I still have a G4 cube, though its now only collecting dust due to lack of room. Still that was a cool design
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What do you miss in the new macs?
- Thread starter oluffen
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I still have a G4 cube, though its now only collecting dust due to lack of room. Still that was a cool design
Really ? Any of the plastic iMacs failed the test of time about 5 minutes after their introduction to me. Same for the original iBook with the handle.
All too "kid" looking. I much prefer the sleeker and more mature designs they have now.
I've always felt it striking as well. It was the first Mac to be truly eye catching! But I wonder how it would look with a 27" display hanging on the stalk?
I doubt the dynamics of the design would work with a 27", it'd just make the design unstable. I'd be perfectly happy with a 17" as long as the actual guts were upgraded though.
Wait, you miss colorful plastic that looks like a Fischer Price computer ? Over what we have now ?
You think this is innovative and you miss it :
Over this :
I'm quite baffled sorry.
I do. I believe the iMac G3 helped to save apple. I think they are great looking computers and I would take that design ANY DAY over anything in their current line up. If they could offer that case with specs of todays machines (even if it had a CRT) I would gladly take it over any other machine. Same with a Clamshell iBook.
System 7.5.3 and before we just horrid, even Motif based Unix GUIs look better :
IRIX was hardly a "Motif based Unix GUI." It had loads of custom extensions.
But yeah, you're correct; The Classic Mac OS was clearly less robust than the high-end Unix workstations of the day. I mean, Apple back then seemed to think that, just because a Mac was a 1/4 the price of a base-model, no-equipment SGI Indy, it was okay to cheap out.
The only reason people found the iMac nice back in those days is because aside from it and a couple of IBM Aptivas, all PCs were beige (including Apple computers). And frankly, the old black IBM Aptiva looked tons better than that original bondi blue iMac and the subsequent mess of kid looking toys they made until their sleeker designs came about.
The graphite G4 was the first Apple design that actually looked somewhat nice, but still looked way too plasticy to me. My PC case was made out of metal back then, thick industrial metal.
Apple has much better looking machines now than they did in those days.
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How was it hardly a "Motif based Unix GUI" when 4Dwm was written using the Motif library and widget set and ran on top of a Unix certified system ?
That would be like saying CDE was not a "Motif based Unix GUI"...
Not taking away anything from IRIX, but it is what I said it was.
But yeah, you're correct; The Classic Mac OS was clearly less robust than the high-end Unix workstations of the day. I mean, Apple back then seemed to think that, just because a Mac was a 1/4 the price of a base-model, no-equipment SGI Indy, it was okay to cheap out.
I wasn't comparing hardware, why are you ? I was talking only about the look of the GUI. At the time of System 7.5.3, OS/2 Warp, Amiga Workbench and Windows all had much better looking GUIs. OS8 refined the look a bit, but frankly but the time it was out, Microsoft was leaps ahead and it was time to kill Classic.
Oh right, you're moving goalposts on me. I believe the topic Cassie was talking about was the feel of the OS, not the hardware it ran on.
Like I said, 4dwm was heavily customized. Yes, it used the same CDE widgets, but it was not just gaudy old Motif in the way CDE was. Motif was hideous when left to its own devices.How was it hardly a "Motif based Unix GUI" when 4Dwm was written using the Motif library and widget set and ran on top of a Unix certified system ?
That would be like saying CDE was not a "Motif based Unix GUI"...
Not taking away anything from IRIX, but it is what I said it was.
I notice even you're not holding up CDE as a paragon of UI design.
Yah, and it's totally fair to compare a GUI that ran on a 68020 with unaccellerated video to one that required a RISC workstation with frame-buffered 3D graphics.
You're kidding. OS/2 and the Amiga were certainly groundbreaking from a technical perspective, but they looked like they were drawn with Crayola magic markers. Like Steve used to say, they had no taste.
Yeah, silly of me. It's totally fair to say that a $1000 machine should have been able to replicate the feel of a $10,000 one.
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That's where you're wrong. CDE and 4Dwm both use Motif. They are both "heavily customized", in the same way Gnome and XFCE are "heavily customized" compared to each other : In parts that have nothing to do with the underlying widget set.
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And frankly, seeing how Motif GUIs, including SGI 4Dwm's, all look like crap, yes, it's fair. You could do fine 16 bit graphics that looked much better than Motif back in those days on Apple hardware.
Unix vendors never concentrated on the look of the GUI. But I see you will nitpick instead of understanding the greater underlying point : Both looked like ass. That was my point, that both are completely unappealing.
Done arguing if you're going to keep moving goal posts.
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As a laptop owner, build quality has absolutely increased: the hinge problems on the last 3-4 generations of portables, not to mention the issue with the charging port detatching from the motherboard, even the painted keyboard and top case of the last PowerBooks compared to the all metal and better plastic PowerBooks... It's gone way up!
*LTD* said:
Of the unibodies and aluminum iMacs??
The build quality has only increased. The very nature of the designs facilitate this. Easily.
As a laptop owner, build quality has absolutely increased: the hinge problems on the last 3-4 generations of portables, not to mention the issue with the charging port detatching from the motherboard, even the painted keyboard and top case of the last PowerBooks compared to the all metal and better plastic PowerBooks... It's gone way up!
Not moving any goalposts.
I never moved any goalposts.
You posted a screenshot of IRIX vs System 7, and said that that proved that any old Motif-based GUI was better than System 7.
My point was that IRIX may have been classier than System 7, but it was also classier than any other Motif-based GUI, in no small part because SGI poured lots of technical and financial resources into it. No other Motif-based GUI matched System 7.
From my perspective, neither System 7 nor IRIX/4dwm looked like ass.
CDE looked like ass, the Amiga Workbench, and Windows 3.x looked like ass. OS/2 was not as gaudy as any of those, but still looked pretty cartoonish.
System 7 was basic, but tasteful.
4dwm was much more elaborate, and also pretty tasteful.
What I miss:
I definitely think the new Macs are missing character... While their designs and build quality is certainly better, they are missing the intangibles that set Macs apart from PCs...
I'm not saying I liked the colorful Macs, although whenever I used the iMac G3, I was in heaven (I was like 7 or 8 when they were in my school). I definitely think, however, even the TiBooks and Aluminum Powerbooks/MacBook Pros had character that this current generation lacks.
I definitely think the new Macs are missing character... While their designs and build quality is certainly better, they are missing the intangibles that set Macs apart from PCs...
I'm not saying I liked the colorful Macs, although whenever I used the iMac G3, I was in heaven (I was like 7 or 8 when they were in my school). I definitely think, however, even the TiBooks and Aluminum Powerbooks/MacBook Pros had character that this current generation lacks.
I miss the old G4 iMac design. The Pizza box design in use since G5 iMacs is boring and the ergonomics suck compared to the G4 iMac.
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And you accuse me of moving goalposts.System 7.5.3 and before we just horrid, even Motif based Unix GUIs look better :
The flower power and dalmatian iMacs were a bit extreme, but the earlier colors were amazing. Ruby, Sage, Snow, the 5 rev.c colors, even the Bondi Blue. Beautiful machines IMO. The iMac G4 was a work of art, the eMac had a sleek clean design with the white plastic, and the B&W PM G3's and the subsequent G4's were stunning. Nothing Apple makes today comes even close to the originality and innovation these machines have. But of course, that's just my opinion.Wait, you miss colorful plastic that looks like a Fischer Price computer ? Over what we have now ?
You think this is innovative and you miss it :
Over this :
I'm quite baffled sorry.
OS X feels the same to me, be it Leopard, Snow Leopard or Lion.
Classic was a pig sorry, even with OS8's better graphic design, it really was a dog of a OS in need of a quick death by that time.
System 7.5.3 and before we just horrid, even Motif based Unix GUIs look better :
Seriously, I know you're even too young to even remember those days really and probably just adhering to a "old school is better" mentality, but no, the old days of Apple were bad. There's a reason they almost went south back in those days. There's a reason that they are where they are right now.
Classic Mac OS was pretty dated by the time OS X came around, I do agree it should've been replaced a few years earlier than it was. But it wasn't a bad OS by any means. A simplistic one, but still quite useful. I use OS 9 today on a rare occasion, you've gotta use old versions of apps and the internet experience isn't exactly pleasurable, but you can still be productive.
However, what I really miss is the older versions of OS X. 10.2, 10.3 and 10.4. They were much more up to date then OS 9 with lots of new features and eye candy, but ]at the core still very simple and down to earth. These days, you've got features like Spaces and Launchpad and what have you, and they all seem just unnecessary in my eyes. Apple seems to be trying to integrate iOS and OS X more and more with each release, and personally I'd rather them stay very apart. OS X is for Macs, iOS for consumer electronics. For now, they are. But I wouldn't be surprised to see them combined into one OS not too far in the future, and we then no longer have what we know now as OS X. I could be wrong, and I know I'm stuck in the past, but the Apple I loved has been gone for a while now, and I don't see them ever returning to how they used to operate. That's progress, I just don't like it.
For me, it was the attention to detail. Now, there's just no detail. The cases are all drap grey. There's no highlight or accent like the PowerBooks or TiBooks. The OS also lost personality as it transformed from pinstripes (maybe too extreme) to dull grey.But then, what do I know. I remember being impressed with the motorised floppy drive eject on the Quadra
Likewise, the computer itself is bland. their laptops look like HP's, and there's nothing that looks good, like the G4 Cube.
For me, the lickability quality that made Aqua, well, aqua, is gone. The computers feel like a prison, with steel walls and no windows (pun intended).
I kind of like the black keyboards, as it breaks up the monotony of silver.
Oddly enough, I do miss the all black Macbook. I also miss Clarus the Dogcow.
MOOF!
Wait, you miss colorful plastic that looks like a Fischer Price computer ? Over what we have now ?
You think this is innovative and you miss it :
Actually for some reason it makes me think of old whiteware, where they used shiny plastic components to make it look fancy.
I actually miss the serviceability of older macs. It shouldn't be so hard to change an HDD in an iMac. There's no reason why it can't be on a rail at the bottom with the RAM.
I miss the color and dimensionality of Aqua. Everything now is flat and steely gray. IMO -- and it kills me to say this -- Windows 7 now has a more Mac-like interface than my Mac does. Even their dock is nicer than ours.
