1Password migrants thread

[jboyzh]

I'd like to point out a specific issue with secure notes, and searching within them:

I have a couple of very long notes stored in the password apps, and I like to be able to locate specific search terms within those notes quickly.

Although all apps that I know of are able to find a note that contains a given search term, being able to locate the search term in the results is a rare feature.

I found that 1Password on iOS can do it, but for whatever reason not consistently on the Mac. On some notes it works, on some not.

Codebook shines with searching secure notes, on Mac and iOS. I can search within secure notes (shift+command+F), even long ones, and I can jump right to the word/s found (Enter). What’s also nice is that I can type right away, and don’t have to change to edit mode first.

So, Codebook might right now be the only password app I’ve found that gives me full note search capability, if I'm not missing any?

 

[sjlombardo]

Hi All, I'm Stephen with Zetetic, the makers of Codebook. We came across this thread and some recent comments related to changes in Codebook 5. I just wanted to clarify that Codebook Cloud is an optional feature available in Codebook 5. We haven't turned off or changed any of the existing functionality for completely offline databases.

In the interest of transparency, we had a bug on macOS where, if you started the Codebook Cloud sign up process, it would switch the Sync setting to use Codebook Cloud. If you subsequently cancelled the sign up, it wouldn't switch your old setting back. Luckily the fix for that is just to change back to your old Sync service in Preferences (e.g. Dropbox, Google Drive, or Desktop Wifi). This issue has also been fixed in a point release so it won't happen any longer.

In short, we're definitely not trying to force Codebook Cloud on users, but we do hope that folks find it useful, especially that it will automatically and securely keep your devices in sync. We think that the fact that your data remains accessible exclusively on your devices (with you retaining full control of the encryption sync key, which never leaves your devices) is a big plus that prevents Codebook Cloud from being susceptible to many of the vulnerabilities that affect online password managers. We're also looking to add more features to Codebook Cloud like sharing, etc. in the future to make it even better.

I hope that helps explain the situation, and I'm happy to answer any questions folks might have.

 

[MacBH928]

I'd like to point out a specific issue with secure notes, and searching within them:

I have a couple of very long notes stored in the password apps, and I like to be able to locate specific search terms within those notes quickly.

Although all apps that I know of are able to find a note that contains a given search term, being able to locate the search term in the results is a rare feature.

I found that 1Password on iOS can do it, but for whatever reason not consistently on the Mac. On some notes it works, on some not.

Codebook shines with searching secure notes, on Mac and iOS. I can search within secure notes (shift+command+F), even long ones, and I can jump right to the word/s found (Enter). What’s also nice is that I can type right away, and don’t have to change to edit mode first.

So, Codebook might right now be the only password app I’ve found that gives me full note search capability, if I'm not missing any?

looks like you need encrypted notes app not a password app

 

[jboyzh]

looks like you need encrypted notes app not a password app

I do use standard notes, but am otherwise happy with the additional note functionality of password apps.

 

[svenmany]

looks like you need encrypted notes app not a password app

1Password has moved way beyond being a password app. It has so many different categories of things that you might want kept from prying eyes. I use it for the strength of its security and convenience. Even though I've never thought to look for the ability to search in notes, it seems an obvious missing feature.

When I search for something in 1Password, it produces a list of matching items. If one of those items is a note and I select that note, contents matching the search is highlighted in the note. But, once I have the note open and want to study its contents some, searching within the note would be very helpful. And the ability to do it is expected. I was surprised that I couldn't do it.

If I had many notes with content that was as sensitive as my simple passwords, then an encrypted notes app would not meet my security standards. Those who feel an encrypted notes app would be good enough for all of their passwords would feel differently.

 

[MacBH928]

1Password has moved way beyond being a password app. It has so many different categories of things that you might want kept from prying eyes. I use it for the strength of its security and convenience. Even though I've never thought to look for the ability to search in notes, it seems an obvious missing feature.

When I search for something in 1Password, it produces a list of matching items. If one of those items is a note and I select that note, contents matching the search is highlighted in the note. But, once I have the note open and want to study its contents some, searching within the note would be very helpful. And the ability to do it is expected. I was surprised that I couldn't do it.

Most "password" managers are beyond passwords with ability to store notes, credit cards, and such. The notes functionality is just a little extra but if the notes are long enough to need its own search function maybe its not the right type of app.

It could in the future the password managers would be more like a "vault" that you can store anything in it including notes, images, videos, whatever you wish. Scans of IDs come to mind, but personally I rather not deal with a huge vault database.

If I had many notes with content that was as sensitive as my simple passwords, then an encrypted notes app would not meet my security standards. Those who feel an encrypted notes app would be good enough for all of their passwords would feel differently.

I meant separate app for the notes, not use notes app as a password manager

 

[svenmany]

Most "password" managers are beyond passwords with ability to store notes, credit cards, and such. The notes functionality is just a little extra but if the notes are long enough to need its own search function maybe its not the right type of app.

It could in the future the password managers would be more like a "vault" that you can store anything in it including notes, images, videos, whatever you wish. Scans of IDs come to mind, but personally I rather not deal with a huge vault database.

To each their own. I keep some documents in 1Password: screenshots with sensitive information like recovery keys come to mind.

Adding search for notes seems like a trivial addition and would be useful even for shorter notes. But, maybe it's not so trivial without being a bit careless about how it's done. For example, using some third-party widget (even one made by Apple) to make use of its text handling is a risk that has to be carefully managed.

 

[jboyzh]

Most "password" managers are beyond passwords with ability to store notes, credit cards, and such. The notes functionality is just a little extra but if the notes are long enough to need its own search function maybe its not the right type of app.

It could in the future the password managers would be more like a "vault" that you can store anything in it including notes, images, videos, whatever you wish. Scans of IDs come to mind, but personally I rather not deal with a huge vault database.

If a basic password manager, say Apple Passwords, only lets me store login data, I use it as such, all fine. Yet if another password app offers so much more, I'm starting to use the functionality it offers. Which is, in my case, storing data also in the form of notes. So the little extra becomes more important to me. And new things arise, such as searching.

For a year, I've been keeping Standard Notes on par with 1Password - and I still do, just to see in which direction it goes - but I now mostly use 1PW (SN is not unlockable via Touch ID on Mac, lacks deep search on iOS, and 1PW handles my notes well).

A (more full featured) password app offers advantages over a note app to me: All I need to be secured goes into one app - logins, notes, and a few PDFs/JPGs. So yes, the password manager has become more like a vault to me than just a storage for logins.

 

[MacBH928]

I just tried to search a text in a not in Bitwarden iOS and it did not find it. It only search the entry "title" . I can see how this is problematic. Enpass can find it but you have to select "search fields" option first. Bitwarden extension on Firefox did find. None of them though seem to do search within the notes itself once you open it.

To each their own. I keep some documents in 1Password: screenshots with sensitive information like recovery keys come to mind.

Adding search for notes seems like a trivial addition and would be useful even for shorter notes. But, maybe it's not so trivial without being a bit careless about how it's done. For example, using some third-party widget (even one made by Apple) to make use of its text handling is a risk that has to be carefully managed.

I am not against it, I just can see how the developers have it on extremely low priority. They are probably busy with implement something like Passkeys now.

If a basic password manager, say Apple Passwords, only lets me store login data, I use it as such, all fine. Yet if another password app offers so much more, I'm starting to use the functionality it offers. Which is, in my case, storing data also in the form of notes. So the little extra becomes more important to me. And new things arise, such as searching.

For a year, I've been keeping Standard Notes on par with 1Password - and I still do, just to see in which direction it goes - but I now mostly use 1PW (SN is not unlockable via Touch ID on Mac, lacks deep search on iOS, and 1PW handles my notes well).

A (more full featured) password app offers advantages over a note app to me: All I need to be secured goes into one app - logins, notes, and a few PDFs/JPGs. So yes, the password manager has become more like a vault to me than just a storage for logins.

I just looked it up and Bitwarden Premium can indeed store files. Didn't know that was a possibility.

 

[jboyzh]

I just tried to search a text in a not in Bitwarden iOS and it did not find it. It only search the entry "title" . I can see how this is problematic. Enpass can find it but you have to select "search fields" option first. Bitwarden extension on Firefox did find. None of them though seem to do search within the notes itself once you open it.

I found searching within notes to be working the best with Codebook, which I got to know only recently. After some time getting to know the whole app, and comparing it to 1Password, Minimalist, and Standard Notes, call me impressed. Codebook has fairly all I'd expect from a full featured password manager (and then something from a secure notes app). Let me share my thoughts on these apps:

Codebook
Next to the ability to store logins and data with customizable fields, it can also work with note entries, PDFs and images. The note entries can be edited right away without hitting edit first - a small but welcome detail. Editing notes is quick and easy, even with larger notes. The ability to search within notes is a plus. It has fairly comprehensive CSV import and export capabilities. It comes in a free version (Google, Dropbox, Wifi, Local sync) that can be upgraded to a paid cloud sync service. The cloud syncing works reliably so far. Autofill works. Both the Mac and iPhone apps I’ve tried seem to be quite polished and clean, it also works on Win and Android.

Minimalist
Looks clean, and works fast - but longer notes slow it down on Mac. Has very good import, export (CSV), and manual and automatic backup features, which I see as a big plus. It doesn’t let me search for terms within notes (yet). It works on Mac, and iOS, and I like its unique, easy to use and clean touch.

1Password
I like the zoomable desktop, and it looks nice to my eyes, if not a little bit cluttered. It also has a good tags management. It will only let me export the whole database as 1PUX, not CSV (I'm aware there's some converter available, which I think is a bit cumbersome). Search within notes doesn’t always work on Mac, and I can only edit notes after hitting edit (it jumps to the top of the note then before I can write).

Standard Notes
While not a password manager, I store all my secure notes in it, and it works quite well. The export generates individual notes, not CSV (which I think is fine for a notes app). Searching on Mac is good, on iPhone it won’t let me search within notes. The Mac app doesn’t work with Touch ID.

 

[svenmany]

I subscribed to Proton Unlimited, for reasons unrelated to password management. Out of curiosity I took a look at Proton Pass.

I haven't found a way to turn off dark mode. Does anyone know if this is possible and how to do it?

 

[jboyzh]

I subscribed to Proton Unlimited, for reasons unrelated to password management. Out of curiosity I took a look at Proton Pass.

I haven't found a way to turn off dark mode. Does anyone know if this is possible and how to do it?

Interesting find. After checking both web app and Mac app, I also found no way to turn off dark mode (web and app). I can only change themes in the Proton Mail web app, but that doesn't change the theme in Proton Pass web.

 

[svenmany]

Interesting find. After checking both web app and Mac app, I also found no way to turn off dark mode (web and app). I can only change themes in the Proton Mail web app, but that doesn't change the theme in Proton Pass web.

So, my eyesight challenges make Proton Pass unusable.

From my review of some Proton apps (desktop Mail, Drive, and Pass), I would say they have a way to go before I'd give them high marks. But, I am happy with the web browser mail and VPN, which were the main things I was purchasing.

 

[Pag46]

So, my eyesight challenges make Proton Pass unusable.

From my review of some Proton apps (desktop Mail, Drive, and Pass), I would say they have a way to go before I'd give them high marks. But, I am happy with the web browser mail and VPN, which were the main things I was purchasing.

I use Proton Pass in “light” mode, i.e. with dark mode switched off, on iOS at least.
User icon -> settings -> theme

The web app is in dark mode by default and I haven’t tried to change it yet.

 

[jboyzh]

So, my eyesight challenges make Proton Pass unusable.

From my review of some Proton apps (desktop Mail, Drive, and Pass), I would say they have a way to go before I'd give them high marks. But, I am happy with the web browser mail and VPN, which were the main things I was purchasing.

Yes, I can imagine, and hope a light theme will be added for the Mac. I agree, Pass is not yet on the same level as web mail and VPN. Proton Mail Bridge works well here, though. I generally do like Proton, and keep my fingers crossed.

I use Proton Pass in “light” mode, i.e. with dark mode switched off, on iOS at least.
User icon -> settings -> theme

The web app is in dark mode by default and I haven’t tried to change it yet.

I didn't know about this iOS setting, thanks.

 

[MacBH928]

I subscribed to Proton Unlimited, for reasons unrelated to password management. Out of curiosity I took a look at Proton Pass.

I haven't found a way to turn off dark mode. Does anyone know if this is possible and how to do it?

the app? From what I know Proton default is the light mode so a light mode should always be an option.

How to change themes and customize the look and feel of Proton web apps | Proton

You can change themes and customize Proton web apps to suit your preferences and accessibility needs. Learn how.

proton.me

maybe there is something in the settings to fiddle with Themes or System theme.

 

[svenmany]

the app? From what I know Proton default is the light mode so a light mode should always be an option.

How to change themes and customize the look and feel of Proton web apps | Proton

You can change themes and customize Proton web apps to suit your preferences and accessibility needs. Learn how.

proton.me

maybe there is something in the settings to fiddle with Themes or System theme.

Thanks for that link.

That page is describing three of their web apps: Proton Mail, Proton Drive, and Proton Calendar. That would apply to running them in the browser or saving those pages as a web app (e.g. to the dock).

I launched those three pages in Safari as well as a page on Proton Pass. Then I opened another Proton page and selected various themes. Only the first three apps changed; Proton Pass didn't.

Their desktop apps (Proton Mail/Calendar, Proton Pass, and Proton VPN) are more limited. Pass and VPN cannot be taken out of dark mode. Mail provides one light theme and one dark one; that's less capable than the web app versions which have eight themes.

I would say that their extended efforts beyond mail seem like they're in early days. (Within the first few minutes of using Proton Drive I encountered a significant bug which I reported to support.) On the chance that the security related facets of Proton Pass are also in their early days, I would hold off using it for a while. If their apps mature in the facets that are visible to the user, then I might assume that the other stuff has as well.

 

[svenmany]

I took a look at Standard Notes; it seems very nice. 1Password is clearly not a usable secure notes repository in the way that Standard Notes is. I've started wondering whether such an app would add something for me.

I realize this thread is about password applications. But secure notes applications are only slightly apart; some people even use them for all their passwords.

Now that I have Proton Drive, I have an end-to-end encrypted document storage that is supported on every platform I use (iOS, macOS, and Windows). They also support Android. Given that, and the fact that I carefully safeguard my devices (short idle timeouts and I don't even walk away from my laptop in my home without locking it), I wonder what Standard Notes would add.

My devices seem like super versions of Standard Notes. I have many different, vetted editing applications. With Standard Notes, the editors (https://standardnotes.com/help/77/what-are-editors) are vetted by Standard Notes, but seem to be a significant unknown to the user. I have encrypted backups of the my drive (including Time Machine backups) and multiple offsite backups to different cloud services. All of it is client-side encrypted.

Tons of PDF files on my drive are just as sensitive as any note I might write. Why dedicate more muscle to the handling of notes? Why use Standard Notes to create their version of spreadsheets when I can just use Excel or Numbers and keep those documents encrypted.

Password applications are a different matter. They are more than just encrypted text documents filled with login information. It's all about the functionality and safety regarding the accessing of that data.

I really don't yet see the advantage I would gain from using something like Standard Notes. I certainly see a risk regarding major workflow disruption should they could go out of business tomorrow; they've only been around for 8 years. I used to use Notebook by Circus Ponies. They went out of business without any advance notice. That was certainly a significant disruption.

 

[MNGR]

came here to see if there was a surge of interest in iOS18 / Passwords app - I upgraded iPhone / iPad / Macbook last night & saw that Passwords will import a CSV file.

anyone moving?

I am still using my old 1PW. Over time will switch to Apple Password

 

[MacBH928]

I would say that their extended efforts beyond mail seem like they're in early days. (Within the first few minutes of using Proton Drive I encountered a significant bug which I reported to support.) On the chance that the security related facets of Proton Pass are also in their early days, I would hold off using it for a while. If their apps mature in the facets that are visible to the user, then I might assume that the other stuff has as well.

As a long time follower of Proton, their apps seems to improve exponentially. If you come a year later its like a whole new app. This is unlike other apps where after 1 year they will introduce 1 new feature.

I took a look at Standard Notes; it seems very nice. 1Password is clearly not a usable secure notes repository in the way that Standard Notes is. I've started wondering whether such an app would add something for me.

I realize this thread is about password applications. But secure notes applications are only slightly apart; some people even use them for all their passwords.

Now that I have Proton Drive, I have an end-to-end encrypted document storage that is supported on every platform I use (iOS, macOS, and Windows). They also support Android. Given that, and the fact that I carefully safeguard my devices (short idle timeouts and I don't even walk away from my laptop in my home without locking it), I wonder what Standard Notes would add.

My devices seem like super versions of Standard Notes. I have many different, vetted editing applications. With Standard Notes, the editors (https://standardnotes.com/help/77/what-are-editors) are vetted by Standard Notes, but seem to be a significant unknown to the user. I have encrypted backups of the my drive (including Time Machine backups) and multiple offsite backups to different cloud services. All of it is client-side encrypted.

Tons of PDF files on my drive are just as sensitive as any note I might write. Why dedicate more muscle to the handling of notes? Why use Standard Notes to create their version of spreadsheets when I can just use Excel or Numbers and keep those documents encrypted.

Password applications are a different matter. They are more than just encrypted text documents filled with login information. It's all about the functionality and safety regarding the accessing of that data.

I really don't yet see the advantage I would gain from using something like Standard Notes. I certainly see a risk regarding major workflow disruption should they could go out of business tomorrow; they've only been around for 8 years. I used to use Notebook by Circus Ponies. They went out of business without any advance notice. That was certainly a significant disruption.

-Your use case scenario has no place for Standard Notes. Standard notes is usefull for people who want to keep text notes encrypted from FAANG eyes and sync across devices. Thats me. Instead of having my simple text notes in files on my cloud storage, its much more manageable to have them in 1 app that I can edit on the go.

-How do you encrypted your files to the cloud? So far I have only found cryptomator. There are official apps like BackBlaze but I do not trust closed source apps when it comes to privacy. My main purpose to backup my whole drive to the cloud, so clicking and dragging files to Proton Drive is not an option unless I can drag an drop my MacintoshHD folder in there. I wonder if that will work.

 

[svenmany]

As a long time follower of Proton, their apps seems to improve exponentially. If you come a year later its like a whole new app. This is unlike other apps where after 1 year they will introduce 1 new feature.

That's good to hear. I'm rooting for them.

-Your use case scenario has no place for Standard Notes. Standard notes is usefull for people who want to keep text notes encrypted from FAANG eyes and sync across devices. Thats me. Instead of having my simple text notes in files on my cloud storage, its much more manageable to have them in 1 app that I can edit on the go.

-How do you encrypted your files to the cloud? So far I have only found cryptomator. There are official apps like BackBlaze but I do not trust closed source apps when it comes to privacy. My main purpose to backup my whole drive to the cloud, so clicking and dragging files to Proton Drive is not an option unless I can drag an drop my MacintoshHD folder in there. I wonder if that will work.

Finder is a good place to organize notes and all kinds of other documents. Those files are likely available on all your devices, assuming you pick a cloud storage service that supports that.

Whole drive backup solutions is a different topic. It seems unrelated to what we're discussing in this thread. But to quickly answer, I used Arq Backup for the critical and sensitive documents cloud storage.

 

[svenmany]

Standard notes is usefull for people who want to keep text notes encrypted from FAANG eyes and sync across devices. Thats me. Instead of having my simple text notes in files on my cloud storage, its much more manageable to have them in 1 app that I can edit on the go.

Oh - IDRKWFM.

I did try out using Proton Drive with text files organized into folders within the sync'd location. It works very well on computers. On my iPhone it was unusable. The documents were there but they were almost impossible to manipulate since getting a file in and out of another application is so hard.

Maybe it's the awkwardness of iOS that makes Standard Notes a compelling option.

 

[DCIFRTHS]

Oh - IDRKWFM.

??? What does this mean? Having a hard time looking it up...

 

[gregmac19]

??? What does this mean? Having a hard time looking it up...

I think svenmany put two acronyms together:

IDRK - I don’t really know
WFM - Works for me

 

[svenmany]

Darn those acronyms. DTA.