4K/60Hz retina displays for new MBPs

[Foss]

I've just ordered the LG 27UD88-W. My decision was based off the fact for some reason this LG monitor provides USB 3.0 ports instead of USB 2.0 on the Ultrafine 4K. Also, I found a vendor that is selling it for basically $600 (all-in) as opposed to the $700 (+ tax) for the Ultrafine 4K. My current machine is the 2012 rMBP which supposedly should be able to display 4K@30, and I'll comment on this thread as soon as I get it in the mail. The real test will come once my pre-order 2016 15" MBP comes in though.

 

[JTToft]

My decision was based off the fact for some reason this LG monitor provides USB 3.0 ports instead of USB 2.0 on the Ultrafine 4K.

- While this is true, keep in mind those speeds will still go down to 2.0 if you drive the monitor through USB-C at 60 Hz. And that the monitor can't deliver more than 60 W to the Mac.

 

[laser71]

- the monitor can't deliver more than 60 W to the Mac.

Is that a problem?

 

[JTToft]

Is that a problem?

- For a 15", it could be. It will consume more than 60 W under certain circumstances, and its included charger is 87 W.

 

[Foss]

- While this is true, keep in mind those speeds will still go down to 2.0 if you drive the monitor through USB-C at 60 Hz. And that the monitor can't deliver more than 60 W to the Mac.

The lack of real world data is a bit irking, but I'm not too concerned. I can just use non-bandwidth intensive devices on those port if need be like a wireless receiver, etc. Ideally I was hoping to connect a USB 3.0 Hub to one of the monitor's USB ports, but it sounds like that may not work ideally. I'll report back with various tests once I actually have the monitor and the MBP.

 

[pshifrin]

I have a Dell p2415q 4k display plugged into a base 13 retina with a $20 USB-C to display port cable from Amazon (not a converter or adaptor, just a straight up cable) and it's working perfectly at 60hz.

 

[JTToft]

The lack of real world data is a bit irking, but I'm not too concerned. I can just use non-bandwidth intensive devices on those port if need be like a wireless receiver, etc. Ideally I was hoping to connect a USB 3.0 Hub to one of the monitor's USB ports, but it sounds like that may not work ideally. I'll report back with various tests once I actually have the monitor and the MBP.

- Please do.

 

[alexandero]

That previously mentioned Belkin Thunderbolt 3 Express Dock is being priced at $430 (!). So I'm now considering the Dell P2415Q with a USB-C to display port cable, if I can find a cheap dock that provides Ethernet and power pass through. And if that's not a viable solution, it'll have to be a USB-C hub with pass through and a USB-A port, where I can plug in my old USB-A to Ethernet adapter.

Update: I've found a $150 dock from CalDigit that provides HDMI 2.0 and DisplayPort 1.2, Ethernet and even charges the MBP with 60W. Looks like this is a viable solution for connecting the MBP with the Dell P2415Q at 4k/60Hz: http://www.caldigit.com/usb-3-1-usb-c-dock/#TechSpec

 

[fs454]

- Depends what you're looking for. Thunderbolt has full docking capabilities, plain USB-C has some, while traditional connections such as DisplayPort and HDMI have none. In order of preference, I would say, generally speaking:

Thunderbolt 3 > Thunderbolt 2 > USB-C > DisplayPort > HDMI

(With the USB-C caveat I mentioned above, which might make DisplayPort or HDMI preferable in some cases.)


- HDMI does support 4K 60 Hz. Just has to be HDMI 2.0 rather than 1.4. DisplayPort is preferable, though.

The Apple Thunderbolt adaptor can't be used for DisplayPort connections. And for charging, a monitor connection with Thunderbolt 3 or USB-C is required.

The best way to connect something like a P2415Q would be a direct USB-C to DisplayPort cable from Mac to monitor.

Hold up. The TB3 to TB2 adapter can't drive Mini Displayport monitors?

...Really?

 

[JTToft]

Hold up. The TB3 to TB2 adapter can't drive Mini Displayport monitors?

...Really?

- Really. It must be some technical limitation, because what few third party adaptors are available also can't.

Though the support document is both oddly specific and nonspecific, mentioning explicitly that Apple DisplayPort monitors are not supported, and that 4K DisplayPort monitors also aren't, but not that non-4K third party monitors aren't - though it should fall under "Displayport devices or accessories". It's just curious that they're singling out 4K displays and Apple displays.

The Thunderbolt 3 (USB-C) to Thunderbolt 2 Adapter doesn't support connections to these devices:

• Apple DisplayPort display
• DisplayPort devices or accessories, such as Mini DisplayPort to HDMI or Mini DisplayPort to VGA adapters
• 4K Mini DisplayPort displays that don’t have Thunderbolt

https://support.apple.com/en-ca/HT207266

 

[pshifrin]

That previously mentioned Belkin Thunderbolt 3 Express Dock is being priced at $430 (!). So I'm now considering the Dell P2415Q with a USB-C to display port cable, if I can find a cheap dock that provides Ethernet and power pass through. And if that's not a viable solution, it'll have to be a USB-C hub with pass through and a USB-A port, where I can plug in my old USB-A to Ethernet adapter.

Update: I've found a $150 dock from CalDigit that provides HDMI 2.0 and DisplayPort 1.2, Ethernet and even charges the MBP with 60W. Looks like this is a viable solution for connecting the MBP with the Dell P2415Q at 4k/60Hz: http://www.caldigit.com/usb-3-1-usb-c-dock/#TechSpec

This looks like a USB C dock and not a true thunderbolt dock, even though it says thunderbolt 3 compatible, it's a bit misleading. I don't think there is enough available bandwidth across the computer to dock interface to run everything at full speed with 4K @ 60

 

[psymac]

I've just ordered the LG 27UD88-W. My decision was based off the fact for some reason this LG monitor provides USB 3.0 ports instead of USB 2.0 on the Ultrafine 4K. Also, I found a vendor that is selling it for basically $600 (all-in) as opposed to the $700 (+ tax) for the Ultrafine 4K. My current machine is the 2012 rMBP which supposedly should be able to display 4K@30, and I'll comment on this thread as soon as I get it in the mail. The real test will come once my pre-order 2016 15" MBP comes in though.

Interested in this monitor myself, can you tell us the vendor?

 

[maratus]

You're defending their choice to go with USB 2.0?

lol, he's not defending, he explained why it couldn't be USB 3.0

 

[cerberusss]

- For a 15", it could be. It will consume more than 60 W under certain circumstances, and its included charger is 87 W.

You posted some useful info, great stuff.

It's my guess that 60W is only going to be a limit when you are the type of user that really tortures his MacBook such that the fan is whining at full speeds for an hour or more. And even then, the MBP can dip into the battery.

 

[JTToft]

lol, he's not defending, he explained why it couldn't be USB 3.0

- His explanation isn't entirely accurate, though, for the reasons I mentioned.

It's my guess that 60W is only going to be a limit when you are the type of user that really tortures his MacBook such that the fan is whining at full speeds for an hour or more. And even then, the MBP can dip into the battery.

- This is correct. I frequently plug into MagSafe 60 W adaptors on my 15", and it's no problem under light use.
But you do run into a situation where it's possible to drain your battery even if you have power plugged in, which really isn't optimal.

 

[Kimcha]

I have a Dell p2415q 4k display plugged into a base 13 retina with a $20 USB-C to display port cable from Amazon (not a converter or adaptor, just a straight up cable) and it's working perfectly at 60hz.

Do you charge it using the other port? Have you seen any adapters that output display port 1.2 AND allow pass thorough charging?

 

[maratus]

- His explanation isn't entirely accurate, though, for the reasons I mentioned.

Yeah I know, but this is just a wrong forum to start explaining what a serial bus is and how much bandwidth does 4K at 60 Hz require

 

[Foss]

Interested in this monitor myself, can you tell us the vendor?

Videoandaudiocenter.com has the best price in the US that I've found. The stores with better prices are all backordered. I'm guessing this model is discontinued and succeeded by the Ultrafine 4K. I've ordered one and would ideally like two; however I want to try one out before committing to the second. They are some locally owned electronics chain and haven't shipped my order that I placed yesterday. Guess I've been so spoiled by shops like Amazon that usually you see shipment within 24 hours.
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Looks like this is a viable solution for connecting the MBP with the Dell P2415Q at 4k/60Hz: http://www.caldigit.com/usb-3-1-usb-c-dock/#TechSpec

There was another thread where they confirmed the caldigit dock only outputs 4K@30. All the docks with 4K@60 are few and far between currently and looking pretty pricey.

 

[alexandero]

There was another thread where they confirmed the caldigit dock only outputs 4K@30. All the docks with 4K@60 are few and far between currently and looking pretty pricey.

Think you could find that post? Would be interesting to see if HDMI or DP was used, if it really was a new MBP, and if the poster requested the "special firmware" from CalDigit to support 4K/60Hz (unsure about the latter, their tech specs only mention it required when connecting to a Windows computer).

 

[Foss]

Think you could find that post? Would be interesting to see if HDMI or DP was used, if it really was a new MBP, and if the poster requested the "special firmware" from CalDigit to support 4K/60Hz (unsure about the latter, their tech specs only mention it required when connecting to a Windows computer).

Ah you are correct, there was some mention of a firmware that could enable 4K@60. IMO, I wouldn't buy this without a user confirmation that this will work. I HATE having to return stuff.

 

[inhalexhale1]

lol, he's not defending, he explained why it couldn't be USB 3.0

Right, the technology just isn't there

 

[alexandero]

Ah you are correct, there was some mention of a firmware that could enable 4K@60. IMO, I wouldn't buy this without a user confirmation that this will work. I HATE having to return stuff.

True. And what I'm also worried about is the reliability of the built in charger (in any dock), and how high the possibility is of it damaging the MBP. I doubt even AppleCare would cover that.

 

[pshifrin]

Do you charge it using the other port? Have you seen any adapters that output display port 1.2 AND allow pass thorough charging?

I'm using a USB-C dock from OWC on port 1 which is doing charging, ethernet, usb, sd card etc. Port 2 is the USB-C to display port cable since the OWC dock only has HDMI and therefore, no 4k @ 60.

 

[psymac]

Think you could find that post? Would be interesting to see if HDMI or DP was used, if it really was a new MBP, and if the poster requested the "special firmware" from CalDigit to support 4K/60Hz (unsure about the latter, their tech specs only mention it required when connecting to a Windows computer).

Just look under my username, that was my post. And Cal digit did confirm later they will upgrade DP to 4K at 60 Hz with a firmware update to their dock.
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Videoandaudiocenter.com has the best price in the US that I've found. The stores with better prices are all backordered. I'm guessing this model is discontinued and succeeded by the Ultrafine 4K. I've ordered one and would ideally like two; however I want to try one out before committing to the second. They are some locally owned electronics chain and haven't shipped my order that I placed yesterday. Guess I've been so spoiled by shops like Amazon that usually you see shipment within 24 hours.
[doublepost=1478095172][/doublepost]

There was another thread where they confirmed the caldigit dock only outputs 4K@30. All the docks with 4K@60 are few and far between currently and looking pretty price

Thanks, I did see that price and I thought that was really great. However, I looked at the reviews on Google and others, seems to be pretty bad and they're selling defective stuff or slow shipping. Let us know how your order turns out,hopefully you've talk to them on the phone and got some reassurance about the order.

 

[Foss]

Thanks, I did see that price and I thought that was really great. However, I looked at the reviews on Google and others, seems to be pretty bad and they're selling defective stuff or slow shipping. Let us know how your order turns out,hopefully you've talk to them on the phone and got some reassurance about the order.

I did see the reviews on that shop. Overall, there were a lot of five star reviews though. I figure it's worth a small gamble to save $150-$200. If they become a headache, you gotta love AMEX buyer protection benefits.