Which M2 Air/M3 Max Dynamic Duo Would You Take of These?

[JustAnExpat]

You suggest that It is a waste of time and money to look forward and that A person should buy for what he or she needs today. Clearly I disagree. ;~)

Sure we are guessing about future needs, but some trends have not changed in 40+ years of Apple computers. Apple II kept growing from 4k IIRC to 64k, then the Mac came out with 128k; over the next 39 years k became MB then GB and now we are at 128 GB available RAM in a MBP. That trend will continue over the 3-6 year life cycle of new boxes being purchased now ~12/23.

It does not take a computer scientist or long experience or heavy research to see the trend. Configuring a $2,000-$4,000 computing tool based upon what worked last year when we know RAM demands by OS and apps will constantly increase is simply bad configuring.

As I posted earlier about trends in Base RAM:

I will only focus on consumer portables.

1GB. This was used in the Late 2007 MacBook released on November, 2007 until the MacBook Late 2008, discontinued in January, 2009. It lasted 25 months.

2GB. This was used in the Late 2008 AL MacBook released on October, 2008, until the MacBook Air 11”, Mid 2011, which was discontinued n June, 2012. This lasted 44 months.

4GB. This was used in the MacBook Air 13”, Mid 2011 released in July, 2011 until the MacBook Air, 13” Early 2015, which was discontinued in June, 2017. This lasted for 71 months.

8GB. This was used as standard on MacBook Air, 2017, released on June, 2017 until now, in November, 2023. 77 months and counting.

Clearly, the amount of time machines stayed at 1GB was half what the time for 2GB, which was almost half of what 4GB. I expect 16GB to become standard in another 40 months or thereabouts, if trends continue.

For what it's worth, professional machines came with 8GB of RAM, as base, with the 2012 12" Retina MacBook Pro. That's over 10 years of 8GB as base RAM.

[source: MacTracker]

 

[Allen_Wentz]

As I posted earlier about trends in Base RAM:

I will only focus on consumer portables.

1GB. This was used in the Late 2007 MacBook released on November, 2007 until the MacBook Late 2008, discontinued in January, 2009. It lasted 25 months.

2GB. This was used in the Late 2008 AL MacBook released on October, 2008, until the MacBook Air 11”, Mid 2011, which was discontinued n June, 2012. This lasted 44 months.

4GB. This was used in the MacBook Air 13”, Mid 2011 released in July, 2011 until the MacBook Air, 13” Early 2015, which was discontinued in June, 2017. This lasted for 71 months.

8GB. This was used as standard on MacBook Air, 2017, released on June, 2017 until now, in November, 2023. 77 months and counting.

Clearly, the amount of time machines stayed at 1GB was half what the time for 2GB, which was almost half of what 4GB. I expect 16GB to become standard in another 40 months or thereabouts, if trends continue.

For what it's worth, professional machines came with 8GB of RAM, as base, with the 2012 12" Retina MacBook Pro. That's over 10 years of 8GB as base RAM.

[source: MacTracker]

Nonsense! Whatever does base RAM have to do with anything? Pretty much every post here except me is whining about not enough base RAM. The point is that real demands on RAM have increased steadily since the beginning of Apple and that buyers should plan accordingly.

 

[JustAnExpat]

Nonsense! Whatever does base RAM have to do with anything? Pretty much every post here except me is whining about not enough base RAM. The point is that real demands on RAM have increased steadily since the beginning of Apple and that buyers should plan accordingly.

> Pretty much every post here except me is whining about not enough base RAM

MacRumors does not reflect the general computer user population.

>The point is that real demands on RAM have increased steadily since the beginning of Apple

No it hasn't. Can you provide a source, like how I provided a source for base RAM?

 

[NEPOBABY]

The point is that real demands on RAM have increased steadily since the beginning of Apple and that buyers should plan accordingly.

For office workers memory usage has remained stagnant for a decade because of cloud apps. 10+ years ago they had to run a fat email client, a spreadsheet app like Excel, a database management app etc locally on their computer.

That has all moved to the cloud and the browser based versions consume less memory and drive space than the locally installed versions. So while the OS is consuming a bit more resources their apps and files are consuming much less on their device.

 

[Allen_Wentz]

For office workers memory usage has remained stagnant for a decade because of cloud apps. 10+ years ago they had to run a fat email client, a spreadsheet app like Excel, a database management app etc locally on their computer.

That has all moved to the cloud and the browser based versions consume less memory and drive space than the locally installed versions. So while the OS is consuming a bit more resources their apps and files are consuming much less on their device.

I certainly do not disagree, which is why I have consistently argued here that minimum RAM should remain low. The needs of deskbound office workers (most of whom are using crap Win boxes anyway) and others at the lowest end usages (K-12; granny with email) are not really relevant to discussion of what a PhD student's highly mobile and potentially highly variable needs may be.

 

[Allen_Wentz]

>The point is that real demands on RAM have increased steadily since the beginning of Apple

No it hasn't. Can you provide a source, like how I provided a source for base RAM?

I have no intention of doing your homework for you. I lived it, including watching RAM much too intimately as an Adobe user since early PS in the 90s, and that is my quite solid source. RAM usage was and is so important that Adobe built use of a scratch disk into its apps. Go back to 1984 and each year since then and look at max-available RAM options just like you looked at relatively meaningless lowest-available-RAM data.

 

[JustAnExpat]

I have no intention of doing your homework for you.

You make a claim. You support the claim. That's how it works in a discussion. Otherwise, it's a bad faith discussion and I do not tolerate that type of behavior.

 

[NEPOBABY]

I certainly do not disagree, which is why I have consistently argued here that minimum RAM should remain low. The needs of deskbound office workers (most of whom are using crap Win boxes anyway)

This isn't really a thing in many offices. I've worked at six large companies where half the employees were not desk bound or using PCs. They each had several hundred employees with MacBooks, MacBook Airs and Pros. They had to move around from department to department, meeting to meeting, and they hot desk.

Their Macs typically had 8GB because that was all they need and it kept costs down.

 

[Allen_Wentz]

You make a claim. You support the claim. That's how it works in a discussion. Otherwise, it's a bad faith discussion and I do not tolerate that type of behavior.

 

[Allen_Wentz]

What I said was:
"The point is that real demands on RAM have increased steadily since the beginning of Apple and that buyers should plan accordingly"
and
"I lived it, including watching RAM much too intimately as an Adobe user since early PS in the 90s."

You are free to disagree and argue that your experience differs from my (substantial) experience. But please do not suggest that my experience is "a bad faith discussion."