iPhone SE (2016) Why Apple made the iPhone SE

[johny328i]

Many people keep forgetting, that a phone is not only a screen and a camera.

Cheaper phones almost always miss :
- IP67/68 water/dust resistance certification
- stereo speakers
- Qi wireless charging
- quality built body
- good camera

The only thing from all this Pixel 3a offered, is the good camera. It is plastic, no water resistance, no wireless charging, and a SoC that was already slow.

Literally the only thing bad about the SE2 is the old screen design.

And while there are quite a lot midrange android phones, they always miss the specs above.

They have 3-4 cameras, big bezelless screens, some of them have flagship processors, but they lack the rest, which ruins the whole experience in the end.

And finally - the size. No one is making small phones anymore, and I feel like that many people still prefer them. I'm one of them - I have a Xs, and can afford the 11 Pro, but both of them are big, so I'm going for the new SE until the 5.4" comes out. Then I'm going to switch.

 

[steve1960]

The SE is made for me. I take very few pics and video. I am sold on the Apple ecosystem all our family devices are Apple. I mostly use Apps for banking, credit cards, taxi's, on line purchases, delivery food ordering, email and messaging. I don't like using my wife's iPhone X because I prefer having a home button. I don't need huge display real estate or the latest greatest display technology. I like the size of my 6s suits me perfectly. I will be replacing the 6s with the SE for sure probably in 2021 when the 6s is no longer supported by the latest iOS.

 

[akash.nu]

You make One valid point and the other one is untrue.

iOS has matured to the point where Apple could do nothing, and it would still be favored because of how fluid and simplistic it is to use.

Where are your incorrect, android isn’t stagnated, as matter of fact, it’s a complete opposite. Androids continued improvements for User customization Has never been stronger. It’s one of the main things Apple is missing, is widgets that android actually has over iOS.

Plus, some of the phones you have listed for Android, are quite outdated in terms of its OS, which if you’re using some of the latest galaxy devices, you’d see exactly what I’m referring to.

I see this widget on the home screen argument comes up every now and then in favour of Android. I’d really like to see some stats on how much an average Android user uses / relies on these.

Personally I’ve not encountered many Android users who are relying on these on a regular basis.

Also let’s not forget widgets are available on iOS just a left swipe away from the home screen. It seems to me that the present implementation on iOS is a good happy medium between making some cut down version of certain data / info available to the user and also not cluttering the home screen with them at the same time. They’re neatly tucked away to be summoned when required.

 

[ApfelKuchen]

There are a variety of reasons people may switch from Android. One is that Apple is an "aspirational brand." Whether it's a matter of what owning an Apple might do for a person's self-esteem (I've come up in the world/can afford 'the best'), or as a status symbol (dress for success), no other brand plays that role. Sure, you can buy "the best" Samsung or Xiaomi and scratch that itch to a certain extent, but buying any Apple product, regardless of price, scratches that itch. So when people are given a chance to buy into that brand name at a relatively low price and without significant compromise on performance/build quality... Yeah, it's going to rope-in a fair number of switchers.

Apple's role as an aspirational brand doesn't change much in emerging markets. What's different is smaller potential market share. But when that emerging market has a huge population, even a tiny market share can translate into very substantial unit sales. So long as the economy and middle class continue to grow over time, Apple's business will grow over time. As more Apple products are seen "in the wild," more people buy into the aspiration. It's a slow game, but growth is growth.

And there is the ever-present benefit of high profit margins. Commodity-priced phones have razor-thin profit margins. How many $300 phones have to be sold to match the gross profit on one SE?

 

[44267547]

I see this widget on the home screen argument comes up every now and then in favour of Android. I’d really like to see some stats on how much an average Android user uses / relies on these.

Personally I’ve not encountered many Android users who are relying on these on a regular basis.

Also let’s not forget widgets are available on iOS just a left swipe away from the home screen. It seems to me that the present implementation on iOS is a good happy medium between making some cut down version of certain data / info available to the user and also not cluttering the home screen with them at the same time. They’re neatly tucked away to be summoned when required.

Just a few things worth noting here:

1.) To be fair, What you’re saying Apple has for ‘widgets’, I think we all know really isn’t a true widget. It’s more of a confused shortcut that really doesn’t get utilized the way it should. But yes, they did implement that when you swipe left, You have basic options for a widget, but it’s not executed very well.

2.) Isn’t iOS 14 allegedly revamping ‘widgets‘ for more customization through iOS? At least I thought that was the rumor AFAIK. If so, I think that shows you that Apple is trying to conform to being more customizable, similarly to how they added ‘dark mode‘.

3.) The difference between android versus iOS, android lets the user kind of create their ‘own version‘ of what works for them in terms of short cutting/accessing certain parts of an app, where iOS doesn’t really do any of that. Now, I’m not complaining, I’m pointing out that iOS is a very clean/organized portrait, but it really doesn’t give the user the customization in terms of allowing them to make it their own. That’s what Android does I think that others have commented that they appreciate.

 

[akash.nu]

Just a few things worth noting here:

1.) To be fair, What you’re saying Apple has for ‘widgets’, I think we all know really isn’t a true widget. It’s more of a confused shortcut that really doesn’t get utilized the way it should. But yes, they did implement that when you swipe left, You have basic options for a widget, but it’s not executed very well.

This is somewhat on the app developers really to decide what a widget can / can’t do.

2.) Isn’t iOS 14 allegedly revamping ‘widgets‘ for more customization through iOS? At least I thought that was the rumor AFAIK. If so, I think that shows you that Apple is trying to conform to being more customizable, similarly to how they added ‘dark mode‘.

Is it?! May have missed that rumour. I thought if anything the revamp will probably be on iPadOS. This will be an interesting space to watch.

3.) The difference between android versus iOS, android lets the user kind of create their ‘own version‘ of what works for them in terms of short cutting/accessing certain parts of an app, where iOS doesn’t really do any of that. Now, I’m not complaining, I’m pointing out that iOS is a very clean/organized portrait, but it really doesn’t give the user the customization in terms of allowing them to make it their own. That’s what Android does I think that others have commented that they appreciate.

You’ve rightly pointed out, iOS has never been about giving millions of option to the users that people don’t even know / care about. That’s one of the major selling point for iOS.

Personally I feel customisation is way too overblown in the tech forums. I wouldn’t think an Average joe would fiddle around with the myriad of toggles available on Android. Heck even I get tired scrolling through the options on different Android devices. It’s so tiring. That’s why I’m intrigued to know if there has been any study around the usage of the widgets in particular. I genuinely hope Apple don’t kill the iOS simplicity.

 

[44267547]

This is somewhat on the app developers really to decide what a widget can / can’t do.



Is it?! May have missed that rumour. I thought if anything the revamp will probably be on iPadOS. This will be an interesting space to watch.



You’ve rightly pointed out, iOS has never been about giving millions of option to the users that people don’t even know / care about. That’s one of the major selling point for iOS.

Personally I feel customisation is way too overblown in the tech forums. I wouldn’t think an Average joe would fiddle around with the myriad of toggles available on Android. Heck even I get tired scrolling through the options on different Android devices. It’s so tiring. That’s why I’m intrigued to know if there has been any study around the usage of the widgets in particular. I genuinely hope Apple don’t kill the iOS simplicity.

These are all good points. And I agree with one main thing you said, is iOS has always been simplistic and fluid. And if Apple continues to expand on changing that through widgets, it could convolute things that would take away that simplistic value that iOS has always carried. If Apple does implement widgets in a way that would create more customization, I still suspect it would allow the user to keep it simplified enough where it’s not obtrusive. iOS has always been the core value of what the iPhone is today, and I don’t think Apple would want that to be affected with a ‘disorganized’ look, So I’m curious to see what the iOS team ‘brings to the table‘ per se.

 

[macrumors newbie]

You make One valid point and the other one is untrue...

Those are excellent points. Thank you. You brought up another reason to leave Android. The manufacturers routinely cut off updates long before the OS outgrows the hardware. It's true that I cannot install Android 10 on my S8. My S3 was even worse, only receiving 2 years of updates.

 

[Nipommu]

I had to laugh at that claim given how it's obviously untrue. If anything, Android manufacturers have become even more competitive since the original iPhone SE.

Xiaomi sells a $169 device with 6.1" OLED, triple rear camera, and in-display fingerprint sensor. And it was launched 10 months ago.

404 - Xiaomi Global

View Xiaomi errors/404. Check the latest errors/404 products from Xiaomi official site Mi.com .

www.mi.com

Let's not even talk about the $300 5G devices that are now available.

Will the SE2 be successful? Sure, because of the Apple branding. But the SE2 is no more competitive than the original SE was in 2016. The consolidation of Android manufacturers makes the market more competitive than before.

But its a xiaomi, literally nobody cares about these low end super budget phones from china. tech from china. whose strategies are just price it cheap. Or otherwise it has no point in existing. And like I said before, these chinese tech companies steal intellectual property and assets from tech companies from japan, korea, and america which are seized by the chinese government and given to their own chinese tech companies to remain competitive.

Most of the "techy" components in these cheap chinese brands (im including huawei too) are either bought from other countries' tech companies or stolen. Chinese tech companies have no reason for existing other than to serve the "i dont' care but i want to spend the least" crowd. These tech such as finger print in sensor, no bezel, rotating camera, 108MP camera, blah blah...other giant tech companies literally had them created and could implement them way back when but they didn't. Why? because it offers no real "innovation" and brings too much compromise. Thats why. Samsung has a brand image to protect and an UI, and UX to protect and so does apple. But these chinese cheap tech companies don't. They can afford to lose because they have nothing. Making sense?

Copy copy copy copy copy steal steal steal steal steal cheap cheap cheap cheap cheap = chinese "tech" companies in a nutshell

Watch these tech companies either whither and die off or have their market share shrink considerably starting from 2020. Low end iphones will become their worst enemy....

Again, why the hell would anybody buy a xiaomi, huawei or a any of the other garbage chinese companies when there are iphones and galaxies at similar price? Absolutely no reason to buy them. Good riddance.

 

[JPack]

Many people keep forgetting, that a phone is not only a screen and a camera.

Cheaper phones almost always miss :
- IP67/68 water/dust resistance certification
- stereo speakers
- Qi wireless charging
- quality built body
- good camera

The only thing from all this Pixel 3a offered, is the good camera. It is plastic, no water resistance, no wireless charging, and a SoC that was already slow.

Literally the only thing bad about the SE2 is the old screen design.

And while there are quite a lot midrange android phones, they always miss the specs above.

They have 3-4 cameras, big bezelless screens, some of them have flagship processors, but they lack the rest, which ruins the whole experience in the end.

And finally - the size. No one is making small phones anymore, and I feel like that many people still prefer them. I'm one of them - I have a Xs, and can afford the 11 Pro, but both of them are big, so I'm going for the new SE until the 5.4" comes out. Then I'm going to switch.

The screen is also the single most expensive component in a smartphone. Most consumers move up in screen size because they're consuming more content. They've already used a 4" or 5" display for years and want more.

For the $399 Android brands that dominate the world, are consumers really looking for wireless charging or water resistance? Do consumers mind if the chassis uses 6000 series aluminum instead of 7000 series if the display much bigger?

The Pixel represents 2% of global sales and shipment. The brand is unavailable in most regions and is effectively a rounding error. If you consider the top 3 major mainstream Android brands, the feature/price mix is done quite well.

 

[NickName99]

I’m not sure if “Apple knew all along” but they sure have taken the opportunity of being in this strong position. Kudos to their market research and marketing teams and of course the adverts partners.

You’re implying that the Apple is only in this strong position because of their marketing and ads? Isn’t that kind of silly?

 

[Seanm87]

I feel like with the SE and the upcoming 5.4 inch iPhone a lot of android manufacturers may start to make smaller phones again.

We've reached the max on screen size until foldables become a thing.

 

[akash.nu]

You’re implying that the Apple is only in this strong position because of their marketing and ads? Isn’t that kind of silly?

No, I’m saying to bring in a lower tiered device when Apple is well known for targeting the more premium market, required a lot of market research backed by clever marketing tactics.

 

[JPack]

I feel like with the SE and the upcoming 5.4 inch iPhone a lot of android manufacturers may start to make smaller phones again.

We've reached the max on screen size until foldables become a thing.

I think the main goal of the 5.4" model is to let Apple to say "iPhone 5G starts at $649." Otherwise, Apple has no response to the current 5G devices priced at $300-$500. If the 5.4" model were a Pro device, then it might provoke a response from Android manufacturers.

 

[kamran9558]

I have been thinking exactly the same. I guess the era of 800£+ phones is going to be over soon. Iphone se 2020 has really changed the market for the better.

 

[NickName99]

No, I’m saying to bring in a lower tiered device when Apple is well known for targeting the more premium market, required a lot of market research backed by clever marketing tactics.

Apple released a $399 phone thats more powerful than any Android phone, and it includes 5 years of software updates. They just lapped the competition. It’s silly to try to reframe that as “marketing tactics”.

 

[jay968]

I think they released this phone because people have gotten wise to the fact that $1000 phones are a bad investment and are just not buying like they used to. Apple just wants to sell more phones again.
I've owned more phones in the past 8 years than I can remember. I've finally come to own the best phone that I've owned since the Blackberry Curve I had back then. It's not an iphone but it cost me $350. Pixel 3a. I used to own an iphone Xs, an Xr, several Samsungs, several Motorolas, most all costing between $700 and $1000. The Pixel 3a is better than any one of them.

 

[nordique]

I clicked through the first 9 minutes, but the final 2 minutes is interesting and I have not heard that take.

For those not wanting to watch, it essentially says that Apple's strategy all along was to slowly increase phone prices to get android to have their increase their phone prices. Apple knew they would be able to reuse the old iphone bodies and release a phone today (2020 SE) that performed better than the expensive android phones and android phone makers would have no answer. Apple now is the only company capable of releasing these cheaper phones that perform at the level they do.

Hmmm thanks for the summary. Very interesting.

Will watch it now

 

[Abazigal]

I clicked through the first 9 minutes, but the final 2 minutes is interesting and I have not heard that take.

For those not wanting to watch, it essentially says that Apple's strategy all along was to slowly increase phone prices to get android to have their increase their phone prices. Apple knew they would be able to reuse the old iphone bodies and release a phone today (2020 SE) that performed better than the expensive android phones and android phone makers would have no answer. Apple now is the only company capable of releasing these cheaper phones that perform at the level they do.

I didn't click on the video, but I think iPhone prices have been going up for the simple reason that they cost more to make. I doubt there is a grander plan to make Android OEMs sabotage themselves in the long run. Likewise, Apple probably did their own market research and concluded that there was a sizeable enough market for a refreshed iPhone 8 model to profit from, and so they did. That the pandemic happened around the same time was pure coincidence.

The simplest explanation is probably the right one here.

 

[TrickyTreeRed]

The simple answer is money.

Apple needs a phone that can compete on price point with mid-tier Android phones. Why? To keep existing and attract new consumers to the Apple ecosystem.

Apple makes a great deal of its profits from the App Store. The company is more than just hardware. Apple risks driving away customers if it charges too much for iPhones.

The differences and quality between mid-tier and flagship devices are rapidly shrinking. Google proved this last year with the Pixel 3A. It’s a great phone, priced very competitively and has sold like hot cakes. The Samsung A51 is also a very good device as are phones from several Chinese companies. They cost around $400 without a contract.

If Apple did not respond with a similar priced iPhone, it’s market share would most likely shrink. This would mean less income from apps and accessories.

 

[44267547]

I think they released this phone because people have gotten wise to the fact that $1000 phones are a bad investment and are just not buying like they used to.

Except, a smart phone is not an investment at all, it’s a commodity. Apple created the original 2016 iPhone SE simply for other emerging markets, and it sold well for two years. The reason they discontinued it, because it wasn’t generating enough money anymore. So why did they revamp the iPhone SE 2? For the same reason the first GEN SE existed, except in a more favorable form factor with the 4.7 inch being popular as it was for over four years.

Plus, they broadened the spectrum for a wider variety of iPhones, which creates more revenue across different revenue households of what somebody is able to afford.

 

[akash.nu]

This video sums it up nicely.

 

[cynics]

Current device support is causing software development to be hindered.

Core frameworks (using deep and machine learning, advanced image/video processing, native hardware support for complex media codec like h265, hardware specifically for energy efficient background task, etc) in iOS 13 aren't being heavily leveraged due to iOS guidelines preventing supported device fragmentation. Most devs just support the lowest common denominator (iPhone 6S?).

Like the move from 32 bit to 64 bit native hardware support for iOS across Apples line up at all price points is really the only solution. The iPhone SE 2 fills the budget roll.

 

[rui no onna]

Current device support is causing software development to be hindered.

Core frameworks (using deep and machine learning, advanced image/video processing, native hardware support for complex media codec like h265, hardware specifically for energy efficient background task, etc) in iOS 13 aren't being heavily leveraged due to iOS guidelines preventing supported device fragmentation. Most devs just support the lowest common denominator (iPhone 6S?).

That would be the iPad mini 4 and iPad Air 2. The A8 doesn’t support H.265. A9 and higher do (granted, A9 is decode only). ML starts with A11 but iirc, wasn’t Apple advertising use of the neural engine for some third party apps in their keynote?

 

[remington79]

Apple made it to open up opportunities. My wife and I each bought one and the reason was price. I follow specs and research things so I knew what I was getting and I felt it was a good value. I knew there would’ve trade offs to lower the price but after looking I felt I was getting a good deal.

This price point allowed us to buy two phones instead of just one. Because of this my wife was able to get rid of her slow and worn out LG and I was able to upgrade from my 6s. I passed my 6s down as a first phone before it gets upgraded to something newer and more expensive. If this phone didn’t come out at this price only my wife would be getting a phone this year and I would wait one more year. My 6s is only about a year and a half old so it has life left in it.