2016 nMP

[s-hatland]

man. you guys... having the high ground is not the same as taking the high road. in all my years of internet it still genuinely shocks me the level of immaturity can come from it. more than a few members here who i initially respected for their vast knowledge, have fallen many rungs due only to their personality. i mean i'm all for some good ol' fashioned forum drama, but keep it fresh at least.

sorry, just ran out of popcorn. let me make another batch and carry on, internet!

 

[koyoot]

Really? you don't get out much, maybe the prop runs for the art department have taken time from looking around the industry.


This quote from the article,

"When we were working on the Fast & Furious ride for Universal Studios and we needed something very fast on set to do editorial, I went back and tested it and was blown away by the performance and the footage it could handle as we were working in 5K RED Raw.

So when VR started, I once again went through testing and FCPX just sailed through stuff that other programs just chugged on. We're cutting 8k native on a few generations ago iMac and it just handles it without a problem."



http://www.fcp.co/final-cut-pro/art...its-3d-360-virtual-reality-on-final-cut-pro-x

There is very strong group of people on this forum who call themselves as Pros. They consider themselves as better than anyone else, and their needs are more important than others. They see Apple as a company that does not meet their needs and crap it all over the forum. They consider Mac Pro, not good enough, they consider FCPX as wedding and youtube content creating tool only.

And what is even funnier, they think that something is wrong with everybody who do not think the same way as they do. They believe they are right and everybody is wrong. They believe that everyone who thinks otherwise should go away from this board.

I am not the one to judge who is right or wrong. Nor is Apple. What I do believe is that Apple knows where they want to go. And that may disappoint very huge amount of people. And they do verbalize that disappointment.

But who cares about that?

In another news:

That is very good value. I wonder how the temps will look like, knowing GTX1080 problems.

 

[pat500000]

Lot better than watching dr Phil's show. And

man. you guys... having the high ground is not the same as taking the high road. in all my years of internet it still genuinely shocks me the level of immaturity can come from it. more than a few members here who i initially respected for their vast knowledge, have fallen many rungs due only to their personality. i mean i'm all for some good ol' fashioned forum drama, but keep it fresh at least.

sorry, just ran out of popcorn. let me make another batch and carry on, internet!

 

[tuxon86]

There is very strong group of people on this forum who call themselves as Pros. They consider themselves as better than anyone else, and their needs are more important than others. They see Apple as a company that does not meet their needs and crap it all over the forum. They consider Mac Pro, not good enough, they consider FCPX as wedding and youtube content creating tool only.

And what is even funnier, they think that something is wrong with everybody who do not think the same way as they do. They believe they are right and everybody is wrong. They believe that everyone who thinks otherwise should go away from this board.

I am not the one to judge who is right or wrong. Nor is Apple. What I do believe is that Apple knows where they want to go. And that may disappoint very huge amount of people. And they do verbalize that disappointment.

But who cares about that?

In another news:

That is very good value. I wonder how the temps will look like, knowing GTX1080 problems.

Poor, poor you...

And since there won't be only one model of the GTX1080, your lame comment about possible heat related problem is at best an assumption on your part.

 

[AidenShaw]

That is very good value. I wonder how the temps will look like, knowing GTX1080 problems.

And what might those problems be? Links, please.

 

[koyoot]

Poor, poor you...

And since there won't be only one model of the GTX1080, your lame comment about possible heat related problem is at best an assumption on your part.

Is GTX 1080 able to maintain core clocks for longer periods of time?

Simple answer is:

And power target is for temperatures. Not power consumption. With normal power target the highest possible temperature is 83 degrees. The GPU will throttle itself down to maintain within. The second part of that table is for 92 degree power target. You know what is funniest however? It uses only 4W less in that power target mode than GTX 780 Ti, which according to TPU numbers while gaming uses 225W. So it is not a 180W anymore. As you can see, even with the highest power target, the GPU is not able to maintain its boost clocks, because of the security point in BIOS for temperature, which is 85 degrees. The GPU will not exceed that level, but always will throttle itself. All of this is from Computerese.de review for GTX 1080.

Guess the "normal" view for GTX 1080 is different. But that is Nvidia magical marketing, at its best.

 

[tuxon86]

Is GTX 1080 able to maintain core clocks for longer periods of time?

Simple answer is:

And power target is for temperatures. Not power consumption. With normal power target the highest possible temperature is 83 degrees. The GPU will throttle itself down to maintain within. The second part of that table is for 92 degree power target. You know what is funniest however? It uses only 4W less in that power target mode than GTX 780 Ti, which according to TPU numbers while gaming uses 225W. So it is not a 180W anymore. As you can see, even with the highest power target, the GPU is not able to maintain its boost clocks, because of the security point in BIOS for temperature, which is 85 degrees. The GPU will not exceed that level, but always will throttle itself. All of this is from Computerese.de review for GTX 1080.

Guess the "normal" view for GTX 1080 is different. But that is Nvidia magical marketing, at its best.

Oh brother...

You really have to keep reaching and moving that goal post... Do you know why it's called a "Boost" clock Koyoot? Because it isn't a constant clock speed...

 

[koyoot]

Oh brother...

You really have to keep reaching and moving that goal post... Do you know why it's called a "Boost" clock Koyoot? Because it isn't a constant clock speed...

Not I am the one moving goal post, here.

 

[tuxon86]

Not I am the one moving goal post, here.

Of course you do.
You're just not able to be honest about it. Every time you get shot down you come back with something else that is just as quickly shot down. That is moving the goal post.

 

[koyoot]

Of course you do.
You're just not able to be honest about it. Every time you get shot down you come back with something else that is just as quickly shot down. That is moving the goal post.

Well if you believe in Nvidia marketing then as well you can call it was "shoot down".

It was nice talking to you, anyway.

 

[tuxon86]

Well if you believe in Nvidia marketing then as well you can call it was "shoot down".

It was nice talking to you, anyway.

Thank you AMD PR guy!

 

[Larry-K]

There is very strong group of people on this forum who call themselves as Pros. They consider themselves as better than anyone else, and their needs are more important than others. They see Apple as a company that does not meet their needs and crap it all over the forum. They consider Mac Pro, not good enough, they consider FCPX as wedding and youtube content creating tool only.

And what is even funnier, they think that something is wrong with everybody who do not think the same way as they do. They believe they are right and everybody is wrong. They believe that everyone who thinks otherwise should go away from this board.

I am not the one to judge who is right or wrong. Nor is Apple. What I do believe is that Apple knows where they want to go. And that may disappoint very huge amount of people. And they do verbalize that disappointment.

But who cares about that?

Apparently you do, or you wouldn't bring it up.

The Old MacPro wasn't strictly a Final Cut Machine, it was a versatile workhorse, the nMP, not so much.

If you're gonna call it a "MacPro", based on prior models, and the expectations they engender, it should be more than an overpriced FCPX dongle. Not all of us want to edit video.

Everybody buys (or doesn't buy) these things with their own needs in mind. Some people feel strongly when a model they happily used to use, is castrated.

 

[koyoot]

Apparently you do, or you wouldn't bring it up.

The Old MacPro wasn't strictly a Final Cut Machine, it was a versatile workhorse, the nMP, not so much.

If you're gonna call it a "MacPro", based on prior models, and the expectations they engender, it should be more than an overpriced FCPX dongle. Not all of us want to edit video.

Everybody buys (or doesn't buy) these things with their own needs in mind. Some people feel strongly when a model they happily used to use, is castrated.

What if definition of workstation is shifting? What if future market of desktop computers will be 90% BGA? What if user replaceable parts will be reserved for custom PC's with workstation only parts?

What if all this is only way to mitigate increased production costs? What if Post-PC era means exactly that what I have written? What if Apple stalled development of their hardware with anticipation of this? What if future computing will be cloud based? Like we have discussed on previous pages? And by that it means: combining multiple computers into one big computational cluster? Balls are dropping with every day. Technology is becoming available. It is easy to find the clues.

But I know it is easier to complain than think: "what is the bloody reason, why Apple decided to do what they did". And start searching for answers.

 

[AidenShaw]

... What if future computing will be cloud based? Like we have discussed on previous pages? And by that it means: combining multiple computers into one big computational cluster? ...

Don't you think that if Apple's engineers were thinking along these lines, that they would have put a pair of 10 GbE Ethernet ports on the tube?

 

[koyoot]

Don't you think that if Apple's engineers were thinking along these lines, that they would have put a pair of 10 GbE Ethernet ports on the tube?

No. Because If you look at NVLink, and other Coherent Fabrics, and how they connect multiple devices, you will see that you can do similar thing with 4 Mac Pros.

Look at the picture on the right. Replace the GPUs with image of Mac Pro, and connect them with each other with Thunderbolt.

Thunderbolt or any other external connection will connect multiple computers. To add to that AI you will need also Wi-Fi connection.

About Coherent Fabric's, that can work regardlessly of architecture: http://www.ccixconsortium.com This has been shown 1 or 2 days ago.

For the first time in the industry, a single interconnect technology specification will ensure that processors using different instruction set architectures (ISA) can coherently share data with accelerators such as GPUs, FPGAs, Smart Network Accelerators, enabling efficient heterogeneous computing and significantly improving compute efficiency for servers running data center workloads.

What is funny in that regard is when you use internal Coherent Fabric in Mac Pro to connect GPUs internally with it, you can run the GPUs on slower PCIe buses. So that leaves more space for Thunderbolt in PCIe.

 

[hollyhillbilly]

Thunder Bridge,
thunderbolt over IP

 

[MacVidCards]

Not I am the one moving goal post, here.

Or maybe grasping at straws?

I can't decide.

By the chart you just posted, AMD never managed to catch up to last gen Nvidia cards. (Maxwell)

And here comes Pascal to Steam Roll over them.

With mild-mannered Polaris arriving sooner or later to bolster the "mediocre" sector.

And the best you've got is "Maybe it won't be as fast all the time"?

Look at that chart you posted. Notice where AMD is...pulling up the rear.

You're going to need to HIDE the goalposts.

 

[AidenShaw]

No. Because If you look at NVLink, and other Coherent Fabrics, and how they connect multiple devices, you will see that you can do similar thing with 4 Mac Pros.
Look at the picture on the right. Replace the GPUs with image of Mac Pro, and connect them with each other with Thunderbolt.

Thunderbolt or any other external connection will connect multiple computers. To add to that AI you will need also Wi-Fi connection.

Isn't IP over Thunderbolt limited to two computers? Also note the capital "B's" in your diagram.

About Coherent Fabric's, that can work regardlessly of architecture: http://www.ccixconsortium.com This has been shown 1 or 2 days ago.

"Shown"? It doesn't even get the dignity of calling it a paper launch.

"there are those who say that it will take until 2019 or 2020 for the first CCIX products to come to market"

http://www.nextplatform.com/2016/05/23/chip-upstarts-get-coherent-hybrid-compute

"It’s very early days for the CCIX. There’s a one-page website with no details even on board structure or bylaws. This is a natural first step. The CCIX consortium has promised to provide more information about their specification over the coming months. No timetable was given for technology access and product availability, but it is reasonable to expect that this could take years to develop, since it depends on the next generation of processors after those that are already in-flight–i.e., after POWER9, after AMD Zen and perhaps after ARM’s next generation. This implies that we probably won’t see fruit of this effort until 2019 or perhaps even 2020."

http://www.forbes.com/sites/moorins...ators-ccix-fantasy-or-nirvana/2/#500e487d3977

Thunder Bridge,
thunderbolt over IP

"Thunderbolt Bridge" is "IP over Thunderbolt".

 

[koyoot]

Lulz

Is this it? You cannot bring more to the table? Show me where am I wrong, or anything?

Why do People on this forum think that when I have to talk about AMD or Nvidia? Why do people think that when I write about Nvidia I think to compare it to AMD? Why do people think that when I wrote about AMD I compare it to Nvidia?

May I know answer for this?

Isn't IP over Thunderbolt limited to two computers?



"Shown"? It doesn't even get the dignity of calling it a paper launch.







"Thunderbolt Bridge" is "IP over Thunderbolt".

Yes, I know this, But I am talking about coherency beyond that. I do not believe TBB currently is capable of this.

Because we are not talking about only using two Mac. We are talking about: External GPUs as execution units, iPads as input devices, etc. Whole Apple ecosystem combined into one cloud. Both with wires, and wirelessly.

I agree, that it is huge paper launch. But this type of coherent fabric is I am sure already developed by Apple.

And what is even funnier this news, may be even more meaningful in the context of what we are talking than anyone thinks:
https://www.macrumors.com/2016/05/24/apple-siri-sdk-amazon-echo-competitor/

 

[hollyhillbilly]

Isn't IP over Thunderbolt limited to two computers?

No,

the Accusys shared storage can do 4 macs
and
the Symply shared storage can do up to 8 macs.

http://www.accusys.com.tw/T-Share/

https://gosymply.com/products/

 

[koyoot]

No,

the Accusys shared storage can do 4 macs
and
the Symply shared storage can do up to 8 macs.

http://www.accusys.com.tw/T-Share/

https://gosymply.com/products/

What about connecting computers directly? Not storage, not external expansion. Just computers. Is it the same way?

 

[AidenShaw]

the Accusys shared storage can do 4 macs

These have independent ports - probably each T-Bolt port connects to a PCIe controller and a PCIe storage controller.

Not IP, no communication between the host systems.

What about connecting computers directly? Not storage, not external expansion. Just computers. Is it the same way?

Doesn't look like it - it still looks like IP over T-Bolt is for two systems.

 

[hollyhillbilly]

These have independent ports - probably each T-Bolt port connects to a PCIe controller and a PCIe storage controller.

Not IP, no communication between the host systems.


Doesn't look like it - it still looks like IP over T-Bolt is for two systems.

I can not define for you technically how this works, I do know that the accusystem does allow for shared storage for multiple systems(4) with proprietary software that allows access to the storage, so systems can read and write media at constant speeds. This has only been possible with SAN/or other 10gb(TB to 10gbe) options before. These systems are new, and as far as I know only a few months old. I have put in place many 10 gbe over thunderbolt solutions for movies I have produced, the new products allow for more users strictly over TB at constant speeds.

 

[koyoot]

Interesting. I've dug deeper into the specs of TB, and what you are talking about. It looks like the only thing that not allows more than 2 computers(Mac's) to be connected through TB2 is... software, more than hardware.

But I could have not seen something. So feel free to correct this.

 

[hollyhillbilly]

Interesting. I've dug deeper into the specs of TB, and what you are talking about. It looks like the only thing that not allows more than 2 computers(Mac's) to be connected through TB2 is... software, more than hardware.

But I could have not seen something. So feel free to correct this.

Yes, that is my understanding too regarding software, and some people think it is something apple can implement in an update in OS X or part of FCPX.

Also, lumaforge has a shared storage of up to 14 users, however that is over 10gbe via TB and only for FCPX.
http://lumaforge.com/jellyfish/

I think the amazing thing about all of this is, as recent as 5-7 years ago you would have had to spend $50K for a heavy iron system.