Why did Steve Jobs say "carriers" and not "carrier?"

[stewart715]

This may be grasping at straws but I just watched the Keynote presentation and I noticed that Steve said the 3G version wouldn't be released for 90 because of the approval process with the carriers not carrier. And he's not talking international because 90 days from now is April and he said they haven't even begun international talks and even when they are finalized, it wouldn't be until June at the earliest. Notice how he barely put any emphasis on the fact that this was for AT&T and didn't once mention the words exclusive.

Also, AT&T is not listed on the iPad website anywhere. Contract obligations to AT&T stopping them from talking about any other carriers? The delay could be caused because of the contract. Contract ends, iPad 3G released to multiple U.S. networks?

Freudian slip or just a mistake of words?

Your thoughts.

 

[jav6454]

He mentioned carriers because the iPad will not be US exclusive. It will available worldwide to any carrier.

Your tears are delicious Verizon Fanboy...

 

[stewart715]

He mentioned carriers because the iPad will not be US exclusive. It will available worldwide to any carrier.

Your tears are delicious Verizon Fanboy...

I have Sprint. And I just said, it will not be sold internationally for 150 days, he was specifically talking about the US only release in 90 days.

 

[Warbrain]

They all come unlocked if I read/heard right.

 

[jav6454]

They all come unlocked if I read/heard right.

This also. BTW, T-Mobile will be able to use it, but using it on T-Mobile will be limited to GPRS and EDGE only.

 

[stewart715]

This also. BTW, T-Mobile will be able to use it, but using it on T-Mobile will be limited to GPRS and EDGE only.

But this wouldn't require any approval process. He specifically stated that the extra time for the 3G version was for an approval process of carriers (not FCC or anything like that). Only sponsored carriers would require an approval process, correct?

 

[ks-man]

I'm wondering if in AT&Ts exclusivity agreement for the iPhone there was a clause that stated the Apple couldn't offer any other devices (non-iPhones) through other wireless voice/data companies during the exclusive period. It makes sense that AT&T would be concerned with Apple offering an iPod Touch through another data carrier offering VOIP. The iPad is basically a large iPod Touch so it could fall under the same rules.

Assuming that is the case, when AT&T loses the iPhone exclusivity deal, it will also lose the iPad exclusivity deal. One final piece could be that Apple isn't allowed to discuss other carriers or the end of the exclusivity deal until it has expired. So perhaps the deal expires either before or soon after the 3G iPad becomes available and Jobs knows there will be other carriers. That is also why it could be an extra month for the 3G version to be ready. Doesn't seem like the hardware side would require an extra month to be ready.

Just speculating here.

 

[jav6454]

But this wouldn't require any approval process. He specifically stated that the extra time for the 3G version was for an approval process of carriers (not FCC or anything like that). Only sponsored carriers would require an approval process, correct?

No... the iPhone was approved by the FCC to be used on AT&T; however, you can well unlock it an use it on T-Mobile, no extra stuff.

The problem with T-Mobile is that they don't share the same radio frequencies the iPad supports. T-Mobile supports 1700Mhz (down) and 2100Mhz (up) for it's 3G, while the iPad supports 850/1900/2100MHz radio waves.

Sure the iPad will take an extra 30 days to be 3G ready, but after that it will be able to run on T-Mobile without further delay. Just at the slower EDGE protocols.

 

[stewart715]

I'm wondering if in AT&Ts exclusivity agreement for the iPhone there was a clause that stated the Apple couldn't offer any other devices (non-iPhones) through other wireless voice/data companies during the exclusive period. It makes sense that AT&T would be concerned with Apple offering an iPod Touch through another data carrier offering VOIP. The iPad is basically a large iPod Touch so it could fall under the same rules.

Assuming that is the case, when AT&T loses the iPhone exclusivity deal, it will also lose the iPad exclusivity deal. One final piece could be that Apple isn't allowed to discuss other carriers or the end of the exclusivity deal until it has expired. So perhaps the deal expires either before or soon after the 3G iPad becomes available and Jobs knows there will be other carriers. That is also why it could be an extra month for the 3G version to be ready. Doesn't seem like the hardware side would require an extra month to be ready.

Just speculating here.

I think you're on to something. I feel like in the iPhone release he was very animated about it being exclusive for Cingular (now AT&T) only. With this, it was merely mentioned once. Also notice, AT&T is not listed on the iPad website anywhere.

 

[stewart715]

No... the iPhone was approved by the FCC to be used on AT&T; however, you can well unlock it an use it on T-Mobile, no extra stuff.

The problem with T-Mobile is that they don't share the same radio frequencies the iPad supports. T-Mobile supports 1700Mhz (down) and 2100Mhz (up) for it's 3G, while the iPad supports 850/1900/2100MHz radio waves.

Sure the iPad will take an extra 30 days to be 3G ready, but after that it will be able to run on T-Mobile without further delay. Just at the slower EDGE protocols.

Eh but still, he mentioned carriers. Not protocol. Just speculating, not stating. Also, to my knowledge, both the WiFi-only and WiFI+3G versions are both not approved by FCC yet. Wouldn't they both be approved at the same time? I feel like the delay is more than that...something we don't know yet.

 

[jav6454]

Eh but still, he mentioned carriers. Not protocol. Just speculating, not stating...

Like I said previously, world wide, means all carriers. Not just AT&T. However, in the US, it will be limited to AT&T because of 3G chip limitations.

 

[stewart715]

Like I said previously, world wide, means all carriers. Not just AT&T. However, in the US, it will be limited to AT&T because of 3G chip limitations.

Going in circles. Internationally, he isn't even beginning to have talks until tomorrow. He has no clue who is gonna sign on. He was specifically talking about the United States only release in April. He stated that any international release would be in June at the earliest. The delay to April is a United States issue, has nothing to do with international. International in June. The delay is only related to the April release. The delay to JUNE is because of international obligations.

 

[jav6454]

Going in circles. Internationally, he isn't even beginning to have talks until tomorrow. He has no clue who is gonna sign on. He was specifically talking about the United States only release in April. He stated that any international release would be in June at the earliest. The delay to April is a United States issue, has nothing to do with international. International in June. The delay is only related to the April release. The delay to JUNE is because of international obligations.

Say someone from Europe is on vacation here in the US or someone from Central America.

They see the iPad, love it and buy it. All they have to do is take it home and stick a miniSIM from their carrier and presto!

Nothing complicated and still serves the many carriers.

 

[stewart715]

Say someone from Europe is on vacation here in the US or someone from Central America.

They see the iPad, love it and buy it. All they have to do is take it home and stick a miniSIM from their carrier and presto!

Nothing complicated and still serves the many carriers.

Yes it will serve many carriers, but like I stated in my first original post. An approval process. This is not speculation whether someone from another country is gonna grab it and run it to Europe and throw it on Orange. The approval process is slowing down the 3G release.

Simply put, what you're stating is all approval processes for both United States carriers and international carriers will be completed by the 90 timeline. If that were correct, why wouldn't they just release an international version in 90 days instead of 150? This has nothing to do with international carriers. Nothing.

 

[jav6454]

Yes it will serve many carriers, but like I stated in my first original post. An approval process. This is not speculation whether someone from another country is gonna grab it and run it to Europe and throw it on Orange. The approval process is slowing down the 3G release.

Simply put, what you're stating is all approval processes for both United States carriers and international carriers will be completed by the 90 timeline. If that were correct, why wouldn't they just release an international version in 90 days instead of 150? This has nothing to do with international carriers. Nothing.

Still, it has also nothing to do. In April the iPad will be available in 3G HSDPA. Also, Steve mentions that they made a breakthrough deal with AT&T. One that many consider breakthrough. No contract? Reduced pricing? Surely Apple had to relinquish something in order to gain this from AT&T. I am assuming this means AT&T got a new extension to their iPhone exclusivity.

Regardless of the iPad being unlocked, you won't be able to use it on Verizon, so AT&T does not mind it being unlocked. Also, there are no carriers in the iPad's website. Because as stated, every carrier can have it.

More over, like many people say, sometimes the simplest answer is the correct one. In this case, Steve is referencing the fact that iPad will be available unlocked and many carriers will have it.

Also, Steve mentioned, if the carrier supported the miniSIM, then they are good to go. Here in the US, AT&T will because of obvious reasons. T-Mobile? Who knows. However, if they are up to it, then go for it. AT&T has no problem with it.

 

[stewart715]

Still, it has also nothing to do. In April the iPad will be available in 3G HSDPA. Also, Steve mentions that they made a breakthrough deal with AT&T. One that many consider breakthrough. No contract? Reduced pricing? Surely Apple had to relinquish something in order to gain this from AT&T. I am assuming this means AT&T got a new extension to their iPhone exclusivity.

Regardless of the iPad being unlocked, you won't be able to use it on Verizon, so AT&T does not mind it being unlocked. Also, there are no carriers in the iPad's website. Because as stated, every carrier can have it.

More over, like many people say, sometimes the simplest answer is the correct one. In this case, Steve is referencing the fact that iPad will be available unlocked and many carriers will have it.

Also, Steve mentioned, if the carrier supported the miniSIM, then they are good to go. Here in the US, AT&T will because of obvious reasons. T-Mobile? Who knows. However, if they are up to it, then go for it. AT&T has no problem with it.

That makes sense. However, if it is true that Verizon is allowing GSM devices on their network by June, then maybe it's unlocked for that very reason. And maybe it was AT&T that begged to have them be the first network announced, and they told Apple they would offer no contract. You never know...

 

[jav6454]

That makes sense. However, if it is true that Verizon is allowing GSM devices on their network by June, then maybe it's unlocked for that very reason. And maybe it was AT&T that begged to have them be the first network announced, and they told Apple they would offer no contract. You never know...

Verizon can't have a GSM based radio on their network. It is technologically impossible.

 

[stewart715]

Verizon can't have a GSM based radio on their network. It is technologically impossible.

Touché. You win.

 

[BigGroll]

Can anyone name a carrier other than AT&T that uses the MiniSIM? For that matter, honestly, who here ever heard about the miniSIM before this? Its just like locking the phone, at least right now

 

[jav6454]

Can anyone name a carrier other than AT&T that uses the MiniSIM? For that matter, honestly, who here ever heard about the miniSIM before this? Its just like locking the phone, at least right now

It's not called a MiniSIM... rather MicroSIM. And yes, using such SIM technically locks the device until others follow with the same technology.

Still, in the US, you have a choice if T-Mobile decides to deliver for the iPad. Although you will be limited up to EDGE. Better than nothing though.

 

[DeusInvictus7]

I have Sprint. And I just said, it will not be sold internationally for 150 days, he was specifically talking about the US only release in 90 days.

Don't know if anyone already said it because I didn't read all the way down, but the iPad is going to be available WORLDwide in 60 days for the wifi version, and 90 days WORLDwide for the 3G version, Steve was only talking about the 3G plan deals for data that would take until June for international carriers.

 

[stewart715]

Don't know if anyone already said it because I didn't read all the way down, but the iPad is going to be available WORLDwide in 60 days for the wifi version, and 90 days WORLDwide for the 3G version, Steve was only talking about the 3G plan deals for data that would take until June for international carriers.

Correct. But, approvals for specific carriers within that 90 period would only take place within the United States. Regardless, it is unlikely that AT&T won't be the only network to offer the iPad, but again, this thread is just speculation.

 

[goosnarrggh]

Verizon can't have a GSM based radio on their network. It is technologically impossible.

Touché. You win.

That was said up here in Canada as recently as spring of 2009 about Bell and Telus.

By fall of 2009, Bell and Telus had completed their complete rollout of a hybrid system of their intact legacy 2G CDMA and 3G EV-DO network, alongside their new shared nationwide 3G+ HSPA network. It is technologically possible.

It requires a huge capital investment, which is why Bell and Telus shared the cost by splitting the country up into zones and only upgrading one company's network in each zone. HSPA customers of each company can freely access the infrastructure that was installed by the other company. It may not be financially possible for Verizon to do something like that right now.

 

[ukcolinr]

it will not be sold internationally for 150 days, he was specifically talking about the US only release in 90 days.

Can I ask where you've heard this? It was said international carrier agreements would not be available til June/July, but after watching the keynote at no point did they say that the WiFi + 3G version would be released later internationally than in the US. Seeing as the device is unlocked I see no reason for Apple to delay international release of this version just because carrier agreements are not in place? If it had been confirmed somewhere please let me know, I'll have to buy one in the US instead lol

Edit: Oops you did kinda answer this, but the approval required isn't network specific to my knowledge (Can use any GSM Device on any network providing its not locked).

 

[TraceyS/FL]

Can I ask where you've heard this? It was said international carrier agreements would not be available til June/July, but after watching the keynote at no point did they say that the WiFi + 3G version would be released later internationally than in the US. Seeing as the device is unlocked I see no reason for Apple to delay international release of this version just because carrier agreements are not in place? If it had been confirmed somewhere please let me know, I'll have to buy one in the US instead lol

Edit: Oops you did kinda answer this, but the approval required isn't network specific to my knowledge (Can use any GSM Device on any network providing its not locked).

I took what was said as you did - that it WILL be sold, but there will NOT be any carrier agreements in place at that time. IF your international carrier supports the sim and has a plan, you got lucky.

WHile i do understand it is often what is NOT said that is important, in this case, i would have expected a "on sale in the US in 60/90 days, with international sales to follow in 120" or whatnot.

I think, frankly, Apple is tired of dealing with carriers. THis is a "here is the product, deal with it. however, if you provide this at this pricing - you can be listed on the website". They basically are saying this with the low pricing and not locking it to a contract.

I actually think we (here in the US) should be thanking Apple for this! (i'm not an AT&T person btw)