iPhone Why does Apple have software development issues?

[MacBH928]

Yeah... I've heard stories like that but I never experience those issues. In fact, my Windows machines (two of them) work great with my AirPods. I switch between devices with ease. ?‍♂️ I also hear a lot of people complaining of updates but I schedule the update time for a period when I'm not using the machines.

I'm not sure what to say, I hear a lot of people here complain about Windows (not surprising on an Apple-centric forum) but having switched back to it from macOS I find that I prefer the Windows experience over the Mac. I can certainly understand that others don't like it, even if I don't agree.



I disagree. I use the terminal all the time, yes, but that's because I develop stuff and need access to it. My servers don't run a GUI so SSH is the way I do work on them. But the desktop machine doesn't really need a lot of terminal tweaking (in fact I can't think of anything I needed to do on my desktop machine in the terminal... there is stuff I do there because I want to, but it's not needed for the machine to run).

If anything the real complaint against Linux would be a lack of specific software. Some people live and die by MS Office or Adobe products.



Agreed, Linux does not have those technologies and, frankly, I'm glad it doesn't. When Apple started adding that stuff is when their OS started going downhill for me. I dislike just about everything listed there and have never really used most of it. There are a couple of exceptions. Apple does have awesome accessibility features compared to other platforms. If you have a vision or mobility issue, Apple operating systems are definitely the way to go, without question. The other is the macOS Preview application. That is awesome. But on Debian I use Document Viewer and PDF Mod; they are a poor substitute but meet my needs. On Windows I use Xodo, which is nearly on par with Preview (Preview still excels in filling out PDF forms that are not actual forms).

For other stuff... ripping BluRays, transcoding videos, writing, surfing, coding, email, messaging... Linux is pretty amazing and their UI is finally (in my opinion) at a place where an average user could use it without much fuss. It's also nice that for Debian (and other distros) all this great software is vetted and available to be easily installed with the operating system's repository. Oh.. that's the other great thing about Linux: apt. It's absolutely awesome for installing, removing, purging, and updating applications.

I wouldn't recommend Linux for someone who is completely computer illerate. Those people should definitely use iPadOS because you can't really screw that up. But for the average Joe walking into Best Buy to purchase a laptop or desktop, that person could easily get away with a Linux machine with the state of Linux today.

Well if you find Windows more stable and more pleasant to use, why do use MacOS? People who use Apple Computers specifically use it because they find MacOS better. As for hardware, similar or better hardware can be found at cheaper prices from other manufacturers.

I personally switched from Windows years ago and never want to go to the Windows world because its horrible experience for me.

 

[sammy2066]

I wish they’d separate the core apps from the iOS updates, if possible (I’m not a developer). It’d be nice to see certain apps with major problems, such as Mail, being updated more quickly.

I think this absolutely needs to happen. I have no clue how software development works, and for such a complex and highly integrated OS, maybe it’s not feasible to decouple development of the core OS and native apps.

That being said, it’s been done before, and for a company like Apple with talent and billions of dollars at its disposal, it should certainly be possible.
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Well if you find Windows more stable and more pleasant to use, why do use MacOS? People who use Apple Computers specifically use it because they find MacOS better. As for hardware, similar or better hardware can be found at cheaper prices from other manufacturers.

I personally switched from Windows years ago and never want to go to the Windows world because its horrible experience for me.

Fair point, but my $0.02 below.

The days when macOS (still prefer calling it OS X) was more stable, fun and intuitive to use really ended after Snow Leopard. Every single release after has not had a single feature that has impacted or meaningfully improved by workflow or productivity. For the lack of a better word, they’ve been gimmicks, plain and simple. It’s almost as if Apple themselves don’t consider OS X to be an important platform anymore, and this why, in my view, it’s been languishing for the past few years.

I’m quite agnostic between my OS preferences and tend to adapt well to both OS X and Windows.

Having been a Windows Insider since 2014, I can absolutely vouch for the fact that MS has been far more agile in meaningfully iterating (much like earlier versions of iOS) and baking in new features/enhancements to Windows 10 - not to mention in a far more open and transparent way.

There’s a reason why annual OS X releases were suddenly made free (it wasn’t out of generosity) - for many years annual OS X releases have simply lacked any substance whatsoever. Nobody in their right mind would pay (not me at least) for such minor, irrelevant and mostly unnecessary features/updates, and Apple figured that out early in the game.

 

[Dave-Z]

if you find Windows more stable and more pleasant to use, why do use MacOS?

I don't. I use Linux and Windows.

I used Macs for about a decade but about two years ago switched away for the reasons I've already mentioned. I do like some of Apple's products. AirPods are great. iPads I like a lot. For me though I'm trying to stay mostly platform agnostic because I don't like the lock in with specific vendors (whether that be Microsoft, Apple, Google, etc.).

Back on topic, Apple's software is definitely more buggy than it used to be. Admittedly they've added a ton of features over the years, but I think these could have been released a bit slower to ensure a better user experience.
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The days when macOS (still prefer calling it OS X) was more stable, fun and intuitive to use really ended after Snow Leopard. Every single release after has not had a single feature that has impacted or meaningfully improved by workflow or productivity.

I absolutely agree. And your comments do a great job summarizing my point of view as well.

I can absolutely vouch for the fact that MS has been far more agile in meaningfully iterating (much like earlier versions of iOS) and baking in new features/enhancements to Windows 10 - not to mention in a far more open and transparent way.

I agree here, as well.

When I decided to give Windows a try again at the end of 2018 I was pleasantly surprised at how far Microsoft had taken the operating system. And I'm also liking the direction they're heading with supporting developers regardless of platform. The Linux Subsystem alone nearly sells it for me. But beyond that, I just like how Windows 10 works these days. I'm probably in the minority but I like the tablet experience. I can go from tablet to laptop to desktop: I can use a machine in tablet mode to surf and read, then switch it to a laptop to do some light work, then connect it to a larger monitor to make it into a desktop machine. All of this from a single device (for me that's a Lenovo 2-in-1 ThinkPad). I find the entire experience just works well with how I use these devices.

 

[primarycolors]

Very interesting read.

The "regression" system explains so much. Like why standard US phone numbers haven't displayed properly on iPhone SE since iOS 10 (they get truncated and have to scroll)... and about a zillion other things...

 

[kyussmondo]

Users are understandably very demanding. Users want new features and already give Apple plenty of flack for playing catch up with Android. I think the issue is with the way Apple releases software. They have these big features that they have to have ready for demo at WWDC and ready for shipping in September / October. Because of these tight deadlines, then quality may be compromised. Even in the Steve Jobs era, there are stories of the first version of iPhoneOS being pretty bad, large parts needed rewriting after the original iPhone was released.

Rather than drop massive releases, it would make more sense releasing new features throughout the year. I believe they did that with Apple Music, which they didn't release till iOS 8.4? They could still announce the features at WWDC or other events but say it will be released in March or something. Also, as someone else mentioned, I would like to see system apps like Mail, Calendar, Safari, Notes, Reminders etc become more standalone apps that can be updated anytime rather than having to wait for an iOS update. At the moment it just feels like, cram as much into the release and then spend the next several months bug fixing and every so often we get an iOS 12 style release, where things have gotten to the point where they have to make optimisations.

 

[wlisik]

That’s sarcasm right????

Partly......
I know some of them are, but majority has average level of knowledge.....

 

[gwhizkids]

Its because what made Apple shine, Jobs, is no longer there. Jobs high standards produced superior products. Tim cares about the money not the user experience, he is a business man, Jobs was visionary.

To be fair though, Apple software is still pleasing in comparison. You only have to use Windows or Linux and feel the horror. Apple is the most solid+easiest to use between the 2. So is iOS.

Another thing to consider is that as software gets more complex and tied to more services, it becomes more prone to failure.

Your first point is simply not correct. The "Jobs as Superman" myth has got to stop. When he passed away, Apple had 1 phone, 1 iPad (maybe 2 if the mini was out) and 3-4 Macs (Air, MBPro, MacPro, iMac). The number of screen and device configs in today's lineup (plus Watch and TV) are infinitely harder to account for, not to mention the billions of older devices that still need support.

Now, you can argue the wisdom of all those additional SKUs, but Steve, for all his undeniable talent, passion and drive, would not have done better if yearly releases remain the norm (and in today's competitive environment they are mandatory, sadly).
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Much as I like dark mode, if that was a drag in resources, it could’ve waited.

Really? The amount of screaming and crying about it not appearing would have been off the charts. Now I agree with your general approach (stagger features throughout the year), but Apple would have taken a vicious beating if Dark Mode did not appear on Day 1.

 

[TokMok3]

To be fair though, Apple software is still pleasing in comparison. You only have to use Windows or Linux and feel the horror. Apple is the most solid+easiest to use between the 2. So is iOS.

There is a big disadvantage when you use a Mac with macOS compared to using only Linux, By learning to use Linux a person becomes more knowledgable and proficient with computers than by using Mac OS 24/7.
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iOS 13, Catalina... Thos year has not been a good year for software quality at Apple.

Can anyone more qualified then I shed some light on what's happening at Apple with their software development and why they seem to have the issues that they do?

As an outsider looking in, much of their problems seem to stem from when they decide to have ‘Big Bang’ software releases tied to hardware releases for September.

Although I’m not a software developer I am a project manager & the above scenario is a classic recipe for a huge crunch/‘death march’ with core features unable to be dropped where quality then will usually be the sacrifice that needs to be made in order to ship.

It feels like Apple needs to be (and use) Agile, but they’re hooked to all of the free marketing and PR that these Big Bang releases give them.

Control quality has gone by the boards and the American worker does not feel proud of the Made in the USA label any more as it was in the old days. Made in the USA was respected all over the world. Those were the good times!

 

[IowaLynn]

Relying on machines to find issues in code has not been as reliable as hoped.
Where once iOS or OS X code fit on a CD today you are dealing with 4-8GB.
Apple has to push out 9 iOS updates in the first 3 months. Insane.
Samsung has gotten better with 9 and 10. With Windows I still cross my fingers that patch Tuesday goes without a hitch, or latest build (Insider, Slow ring).

 

[cynics]

iOS 13, Catalina... Thos year has not been a good year for software quality at Apple.

Can anyone more qualified then I shed some light on what's happening at Apple with their software development and why they seem to have the issues that they do?

As an outsider looking in, much of their problems seem to stem from when they decide to have ‘Big Bang’ software releases tied to hardware releases for September.

Although I’m not a software developer I am a project manager & the above scenario is a classic recipe for a huge crunch/‘death march’ with core features unable to be dropped where quality then will usually be the sacrifice that needs to be made in order to ship.

It feels like Apple needs to be (and use) Agile, but they’re hooked to all of the free marketing and PR that these Big Bang releases give them.

You pretty much have it right however before proceeding I dont have any issues with Catalina. I didn't have any issues with iOS 13 until I got my iPhone 11 Pro Max so that leads me to believe it needs optimization.

Anyway, you are correct a yearly release is a tough schedule to maintain. They've never done it which is why we get updates for the new iOS/MacOS release throughout the year.

The reason they do it is because they literally have too. iOS and MacOS are used for their flagship devices. Add 6 months to their development window you reduced their revenue 50%. That is just an arbitrary time period I used however Apple has released updates for previous year iOS versions. If that were the case and we went to 2 year update cycles that reduces their revenue ~100%.....

Apple has an obligation to their employees and their families (pay their paychecks, benefits, retirements, etc) and to their stockholders (be profitable) and they can't do that by making less money.

I get what you are saying about being agile, before my current job I used to run my own mechanical/HVAC business. It was myself and 2 employees and we ran "lean and mean", by doing so not only did we maximize profit by minimizing overhead but we were incredible efficient because we all knew exactly what was going on at all time.

The problem with that for Apple is its just not possible for small teams to engineer hardware and develop and integrate software that than integrates with all their devices. They need to continually improve the product is meaningful ways because if they dont there is literally no reason to by those products.

Honestly from my experience there isn't much they can do outside of streamlining what they are doing now. Some people say "add more people". That works to an extent but it peaks quick and then becomes VERY inefficient. Imagine you could get a helper for your job/career, and then another, and then another and then another. At first its helpful but it quickly gets to the point that there are people getting in the way and eventually errors are happening because the work is too thinned out to get a grasp on the entire project.

You however don't need to update immediately. Many people will update iOS on the first major update a couple months after its initial launch. If the game allows it.....

 

[rforno]

Because emoji and animoji are much more important to Tim than Jobsian QA on things like ... Mail or memory management.

 

[Puppuccino]

Can anyone more qualified then I shed some light on what's happening at Apple with their software development and why they seem to have the issues [...]

Like who? Tim? What qualifies, or does not in this scenario.

Although I’m not a software developer I am a project manager

Right?

It feels like Apple needs to be (and use) Agile, but they’re hooked to all of the free marketing and PR that these Big Bang releases give them.

Agile as a development practice is just middle management buzzword fluff. Proper planning and communication gets work done. ‘Agile’ only works for small teams.

As a former developer and avid watcher of Silicon Valley, I know when Agile can work and when it won’t. Apple team is likely too big and everything in a release would probably get categorised as an ‘epic’ that not only relies on other features but other teams when iOS needs to do something with macOS.

I think Apples problem is lack of quality, quality assurance. There’s a reason iOS 12 was solid. They knew what they had to release. It was about stability. iOS 13 was about huge feature.

 

[wlisik]

@Daniel James
There is sth wrong with your reply mate

 

[Ipadfever]

Because emoji and animoji are much more important to Tim than Jobsian QA on things like ... Mail or memory management.

What any good is a phone without emoji and Animoji... come one it’s 2020! Who needs mail and ram management?? Apple caters to kids not adults lol. Only apple can construct something and not remember how they built it!

 

[I7guy]

Because emoji and animoji are much more important to Tim than Jobsian QA on things like ... Mail or memory management.

True. It's commonly known that apple is single-threaded and can either do emoji/animoji or QA and development. /s

 

[bluecoast]

I’m not saying that agile would be a panacea.

As I’ve said in other posts on this thread, I think it’s more to do with a marketing lead approach to iOS and macOS that forces Apple into a crunch to ship all of the June WWDC promised features in September & corporate ego and face saving means that they cannot publically drop these promised features.

And as you know better than I (being a dev) that one of the first casualties of this approach, is quality.