iPad Pro What is the process for battery replacement at the Apple store?

[muzzy996]

Seems to me that things like the degradation of battery capacity over time as a battery ages and the increasing load on a system as features are added to an operating system and applications in general should be accepted truths.

A person can't stop the battery aging process but one can choose to never update the software on their device. Should one choose to stay on an old operating system for the sake of battery life they should accept the compromises that come with it which include the eventual ending of periodic security updates and the eventual obsolescence of some applications as support for older operating systems by various developers ends. That solution isn't for everyone though, since we all use our devices differently, and it also isn't necessarily restricted to just the OS itself but also the applications that are installed which all go through feature changes as they continuously evolve.

Not everyone wants to purchase a mobile device and never reap the benefits of continuous software development after the time of purchase. It should be obvious that replacing a battery in a mobile device that has gone through generational changes in operating system and application versions will not result in the same battery life that the device had when it was originally released. So what's there to argue about and why the incessent need to use data to proove such things?

 

[FeliApple]

Seems to me that things like the degradation of battery capacity over time as a battery ages and the increasing load on a system as features are added to an operating system and applications in general should be accepted truths.

A person can't stop the battery aging process but one can choose to never update the software on their device. Should one choose to stay on an old operating system for the sake of battery life they should accept the compromises that come with it which include the eventual ending of periodic security updates and the eventual obsolescence of some applications as support for older operating systems by various developers ends. That solution isn't for everyone though, since we all use our devices differently, and it also isn't necessarily restricted to just the OS itself but also the applications that are installed which all go through feature changes as they continuously evolve.

Not everyone wants to purchase a mobile device and never reap the benefits of continuous software development after the time of purchase. It should be obvious that replacing a battery in a mobile device that has gone through generational changes in operating system and application versions will not result in the same battery life that the device had when it was originally released. So what's there to argue about and why the incessent need to use data to proove such things?

This is the truth.

 

[FeliApple]

yeah sure, I am misleading, while you helping people, amen...

I wasn’t talking about you. You didn’t recommend that to anyone throughout this thread, but I have seen it happen here and elsewhere.

 

[Digitalguy]

It should be obvious that replacing a battery in a mobile device that has gone through generational changes in operating system and application versions will not result in the same battery life that the device had when it was originally released. So what's there to argue about and why the incessent need to use data to proove such things?

The point is how much is the battery life difference between a 100% battery device on say iPadOS 14 and one (same 100% battery, for instance after battery service) on iPadOS 17, 18, 19 etc.
Are we talking 5% less? Or 50% less? Because if the difference is negligeable, it doesn't matter. Also are we talking screen on time or stand-by time?
Also I don't think things are so "obvious" as you imply. I don't consider impossible that Apple makes an iPadOS version (say 20) that has actually better stand-by time than before and improves it on devices that came with prevous versions of iPadOS (with negligeable difference in screen on time)

 

[muzzy996]

The point is how much is the battery life difference between a 100% battery device on say iPadOS 14 and one (same 100% battery, for instance after battery service) on iPadOS 17, 18, 19 etc.
Are we talking 5% less? Or 50% less? Because if the difference is negligeable, it doesn't matter. Also are we talking screen on time or stand-by time?
Also I don't think things are so "obvious" as you imply. I don't consider impossible that Apple makes an iPadOS version (say 20) that has actually better stand-by time than before and improves it on devices that came with prevous versions of iPadOS (with negligeable difference in screen on time)

The question that is in the back of my mind is would the background processes that run on a stock iPadOS 14 vs stock iPadOS 17 install be identical in burden on system resources and if not, why?

Perhaps I'm thinking too simplistically but I lean towards the thought that a newer operating system with more functionality built in is going to have a heavier burden on resources and it seems like you're leaning towards less efficient code being the primary issue not the additional processing involved in the added functions. The true answer probably lies somewhere in between but which side it leans toward more I'm not sure.

 

[Digitalguy]

The question that is in the back of my mind is would the background processes that run on a stock iPadOS 14 vs stock iPadOS 17 install be identical in burden on system resources and if not, why?

Perhaps I'm thinking too simplistically but I lean towards the thought that a newer operating system with more functionality built in is going to have a heavier burden on resources and it seems like you're leaning towards less efficient code being the primary issue not the additional processing involved in the added functions. The true answer probably lies somewhere in between but which side it leans toward more I'm not sure.

I currently have around 10 iPads (mainly pros and minis) and have had others that I have sold over the years so I have seen various chips evolve over the update cycle since 2014...
The burden on system resources you mention has not translated into a burden on screen on time so the assumption that a new iPad pro 2018 for instance would last longer in 2018 than (a the same new one) today say in terms of video watching time is simply wrong in my experience, or too "simplistic" as you say (that's my first hand expierience and I couldn't care less if some other people here with no first hand experience don't believe it and think I simply "don't remember how much better" screen on time was back then).
Where I can see a difference is in stand-by time, which has got worse, but which worsens or improves with every minor update. I attribute that mainly to Find my, to shortcuts and to Siri (even if you disable all of those things as I do, except for shortcuts) working in the background constantly.
Having said that the difference in standby time over the last 3-4 iPadOS has been negligeable and you can only mainly see compared to pre-iPadOS versions.
I am fully convinced that if Apple wanted they could dramatically improve standby time.
My Samsung tablets have much better stand-by time and I don't think iPadOS is more capable / sophisticated that OneUI, far from it, OneUI is way more capable than iPadOS in my experience and I doubt that Qualcomm chips are much more efficient than Apple Silicon ones. So it's a matter of code when it comes to stand-by time.

So to sum up, no significant change in screen on time, significant change in standby time, but only compared to several years ago (standby time is just as bad now as it was say 4 years ago, so updates have changed very little, in any device)
Also no significant impact in speed since A10X (so 2017) or better (probably because anything with A10X or better has still plenty of room in terms of cores/power), but a clear impact on RAM usage (more reloads, that is more stuff ejected from RAM).

 

[FeliApple]

The question that is in the back of my mind is would the background processes that run on a stock iPadOS 14 vs stock iPadOS 17 install be identical in burden on system resources and if not, why?

Perhaps I'm thinking too simplistically but I lean towards the thought that a newer operating system with more functionality built in is going to have a heavier burden on resources and it seems like you're leaning towards less efficient code being the primary issue not the additional processing involved in the added functions. The true answer probably lies somewhere in between but which side it leans toward more I'm not sure.

I’m not sure about iPadOS 14 vs 17. The 4th-gen iPad Pro ran both, and users typically don’t share battery screenshots or talk much about iPad battery life other than “my 7-year-old updated device is gone”, but as far as history goes, this is the case. It’s highly likely that the 4th-gen iPad Pro has seen some sort of drop, how much and its relevance is rather unclear.


Apple knows exactly why, though. Which part of iOS updates decreases battery life so much even after replacements? It’s tough to say without analytics, and only Apple has those. But you can grab an iPhone 6s on iOS 15, another one on iOS 10. The one on iOS 15 will plummet just sitting on the home creek when compared to the one on iOS 10, even with a replaced battery. Why? I have no idea.


It’s likely (and this is a nod to @Digitalguy’s words), that newer, full-screen iPad Pros, as of now, are better than their 1st and 2nd-gen predecessors, just like the iPhone Xʀ on iOS 17 is comparatively better than the 6s and 7 on iOS 15. Probably due to sheer processor firepower (though not battery capacity, as the 6s Plus is very poor, too).


But I agree with you: I’m inclined to think that this is a result of increased functionality. The sad part is that devices may be better, but they still struggle. The iPhone Xʀ on iOS 17 went from a two-day phone on iOS 12 to barely getting through maybe a 6-hour SOT day today. Usable, unlike the iPhone 6s? Sure. Good? No. iPad users are more resilient: a theory, but: typically used indoors, with access to chargers, and henceforth no real, prolonged battery requirements, so people don’t really mind. Phones, OTOH, are required to have enough battery life for the day.

I wish battery replacements drove devices back to perfection, but sadly this isn’t the case.

And @Digitalguy is right about standby, too: it has worsened. But I’ll go further: it has worsened... on original iOS versions! What they have done is absurd because you can’t even fight it by staying behind. My 9.7-inch iPad Pro on iOS 12 is just as good as it was on iOS 9 (in terms of standby only, obviously), and is significantly better than my latest Air 5 on its original iOS version, iPadOS 15. This shows that the OS itself has worsened, regardless of updates and battery health.

The worst part is that users cannot fight this. Battery replacements only help temporarily, and they cannot downgrade, so the device is lost forever. iPads are especially good at longevity. Unlike iPhones (typically), you can use iPads for content consumption practically forever (An iPad Air 2 can read iBooks, it can watch tv shows, etc, even if it were on iOS 8), and it’s sad to see people say “I don’t want this anymore because it has two hours of battery life and is very slow”. My 9.7-inch iPad Pro (device from which I’m writing this), works just like my Air 5 for that on iOS 12. If it had the battery life I’ve seen that 9.7-inch iPad Pro users get on iPadOS 16, it would be turned off in a drawer, because out of principle, I won’t use software-induced garbage.

And it is especially sad because hardware longevity is astonishing on iPads. They last a lot. So if and when software accompanies that, you are practically guaranteed a very lengthy and great user experience.

A 1st-gen iPad Pro, Air 2 user, etc, can use these devices on efficient, original iOS versions for 12 years and the battery won’t fall apart, and performance won’t fall apart either. Compatibility will, and that’s the worst part.

If it were a matter of battery replacements turning everything back to perfection, it would be easy to solve. Sadly, it isn’t the case.

 

[Digitalguy]

I’m not sure about iPadOS 14 vs 17. The 4th-gen iPad Pro ran both, and users typically don’t share battery screenshots or talk much about iPad battery life other than “my 7-year-old updated device is gone”, but as far as history goes, this is the case. It’s highly likely that the 4th-gen iPad Pro has seen some sort of drop, how much and its relevance is rather unclear.


Apple knows exactly why, though. Which part of iOS updates decreases battery life so much even after replacements? It’s tough to say without analytics, and only Apple has those. But you can grab an iPhone 6s on iOS 15, another one on iOS 10. The one on iOS 15 will plummet just sitting on the home creek when compared to the one on iOS 10, even with a replaced battery. Why? I have no idea.


It’s likely (and this is a nod to @Digitalguy’s words), that newer, full-screen iPad Pros, as of now, are better than their 1st and 2nd-gen predecessors, just like the iPhone Xʀ on iOS 17 is comparatively better than the 6s and 7 on iOS 15. Probably due to sheer processor firepower (though not battery capacity, as the 6s Plus is very poor, too).


But I agree with you: I’m inclined to think that this is a result of increased functionality. The sad part is that devices may be better, but they still struggle. The iPhone Xʀ on iOS 17 went from a two-day phone on iOS 12 to barely getting through maybe a 6-hour SOT day today. Usable, unlike the iPhone 6s? Sure. Good? No. iPad users are more resilient: a theory, but: typically used indoors, with access to chargers, and henceforth no real, prolonged battery requirements, so people don’t really mind. Phones, OTOH, are required to have enough battery life for the day.

I wish battery replacements drove devices back to perfection, but sadly this isn’t the case.

And @Digitalguy is right about standby, too: it has worsened. But I’ll go further: it has worsened... on original iOS versions! What they have done is absurd because you can’t even fight it by staying behind. My 9.7-inch iPad Pro on iOS 12 is just as good as it was on iOS 9 (in terms of standby only, obviously), and is significantly better than my latest Air 5 on its original iOS version, iPadOS 15. This shows that the OS itself has worsened, regardless of updates and battery health.

The worst part is that users cannot fight this. Battery replacements only help temporarily, and they cannot downgrade, so the device is lost forever. iPads are especially good at longevity. Unlike iPhones (typically), you can use iPads for content consumption practically forever (An iPad Air 2 can read iBooks, it can watch tv shows, etc, even if it were on iOS 8), and it’s sad to see people say “I don’t want this anymore because it has two hours of battery life and is very slow”. My 9.7-inch iPad Pro (device from which I’m writing this), works just like my Air 5 for that on iOS 12. If it had the battery life I’ve seen that 9.7-inch iPad Pro users get on iPadOS 16, it would be turned off in a drawer, because out of principle, I won’t use software-induced garbage.

And it is especially sad because hardware longevity is astonishing on iPads. They last a lot. So if and when software accompanies that, you are practically guaranteed a very lengthy and great user experience.

A 1st-gen iPad Pro, Air 2 user, etc, can use these devices on efficient, original iOS versions for 12 years and the battery won’t fall apart, and performance won’t fall apart either. Compatibility will, and that’s the worst part.

If it were a matter of battery replacements turning everything back to perfection, it would be easy to solve. Sadly, it isn’t the case.

Not easy to solve, since Apple replaces the battery only when it's already trash and often by the time it's trash the iPad is obsolete and not even eligeable for replacement, like the first gen pro is now.
They say they replace below 80% but their 80% in my experience means a couple of hours of battery life at best.

But I'll say something that will make some Apple fans scream now.
Samsung flagship tablets are now much more future proof than any iPads.
They have as much or more RAM, CPU power has increased a lot are reduced the gap significantly... And they have battery protection features that iPads lack (only solution with iPads it to baby the battery).
And above all, they remain compatible with apps much longer than iPads. My Tab S4 from 2018 is still on Android 10 and compatible with everything. My lenovo tablet from 2014 is still on Android 5 and 90% of apps work (hardly any app works anymore on IOS 9, which is more recent...). But while the lenovo and the S4 were underspecced (just like iPad were in terms of RAM) compared to computers of their time, now they are on par with very decent computers in terms of CPU and Power. So if you don't care about security you can use them well past the 5 years of updates (and the battery can last well over a decade if battery protection is enabled and some common sense is used... my S4 still has amazing battery life, my lenovo still last virtually as much as 10 years ago)
And stnadby time is better than on iPad.
And now Samsung is starting to give 7 years of updates (let's hope it does not degrade things with those updates on future tablets...)

 

[FeliApple]

Not easy to solve, since Apple replaces the battery only when it's already trash and often by the time it's trash the iPad is obsolete and not even eligeable for replacement, like the first gen pro is now.
They say they replace below 80% but their 80% in my experience means a couple of hours of battery life at best.

Yeah, it’s just the cycle: time elapses, health decreases, iOS updates are impossible to roll back. Best case scenario? A battery replacement right before the end of eligibility, an updated device that lasts several years with half-usable battery life. Worst case? An EOL device with full iOS updates and a degraded battery with no decent solution other than to upgrade.

That’s when updated. I consider the best case scenario an iPad on its original iOS version, with the original battery forever, used for whatever that original iOS version supports. When that isn’t enough? Keep it for content consumption and upgrade. You have to upgrade regardless, but it’s very important for me that the entire device’s lifespan has been flawless.

This is why I often state that this is a preference: others may prefer constant compatibility at the expense of long-term battery life and performance, and there’s nothing wrong with that.

But I'll say something that will make some Apple fans scream now.
Samsung flagship tablets are now much more future proof than any iPads.
They have as much or more RAM, CPU power has increased a lot are reduced the gap significantly... And they have battery protection features that iPads lack (only solution with iPads it to baby the battery).
And above all, they remain compatible with apps much longer than iPads. My Tab S4 from 2018 is still on Android 10 and compatible with everything. My lenovo tablet from 2014 is still on Android 5 and 90% of apps work (hardly any app works anymore on IOS 9, which is more recent...). But while the lenovo and the S4 were underspecced (just like iPad were in terms of RAM) compared to computers of their time, now they are on par with very decent computers in terms of CPU and Power. So if you don't care about security you can use them well past the 5 years of updates (and the battery can last well over a decade if battery protection is enabled and some common sense is used... my S4 still has amazing battery life, my lenovo still last virtually as much as 10 years ago)
And stnadby time is better than on iPad.
And now Samsung is starting to give 7 years of updates (let's hope it does not degrade things with those updates on future tablets...)

Android’s compatibility scheme would be perfect for iOS, agreed. Long-term general compatibility would practically eliminate the only drawback that staying behind has, and would make staying behind far and above the only correct choice to maintain device quality. Sadly, today’s status quo is marred with compatibility issues which make the “update and replace battery” cycle unavoidable for many, even if, like you mentioned, there comes a point in which due to loss of support this approach is untenable, even if you were to accept and/or tolerate the loss of SOT after replacement.

Devices succumb to either lack of compatibility or sheer degradation. Only those users with very light usage patterns can escape this, like myself. If my 9.7-inch iPad Pro cannot do something I use something else and accept every compatibility loss as unfortunate developer policy, one which I cannot do nothing about. Others cannot, update, and then upgrade when it becomes untenable. Unfortunate and forced choices due to circumstances which users cannot fight.

 

[muzzy996]

Over the past several years standby time has been hit and miss for me with my 2nd gen iPP 12.9 and over the course of those several years I have had it replaced twice. I agree with the idea that code base has a lot to do with it because there can be significant changes in standby time between updates in iPadOS. There's no doubt in my mind that if I were to nuke any of my iPads, set them up as new and not install anything on them the standby time will differ as opposed to what they demonstrate currently, just like I have no doubt that standby time will vary for me between update versions moving forward without significant changes on my part in app installs and settings.

The only point I was trying to make is that as more gets done in the background more processing time is needed, I wasn't trying to dismiss the fact that Apple (and app developers) play a role in the efficiency of background (and foreground) processing. That's what I get for entering into a conversation mid stream LOL.

I haven't had an Android tablet since 2017 or an Android phone since 2021 but I don't doubt that there have been improvements there. I attribute my move to iPads in 2017 to Google abandoning Android tablet development briefly and leaving 3rd party manufacturers like Samsung and Lenovo etc. holding the bag to keep things moving while Google focused on Chromebooks. I was happy to see other manufacturers continue to carry the torch and carry it well, and for Google to get back into making Android tablets to further bolster development. I'm still all-in with iPad for now though since I do like my iPhone and I'm going to stick it out despite not being happy with random standby time issues on my iPads.

 

[Digitalguy]

Over the past several years standby time has been hit and miss for me with my 2nd gen iPP 12.9 and over the course of those several years I have had it replaced twice. I agree with the idea that code base has a lot to do with it because there can be significant changes in standby time between updates in iPadOS. There's no doubt in my mind that if I were to nuke any of my iPads, set them up as new and not install anything on them the standby time will differ as opposed to what they demonstrate currently, just like I have no doubt that standby time will vary for me between update versions moving forward without significant changes on my part in app installs and settings.

The only point I was trying to make is that as more gets done in the background more processing time is needed, I wasn't trying to dismiss the fact that Apple (and app developers) play a role in the efficiency of background (and foreground) processing. That's what I get for entering into a conversation mid stream LOL.

I haven't had an Android tablet since 2017 or an Android phone since 2021 but I don't doubt that there have been improvements there. I attribute my move to iPads in 2017 to Google abandoning Android tablet development briefly and leaving 3rd party manufacturers like Samsung and Lenovo etc. holding the bag to keep things moving while Google focused on Chromebooks. I was happy to see other manufacturers continue to carry the torch and carry it well, and for Google to get back into making Android tablets to further bolster development. I'm still all-in with iPad for now though since I do like my iPhone and I'm going to stick it out despite not being happy with random standby time issues on my iPads.

Android tablets are night and day with what they were 5-6 years ago... My Tab S4 came in 2018 just like my 11" iPad pro and man those devices are night and day. Sure the S4 has oled, but the A12x wipes the floor with the SD 835, both had 4GB RAM and 6GB max (because Apple has always starved the iPad with RAM). Back then OneUI was way more capable than IOS 12. And even today it is more capable than iPadOS 17, but they are much closer. But today Android has many pro apps (drawing, video editing, note taking etc) and way more optimized apps that back then.
But above all the hardware gap is much narrower. My M1 pro and my Tab S9 feel just as fast and I don't think the M2 is much different. They are as fast as a high end ultrabook and have both betwen 8 and 16GB RAM (back then the iPad pro was fast as a high end pc while the S4 was as slow as an entry level one).