’t shop there. I vote with my $$$.

 

[lartola]

Not having to pay fees and getting people to use the Walmart app is strategic for their product. It’s the same thing

Walmart isn’t saving any money worth of fees for not accepting contactless and apple pay. They only pay a fee for taking visa, mc, etc. As long as they accept chip cards at the store and let customers store their card details in walmart pay to pay for their purchases, they still have to pay the fee. They don’t save a penny, so the only benefit they get is harvesting customer information.

 

[monstermash]

Whether apple supports rcs has no practical impact on me. Walmart not supporting Apple Pay means I don’t shop there. I vote with my $$$.

Exactly as it should be. No interventions are required.

I mean, this is SUCH a first world "problem", it's unbelievable. I can't help but wonder what would do if they had real problems to worry about.

 

[monstermash]

Walmart isn’t saving any money worth of fees for not accepting contactless and apple pay. They only pay a fee for taking visa, mc, etc. As long as they accept chip cards at the store and let customers store their card details in walmart pay to pay for their purchases, they still have to pay the fee. They don’t save a penny, so the only benefit they get is harvesting customer information.

If people are loading up "Walmart pay" cards, essentially keeping that money on deposit with Walmart for future purchases, I'd say it has at least two more benefits.

 

[tmiw]

Walmart isn’t saving any money worth of fees for not accepting contactless and apple pay. They only pay a fee for taking visa, mc, etc. As long as they accept chip cards at the store and let customers store their card details in walmart pay to pay for their purchases, they still have to pay the fee. They don’t save a penny, so the only benefit they get is harvesting customer information.

If they ever get enough people using their app, they could start offering discounts or some other incentive for people to do, say, direct bank transfer instead of using a card. It's a similar thing to what Target does with REDcard. Even if only like 5% of users opt into that, that could still save Walmart a lot of money.

 

[FloatingBones]

What the hell Are you talking about?

Don't shout in discussions. Simple.

Among other reasons, they developed it, they possess it and they buy and sell it at will. That's a pretty strong case for ownership.

The "it" we're talking about is Walmart's system to scrape data on CC transactions. What are you disagreeing with? Nobody ever disputed that they developed their own scraping tech.

The question is why they should be entitled to scrape our data. Now: you personally have already declared that you're complacent about big businesses scraping your data; you're not competent to answer the question.

Normal people care about data-scraping by the Walmarts of the world. Informed consumers wonder why Walmart is deliberately blocking tech like AppplePay. For some quaint reason, you don't care.

I completely disagree, but that isn't a surprise. I don't think retailers should be required to accept credit cards or debit cards, let alone ApplePay.

Yes. You are complacent about the data-scraping issue. You're happy with big businesses scraping data. We covered that with the ignorance/apathy riddle. Do you remember?

Maybe, I dunno. What is it?

You really are complacent about privacy issues! You can look up a thorough discussion about iCloud Private Relay on MR. Then look up this link about efforts to block the service in the UK. Does that initiative make any sense whatsoever to you.

Do you even know what a VPN is?

wanna go ahead and call me racist too?

You are complacent about security issues. You're clearly ignorant about iCloud Private Relay, and you didn't bother to go educate yourself. If you want to utter opinions about privacy issues, you should be educated about privacy mechanisms—like iCloud Private Relay. Simple.

As it stands right NOW, in the U.S., they are.

You deliberately misunderstood. They are NOT entitled to my data. Laws will change when non-complacent users understand the question -- now that companies are fundamentally committed to privacy (like Apple).

You are complacent about security issues, and you haven't bothered to educate yourself. Why should we care about your opinion?

that's certainly one opinion. Others vary. I know mine does. when I had a retail business, I ALWAYS preferred cash to any other payment options. I also didn't take checks.

It's not an opinion that the lobbyist scene is shifting in retail. Apple and other companies are all-in for privacy. The political scene is changing, and many -- unlike you -- are actively engaged on the issues. They are not complacent about security and privacy issues, and they have educated themselves on the technology.

Your business was obviously quite tiny. If you think your business is a good example, give us a ball park what sort of monthly gross revenue you were receiving.

I could...but it would probably be deleted for being political. Too bad. But bottom line: not a problem requiring govt intervention.

You have self-identified as being complacent on security issues. Your opinion is not really valuable in this discussion.

it was a "for instance"..

It was a worthless hypothetical/"for instance". It wasn't ever going to happen. Deal with it.

so you've said...speaking of repeating yourself...

Then explain to us: why would any real business want to deal with more cash than absolutely necessary? How do you handle deposits? Security?

No idea, since you didn't provide any kind of summary. I'm not gonna open some other window, read whatever, and come back here. Too much hassle on a phone. If you want a better response, post the complaint rather than a link to it.

If you haven't figured out what iCloud Private Relay is > 1 year after it's part of the iCloud service, then you are fundamentally apathetic on security issues.

Yes.

You're complacent about ISPs scraping metadata on your internet connection? Wow. You are truly complacent! We'll call that metacomplacent.

I don't know what it is, so I can't offer any opinion about it

iCloud Private Relay stops ISPs from scraping metadata [from most traffic] on your internet connection. You really aren't bothered by ISPs scraping your metadata? Wow.

If you really feel that way, we have very little to talk about.

 

[RobArtLyn]

You're asking the wrong question.

If I buy something from you, why do you feel entitled to harvest my personal information in the transaction? You CANNOT do that if I pay cash. What is it in the nature of the Universe that gives you the right to gather that information and [ab]use it in the future?

This is quite similar to questions in the browser: why doesn't incognito mode mean that Google (and others) cannot track me? Google employees have called out this failure of their company to really provide an incognito mode.

You may be complacent about the failure of big businesses to honor our privacy, but many of us are not. You're welcome.

If we are both parties to a transaction then we both have a right to the data about that transaction. You know who i am and I know who you are. If you don’t want someone to know and remember something, don’t tell them in the first place. There is a reason street level drug deals happen in cash and no one uses a real name. That’s what real privacy protection looks like for all involved parties. Even then, a dealer that is paying attention will notice the patterns of repeat customers through the oldest method of all, facial recognition.

As I said earlier, if you get to remember that you like to buy apples from me because they are always fresh then I get to remember that I keep selling you apples.

 

[monstermash]

Don't shout in discussions. Simple.

You keep saying that. What are you talking about?

The "it" we're talking about is Walmart's system to scrape data on CC transactions. What are you disagreeing with? Nobody ever disputed that they developed their own scraping tech.

The question is why they should be entitled to scrape our data. Now: you personally have already declared that you're complacent about big businesses scraping your data;

Yes. I have more pressing issues to concern myself with.

Normal people care about data-scraping by the Walmarts of the world. Informed consumers wonder why Walmart is deliberately blocking tech like AppplePay. For some quaint reason, you don't care.

Yes. You are complacent about the data-scraping issue. You're happy with big businesses scraping data. We covered that with the ignorance/apathy riddle. Do you remember?
You really are complacent about privacy issues! You can look up a thorough discussion about iCloud Private Relay on MR. Then look up this link about efforts to block the service in the UK. Does that initiative make any sense whatsoever to you.

Do you even know what a VPN is?

Yes. I use a VPN. Do you know what a VPN is? Condescending minds wanna know!

You are complacent about security issues. You're clearly ignorant about iCloud Private Relay, and you didn't bother to go educate yourself. If you want to utter opinions about privacy issues, you should be educated about privacy mechanisms—like iCloud Private Relay. Simple.

Ok. Thanks.

You are complacent about security issues, and you haven't bothered to educate yourself. Why should we care about your opinion?

I have made no claims concerning whether you should care about my opinion.

It's not an opinion that the lobbyist scene is shifting in retail. Apple and other companies are all-in for privacy. The political scene is changing, and many -- unlike you -- are actively engaged on the issues. They are not complacent about security and privacy issues, and they have educated themselves on the technology.

Ok...

Your business was obviously quite tiny. If you think your business is a good example, give us a ball park what sort of monthly gross revenue you were receiving.

It grossed about $300k a year and netted about $175K a year. It was about a 50-50 mix between cash and cards.

But I would have preferred cash even if those were M rather than K. Probably even more so.

"You have self-identified as being complacent on security issues. Your opinion is not really valuable in this discussion."

Thanks for letting me know.

It was a worthless hypothetical/"for instance". It wasn't ever going to happen. Deal with it.

Why so angry?

Then explain to us: why would any real business want to deal with more cash than absolutely necessary? How do you handle deposits? Security?

Tax avoidance and cost avoidance.

Cash is easily picked up my armored car services. Happens every day.

If you haven't figured out what iCloud Private Relay is > 1 year after its part of the iCloud service, then you are fundamentally apathetic on security issues.

Darn.

You're complacent about ISPs scraping metadata on your internet connection? Wow. You are truly complacent! We'll call that metacomplacent.

Double darn.

iCloud Private Relay stops ISPs from scraping metadata [from most traffic] on your internet connection. You really aren't bothered by ISPs scraping your metadata? Wow.

You previously asked if I thought they should be entitled to capture metadata, not if I was bothered by it. Those are two different issues.

Like Walmart not accepting NFC. I think they should be allowed not to do so, even if I find it obnoxious.

"If you really feel that way, we have very little to talk about."

I agree.

I also don't conflate "security" with "privacy". They are two different things.

But here's the thing....suppose every single purchase over the course of a year, with line item detail, we're captured and made available (free or at charge, doesn't matter) to anyone who wanted it. What is the absolute worst that would happen to me? In reality, today, not in some kind of futuristic dystopian conspiracy fantasy.

Side note: I wish I could get such a report on myself. I would find it very helpful.

 

[FloatingBones]

If we are both parties to a transaction then we both have a right to the data about that transaction.

That's too vague. All the seller really needs to know is that he has securely received the funds for the transaction.

You know who i am and I know who you are.

Um... no. It's completely unnecessary w/ApplePay for the transaction for the seller to know the identity of the buyer.

If you don’t want someone to know and remember something, don’t tell them in the first place.

Bingo. That's what ApplePay provides. You never provide your identity to the merchant with ApplePay.

 

[SalisburySam]

One is cough syrup…

First donuts in a previous post, now cough syrup! When will the exposure end!

 

[monstermash]

First donuts in a previous post, now cough syrup! When will the exposure end!

I know, right!

I bet you didn't know my life could be so interesting, eh?

I might buy a pizza tomorrow.

 

[SalisburySam]

I know, right!

I bet you didn't know my life could be so interesting, eh?

I might buy a pizza tomorrow.

On the edge, man, on the edge. I just couldn’t live like that, sadly.

 

[JBGoode]

I know, right!

I bet you didn't know my life could be so interesting, eh?

I might buy a pizza tomorrow.

I get it now. Cough syrup, donuts, and pizza. You should be more careful about revealing what you buy. You're obviously involved with these guys and need to be arrested.

Pic my wife took of me just before figuring out your little scheme (a bit embarrassing I know):

 

[monstermash]

Here is some more super secret info you will need to decipher my sinister plot.

 

[ProfessionalFan]

View attachment 2105250Here is some more super secret info you will need to decipher my sinister plot.

How do you go to Citgo and only pay $3.19? My man left after only half gallon of gas.

 

[monstermash]

How do you go to Citgo and only pay $3.19? My man left after only half gallon of gas.

That was for Advil.

In this screenshot, you can see a second charge for gas. Only a few gallons because I was on a scooter. It has a 4 gallon tank.

All part of my master plan of course.

 

[lartola]

If people are loading up "Walmart pay" cards, essentially keeping that money on deposit with Walmart for future purchases, I'd say it has at least two more benefits.

People are loading their usual credit/debit cards onto walmart pay, that’s what they’re loading. If they make a purchase using walmart pay and walmart charges their card for that, walmart still pays a fee for using visa, mc, etc. No money savings for walmart.

 

[echopulse]

Well, again, it's not "America", it's literally 10% of retailers who have chosen to do something different. All this complaining is about a tiny 10% of retailers. People will complain about anything.

I don't know why brother would have to enter any kind of number when using his credit card. I certainly have never done so.

As for bank account fees...the only accounts that carry fees for HAVING the accounts are account types geared toward customers banks really don't want anyway (ones that don't keep a certain balance, have bad credit or whatever). I don't pay any fees for my bank account, and have not ever, as far as I can remember. MOST banks offer some kind of "free checking" account service.

It's actually 8 of the top 100 retailers that don't aceept contactless payments, and 4 of those are in the top 10. Wal-mart, Home Depot, Kroger, and Lowes. The other four are HEB, Hobby Lobby, Winco, and Restoration Hardware.

 

[echopulse]

In theory it’s totally no sign because years ago the card networks mandated to stop using signatures. And that was in general, even when paying via chip, because they expected the signature to be replaced by some other authentication method such as pin, which the US refused to do and just eliminated signatures without replacing them. In practice, however, the system still asks for signature at many places because the software of the cash registers hasn’t been updated.

They didn't prohibit signatures, they just stopped requiring them. Most independent restaurants still ask for signatures, but most corporate stores and chain restaurants do not.

 

[monstermash]

It's actually 8 of the top 100 retailers that don't aceept contactless payments, and 4 of those are in the top 10. Wal-mart, Home Depot, Kroger, and Lowes. The other four are HEB, Hobby Lobby, Winco, and Restoration Hardware.

which are about 10 percent of all retailers.

all this complaining about a tiny fraction of retailers.....truly a first world problem if there ever was one.

"oh, oh, I can't pay the way I want to pay in this store. I have to INSERT a card or pay cash. Help, help, I'm being oppressed! Call the govt, call the govt!"

More like call the whahbulance.

 

[tmiw]

It's actually 8 of the top 100 retailers that don't aceept contactless payments, and 4 of those are in the top 10. Wal-mart, Home Depot, Kroger, and Lowes. The other four are HEB, Hobby Lobby, Winco, and Restoration Hardware.

Winco I at least somewhat get. They've always seemed pretty card-hostile to me and likely only did the minimum possible to accept debit cards because they didn't realistically have a choice.