2011 Mac Mini - Speculation

[MacinJosh]

I'm not sure if this has been covered already but here it is.

Since we know for relatively sure, that the new Mini will sport Sandy Bridge architecture, I believe that the chances of a discrete AMD GPU are pretty good.

The reasons for there not being a discrete GPU has been a lack of space. Thus far there has been the CPU and the all-in-one controller from nvidia. An additional GPU would have added a third big chip. Now that the Sandy Bridge is essentially a SoC requiring only the CPU for all functions there is space for a discrete chip. I certainly hope that Apple would utilise this in some way.

It would make sense to have the Mini available in models comparable to the MBP line. Base Mini would be like the 13" MBP and high-end like the 15"/17" with discrete GPU. That way we would have more choice in terms of headless Macs as the gap between the Mini and Pro is pretty massive.

 

[kjjnk]

Intel now has 35W desktop processors so we may see them in the next Mini.

They would be the following:
2100T - Core i3 - 2.5 GHz
2390T - Core i5 - 2.7 GHz

If Apple has the space I expect them to use an AMD 6490M for the GPU.

 

[MacinJosh]

Intel now has 35W desktop processors so we may see them in the next Mini.

They would be the following:
2500T - Core i3 - 2.5 GHz
2390T - Core i5 - 2.7 GHz

If Apple has the space I expect them to use an AMD 6490M for the GPU.

Interesting. How would these differ from the mobile variants used in the MBPs?

I believe the 6490M would not be a huge upgrade from the 320M or am I wrong?

 

[Hastings101]

I want a Mac Mini with an i3 and a dedicated gpu - even something as low as the 6490m would be better than an integrated one.

 

[kjjnk]

Interesting. How would these differ from the mobile variants used in the MBPs?

I believe the 6490M would not be a huge upgrade from the 320M or am I wrong?

For the CPU's I don't have any hard benchmarks but here's the comparison on Intel's site:
http://ark.intel.com/Compare.aspx?ids=52224,52231,53423,53448,

For the GPU's:
320M - http://www.notebookcheck.net/NVIDIA-GeForce-320M.28701.0.html
6490M - http://www.notebookcheck.net/AMD-Radeon-HD-6490M.43843.0.html

 

[MacinJosh]

I just realised that I didn't take into consideration the fact that a dedicated GPU needs RAM in the form of chips unlike the 320M that uses system RAM to operate.

If indeed the space on the logic board does not allow for additional circuitry, we might as well forget about discrete GPUs but surely there would be some way to accommodate RAM for the GPU on the board. Thoughts?

 

[kjjnk]

I just realised that I didn't take into consideration the fact that a dedicated GPU needs RAM in the form of chips unlike the 320M that uses system RAM to operate.

If indeed the space on the logic board does not allow for additional circuitry, we might as well forget about discrete GPUs but surely there would be some way to accommodate RAM for the GPU on the board. Thoughts?

Apple has never put any discrete graphics in the Intel Mac Mini so the 6490M was really just wishful thinking on my part if it's possible for them to fit it. We will most likely see Intel HD Graphics 3000 as the sole GPU.

 

[MacinJosh]

Apple has never put any discrete graphics in the Intel Mac Mini so the 6490M was really just wishful thinking on my part if it's possible for them to fit it. We will most likely see Intel HD Graphics 3000 as the sole GPU.

Absolutely, but my point was that since Sandy Bridge includes *everything* on the CPU rendering the space the 320M took as available for a discreet GPU.

HD 3000 is a given, no doubt as it's included on the CPU. The space left by the 320M is available for a discreet GPU. Question is, is there space for RAM for the GPU and would Apple give us that option.

 

[kjjnk]

Absolutely, but my point was that since Sandy Bridge includes *everything* on the CPU rendering the space the 320M took as available for a discreet GPU.

HD 3000 is a given, no doubt as it's included on the CPU. The space left by the 320M is available for a discreet GPU. Question is, is there space for RAM for the GPU and would Apple give us that option.

Probably not seeing as how the 13" MacBook Pro doesn't use discrete graphics and the Mini, MB, MBP 13" and MBA have always shared the same GPU.

If Apple were to use a discrete GPU they would disable the Intel 3000 like they do on the iMacs.

 

[firestarter]

If it has Thunderbolt, you can hook up a desktop GPU in an external PCIe expansion box. Might be fun!

 

[philipma1957]

[delete double post

 

[philipma1957]

Indeed, the comparison was the more or less expected 2011 Mac Mini (using MBP specs) with a 2008 quad core Mac Pro, not a 2010 Mini with a 2008 Pro. Or was the remark aimed at michaelqsm?

yeah that was for michealqsm. sorry about that.

 

[Tsurisuto]

If it has Thunderbolt, you can hook up a desktop GPU in an external PCIe expansion box. Might be fun!

I don't know how accurate this is, but a friend told me that Thunderbolt in it's current form of 10Gb/s does not have enough bandwidth for external GFX cards.

Does anyone have any input on this?

 

[firestarter]

I don't know how accurate this is, but a friend told me that Thunderbolt in it's current form of 10Gb/s does not have enough bandwidth for external GFX cards.

Does anyone have any input on this?

Your friend is semi-correct.

Thunderbolt is fast enough to drive 4 lanes of PCIe in an external box (like the Sonnet Echo Express).

Using just 4 lanes rather than 16 lanes isn't ideal - but it should work. Performance wouldn't be 1/4 of 16 lanes (as you'd expect), tests that Tom's Hardware did suggest that a top-end card like the GTX570 would loose around 10% of its speed in this arrangement. Still a massive performance increase over integrated graphics.

 

[michaelqsm]

yeah that was for michealqsm. sorry about that.

Hi again.

Sorry, I should have been clear in my original post. I have a late 2009 i5 2.66GHz iMac doing the Handbrake duties when necessary. That machine will run the Plex Media Server and the Mac Mini will be the client for Plex and other video playback duties.

For that reason and considering the refresh did not come yesterday, I reckon a current generation mac mini will be plenty good. In fact I am very likely to be getting one today.

What do you guys think? I am sure the performance will be adequate?

Although my movie library is huge, all if my videos are handbrake AppleTV settings do none of them are 1080p anyway. Even if that changes, I think the mac mini is capable of 1080p with no real effort.

Besides if the new mac minis are that good, eBay is my friend!

Cheers guys.

Michael

 

[Tsurisuto]

Hi again.

Sorry, I should have been clear in my original post. I have a late 2009 i5 2.66GHz iMac doing the Handbrake duties when necessary. That machine will run the Plex Media Server and the Mac Mini will be the client for Plex and other video playback duties.

For that reason and considering the refresh did not come yesterday, I reckon a current generation mac mini will be plenty good. In fact I am very likely to be getting one today.

What do you guys think? I am sure the performance will be adequate?

Although my movie library is huge, all if my videos are handbrake AppleTV settings do none of them are 1080p anyway. Even if that changes, I think the mac mini is capable of 1080p with no real effort.

Besides if the new mac minis are that good, eBay is my friend!

Cheers guys.

Michael

I bit the bullet and ordered a Mac mini Server. I also order a 64GB SSD Drive and 8GB Ram from Crucial. I'll install the OS on the SSD and have my home folder on the secondary 500 GB Hard Drive.

 

[mdgm]

2010 Mac Mini price has dropped $100AUD to $799AUD on Australian Apple Online Store. I guess that's an indication the 2011 Mini refresh isn't imminent. It could still be a few months or so away.

 

[michaelqsm]

I bit the bullet and ordered a Mac mini Server. I also order a 64GB SSD Drive and 8GB Ram from Crucial. I'll install the OS on the SSD and have my home folder on the secondary 500 GB Hard Drive.

That sounds like a good config

I cant stretch to the server am afraid as i need the extra cash for the keyboard and mouse, and extra RAM.

Still a good machine i think

Cheers

 

[Westyfield2]

Your friend is semi-correct.

Thunderbolt is fast enough to drive 4 lanes of PCIe in an external box (like the Sonnet Echo Express).

Using just 4 lanes rather than 16 lanes isn't ideal - but it should work. Performance wouldn't be 1/4 of 16 lanes (as you'd expect), tests that Tom's Hardware did suggest that a top-end card like the GTX570 would loose around 10% of its speed in this arrangement. Still a massive performance increase over integrated graphics.

Now that's interesting!

In a way then, I wouldn't mind if the new Mac Mini had crap onboard graphics, as I'd just get one of those and stick a proper card in it.

Are there any reviews of them anywhere (obviously MBP & iMac only so far)? Only thing I can see being an issue is OSX drivers...

 

[Diesel-Benz]

Your friend is semi-correct.

His friend is 100% correct. 10gb is slower than even the old AGP spec.

 

[lilsoccakid74]

Your friend is semi-correct.

Thunderbolt is fast enough to drive 4 lanes of PCIe in an external box (like the Sonnet Echo Express).

Using just 4 lanes rather than 16 lanes isn't ideal - but it should work. Performance wouldn't be 1/4 of 16 lanes (as you'd expect), tests that Tom's Hardware did suggest that a top-end card like the GTX570 would loose around 10% of its speed in this arrangement. Still a massive performance increase over integrated graphics.

So a new mini with thunderbolt could possibly power an external graphics card? that would be amazing.

 

[zap2]

All the Ivy Bridge talk has made me want to put off any purchase. But I'm hoping to buy a Mac mini with Sandy Bridge, then when Apple gets Ivy Bridge, I can jump on that ship and only lose a few hundred dollars.

I'm assuming Apple won't put Ivy Bridge in Mac mini right away, hopefully I'll be able to put off a purchase for a 2nd gen of the Ivy Bridge(I'm sorting assuming Apple will leave Sandy Bridge ASAP with Ivy Bridge)

 

[C64]

All the Ivy Bridge talk has made me want to put off any purchase. But I'm hoping to buy a Mac mini with Sandy Bridge, then when Apple gets Ivy Bridge, I can jump on that ship and only lose a few hundred dollars.

I'm assuming Apple won't put Ivy Bridge in Mac mini right away, hopefully I'll be able to put off a purchase for a 2nd gen of the Ivy Bridge(I'm sorting assuming Apple will leave Sandy Bridge ASAP with Ivy Bridge)

Apple doesn't know "ASAP". They stuck long enough with the C2D too. They'll switch to Ivy eventually, but it'll probably be another year after the next Sandy Bridge refresh.

 

[zap2]

Apple doesn't know "ASAP". They stuck long enough with the C2D too. They'll switch to Ivy eventually, but it'll probably be another year after the next Sandy Bridge refresh.

I have my doubts...Apple was the first hardware maker to put the iX Core chip into a Mac Pro. And Apple launched things like firewire, Thunderbolt and bet a lot on USB. Apple also was an earlier supporter of the Core Duo chips in the iMac and MacBook Pro.

The reason Apple stayed with C2D was because of the graphics card, forcing them to make a compromise on the CPU.

Apple moves with great haste when it wants to, and moves slower then anyone in the market at other times. They have the ability to do that because of their market status. I'd expect to see Ivy Bridge in 2012 in the Mac Mini.

That said, I'm not waiting, lets see some Sandy Bridge Mac mini, I don't really want to pay thousand to two thousand dollar for an iMac nor do I have the room in my dorm. Small is good! (But I need some performance as well)

 

[Lesser Evets]

If they put in Sandy bridge, I think the price of the mini will jump up a hundred or more. It would bring amazing speed making the mini about as fast as this 2006 tower I have, and it would bring the versatile and awesome Thunderbolt. It'd make sense, but it would raise the price.

I'm hoping 1TB drives are universal at the base, 2TB custom.
Sandy Bridge.
Thunderbolt.
$799

It's too optimistic, but the mini would be a brilliant little machine for people switching out Macs, saving cash, and reusing monitors and keyboards, etc.