Why the heck does America still use outdated measurement and date units?

[Wondercow]

Yes, but the real question is: does the milk come in bags?

Nice!
[doublepost=1462834684][/doublepost]

...bag of milk? O_0

Yup; in many areas of Canada (but definitely not all) we buy milk in bags. One buys a 4 litre bag of milk which, when opened, contains three 1.33 litre sleeves of milk. We put the sleeve in a milk jug, cut the corner off of the sleeve, and Bob's your uncle! Or, if you live in Québec, you follow the same instructions but end with et voilà !

And, if one is feeling very adventurous, it's fun to forgo the jug and use it like a wineskin!

 

[Fancuku]

...bag of milk? O_0

Canada's attempt to be like Europe.

 

[Roller]

Nice!
[doublepost=1462834684][/doublepost]
Yup; in many areas of Canada (but definitely not all) we buy milk in bags. One buys a 4 litre bag of milk which, when opened, contains three 1.33 litre sleeves of milk. We put the sleeve in a milk jug, cut the corner off of the sleeve, and Bob's your uncle! Or, if you live in Québec, you follow the same instructions but end with et voilà !

Thanks for mentioning bagged milk - I'd forgotten about it from my years in Canada.

I also remember "the milkman" (now t would be "milk person" if anyone still delivered milk these days) bringing us milk in glass bottles with cardboard tops when I was growing up. I guess they were Imperial quart bottles back then.

 

[Wondercow]

Thanks for mentioning bagged milk - I'd forgotten about it from my years in Canada.

I also remember "the milkman" (now t would be "milk person" if anyone still delivered milk these days) bringing us milk in glass bottles with cardboard tops when I was growing up. I guess they were Imperial quart bottles back then.

And, since it's used in a lot of metric countries, let's tie it back to the thread topic and call it a "metric milk container"

 

[Renzatic]

Nice!
[doublepost=1462834684][/doublepost]
Yup; in many areas of Canada (but definitely not all) we buy milk in bags. One buys a 4 litre bag of milk which, when opened, contains three 1.33 litre sleeves of milk. We put the sleeve in a milk jug, cut the corner off of the sleeve, and Bob's your uncle! Or, if you live in Québec, you follow the same instructions but end with et voilà !

Oh, man. I can't imagine that being anything but an accident waiting to happen. Even with our big jugs, I still manage to make a mess on occasion. With a bag, I'd be spilling milk all over the damn place.

And, if one is feeling very adventurous, it's fun to forgo the jug and use it like a wineskin!

...but this would make it worth it.

 

[garirry]

Nice!
[doublepost=1462834684][/doublepost]
Yup; in many areas of Canada (but definitely not all) we buy milk in bags. One buys a 4 litre bag of milk which, when opened, contains three 1.33 litre sleeves of milk. We put the sleeve in a milk jug, cut the corner off of the sleeve, and Bob's your uncle! Or, if you live in Québec, you follow the same instructions but end with et voilà !

And, if one is feeling very adventurous, it's fun to forgo the jug and use it like a wineskin!

Oh yeah, I remember those. My family used to buy massive packs of milk bags and then put them in a container like this. It makes it a bit easier to pour the milk, but you could easily drop the bag and get it spilled. Though usually they just cut a tiny tip at the end so it could pour slowly. Now they just get regular cardboard bottles.

 

[Wondercow]

Oh, man. I can't imagine that being anything but an accident waiting to happen. Even with our big jugs, I still manage to make a mess on occasion. With a bag, I'd be spilling milk all over the damn place.

I actually find it easier than the traditional 4 L or 4 gal. jug: the bag is lighter than the jug, the handle of the bag's pitcher is larger and easier to hold, the placement of the pitcher's handle give better leverage against the weight, and, lastly, since the user cuts their own hole from the sleeve the opening doesn't need to be as large as that of the jug (in fact, people who aren't used to the bags, in my experience, often cut the hole wayyyyy too big and thus end up making a mess).

That being said, even as an experienced milk-bag-pourer, I have made a mess when the pitcher was a little too short and the bag would fold over under the weight of the milk and thus miss the glass.

 

[Renzatic]

That being said, even as an experienced milk-bag-pourer, I have made a mess when the pitcher was a little too short and the bag would fold over under the weight of the milk and thus miss the glass.

Question is, why not just pour all the milk into a big airtight pitcher? That'd solve most of the problems of potential bag spillages.

 

[Wondercow]

Question is, why not just pour all the milk into a big airtight pitcher? That'd solve most of the problems of potential bag spillages.

Its actually extremely difficult for anyone over the age of six to spill as long as the hole isn't cut too large and the pitcher is not short (and the size isn't a common issue, it's really only if it's purchased from a dollar store--they may get some made for different markets where the bags are slightly smaller, usually 1 L). For the reasons given in my previous post the bag is, I find, more accurate and controllable than the jug (and I have used many jugs over the years, both on visits to the States and here--we do have stores that sell/sold milk in 4 litre plastic jugs).

Edit for typo

 

[Mr. Buzzcut]

Actually, it does defy logic. This form may be how it is spoken in everyday speech, but it is more logical to run a sequence of dates from small to large, (or vice versa) when putting them in writing.

The problem with the US system is that the spoken form and the written form differ. Format and structure and logic matter more in writing, and writing prioritises an agreed accepted standard, - which is how language becomes standardised (otherwise local media would reflect local accents and would be unintelligible to those not from that region if the accent was especially strong) which the US system is not; it is merely a written version of a form of speech, a triumph of informal usage, over logical precision.

And, as someone who has been a professional historian, dates are something I have consumed, and devoured and utilised. Dates matter, and whatever about accepting the Imperial (gloriously impractical, but with its own internal coherence), alongside the metric, I can never see myself using the US method of rendering time, mainly because it makes no sense.

Simple. Writing small numbers instead of spelling them out is lazy. If you spell it out, there is no ambiguity.

 

[Renzatic]

Its actually extremely difficult for anyone over the age of six to spill as long as the hole isn't cut to large and the pitcher is not short...

...which means I'll probably spill it all the time then. I'm easily distracted.

Though now I have one more reason to head up to Canada. For the sights, sounds, and experiences. Plus the bagged milk.

 

[Mr. Buzzcut]

Valid arguments regarding the benefits of the metric system notwithstanding, it's unlikely that the U.S. will transition to it in the foreseeable future, whether it's because of cost, inertia, laziness, or politics. And, given the current state of affairs in which politicians here deny grave threats such as climate change, I don't view moving to the metric system as an issue that I need to be overly concerned about.

As for date representations, which have nothing to do with units, I also think that change is unlikely for the reason mentioned by others.

Americans already buy liters of soda, ml of liquor, mg of medication, run and bike in meters, talk about liters of displacement in car engines, etc.

What died a gruesome death was gas in liters. Or should I say litres. It must have been taken as some sort of conspiracy theory to bankrupt the country. Gas pumps were briefly changed but it didn't last long at all.

This thread is just a thinly veiled attempt to call Americans stupid. Trust me, most of us can use both systems effectively if we have the need.

 

[dec.]

We've moved to a new place and my hubby kept using inches when we were hanging up stuff, it was so insanely frustrating to watch him work with feet, inches, some /16tth... wtf? A nice metric 1/10/100 is so simple, accurate and extremely efficient.

 

[Mr. Buzzcut]

We've moved to a new place and my hubby kept using inches when we were hanging up stuff, it was so insanely frustrating to watch him work with feet, inches, some /16tth... wtf? A nice metric 1/10/100 is so simple, accurate and extremely efficient.

Fractions are not units! Fractions are frequently used in science and math to provide precision that decimals cannot.

Now, kindly move that picture up .33333333333333333333333333333333333333333333333333333333333 meter, please.

 

[dec.]

Fractions are not units! Fractions are frequently used in science and math to provide precision that decimals cannot.

Now, kindly move that picture up .33333333333333333333333333333333333333333333333333333333333 meter, please.

At least I know that you'd mean 33 centimeters and 33 millimeters in metric, while .3333333333333333333etc ft. would require a calculator besides the measuring tape.

 

[Mr. Buzzcut]

At least I know that you'd mean 33 centimeters and 33 millimeters in metric, while .3333333333333333333etc ft. would require a calculator besides the measuring tape.

1/3 of a meter is 363 mm? Maybe you need the calculator.

1/3 of a yard is a foot. That was hard. 1/3 of a foot? Four inches! My brain is really hurting now.

Finally, it is quite possible to measure inches using decimals. From our 1/3 yard example, 12.0 inches would be the answer.

 

[von franklin]

I think you put why to much time in to thinking about why this.

 

[wallmaxx]

Okay guys, this is probably my angry 1 AM self again posting here, but this is something that has been bothering me for a few weeks now. I am posting it here because I know this is a website primarily of American people, and I don't know who else to rant this about.


Okay, first off, temperature. We all know what the three useful temperature measurements are. Only one is used in daily use, it's Celsius, and across the entire world. It is the most logical of the three, 0° is water's freezing point, 100° is its boiling point, every semi-educated person knows that. Only THREE countries use Fahrenheit exclusively, and surprise surprise, the United States is one of them. Why? Why is that necessary? Why use a system that is absolutely outdated, makes no sense whatsoever (water freezes at 32° and melts at 212°? yeah, totally makes sense), that is used by basically no one else? Even, excuse me for this term, stubborn countries like the United Kingdom now use Celsius exclusively and primarily. Even Canada, and its influence of the country did not force it to keep Fahrenheit. It annoys me because every time someone says "it's 60° outside!" I have to google and convert it because that means nothing for me, and I don't communicate enough with Americans to bother learning it. I could get away with it if it was something that was used interchangeably in multiple countries, but it isn't, it's outdated.

Second, measurement units. On one hand, you have the most logical system on the planet, the metric system. Simple, each unit correlates with each other, and there are basic prefixes which simply divide or multiply the numbers by multiples of 10. And I will be blunt here, the imperial units are more intuitive and are still somewhat logical. However, once you want to do anything slightly more complex, it becomes annoying. You can't do anything with a system like that. You have to learn the massive amount of words and how each of them correspond with each other. Imagine instead of having to use Kilobytes, Megabytes, Gigabytes, Terabytes, you would instead use Floppies, Discs, Drives, and Servers. It seems like the logical option, but they do not work together well at all and you gotta remember all of that crap. Once again, only the United States along with two other small countries exclusively use this system. In fact, when I thought that the United Kingdom was responsible for the same thing, it turns out it's technically the main measurement system of today (even though many people still use the other one), so I've actually gotta give them credit for having the guts to defy a traditional system. Every commonwealth country has adopted the SI, even if some like Canada still offer it occasionally. Seriously, why do this? Sure, I can deal with that, it's not like it's stupid or anything, but NOT when it's officially only used in a SINGLE GODDAMN COUNTRY (I'm excluding minor countries here because they are usually very small and have very little influence on the rest of the world).

Finally, this one pisses me off so much I just want to die. The date system. The entire world uses one or the other, either a DD/MM/YYYY system (common in European countries), either a YYYY/MM/DD system (common in East-Asian countries and some other places). Both are perfectly fine, as they represent a proper level of importance. What is NOT fine is when a single country just comes to troll everybody and bring a MM/DD/YYYY system, which completely messes up the order of the dates. The month, then a small part of the month, and then the year which the month takes place in? WHAT? How does that make any sense? WHY IS THAT NECESSARY? WHY THE ILLOGICALITY? I can bear with a January 1st, 2016 date system because it is closer to being a feature of the language, but not when it's a purely written form! At least use YYYY/MM/DD if you want to keep the M/D part! Seriously!


Okay, I understand that this was a bit blunt. But I can't accept that. I can't accept a country where there are people so lazy to adopt systems that are, by far, much more convenient than whatever is present, especially considering we are in 2016 and no improvement has been made to this date. And not to mention I'm sure there will be some idiots defending this system saying that "we are not sheeple to follow other people like that!". Well, uh, then you're sheeple to your own ****ing community. Any thoughts? Sure, you may call be brainwashed if that's what you believe, but I'd just like to point out that even though I grew up in a 24h system and I completely switched to 12h. And now I'm (partially) back at 24h. During this whole time, I barely spent any time outside. How exactly can you prove this against me if that's your intent? Anyway, any reasonable and non-biased explanations and/or defenses? Thank you.

There is so much in this life that is actually important that it's sad something so petty as this is what you wish to focus on.

 

[Renzatic]

Fractions are not units! Fractions are frequently used in science and math to provide precision that decimals cannot.

Now, kindly move that picture up .33333333333333333333333333333333333333333333333333333333333 meter, please.

Fractions make sense for scientific endeavors, but you don't need to be quite that specific for measurements, even when building furniture.

It's a lot easier to work with decimal points in everyday situations than it is with fractions. Off the top of your head, it's easier (for me at least) to half, quarter, or third 24.7 centimeters than, say, 9 and 11/16ths inches.

 

[D.T.]

Milks bags ... must resist juvenile comments ...

 

[Mr. Buzzcut]

Fractions make sense for scientific endeavors, but you don't need to be quite that specific for measurements, even when building furniture.

It's a lot easier to work with decimal points in everyday situations than it is with fractions. Off the top of your head, it's easier (for me at least) to half, quarter, or third 24.7 centimeters than, say, 9 and 11/16ths inches.

Well if you want to be imprecise about it, use decimals instead. 11/16 is just under 3/4, so round to 9.7 and off you go.

People act as if fractions are sloppy somehow. It's quite the opposite. That said, I do prefer metric by far and hate having two sets of tools.

 

[mojolicious]

I'll buy a 4L bag of milk (or a 2L carton), then fill up my 20 lb propane tank so I can throw some 8-oz hamburgers on the BBQ - brown them at 250 degrees F. It's 20 degrees C out, a nice spring evening to cook outside.

Deeply committed as I am to Le Système international d'unités, it's very difficult to get excited when a restaurant menu offers you a steak described as "minimum 280g (uncooked weight)".

 

[Renzatic]

People act as if fractions are sloppy somehow. It's quite the opposite. That said, I do prefer metric by far and hate having two sets of tools.

You're right, they are more precise. But they're also more cumbersome.

This is why I ultimately prefer metric over standard. It's simpler and more immediately intuitive.

 

[AtikCzaTok]

..

 

[Mr. Buzzcut]

Milks bags ... must resist juvenile comments ...

I hear they come in kid size and are called "fun bags" I guess in line with "happy meal"