(2019) 16" is HOT & NOISY with an external monitor! :(

[ThatOneAwkwardGuy]

The major issue is all about using an external monitor with an open lid.
In clamshell you could have solved the issue before the last update by changing the resolutions.
So unfortunately, with an open lid the GPU consumption is still 20W in the last version, at least for me.

I was getting throttled even in clamshell mode with multiple screen resolution changes .etc

 

[Nol Roos]

Thanks all for the information in this thread. My observations:

Setup

• Macbook Pro 16 inch
• Radeon 5500M 8GB
• Clamshell mode
• CalDigit Thunderbolt 3 dock, using 2 x Displayport out
• Other setup: 2 x cheap USB-C to mini-displayport out (same results)

Displays

• 2 x Dell P2715Q (27 inch 4K)

Resolution tests

• Both displays in 3008x1692 (HiDPi, 60hz) resolution, Radeon High Side draws ~ 7.5 Watt
• Both displays in 2560x1440 (HiDPi, 60hz) resolution, Radeon High Side draws ~ 19 Watt
• One display in 2560x1440 (HiDPi, 60hz) resolution the other one in 3008x1692 (HiDPi, 60hz) resolution, Radeon High Side draws ~ 7.5 Watt

When drawing ~19 Watt, the temperature of the Macbook rises and the fans start spinning easier. When drawing ~7.5 Watt, the temperature stays low and fans almost never start spinning.

 

[ght56]

Does anybody know how the 16" MacBooks work with a 27" 2K monitor (WQHD 2560x1440)?

Do they run hot, too?

I need to use the laptop screen in conjunction with one external screen (not clamshell).

If you are using it with the clamshell open, the 5300M/5500M models are still going to still draw the 20 watts and therefore it does result in an overall performance reduction, elevated baseline temperatures, and moderate CPU activity will result in more elevated temperatures and accompanying fan speed increases.

When external displays are involved and will be used for extended periods (e.g., the MBP will mostly be used as a desktop replacement), I am finding it increasingly hard to recommend the system without a 5600M GPU, as the lower operating temperatures it permits plus vastly superior performance has short-term usability benefits, and these lower temperatures may also have possible long-term longevity ones.

 

[BAT Guano]

This is a great response, thank you.
With regards to SwitchResX, couldn't you have used the native option in the display option in settings? It gives you access to adjust the resolution and Hz.

Thanks, a good thought, but my monitor options page only gave me the one option of 59.xx. SwitchResX allowed me to pick NTSC resolutions with 60 (and greater)Hz, which again were not available in the standard (or alt) command panel. All of the NTSC and 60hz + that I tried produced draw of around 4 watts.

 

[rioriojc]

Does anyone have a suggestion for a custom resolution that might help me lower the power draw and fan speed for my setup? I just registered the full version of SwitchResX. I'm using an ASUS PB278...using a display port to USB-C on the left side of the machine and the power on the right side of the machine...

I have the 5500M machine...

 

[jc_9]

• Both displays in 3008x1692 (HiDPi, 60hz) resolution, Radeon High Side draws ~ 7.5 Watt
• Both displays in 2560x1440 (HiDPi, 60hz) resolution, Radeon High Side draws ~ 19 Watt

Wait what? So by purely increasing the amount of work by the dGPU going from 1440p to 1692p, it consumes less that half power? This is probably a proof of a software bug in the drivers?

 

[thedocbwarren]

What if you set both to native 4k?

Wait what? So by purely increasing the amount of work by the dGPU going from 1440p to 1692p, it consumes less that half power? This is probably a proof of a software bug in the drivers?

 

[macbookfan21]

Hello friends- I have an interesting problem and I want someones opinion on it-

I had a higher end MBPro 16" i9/1TB/16GB/5500 model that I was using regularly on external monitor connected directly via USB-C cable. After 2 months of use, the USB-C ports on the left side of the MBPro that I was using the monitor cable connected to died out. They stopped recognizing the monitor, and stopped recognizing anything connected, including Apple charger.

I was able to replace that model with a new MBPro 16" (same specs as previous), and started using on monitor 2 days ago. After 1 day of monitor use, again the USB-C ports on the left side of the MBPro have died. They no longer recognize the monitor or anything else I plug into that side, but they recognize the Apple charger so the macbook pro can still accept charge.

Is it the monitor causing my problem? Is the USB-C somehow messing up the internal logic board usb-c bus by charging less or something?

Specifically, should I not use USB-C cable with it to connect to macbook pro now anymore? What's the alternative if someone can link me a better cable/dongle/product to connect to the monitor? Idk what to do anymore and this is very frustrating. Monitor I use is Samsung 43" CJ890 UltraWide display.

 

[Dumitru Erhan]

I tried many different things my setup (2019 16-inch i9 with 5500M), here's what mostly works for me with the lid open:

1. One monitor (Dell P2715Q) hooked to the CalDigits TS3+ via a USB-C-to-DisplayPort (TS3+ is connected via the TB3 cable to the right side of the computer).
2. Second monitor (LG 27UK850-W) hooked directly to the laptop with USB-C to USB-C on the left side of the laptop.
3. If I connect the LG monitor to the TS3+ instead there's a noticeable increase in the right thunderbolt proximity temperature and the fans go from 1800rpm to ~2300rpm.
4. In both cases, the radeon high side is ~18-20W. Both monitors run at the native/default 4K res. I was never able to get the radeon usage to be 5-10W, unless it's just one monitor in clamshell mode.
5. I have the Turbo Boost Switcher running in auto mode, which helps with fan noise when CPU usage is high.
6. My most demanding application is Google Meet: when I do those, the fans rev up to 2500-3000rpm which is quite acceptable.

If I have to summarize the things that made the most impact: Turbo Boost Switcher for (high-CPU usage situations) and having the monitors connected on both sides rather than one side only (for baseline web surfing stuff).

I'm actually quite happy that I found a good solution that works with the open lid because I enjoy the TrueTone adjustments on my external monitors and those work only with the open lid AFAICT.

 

[MikeALaGuitare]

Does anyone have a suggestion for a custom resolution that might help me lower the power draw and fan speed for my setup? I just registered the full version of SwitchResX. I'm using an ASUS PB278...using a display port to USB-C on the left side of the machine and the power on the right side of the machine...

I have the 5500M machine...

Hello,
have you tried a new configuration based on GTF profile in SwitchResX ?
It often solves the Radeon wattage issue in clamshell mode.
Sorry for the French version of SwitchResX, you can find in the thread some posts with English details if you search for GTF option.

 

[arobert3434]

The high power draw is caused by the memory clock going and staying at max. This can happen even with external only at "bad frequencies". What I haven't seen clarified is whether the frequency that matters is the refresh rate (e.g., 60Hz), the scanline rate (e.g., 2160x that), or the pixel clock (another, e.g., 3840x). But anyway the need for the clock going to max seems to come from needing to drive two displays at incompatible frequencies. Using dGPU with just the internal display, or just an external, does not (necessarily) cause 20-watt draw.

So that leads to the question, couldn't SwitchResX be used to tweak the external to a frequency that's "compatible" with the internal? Does anyone know which frequency needs to be "aligned" (refresh, line, or pixel)? A simple calculation should then show if it's possible (given the internal display's resolution being different from anything standard).

 

[TechViking]

My machine actually seems to be running a LOT cooler . . . I didn't even think to check pre/post 10.15.7 temperatures, but something between that and buying and setting up this:

KLIM Nova RGB Laptop Cooling Pad - New - Gaming Laptop Cooler with Phone Holder - Quiet Laptop Stand with Fan - Compatible up to 17"- Ventilador para Laptop - 5-Year Warranty - Mac PS5 PS4 Xbox One

Laptop cooling pad

smile.amazon.com

has my laptop running quietly and much cooler - the area above the touchbar used to be hot enough to cook an egg on, now it's fine to touch.

View attachment 963354

What software is that screenshot from? Thanks.

 

[GumaRodak]

Istat menus

 

[Vinamra07]

Hey everyone, not the right place for the post. But just to get a prompt reply. I have a MacBook Pro 16" Base model. At boot up from the apple icon till the login screen it takes 53 seconds. The most time it takes is when the bar is filled up 75%. Anyone facing the problem? I have tried resetting PRAM and NVRAM and my FileVault is off.

 

[Kung gu]

Hey everyone, not the right place for the post. But just to get a prompt reply. I have a MacBook Pro 16" Base model. At boot up from the apple icon till the login screen it takes 53 seconds. The most time it takes is when the bar is filled up 75%. Anyone facing the problem? I have tried resetting PRAM and NVRAM and my FileVault is off.

mine takes 26-30 seconds from boot up, I am on 10.15.7. base model and fire vault off.

 

[Vinamra07]

mine takes 26-30 seconds from boot up, I am on 10.15.7. base model and fire vault off.

Any idea what's causing the 23 second spike? It's been a month since this has been happening. I am also on 10.15.7

 

[RFI]

The high power draw is caused by the memory clock going and staying at max. This can happen even with external only at "bad frequencies". What I haven't seen clarified is whether the frequency that matters is the refresh rate (e.g., 60Hz), the scanline rate (e.g., 2160x that), or the pixel clock (another, e.g., 3840x). But anyway the need for the clock going to max seems to come from needing to drive two displays at incompatible frequencies. Using dGPU with just the internal display, or just an external, does not (necessarily) cause 20-watt draw.

So that leads to the question, couldn't SwitchResX be used to tweak the external to a frequency that's "compatible" with the internal? Does anyone know which frequency needs to be "aligned" (refresh, line, or pixel)? A simple calculation should then show if it's possible (given the internal display's resolution being different from anything standard).

It is strictly related to refresh rate of your monitor and reslution at the same time. I've been using 1440p LG 27 inch monitor and while 75Hz was fine, 60 hz resulted in increased power draw by dgpu (circa 19W). Oh and yesterday I've tried 1440p 34 ultrawide monitor that is 144hz and also had 19W power load from GPU. Only changing to 60Hz decreased power demand to around 5W.


My findings (lid closed):

4k and 27 at 60hz = 5W dgpu
38 inch ultrawide (110 ppi) at 60 hz = 5W dgpu
34 inch ultrawide (110 ppi) at 144 hz = 19W dgpu
34 inch ultrawide (110 ppi) at 60hz = 5W dgpu
1440p and 27 inch at 60hz = 19W dgpu
1440p and 27 inch at 75 hz = 5W dgpu
24 inch full HD at 60 hz = 5W dgpu

lid open and external monitor = 19W dgpu no matter what

 

[Kung gu]

Any idea what's causing the 23 second spike? It's been a month since this has been happening. I am also on 10.15.7

mmm idk. maybe take a backup and reinstall macOS if it bothering u.

 

[Essaux]

@Essaux

Just a reminder that in clamshell mode with an external monitor, using SwitchResX and changing to a different refresh frequency has helped a lot of users to get Radeon GPU idle wattage down to ~5 W.

Thanks for this tip!

 

[FilmIndustryGuy]

I noticed the new 32 inch LG Ultrafine Ergo doesn't heat the fans up when MacBook open and doesn't look that bad with resolution. Its acceptable with the Mac retina. People are buying the $700-750 version but I found another version of it on amazon for a better deal with a current discount at $577 today after $30 cloupon. the price moves around. The model is LG 32BN88U-B. Maybe its the office version of the display. the model number is slightly different but I couldnt tell the difference when looking at specs online. Also The manual in the box shows the other model number that everyone is buying. you're welcome

 

[Mr.Potato]

Hi All,

Sorry if it was already mentioned in the thread, maybe someone will find this useful.

MBP 16" base spec, i7 5300M
MacOS 10.15.7
Monitor Lenovo L24q-30
Clamshell mode
USB-C to DisplayPort cable, HDMI through an adapter

Default resolution for the monitor 1440p@60Hz - 17w dGPU power draw
1440p@75Hz - 17w
1080p@60Hz - 4w
Installed SwitchResX, copied resultion specs for active 1080p@60Hz, created custom resolution, pasted copied specs, adjusted res to 1440p, set refresh to 60Hz as form lowered it, saved, rebooted
custom 1440p@60Hz - 4w

Kinda does it for me, wasn't able to create 1440p@75Hz custom res with normal power draw yet, though.

 

[IceStormNG]

So... I did this modification with the thermal pads. But I also padded the TB3 controllers.

Not only did it fixed the VRM throttle which is heavily noticeable under high GPU and CPU load (e.g. Final Cut export), but it also reduced the fan noise for me.

I tried it for some hours now. Xcode (especially using its Interface Designer), AppCode, Discord and Safari are in use while listening to music. Before the mod, the fans would constantly sit at around 3k RPM and spike to full blast when compiling. Now the fans are sitting at 1800RPM and sometimes spike to 2200RPM and go back to idle after compile is done. Working in AppCode and Xcode (also Interface designer) doesn't trigger the fans.

This is open lid with one external 4K monitor in HiDPI mode after a few hours of usage.

Of course it doesn't fix the high power usage, but the fans are quiet now.

 

[petterihiisila]

So... I did this modification with the thermal pads. But I also padded the TB3 controllers.

View attachment 964018


Not only did it fixed the VRM throttle which is heavily noticeable under high GPU and CPU load (e.g. Final Cut export), but it also reduced the fan noise for me.

I tried it for some hours now. Xcode (especially using its Interface Designer), AppCode, Discord and Safari are in use while listening to music. Before the mod, the fans would constantly sit at around 3k RPM and spike to full blast when compiling. Now the fans are sitting at 1800RPM and sometimes spike to 2200RPM and go back to idle after compile is done. Working in AppCode and Xcode (also Interface designer) doesn't trigger the fans.

This is open lid with one external 4K monitor in HiDPI mode after a few hours of usage.


View attachment 964017

Of course it doesn't fix the high power usage, but the fans are quiet now.

Well that’s bold, considering that you were still within the 1 year warranty, were you? I don’t need this mod myself, since the eGPU fixes things for me, but good to know going forward. Thanks for sharing.

What’s your theory of why it works? Is it now conducting more energy from the components directly to the chassis, instead of through whatever air gap is between the components and the aluminum normally?

 

[IceStormNG]

I'm in Germany (and I also have Apple Care+). You can remove the pads without residue. So Apple won't know what I did if I don't tell them... and I won't.

It dissipates some of the heat through the bottom plate. The plate is out of aluminium. The VRMs definitely need cooling. they're naked and not in the airflow at all. They're cooled through ambient air in the case.

The TB3 chips are also not cooled but Air streams over them when the fans run loud. Sadly, apply put some sticker on them. Either to make the inside look nice or it's a heatshield. I haven't removed the sticker as that wouldn't be reversible anymore and would definitely void my warranty.

The other point is: Heat will of course collect under the MacBook now as there's really low clearance between the bottom plate and the desk, so my desk gets pretty toasty. If I move the MacBook a few centimeters to the side onto a cool spot, its temperatures drop by a few °C (especially the TB3 drops by 4-5°C in 1 minute). This means: A cooling stand (even without fans), or a vertical stand when using clamshell mode, would now increase cooling even more because the bottom plate acts as a giant heatsink for VRM and TB3 controllers.

 

[dwamk]

Was reading a lot theze days about the MBP 16 because I want to purchase one and then I found this thread so devastating as I always use a monitor to work on plus the laptop screen.

What would be your advice, wait on apples fix for this or just get one and try to play with monitor resolution and HZ to get normal power GPU usage?