Hi,
I used Datavault before. It was great. There was un update like three or 4 years ago. It was difficult to sync. That is when I moved to Msecure. I haven't looked back since.
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1Password migrants thread
- Thread starter MacBH928
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I used Datavault before. It was great. There was un update like three or 4 years ago. It was difficult to sync. That is when I moved to Msecure. I haven't looked back since.
Why is everyone avoiding EnPass when its the closest thing to 1password?
Looks archaic, as in made for an old MacOS version but never updated. I always look for apps with huge user base and popular that way I know the company is legit and care to update. I don't want to pay $80 and get an outdated app that never gets updated. Even their page on app store does not have privacy info
I wanted to give mSecure a chance but then saw everything old on the websites, forums, twitter... i ran away.
I’m looking at DataVault it seems to have everything or just about everything I’m looking for.
Any objections?
- Stand alone vault option via something like dropbox.
- No subscription, although I'd pay $10 per year if I had too. As is it’s $10 for Mac version, $10 iOS version (covers multiple iOS devices) and $10 PC version.
- I want Mac, iOS, and PC compatibility.
- Browser extensions.
- 2FA (unconfirmed)
- And they offer a competitive upgrade from 1Password. Have emailed them for info on this.
FAQ - DataVault for Mac
Frequently Asked Questions (FAQ) - DataVault Password Manager for Macascendo.co
Looks archaic, as in made for an old MacOS version but never updated. I always look for apps with huge user base and popular that way I know the company is legit and care to update. I don't want to pay $80 and get an outdated app that never gets updated. Even their page on app store does not have privacy info
I wanted to give mSecure a chance but then saw everything old on the websites, forums, twitter... i ran away.
mSecure 6 is apparently very close to release. I have not tried it so this is not a recommendation, just an alert. You can read about v6 features here.
I purchased DataVault for Mac. I'm seeing some issues, some bigger than others. I may ask Apple for a refund.
- DataVault allows you to use Touch ID, but the browser extension separately demands a separate sign in and I don't see any Touch ID compatibility with that.
- If you have mutliple sign-ins say one for you and one for your wife, the extension will choose one ( to fill in and if it's the wrong one, I have to go up and select the extension which then sometimes wants me to sign in my long password before it will open, then I can pick another entry, from the short list it shows as possibilities.
- It does not seem to do the traditional fill in fields and if you imported your 1PW database into DataVault, what happens that instead of just filling in the fields you need filled, say user and password, it will execute the web url it shows in the record, opens up a new page, which in several cases did not take me to the log in page, although I checked the record for the correct web address such as "login page" and it should be opening that page, but it's not.
- And from the browser extension, there is no accessing the app to make a change for an individual record.
- Another curious problem is that I was given a Windows key and I noticed the Mac version allows you to use a nice long password, but the PC version limits you to 16 characters, and this is an issue if you are trying to synch with a vault sitting in the cloud. Two different passwords don't work, so for cross platform synching, you'd need to go with the shorter password, which I guess is not a huge deal, but it irritates me. (Update: Although I downloaded the Windows version from the Microsoft Store, so it should be the latest version right?, I asked DataVault's support via email about this, and they pointed me at a different download that supposedly fixes this issue.)
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I ruled out Enpass (I had purchased) after Enpass chose screwing over lifetime pro users by having created a (pay for it again) "premium version" plus implementing subscription payment And no local vaults.
Seems they reversed their stance after getting a lot of push back from customers.
if you take a look at the Enpass users forum, customers had already paid for a license, only to find the company rebranded the product, added feature to the newly named product and told previous customers they would need to buy another "lifetime" licence.
I dont need a repeat of Agilebits grubby behaviour.
For what its worth....my view (lots of reasons described previously in this thread) :
Safeincloud - for iOS, macOS and PC ...I used for two years and it was great.
Stongbox - for iOS and mac OS (not for PC) ...this is what I use now. Terrific.
more like 2004: https://ascendo.co
I dont think I should trust a developer that does not keep an updated website or social account especially with my passwords. The effort feels like underground hackers work.
I purchased DataVault for Mac. I'm seeing some issues, some bigger than others. I may ask Apple for a refund.
More to come!
- DataVault allows you to use Touch ID, but the browser extension separately demands a separate sign in and I don't see any Touch ID compatibility with that.
- If you have mutliple sign-ins say one for you and one for your wife, the extension will choose will to fill in and if it's the wrong one, I have to go up and select the extension which then wants me to sign in my long password before it will open, then I can pick another entry, from the short list it shows as possibilities.
- It does not seem to do the traditional fill in fields and if you imported your 1PW database into DataVault, what happens that instead of just filling in the fields you need filled, say user and password, it will execute the web url it shows in the record, opens up a new page, which in several cases did not take me to the log in page, although I checked the record for the correct web address such as "login page" and it should be opening that page, but it's not.
- And from the browser extension, there is no accessing the app to make a change for an individual record.
- Another curious problem is that I was given a Windows key and I noticed the Mac version allows you to use a nice long password, but the PC version limits you to 16 characters, and this is an issue if you are trying to synch with a vault sitting in the cloud. Two different passwords don't work, so for cross platform synching, you'd need to go with the shorter password, which I guess is not a huge deal, but it irritates me.
glad I didn't go that route.
I actually purchase Msecure v5 today after reading online that 1)No Subscription, and 2) It had both Mac Safari and Chrome extensions. $19.99 is a great prices (sale price). However after I downloaded it, I could find no Safari extension for MacOS, then I stumbled across this discussion at Msecure: https://support.msecure.com/en/support/discussions/topics/36000017834
Not only no Safari extension (somewhere I swear it said Safari and Chrome browser extensions for Mac 🤔 ), but they plan on going subscriptionj plan only for Msecure 6, sigh. I've sent them an email asking about this, and if it's not there, requesting a refund (60 day refund policy).
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And downloading a beta version from a random Dropbox account? Yeah, that sounds perfectly safe and reasonable.
I've been following these discussions with interest, as I'm a 1Password 7 user, and none of the alternatives that have been suggested really hit the mark. I want something that doesn't offend my eyes, offers local vaults and syncing via iCloud and which doesn't pollute my computer with Electron junk. I'm sticking with the devil I know for now, even though there are some aspects of it that annoy me (e.g. when I log in and it launches an application that appears on the Dock for about 1 second and then quits - other apps are in my login items and manage to start without doing that). I've had to turn off automatic updates on my iPhone and iPad so I don't download the 7.8 iOS update (which does away with local vaults, even though Agilebits said that they weren't going to do that before V8 comes out - evidently they can't count).
The closest to what I want that I can find is Minimalist, but it seems a little too minimalist, and it could do with a touch of color to liven it up (it's all very monochrome). The developer seems quite responsive to suggestions, though.
I've tried a couple of others, just to see:
Enpass - full of bad grammar (e.g. "You can add your every single login accounts here and Enpass will auto-fill them in a single tap whenever required"), which is just annoying and looks unprofessional.
KeePassXC - hideous UI. Looks like it was ported from a Windows XP version built in Visual Basic 6. Why doesn't it use native Cocoa UI elements?
Strongbox - another terrible UI, though at least it uses native UI elements.
Terrible UI for Strongbox and you are fine with 1Password, which is more cluttered? That doesn't make sense to me. The UI for Strongbox is very similar to 1Password.
If you're wanting to jump from 1Password, I'll gladly take your 1Password 7 license.
Seriously, it's like we're back to the drawing board with all of this. And while I don't use it, I also hear through the grapevine that MS Outlook is going Electron, which will piss off the business masses that depend on it.
BL.
I downloaded the free "premium" version of LogMeOnce Interesting account level categorization considering all of the restrictions. 🤔 The next notch up is Professional which is a subscription. Anyone using this? I have played around with it a bit. I have a LogMeIn App sitting in my Applications folder, but I interact with it exclusively in my (Safari) Browser. I don't care for that. The browser is where the app interface sits.
I turned on 2FA, but they actually want me to pay to have an SMS code sent to my phone, $.10. Maybe because I'm just at the Premium tier. What concerns me here is that you can turn on 2FA and if you use something like Google Authenticator, when you phone croaks on you for whatever reason, you need an alternative way to connect. So here I tried to turn on SMS texting for the phone, and was advised, I need to put money into the account. Normally with 2FA, the entity providing the service will give you an alternative means of getting in such as getting a text, or a list of emergency codes, which LogMeIn did not provide. So as is, if my phones croaks, I'm locked out of this account as best I can tell.
I've not gotten there, but as far as I can tell, it does dropbox for synching with other devices.
I turned on 2FA, but they actually want me to pay to have an SMS code sent to my phone, $.10. Maybe because I'm just at the Premium tier. What concerns me here is that you can turn on 2FA and if you use something like Google Authenticator, when you phone croaks on you for whatever reason, you need an alternative way to connect. So here I tried to turn on SMS texting for the phone, and was advised, I need to put money into the account. Normally with 2FA, the entity providing the service will give you an alternative means of getting in such as getting a text, or a list of emergency codes, which LogMeIn did not provide. So as is, if my phones croaks, I'm locked out of this account as best I can tell.
I've not gotten there, but as far as I can tell, it does dropbox for synching with other devices.
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In an ideal world KeeWeb will turn into something like 1password.
Why don't You give EnPass a try?
bad grammar is something small I am willing to look over for a functioning password app.
Why is everyone going electron when its so bad?
i understand if it was small 3 man team but multi-million corporates?!
I downloaded the free "premium" version of LogMeOnce Interesting account level categorization considering all of the restrictions. 🤔 The next notch up is Professional which is a subscription. Anyone using this? I have played around with it a bit. I have a LogMeIn App sitting in my Applications folder, but I interact with it exclusively in my (Safari) Browser. I don't care for that. The browser is where the app interface sits.
I turned on 2FA, but they actually want me to pay to have an SMS code sent to my phone, $.10. Maybe because I'm just at the Premium tier. What concerns me here is that you can turn on 2FA and if you use something like Google Authenticator, when you phone croaks on you for whatever reason, you need an alternative way to connect. So here I tried to turn on SMS texting for the phone, and was advised, I need to put money into the account. Normally with 2FA, the entity providing the service will give you an alternative means of getting in such as getting a text, or a list of emergency codes, which LogMeIn did not provide. So as is, if my phones croaks, I'm locked out of this account as best I can tell.
I've not gotten there, but as far as I can tell, it does dropbox for synching with other devices.
Why don't You give EnPass a try?
bad grammar is something small I am willing to look over for a functioning password app.
If you're wanting to jump from 1Password, I'll gladly take your 1Password 7 license.
Seriously, it's like we're back to the drawing board with all of this. And while I don't use it, I also hear through the grapevine that MS Outlook is going Electron, which will piss off the business masses that depend on it.
BL.
Why is everyone going electron when its so bad?
i understand if it was small 3 man team but multi-million corporates?!
I never said that they didn't.
Java, in its compiled binary format, was portable to every OS that supported it: Linux, Mac, Windows, SunOS, Solaris, AIX. As long as the JRE was installed, you could compile the binary on Windows, move it over to Solaris, and it would work. However, it was a HUGE resource hog, as when you start the JVM for the application, memory and CPU have to be allocated to it, and any memory used inside that allocated memory does not get freed up back to the JVM until garbage collection is run. So it stays allocated and used until the JVM is shut down. However, such allocation and memory/CPU usage can be controlled.
Swift is object oriented, portable as well, integrates with Objective-C, so you're getting into object oriented programming. However, it does not have the downsides of electron:
Again, Swift can be controlled, especially as you'll still be compiling something that is portable.
- It is portable, but limited in scope: iOS, MacOS, WatchOS, tvOS. You can compile on one of those environments, move it to another, and will work.
- Does not have the security or resource contention issues as Electron does.
Electron, is based off of HTML, Cascading Style Sheets (CSS) with HTML, and JavaScript. The security implications are huge:
If I were to rank them in order of usage, I'd go with Swift at #1, Java at #25, and Electron at #4,827,955,004,271. Yes, I know there aren't that many programming languages in the world; I'd make some of them up, let alone call up some that haven't seen the light of day since they were first used. Hell, I'd use Logo before Electron, because Turtle Graphics.
- Javascript. Enough said. Insert script kiddie issues here.
- it runs off of the Chromium engine, which is known to be prone to cross site scripting attacks.
- Because of Chromium, Electron are simply web-based applications. It requires that engine to exist, meaning you have to have Chromium installed or used.
- Because of #3, every Electron app comes with its own version of Chromium. Chromium on its own is 20 million lines of code. The Linux kernel is 27.8 million lines of code on its own. Chromium is nearly the size of Linux, and just for an engine.
- because of #4, you get the resource hog. Each electron app spawns its own version of Chromium, then it has to start the application you're wanting to start. So even something like an app printing "hello World" takes up a good 100MB of space, let alone the memory. Now, look at 1Password, and all of the functionality it needs.
Turtle graphics - Wikipedia
en.wikipedia.org
BL.
Out of topic but why electron has to use Chromium and not another engine? and why is a browser as huge as an OS kernel? Is it bloat?
That's the engine they decided to go with, in making a web-based application. They could have gone other ways: Tomcat, Weblogic, etc., those require a JVM; essentially, the JVM would be their engine. In fact, a good comparison is this: Tomcat and Weblogic are to JVM as Electron is to Chromium.
Why they went with Electron? The cynic in me thinks that they didn't want to learn a "real" programming language, as Electron is based on scripting and markup languages (HTML, CSS, and JavaScript). They wanted to play KISS (not the band, but Keep It Simple <insert favourite S-word here>), but they didn't realize that their version of playing KISS required both the London and San Francisco Philharmonic orchestras, the London Metro Voices Choir, and Yngwie Malmsteen to play every single song Dragonforce has recorded, when all they want to do is play Happy Birthday.
BL.
My guess is that they are just going off of popularity or corporate buzzwords while not looking at real use cases and reports of how the electron-based application consumes a computer's resources. In short, they (project managers and programmers) are only looking at features and not bugs/resource hogs being reported. I worked at a company that did such a thing; after reporting bugs myself, they said they didn't care about them and went to add more features, to the point where I forwarded every single exception to the project managers and development team. They still didn't care, because features, money, and not wanting to fix the messes they had made.
BL.
Which is a bit worse. Not only is it a feature tied to what is essentially a subscription, but it also leaves you not in control of your vaults, plus leaves you out of control should your vault get compromised. And it isn't as if Dropbox hasn't been hacked before.
The issue we all have is needing to be secure in our data without having to depend on some service to keep our data, because should they fold up and go out of business, your data is gone the moment they close up shop. All of that has been discussed before here in this thread..
BL.
Nope, can’t do it. I went back to windows, and anticipating the misery of managing my passwords outside of 1p I ended my valiant boycott before the sub expires. Hopefully I can dodge the electron app forever with browser extensions. Nothing else really bothers me about it.
Right now, our saving grace is Apple and time. While AgileBits effectively forced everyone's hands with the 1Password IOS update, until a replacement or alternative application can be found, we still have whatever the time length is (probably determined by Apple) on how long Rosetta 2 will work.
I'm going to guess one more year, but does anyone have the wording that they used at last year's event? As in, they said that this would be the last year they would be selling Intel-based Macs, as they were going to give 2 years to get them completely out of inventory. What was it that they said about OS support? was it just "future releases" that wouldn't support Intel anymore, or was it a specific year? If they left it open ended, that means that we could have a good 3-5 year range before they would completely drop Rosetta 2, so that leaves us that much time for a 1Password replacement to come around.
Thoughts?
BL.
I'm going to guess one more year, but does anyone have the wording that they used at last year's event? As in, they said that this would be the last year they would be selling Intel-based Macs, as they were going to give 2 years to get them completely out of inventory. What was it that they said about OS support? was it just "future releases" that wouldn't support Intel anymore, or was it a specific year? If they left it open ended, that means that we could have a good 3-5 year range before they would completely drop Rosetta 2, so that leaves us that much time for a 1Password replacement to come around.
Thoughts?
BL.
I gifted the iOS version of 1Password 7 to several loved ones. I've told them they probably have a couple of years to decide if they want to start paying a subscription or move to something else. Several of them told me they don't even use a password manager (which is why I paid for one for them).
I gifted the iOS version of 1Password 7 to several loved ones. I've told them they probably have a couple of years to decide if they want to start paying a subscription or move to something else. Several of them told me they don't even use a password manager (which is why I paid for one for them).
Ouch. They definitely should use that, and if they have the chance, not move above 7.7.8, as version 7.8 and higher are the ones requiring the subscription and not using any type of local vault.
BL.
There is an update for 1Password I think v7.8 sitting on my Mac. Can I assume that all updates of V7 will continue to work as is?
I was looking at my purchase records and I the first time I quit 1PW when they first tried forcing subscriptions, in association with a MacOS update that required a new version of 1PW, I purchase the premium version of Enpass for $12 no subscription, but then later after another MacOS update, I had all kinds of issues with Enpass and returned to 1PW after I discovered I could still get it without a subscription. They just had it hidden away at that point.
Then Enpass did whatever they did and decided no a lifetime license was no longer a lifetime license, and if you purchase Enpass after Nov2019, you can still use it without a subscription. Ha ha, I purchased in Sept 2019, and now for a lifetime license they want $80 for the same features...
Update: Just looked at my iPhone and it has v1PW version 7.8.2, and under Synch it still shows dropbox as my vault, and I'm not getting a message about private vaults not supported? I wonder if it is actually synching there. 🤔
Then Enpass did whatever they did and decided no a lifetime license was no longer a lifetime license, and if you purchase Enpass after Nov2019, you can still use it without a subscription. Ha ha, I purchased in Sept 2019, and now for a lifetime license they want $80 for the same features...
I saw this after I posted my last. This is really dastardly to destroy the ability of private vaults in V7. I think I may have screwed myself with my iPhone and iPad, and I assume once the updated deed is done there is no going back to 7.7...? It's a blatant violation of trust with their customers. It will just motivate me to actually find something I can stomach.
Update: Just looked at my iPhone and it has v1PW version 7.8.2, and under Synch it still shows dropbox as my vault, and I'm not getting a message about private vaults not supported? I wonder if it is actually synching there. 🤔
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This subscription BS, is happening all over. I downloaded the free version of Clean Your Mac X to help with an install on my wife's MB Air of Big Sur, and the free version does not clean it all the way, although the stuff that is left over, you can actually manually delete it item by item. I had about 200MB of stuff I deleted file by file. They offer a "package" for $35 a year for a single computer. Bastardos!