8GB RAM in M3 MacBook Pro Proves the Bottleneck in Real-World Tests

[Kal Madda]

You can’t compare to Intel. Those are so terrible inefficient, they don’t compare at all. The real change was the M chips. RAM management is better, but it does still throttle a lot with several tasks going. You may be able to do what you said as your example, but things have gone into cache and it you really tried to push it with anything you would notice throttle. So while it works for you, that doesn’t mean there is lots of limitations to it.

I can compare to Intel since that’s what we were getting before the M1 for the same price point. The M1 and Apple Silicon made a big difference in performance, especially on the 8GB configurations. They offered much better value than the previous Intel-powered base-spec models. There wasn’t really much reason to up base RAM configuration when performance felt nearly doubled, and the value was already so much better.

So running two graphic design apps with dozens of files open, Blender with a 3D model open, Safari with 19 tabs open, plus several other apps isn’t pushing it with anything? Even with all of those things running simultaneously, I didn’t notice any noticeable slowdown. I posted screenshots earlier in this thread to demonstrate. No beachball cursor even. It just kept on zipping. Heck, I’ve even run some Windows games in emulation with an app called Whiskey. Those extreme edge cases aren’t “pushing the hardware”? I don’t think most average base spec users would even try to do any of those things on a base spec model. Heck, that’s not even the way that I normally do my work. I don’t use Blender plus two graphic design apps at the same time usually. Even if we assume that all of those apps running simultaneously were the “upper limit” (I’m sure you could probably add some more since I wasn’t noticing slowdown at that point), that’s a much more taxing use case than what most would expect out of a base-spec model…

 

[kirbysmartsdawg]

I can compare to Intel since that’s what we were getting before the M1 for the same price point. The M1 and Apple Silicon made a big difference in performance, especially on the 8GB configurations. They offered much better value than the previous Intel-powered base-spec models. There wasn’t really much reason to up base RAM configuration when performance felt nearly doubled, and the value was already so much better.

So running two graphic design apps with dozens of files open, Blender with a 3D model open, Safari with 19 tabs open, plus several other apps isn’t pushing it with anything? Even with all of those things running simultaneously, I didn’t notice any noticeable slowdown. I posted screenshots earlier in this thread to demonstrate. No beachball cursor even. It just kept on zipping. Heck, I’ve even run some Windows games in emulation with an app called Whiskey. Those extreme edge cases aren’t “pushing the hardware”? I don’t think most average base spec users would even try to do any of those things on a base spec model. Heck, that’s not even the way that I normally do my work. I don’t use Blender plus two graphic design apps at the same time usually. Even if we assume that all of those apps running simultaneously were the “upper limit” (I’m sure you could probably add some more since I wasn’t noticing slowdown at that point), that’s a much more taxing use case than what most would expect out of a base-spec model…

Watch MKBHD’s video on the M1 and M2 with 8GB. It can perform, but it’s not exactly running like the 16GB or higher would. There is some throttling, caching, and putting some apps in chard memory that are going to have to refreshed when open. I bet not every single one of those safari tabs stay open and don’t refresh when you open them back up. There is no possible way it could manage all that with 8GB of RAM. If that works for you, fine have fun. But if Apple are going to charge the price they are, 16GB is more than fair for the base model.

 

[Velli]

Your argument makes zero sense. They made the 16GB the base and it’s priced at the same price as the 8GB. So how can anyone be mad or argue against that. More less is always better.

Exactly noone is mad or argued against that. You are totally making that up. It’s great that one now gets 16GB instead of 8.

I understand you say you don’t care what people think about your purchase. But it’s clear because you bought the lowest base spec at 8GB of RAM you feel the need to defend that. Other wise you have zero reason to disagree.

Not true. The reason to disagree is that you are wrong. The reason people with 8GB Macs are the ones disagreeing with you is that we are the ones who know you are wrong, because we are the ones who know what it’s like to use one, with our use cases. You don’t.

 

[Kal Madda]

Watch MKBHD’s video on the M1 and M2 with 8GB. It can perform, but it’s not exactly running like the 16GB or higher would. There is some throttling, caching, and putting some apps in chard memory that are going to have to refreshed when open. I bet not every single one of those safari tabs stay open and don’t refresh when you open them back up. There is no possible way it could manage all that with 8GB of RAM. If that works for you, fine have fun. But if Apple are going to charge the price they are, 16GB is more than fair for the base model.

You keep citing one video, the problem with the “comparisons” these content creators make though is that they don’t actually reflect an average use-case. You’re average person isn’t using Lightroom, isn’t editing 8K videos for their channel, etc. So it’s no surprise when a content creator finds base-spec configurations to not suit their heavy niche 8K video editing workflow… I can’t find the video you’re talking about, but I actually have real experience using and owning an 8GB Mac, and I have owned and used 16GB Intel Macs and used 16GB Apple Silicon Macs. So I actually have first-hand experience, why would I care about a video from someone who has such a heavy use-case they would never actually use a base-spec for their workflow anyways? I have actually proven that an 8GB base spec model can power a workflow much more taxing than the average user would ever even imagine. An average user wouldn’t be running two graphic design apps simultaneously with dozens of files open plus Blender, plus Safari with 19 web tabs, plus several other apps. I don’t even normally use that many heavy apps at once… If the 8GB Mac can power that kind of use, as I have proven, then it should definitely be able to meet the needs of the average user who wants to surf the web, check mail, stream movies, etc…

PS. The oldest Safari tab I had open when I was running that test had been binned, but it loaded right up when I selected it. I went through there clicking tabs, and they opened very quickly. Just because you don’t think an 8GB model can manage that much doesn’t mean it can’t. Apple Silicon is far more efficient, and there’s notable differences in RAM management between Apple Silicon Macs and Intel Macs. Apple Silicon Macs can run things much more efficiently with memory swap and the kinds of memory management magic that iOS has done for many years.

 

[Velli]

That’s just it. My whole premise is that Apple should have updated the base spec back on the M1. When they went to their own chips, they should have updated.

This makes no sense. M1 is more RAM efficient, and an 8GB M1 was a HUGE upgrade from an 8GB Intel that was before it. If that is your baseline performance for the base Mac, they should have updated several years before, not at the transition. Perhaps you can argue that they should have updated when the M3 was launched, since that was a kind of weird CPU step, so a RAM bump could have alleviated that. But the M1 launch is a totally illogical point in time to point out.

 

[Kal Madda]

Exactly noone is mad or argued against that. You are totally making that up. It’s great that one now gets 16GB instead of 8.

Not true. The reason to disagree is that you are wrong. The reason people with 8GB Macs are the ones disagreeing with you is that we are the ones who know you are wrong, because we are the ones who know what it’s like to use one, with our use cases. You don’t.

Exactly, I’m so beyond tired of the “you just feel the need to defend your purchase” argument. I could give a rats rear-end about what this random dude on the internet thinks about my computer purchase… I’m merely pushing back on his false claims. Apparently his information about 8GB Apple Silicon Macs come from a YouTuber called MKBHD… Mine come from actual experience from owning and using an 8GB M1 Mac and having used 16GB Intel Macs, as well as 16GB M-Series Macs…

 

[Velli]

Watch MKBHD’s video on the M1 and M2 with 8GB. It can perform, but it’s not exactly running like the 16GB or higher would.

Who here has argued that it would? OF COURSE a 16GB is faster than an 8GB. That’s not the question.

There is some throttling, caching, and putting some apps in chard memory that are going to have to refreshed when open. I bet not every single one of those safari tabs stay open and don’t refresh when you open them back up. There is no possible way it could manage all that with 8GB of RAM. If that works for you, fine have fun.

Thanks, that’s exactly what we are doing.

But if Apple are going to charge the price they are, 16GB is more than fair for the base model.

Oh, so it WAS about the price after all??

 

[Velli]

Watch MKBHD’s video on the M1 and M2 with 8GB. It can perform, but it’s not exactly running like the 16GB or higher would. There is some throttling, caching, and putting some apps in chard memory that are going to have to refreshed when open. I bet not every single one of those safari tabs stay open and don’t refresh when you open them back up. There is no possible way it could manage all that with 8GB of RAM. If that works for you, fine have fun. But if Apple are going to charge the price they are, 16GB is more than fair for the base model.

Don’t know if I’m watching the right MKBHD video, but in the one I found he says, direct quote (about base M1 Air):”It was the most universally recommended computer for like two years straight…this computer is great at this price…go for it”. He then goes on to talk about how M2 has poor SSD in the base spec and you need to uograde to 512, but says MAYBE upgrade the RAM, then goes on to say that the 8GB M1 (which was still in the lineup at that point) was still a good buy. Direct quote: “Pretty good computer for the price still”.

So if we want to use MKBHD as a credible source, he supported our argument that at the time an 8GB AS Mac was a good buy.

EDIT: In another video from March 20 2024, he outright recommends 8GB M1 or M2 over a 16GB M3 “for light users”. Case closed.

 

[Abazigal]

Exactly! I couldn’t have said it any better. Much of the arguments against the existence of an 8GB configuration reek of elitism and snobbishness. What about the people who need 32GB configurations? Should the 16GB options not exist at all because it isn’t sufficient for them?

I am not going there.

I just wish the people clamouring for 16gb ram as the default for Macs to be honest that this was, and always has been, about them (and them) alone. Their reticence to spend more on additional ram is just that. That it may incidentally benefit every other Mac user is incidental.

 

[kirbysmartsdawg]

You keep citing one video, the problem with the “comparisons” these content creators make though is that they don’t actually reflect an average use-case. You’re average person isn’t using Lightroom, isn’t editing 8K videos for their channel, etc. So it’s no surprise when a content creator finds base-spec configurations to not suit their heavy niche 8K video editing workflow… I can’t find the video you’re talking about, but I actually have real experience using and owning an 8GB Mac, and I have owned and used 16GB Intel Macs and used 16GB Apple Silicon Macs. So I actually have first-hand experience, why would I care about a video from someone who has such a heavy use-case they would never actually use a base-spec for their workflow anyways? I have actually proven that an 8GB base spec model can power a workflow much more taxing than the average user would ever even imagine. An average user wouldn’t be running two graphic design apps simultaneously with dozens of files open plus Blender, plus Safari with 19 web tabs, plus several other apps. I don’t even normally use that many heavy apps at once… If the 8GB Mac can power that kind of use, as I have proven, then it should definitely be able to meet the needs of the average user who wants to surf the web, check mail, stream movies, etc…

PS. The oldest Safari tab I had open when I was running that test had been binned, but it loaded right up when I selected it. I went through there clicking tabs, and they opened very quickly. Just because you don’t think an 8GB model can manage that much doesn’t mean it can’t. Apple Silicon is far more efficient, and there’s notable differences in RAM management between Apple Silicon Macs and Intel Macs. Apple Silicon Macs can run things much more efficiently with memory swap and the kinds of memory management magic that iOS has done for many years.

Yeah I am not going to believe some rando from the internet with no credibility. I will listen more to a very accomplished and well respected tech YTer who knows far more about computers. Unless I missed it (not going back through the pages of none sense here), you show nothing about what your FPS were with this more extreme workflow. I imagine Blender is rather low.

Funny enough I have experience with both the base spec and mine now currently M3 Max, and for basic business workflow with a excel spreadsheet, outlook, 10-12 chrome tabs open, 3 safari tabs open, Quickbooks, and Word open, the spreadsheet starts choking up on the base 8GB M1 and drops frames and has noticeable lag. I don’t see that as an extreme workflow and rather average. My actual workflow is much more intense and the M1 can’t touch it. The M3 Max with 48GB of ram on the other hand has zero problems. My employee that has a 16GB M3 has no issues with said basic workflow.

 

[Kal Madda]

Yeah I am not going to believe some rando from the internet with no credibility. I will listen more to a very accomplished and well respected tech YTer who knows far more about computers. Unless I missed it (not going back through the pages of none sense here), you show nothing about what your FPS were with this more extreme workflow. I imagine Blender is rather low.

Funny enough I have experience with both the base spec and mine now currently M3 Max, and for basic business workflow with a excel spreadsheet, outlook, 10-12 chrome tabs open, 3 safari tabs open, Quickbooks, and Word open, the spreadsheet starts choking up on the base 8GB M1 and drops frames and has noticeable lag. I don’t see that as an extreme workflow and rather average. My actual workflow is much more intense and the M1 can’t touch it. The M3 Max with 48GB of ram on the other hand has zero problems. My employee that has a 16GB M3 has no issues with said basic workflow.

And said YouTuber agreed with me and my side of the argument and said that the 8GB Apple Silicon base spec models were a great value. I haven’t been able to find a single video where he says otherwise. So the guy you cite as “very accomplished and well respected tech YTer who knows far more about computers” agrees with me it seems, not you…

Your workflow doesn’t sound average at all. The average user likely doesn’t know how to use Excel, let alone use Excel, QuickBooks, etc. And Chrome is far more RAM hungry than Safari is. The workflow you described is far from an “average” use case that the vast majority of people would be looking to do. And even then, the only way I can see that slowing down an 8GB M1 Mac is Chrome hoarding RAM, which is a problem that can be easily remedied by using Safari. Unless you have a massive spreadsheet in Excel. Most average people are interested in things like streaming movies, surfing the web, checking email, scrolling through photos, and playing light games like Stardew Valley. The 8GB base spec is more than enough for that.

If you’re interested, my Mac is connected to a 4K monitor. I never noticed any kind of resolution drop or any visual quality issues when I was stress testing it with all of those apps…

 

[kirbysmartsdawg]

And said YouTuber agreed with me and my side of the argument and said that the 8GB Apple Silicon base spec models were a great value. I haven’t been able to find a single video where he says otherwise. So the guy you cite as “very accomplished and well respected tech YTer who knows far more about computers” agrees with me it seems, not you…

Your workflow doesn’t sound average at all. The average user likely doesn’t know how to use Excel, let alone use Excel, QuickBooks, etc. And Chrome is far more RAM hungry than Safari is. The workflow you described is far from an “average” use case that the vast majority of people would be looking to do. And even then, the only way I can see that slowing down an 8GB M1 Mac is Chrome hoarding RAM, which is a problem that can be easily remedied by using Safari. Unless you have a massive spreadsheet in Excel. Most average people are interested in things like streaming movies, surfing the web, checking email, scrolling through photos, and playing light games like Stardew Valley. The 8GB base spec is more than enough for that.

If you’re interested, my Mac is connected to a 4K monitor. I never noticed any kind of resolution drop or any visual quality issues when I was stress testing it with all of those apps…

You surely didn’t look hard enough. Try this at minute 9.

So basically you are describing a person that needs an iPad, not a Mac. The workflow I described is really not that extreme. Let’s take a student in college (perfect example of a basic user). All these tasks are completely normal for said college student. Also chrome may be more RAM heavy, but in lots of cases that’s users choice, for our business chrome is necessary.

 

[Velli]

You surely didn’t look hard enough. Try this at minute 9.

So basically you are describing a person that needs an iPad, not a Mac. The workflow I described is really not that extreme. Let’s take a student in college (perfect example of a basic user). All these tasks are completely normal for said college student. Also chrome may be more RAM heavy, but in lots of cases that’s users choice, for our business chrome is necessary.

Dude. At minute 10 in that video he literally calls an 8GB M1 “still a great laptop”. You’re seriously painting yourself into a corner here.

Edit: Also, the result of your iPad argument here is that if a person is such a light user that 8GB is enough, and wants a 13” screen and a physical keyboard, he should spend MORE money to get an iPad instead of a Macbook Air. I don’t think you have a clue what the use case for a base Macbook Air is.

 

[kirbysmartsdawg]

Dude. At minute 10 in that video he literally calls an 8GB M1 “still a great laptop”. You’re seriously painting yourself into a corner here.

Edit: Also, the result of your iPad argument here is that if a person is such a light user that 8GB is enough, and wants a 13” screen and a physical keyboard, he should spend MORE money to get an iPad instead of a Macbook Air. I don’t think you have a clue what the use case for a base Macbook Air is.

Hahaha I never once said he didn’t like it. I simply have said that he brings up the issues with 8GB of ram and now I remember the bad SSD. Seriously stop. I still stand by what I said.

What??? You can get a basic iPad for $349, or if you want to get fancy and get an Air it’s $799. At least $200 less than the base Air. I never said anything about needing a keyboard and mouse. The workflow (can’t really call it a workflow) that Kal described would not require a mouse and keyboard at all. Absolutely ridiculous. Talk about backing yourself into a corner. I am not even sure your argument. Originally you brought up price, which is the worst argument because Apple put 16GB in the base for the same price as 8GB. You just make up things up and sound silly.

 

[Kal Madda]

You surely didn’t look hard enough. Try this at minute 9.

So basically you are describing a person that needs an iPad, not a Mac. The workflow I described is really not that extreme. Let’s take a student in college (perfect example of a basic user). All these tasks are completely normal for said college student. Also chrome may be more RAM heavy, but in lots of cases that’s users choice, for our business chrome is necessary.

I did, and I shouldn’t have had to look for the video in the first place since you were the one citing it repeatedly. You should have provided a link. And the same guy said repeatedly (including in that video), that the 8GB base spec is a good option. You’re just taking the bits and pieces you like that you want to hear, and ignoring all the parts where he agrees with me that the 8GB model is a good computer…

What if the person wants a Mac rather than an iPad for the bigger screen, trackpad, built-in keyboard, etc? Many people just prefer the form-factor of a Mac. Many people prefer typing on a physical keyboard, not an on-screen keyboard. So they would either want a MacBook, or would have to buy an iPad with a keyboard case that wouldn’t balance the same on the lap and such… There aren’t as many ports on an iPad for accessories, the screen is smaller, no built-in keyboard and trackpad, the speakers aren’t as good on lower end iPads, and most importantly, some people just don’t want to use iPadOS. Some people prefer macOS. There are plenty of good reasons why many average people may want a MacBook over an iPad. That “you just need this device” mentality comes off as pretty snobbish. People have personal preferences, and many prefer the Mac for a number of reasons, even if they don’t have super heavy workflows or needs…

Yeah, never seen a college student using QuickBooks for managing a business… But interesting you think that’s an “average” use-case… And as I said before, I doubt that the 8GB M1 Mac slows down for that, unless you have a massive excel sheet open, or QuickBooks is hoarding tons of resources. If you want, sometime when I get time I’ll even replicate that setup minus QuickBooks (I don’t have that app) on my Mac to see how it runs…

The thing is, it’s like you’re grasping at straws to say the former base spec models were a bad value, when even the YouTuber you reference clearly doesn’t seem to agree with that assessment. The 8GB base spec Apple Silicon Macs were a far better value than the previous base spec Intel Macs…

 

[kirbysmartsdawg]

I did, and I shouldn’t have had to look for the video in the first place since you were the one citing it repeatedly. You should have provided a link. And the same guy said repeatedly (including in that video), that the 8GB base spec is a good option. You’re just taking the bits and pieces you like that you want to hear, and ignoring all the parts where he agrees with me that the 8GB model is a good computer…

What if the person wants a Mac rather than an iPad for the bigger screen, trackpad, built-in keyboard, etc? Many people just prefer the form-factor of a Mac. Many people prefer typing on a physical keyboard, not an on-screen keyboard. So they would either want a MacBook, or would have to buy an iPad with a keyboard case that wouldn’t balance the same on the lap and such… There aren’t as many ports on an iPad for accessories, the screen is smaller, no built-in keyboard and trackpad, the speakers aren’t as good on lower end iPads, and most importantly, some people just don’t want to use iPadOS. Some people prefer macOS. There are plenty of good reasons why many average people may want a MacBook over an iPad. That “you just need this device” mentality comes off as pretty snobbish. People have personal preferences, and many prefer the Mac…

Yeah, never seen a college student using QuickBooks for managing a business… But interesting you think that’s an “average” use-case… And as I said before, I doubt that the 8GB M1 Mac slows down for that, unless you have a massive excel sheet open, or QuickBooks is hoarding tons of resources. If you want, sometime when I get time I’ll even replicate that setup minus QuickBooks (I don’t have that app) on my Mac to see how it runs…

The thing is, it’s like you’re grasping at straws to say the former base spec models were a bad value, when even the YouTuber you reference clearly doesn’t seem to agree with that assessment. The 8GB base spec Apple Silicon Macs were a far better value than the previous base spec Intel Macs…

It’s clear you and the few people defending the 8GB of ram are only doing so because that is what you own.

You really change my words every single time. I am finished. I have no idea why I bother with you. I quite an entire thread because of you. Think what you will about 8GB of ram, but stop changing my words and saying things I didn’t say. I am not bothering responding to any of your claims because they aren’t what I said. Prime example being Quickbooks for college student. Didn’t say that at all. Bye now.

 

[Kal Madda]

Hahaha I never once said he didn’t like it. I simply have said that he brings up the issues with 8GB of ram and now I remember the bad SSD. Seriously stop. I still stand by what I said.

What??? You can get a basic iPad for $349, or if you want to get fancy and get an Air it’s $799. At least $200 less than the base Air. I never said anything about needing a keyboard and mouse. The workflow (can’t really call it a workflow) that Kal described would not require a mouse and keyboard at all. Absolutely ridiculous. Talk about backing yourself into a corner. I am not even sure your argument. Originally you brought up price, which is the worst argument because Apple put 16GB in the base for the same price as 8GB. You just make up things up and sound silly.

You literally argued the 8GB models shouldn’t have existed, then cite a YouTuber to support your argument, even though said YouTuber clearly doesn’t agree with your assessment those specs shouldn’t have existed, repeatedly praising the 8GB base spec model, in multiple videos even… You are, indeed, painting yourself into a corner…

What? So drafting an email is so much easier to do finger typing on a big screen keyboard. 😂 Got it… I mean, come on, just because you think it “doesn’t require a keyboard” doesn’t mean that people don’t want or prefer one… Why do you think many people end up buying a separate keyboard to use with their iPad? Secondly, by the time you get an iPad with a 13” display (still a bit smaller than Mac displays), you’re paying around Mac prices, and definitely higher than prior-gen base MacBook Airs that can be found refurbished or are still sold new at several stores at a hefty discount… For some people, the iPad is the better option. I love the iPad. But for others, they prefer a traditional laptop form-factor, and the iPad wouldn’t be a good fit…

The average college student isn’t using huge Excel sheets and QuickBooks to manage a business. They’re writing papers, surfing the web to research for said papers, streaming some movies on off-time, checking email, etc. I’ve never heard of owning QuickBooks as being a requirement to do college…

 

[Kal Madda]

It’s clear you and the few people defending the 8GB of ram are only doing so because that is what you own.

You really change my words every single time. I am finished. I have no idea why I bother with you. I quite an entire thread because of you. Think what you will about 8GB of ram, but stop changing my words and saying things I didn’t say. I am not bothering responding to any of your claims because they aren’t what I said. Prime example being Quickbooks for college student. Didn’t say that at all. Bye now.

You said: “Let’s take a student in college (perfect example of a basic user). All these tasks are completely normal for said college student.”

You also said this: “I don’t see that as an extreme workflow and rather average.” (in reference to your QuickBooks, Excel, etc. business management workflow)

All these tasks are the tasks you just got done describing: QuickBooks, Excel, etc. that you do. You said that you see that workflow as average, and said it was a “completely normal” workflow for a college student. So yes, you did, in fact, argue your workflow (which includes QuickBooks) is average and is completely normal for a college student, something that is clearly not the case… No changing of words here… You said these things.

And again, I don’t care what you or anyone else here thinks about my computer purchase. I am beyond tired of that rehashed and useless argument. I don’t push back against your incorrect claims because I own a certain computer, I push back because your claims are incorrect. By that “logic”, I could say “the only reason you don’t think the 8GB base spec is good is because you own a bigger spec”. Come on, that isn’t even an argument. It has no basis in logic and does nothing to support your argument or claims…

PS, I “made” you leave a thread? What was that the iOS 18 Speculation Thread where I simply said “we might get a beta today!” and then you angry reacted at it?

 

[Kal Madda]

Two word documents, 14 tabs open in Google Chrome, Excel sample spreadsheet, Safari with 3 tabs with a video playing on Apple website, Outlook, Finder, and Activity Monitor. Oh, and a background app I run on my Mac that was using over 1GB of RAM at the time… And it’s all running smoothly, with green memory pressure…

 

[Bento.Box]

What kind of a crap argument is that? It’s not even a logical argument. More elitism. If someone doesn’t need the same higher specs you do, just tell them to stick with a computer from the 2010s. Got it… 🤦🏼‍♂️🙄

Not sure what you mean.

If your requirements are satisfied by a computer you most likely already own for plenty of years or you can get second hand for cheap, why buy a new one?

I also don't need "higher specs". I'm perfectly good with the 32GB in my laptop with integrated GPU that I bought last year. Cost half of what the last company MBP did. First time I bought a private laptop in ages.
Also not sure what you mean by "elitism". PCs are a commodity now. Have been for decades.

 

[Kal Madda]

Not sure what you mean.

If your requirements are satisfied by a computer you most likely already own for plenty of years or you can get second hand for cheap, why buy a new one?

I also don't need "higher specs". I'm perfectly good with the 32GB in my laptop with integrated GPU that I bought last year. Cost half of what the last company MBP did. First time I bought a private laptop in ages.
Also not sure what you mean by "elitism". PCs are a commodity now. Have been for decades.

My requirements are not met by 2010 Macs, and the 8GB M1 Mac I have is far more capable than Macs that old…

Elitism as in telling me what products I need or don’t… It comes off as very snobbish to tell someone to use computers from 2010 because they’re happily using a modern base-spec computer from about 4 years ago…

 

[Bento.Box]

My requirements are not met by 2010 Macs, and the 8GB M1 Mac I have is far more capable than Macs that old…

Elitism as in telling me what products I need or don’t… It comes off as very snobbish to tell someone to use computers from 2010 because they’re happily using a modern base-spec computer from about 4 years ago…

But then you have very niche requirements.
If you need power, you want to have a proper RAM outfit.
If you don't, then CPU is typically not the limiting factor. And storage is expandable.

E.g. my 2008 PC would still be viable for just a bit of surfing and stuff and it already came with 8GB RAM and a 4-core CPU (more than enough). You could still even play a few games in 1080p.

As I said, I also have cases where 8GB is more than enough.
The last one was a Raspberry Pi that replaced a Dual Core Atom as HTPC. The Atom from 2012 was mostly still good, but the GPU couldn't decode h.265 and then I also ran into issues where the GPU was not supported by nVidia anymore and the open source driver had issues with video decoding. But I also couldn't use an old driver because I wanted to have a current kernel and it was incompatible.
For the Raspberry Pi i opted for the 4GB model even, because the memory usage never went beyond 2GB in a decade of operations anyway.

But this is not your average Desktop, where you typically put in 32GB or 64GB by default.
Why would you save a few bucks on something you're going to use for years?

E.g. from my local dealer I get a pair of 8GB SO DIMMs (16GB total) for around 40 USD, a pair of 16GB SO DIMMs (32GB) for around 55 USD.
OEMs, such as apple, get their stuff for cheaper, especially if soldered in (you save the packaging and interface).

I don't even see 4GB SO DIMMs anymore, so you have to order them extra (something an OEM can do) or just use one (but typical CPUs have 2 memory channels in their controller).

How much saving is it going to yield? Will Apple customers say: "Hey, if this entry level MBA cost 10 USD more, I would not buy it"

 

[Velli]

But then you have very niche requirements.

I don’t think this is true at all. I think it is a very common requirement. Try surfing the web on a 2010 MacBook Pro with 16GB of RAM (I had one until I bought my M1). It’s dreadfully slow, and then I don’t really care which part of the computer is the limiting factor. You would only say that use cases filled with an 8GB M1 could be done on a 2010 Mac if you haven’t used either recently.

Other benefits I got from the upgrade: HUGE boost in battery life (worth it alone), completely silent, lighter, better screen, USB-C (I am aware some will argue that is not a benefit, but it is for me).

You are just oblivious to the concept that a computer is not just about performing X tasks in Y amount of time. To many, especially Apple customers, it’s much more a question of “how nice is the experience of using this computer”.

Surfing the web, writing on social media, writing emails, (very) casual gaming (in my case that means Bloons TD6), simple Excel and Powerpoint, music playback - those are basically my uses, and the experience of doing that on the 8GB M1 is MILES better than on my 2010 16GB MBP, or any of my two 16GB Windows PC’s. If you are not willing to accept that, you are basing your opinions on your own feelings, not facts.

 

[Bento.Box]

Surfing the web, writing on social media, writing emails, (very) casual gaming (in my case that means Bloons TD6), simple Excel and Powerpoint, music playback - those are basically my uses, and the experience of doing that on the 8GB M1 is MILES better than on my 2010 16GB MBP, or any of my two 16GB Windows PC’s. If you are not willing to accept that, you are basing your opinions on your own feelings, not facts.

Surfing is mostly slow because you only have wifi or mobile.Or you live in an area where DSL is still a thing. The Q9550 that was in my 2008 computer would still provide an adequate surf experience today.

People who cheap on on 15 USD RAM Upgrades typically don't care how "nice" something is.

We are also not talking about Windows PCs. A Mac is typically not in direct competition since it's gaming experience is horrible and on Windows the working experience is horrible. Yes you can interchange them if you're a masochist, but it's typically very clear which one fits which role.

It's you who cares more about feelings than facts.
The 8GB vs. 16GB discussion is something of 2008. We have 2025 now. Move on.

 

[Velli]

Surfing is mostly slow because you only have wifi or mobile.Or you live in an area where DSL is still a thing. The Q9550 that was in my 2008 computer would still provide an adequate surf experience today.

I’m using both on the same 300/300 fiber connection. Yes, via WiFi, but that is not the limiting factor, and if you’re suggesting that I run an Ethernet cable to my couch or kitchen tabletop to make a 2010 laptop work a little faster, you’re even more clueless than your previous posts alluded to.

People who cheap on on 15 USD RAM Upgrades typically don't care how "nice" something is.

1: Wrong, because then they wouldn’t buy a Mac in the first place, and 2: With Apple it is not a 15$ upgrade, but 200$. You can complain about that all day, but that is a different discussion.

We are also not talking about Windows PCs. A Mac is typically not in direct competition since it's gaming experience is horrible and on Windows the working experience is horrible. Yes you can interchange them if you're a masochist, but it's typically very clear which one fits which role.

I’m not a masochist, but my work computer is Windows mandated by my employer, who also mandates that I cannot install Bloons on that computer, so my “gaming” computer is my Mac (and would be anyway due to no noise, better touchpad and better battery life).

Saying that a Mac is not in direct competition with Windows because it doesn’t play games very much proves that your arguments are feelings based and not facts based. Most of the work done on computers in the world is done on Windows.

It's you who cares more about feelings than facts.
The 8GB vs. 16GB discussion is something of 2008. We have 2025 now. Move on.

Please do move on. All new Macs have 16GB now, so yes we are discussing the past here. All the way back in 2024 when a new 8GB Mac was way, way faster than a 2010 16GB Mac. And noticeably faster than my 2022 16GB Lenovo.