Am I being scammed by the guy who bought my Macbook pro?

[Technerd108]

Selling on Swappa/Ebay to avoid getting scammed isn't great advice.

A buyer on there can claim the same thing after tampering with it and in those cases, PayPal/Ebay will make you refund upon return. PayPal (the payment processor for Swappa) allows returns up to six months now and Ebay does not allow you to leave buyer feedback as of nearly a decade ago. They will ALWAYS side with the buyer unless they've shown a pattern of abuse of buyer protection features. The upside to selling online is that you'll usually get more money, even after fees/shipping. I've sold hundreds on several platforms. Amazon doesn't allow apple products anymore unless you're doing 7 figure sales every 6 months, I believe. Even then, you have to apply for authorization. MR did a story on this a few years ago.

Selling in person at a safe location like a Police Department is the best way to avoid getting scammed. I've bought several devices like this and most even have an online transaction meetup spot. I'll use hotspot for internet to try it out. Never had an issue.

Telling buyer he's out of luck might get her banned if she sold on FB marketplace or something like that. But she can be proactive in reporting him first. If it was something like CL, I would simply tell him all sales are final.

This is not true. You can put no returns accepted when selling on Swappa and Ebay. If the buyer has a problem they can contact the seller and try to work it out but the seller has no obligation to return. I even state in the sales listing all sales are final.

I agree that if you are going to meet to sell an item the Police Department is a great and safe choice. The problem as I see it is the buyer has more personal information like a phone number. If they are a thief they can get your home address and identity this way.

So I recommend selling via a third party where your personal information is private. Swappa is my personal choice for selling electronics but there are some brands they don't list so then eBay is what I use for the rest. I have helped many buyers with software issues after sale. I try to accurately describe condition even if I have to lose money. I would rather over deliver than have a problem later.

In this case the seller and buyer met in person and everything was fine. The buyer had plenty of time to inspect the device before purchase. Then after 15 minutes the screen went bad. The seller had the device and never had an issue until the buyer took it away. To me this smells fishy.

Hardware generally doesn't work for a year and then fail in 15 minutes-UNLESS it had a catastrophic accident like a drop. All it takes is a second to drop a laptop and have a hardware failure. Generally if the screen was failing it would most likely have had flickering and then maybe intermittent failure and then total failure which would have taken at least a few days.

To me this seems like the buyer dropped the laptop and realized they had a problem and tried to return it to the seller right away. The buyer also could have had a similar laptop with a bad screen and swapped the screen out.

The main point is the seller has no idea what happened once she completed the transaction. Used items sold by private parties do not come with ANY guarantee unless the seller provided an extended warranty. Buying used items is at your own risk.

The seller has no responsibility towards the buyer in this case. People can say what about buyers rights and what if you were the buyer all day. I have been the buyer and that is why I don't buy high end electronics used unless they have an extended warranty. On the flip side we don't know if the OP ever dropped the laptop. Could there be a hardware issue just waiting to happen? Who knows. The responsibility of the seller is to describe to the best of their abilities the condition of the device they are selling accurately and if the buyer decides to buy and make the transaction her responsibility is over.

As the seller said how long should they be responsible for a device they no longer possess? All it takes is a few seconds to drop something.

I understand if you just bought something and it fails that sucks but then all you can do is learn a lesson and move on.

 

[bobcomer]

You do realise when faced with the same problem people will search on MR to see if anyone has had the same problem and how it was dealt with and when they see this thread with the advice being 'ignore the buyer' what do you think is going to happen when you become the buyer or others in here become the buyer and the seller ignores you because that is the advice they've seen.

I personally would probably take the laptop back and give him his money. If you'd have put in a disclaimer that sales are final in how you advertised it, it might have been the best...

I hate selling things personally just because of this kind of situation. The risks are high for both the seller and the buyer.

 

[Hieveryone]

This does not sound like a good situation. What would be the buyer's motive here? That's what I don't understand.

Surely, he didn't buy it, break it on purpose, and demand the refund just for kicks?

He could've accidentally broke it, but in 15 minutes of buying it?

It could just be a freak coincidence as well. One of those "1 in a million" things that almost never happens. Almost..

I wish you luck, OP

 

[MPclk2006]

First off I am not sure how you sold the laptop. I would avoid things like Craigslist and personal meet ups. Also any time you sell a device as the previous poster said all sales are final. There are no returns. Try to sell used on Swappa, Amazon and maybe ebay but never allow for returns. Ship never meet up.

The reason for having an all sales are final is because the buyer could do anything with your previous laptop like accidentally drop it, scratch it, etc.

You can help with software issues like maybe the device is still linked to your icloud account. Beyond that there is nothing you can do.

DO NOT TAKE THE LAPTOP BACK and don't refund his money.

He bought a used laptop and once he paid and took the device out of your physical possession it is his.

If you met him he had a chance to check everything out and if there was a problem he should have seen it in the initial meet and buy.

I would block him as well. You could explain you can't take the laptop back because once it left your possession you have no control what happens and when you sold it, it was working fine. Then block.

If you were to take it back now you have a device worth considerably less or have to make a repair through no fault of your own.

You’re better off selling on Facebook market place or something like that with the “no returns” policy. eBay will always side with the buyer. Wife and I sold stuff on eBay and one lady requested refund for a tiny scratch on a shoe, the scratch was not there on pictures before we carefully packaged them, and was not there when we shipped. eBay immediately gave her the money before she even sent shoes back.

i believe she wore them that weekend and then requested refund the following Monday. 🤷‍♂️

 

[saudor]

I miss the days of buying stuff on the used market and not getting scammed. Now there are elaborate scams that rear its ugly head 6 months after the transaction when a phone gets backlisted for being reported stolen (the insurance scam), non payment of the contract the phone is tied to, etc

This particular story could easily have multiple scenarios

1.) Seller knew there was a fault (that doesn't surface often) and pawned it off. I see this even on macrumors and other forums where they're "happy" they got rid of a semi faulty device for ~* top dollar * ~ just in time for the next one and brag about how they only needed to spend $10 on top.

2.) Buyer got cold feet / dropped it by accident / damaged it and then mentions it's broken

3.) Buyer wanted to troll and deliberately damaged the device.

 

[Technerd108]

I miss the days of buying stuff on the used market and not getting scammed. Now there are elaborate scams that rear its ugly head 6 months after the transaction when a phone gets backlisted for being reported stolen (the insurance scam), non payment of the contract the phone is tied to, etc

This particular story could easily have multiple scenarios

1.) Seller knew there was a fault (that doesn't surface often) and pawned it off. I see this even on macrumors and other forums where they're "happy" they got rid of a semi faulty device for ~* top dollar * ~ just in time for the next one and brag about how they only needed to spend $10 on top.

2.) Buyer got cold feet / dropped it by accident / damaged it and then mentions it's broken

3.) Buyer wanted to troll and deliberately damaged the device.

I agree with you about not getting scammed in years past.

I think selling a broken item deliberately or something with a fault without specific description is akin to theft and fraud.

I always give great detail about what I sell and lots of high res pictures.

Yes you won’t get as much money but you will always find a buyer even if they just want it for parts.

Plus if you are honest you get a reputation that helps you sell more in the future.

Scamming people is like shooting yourself in the foot. In the end, it always catches up with you.

 

[DMG35]

I mean, a lot of things can happen in 15 min.. it was just so strange for me that a machine that was flawless for more then a year in my hands, all of sudden have an issue 15 min after I sold him to this guy, its just too strange.

Yeah, good point. The whole situation is unfortunate.

 

[wilberforce]

It's a scam if he offers to pay you a lot less for it. Do not agree to this.

 

[tugger]

FWIW, take it to an authorized Apple repair service and get a diagnosis. I'm wondering if liquid got into the unit after he took possession of it (possible that kind of damage could cause the erratic black screen events?). Anyway, a good tech could probably help move the whole bloody situation to a conclusion much faster than just guessing about who's responsible.

This is why I always use Apple trade-in. Sure, I pocket less than I would by selling it, but I don't have the time, patience or mental energy to deal with the kind of dilemma you've got on your plate right now. Good luck .. I really hope it works out in your favor.

 

[manwithashoe]

Maybe the buyer is using the MacBook in clamshell mode?
I remember there being an issue with using the M1 MacBook in clamshell mode and the blacklight not turning on after that.

13" M1 Macbook Pro screen/backlight not t… - Apple Community

discussions.apple.com

https://www.reddit.com/r/macbookpro/comments/ldfpv1

In this case.. it sounds like a problem between the buyer and Apple.. as he may be using the MacBook in a different way than you were.

 

[laptech]

I see what you saying, but you don't find it strange that a laptop that was working perfectly fine for me for over year all of a sudden have hardware problems 15 min after I sold him? also It's the buyer responsibility to examine the machine when he purchase it, but once it left my hands in a perfect working order, how long should I be responsible for any damage that could happen ?

That is all well and fine telling us that but if you told the buyer that, how much is the buyer going to believe you? You are a total stranger, there is no sellers feedback the buyer can review before purchase. You said the machine had been working fine up until you decided to do a software reset. How long did you test the machine before you sold it, a few hours, a day, 2 days, a week? because if there was a fault with the machine due to the reset it should have shown itself during your testing phase.

At the end of the day it's a case of who trusts who. Do you trust the buyer that they did not do anything to break the machine and does the buyer trust you that you didn't sell them a faulty machine.

 

[saudor]

This is why I always use Apple trade-in. Sure, I pocket less than I would by selling it, but I don't have the time, patience or mental energy to deal with the kind of dilemma you've got on your plate right now. Good luck .. I really hope it works out in your favor.

This used to be the safe route but at least with Samsung, this can be just as dangerous. You 100% need to video record everything before sending it in or they will reduce the value significantly citing all kinds of damages. In some cases, there are reports where it glitched into the negatives and not only do you lose your device, you also had to pay them extra on top of the trade in credit you received even though a $0 value should be the minimum.

 

[Technerd108]

This used to be the safe route but at least with Samsung, this can be just as dangerous. You 100% need to video record everything before sending it in or they will reduce the value significantly citing all kinds of damages. In some cases, there are reports where it glitched into the negatives and not only do you lose your device, you also had to pay them extra on top of the trade in credit you received even though a $0 value should be the minimum.

I don’t know what you are sending in. I think that is a rather subjective statement.

Samsung trade in has never been an issue for me. Sometimes it takes a while but as long as the device is in the condition that you stated I have had good trade in values from Samsung making their products very affordable.

I have had trade in values sometimes even higher than resale/used and many times very close.

Any company can make mistakes but I have never had them charge me for a trade in device.

 

[kp98077]

are you sure you erased it properly? The M1s are finicky... hopefully, he doesn't have your information on it! I've had something like this happen once, and he said there was "water damage" a week later.. lol, I was like ahhhh no, I baby my machines, no way... block!

 

[JaraCz]

I would not care. As soon the device left my sight the sale is closed for me.
During these 15 min the macbook could fall, be hit with something or the buyer just can be IT specialist and messed up with internal components. You never know.
You are just too nice. I would tell him that the macbook was okay and you do not know what he did with it, so if he has problem with it he can go for Apple to claim warranty. It was his fault that he did not check more Macbook when in person with you.

In the past before buying Macbook I sold Acer gamming laptop to one guy who came with child to my home to check the computer. And he spend like 4 hours at my home investigating and installing laptop from scratched to find out if it is okay. It was and I was pi**ed off how much time he took before buying but I did not tell him anything because I he had right to try everything and I was sure it is fine. But as he left my place I would not speak him anymore. It is closed.

Funny fact: I forgot that I bought new second big SSD disk, so he got it for free.

 

[spiderman0616]

I would not care. As soon the device left my sight the sale is closed for me.
During these 15 min the macbook could fall, be hit with something or the buyer just can be IT specialist and messed up with internal components. You never know.
You are just too nice. I would tell him that the macbook was okay and you do not know what he did with it, so if he has problem with it he can go for Apple to claim warranty. It was his fault that he did not check more Macbook when in person with you.

In the past before buying Macbook I sold Acer gamming laptop to one guy who came with child to my home to check the computer. And he spend like 4 hours at my home investigating and installing laptop from scratched to find out if it is okay. It was and I was pi**ed off how much time he took before buying but I did not tell him anything because I he had right to try everything and I was sure it is fine. But as he left my place I would not speak him anymore. It is closed.

Funny fact: I forgot that I bought new second big SSD disk, so he got it for free.

I hate to say it, but I've been keeping up with this thread, and this is the attitude I would probably have in the end. The buyer is probably either trying to get a free laptop out of you, or really did manage to immediately break it after it exchanged hands. I'm going to assume OP is not trying to scam the buyer, so I'll pretend that's not an option. I guess it's also possible the buyer got buyer's remorse immediately and now just wants their money back.

In any event, OP, I would just forget about it. Think about if worse came to worst and you end up in court over it. A judge would have just as hard of a time believing the buyer as you are having.

 

[JaraCz]

Yes. Buyer´s remorse it can be. Once I sold iPhone 11 PM for good price the buyer contact me few hours later that he wants to return money and I said: F-u-ck off..😁

 

[Fishrrman]

If it's still covered by the Apple warranty, tell him to take it to an Apple Store ASAP.
END OF STORY.

 

[arcite]

Delete the contact, tell him you will report him to the police if he keeps harassing you.

 

[R56L]

Delete the contact, tell him you will report him to the police if he keeps harassing you.

Seems like a major overreaction. Rather, the response to assist facilitating a diagnosis at an apple store?

 

[nutritious]

People are saying the buyer could have done something to the laptop and thus as all sales are final it's basically a case of tough luck. Are people really suggesting this as a way forward, to ignore the buyer?

What about from the buyers perspective, he buys what he thinks is a fully functional machine and then withing hours/days it stops working. Now are you telling me if you was in this buyers shoes you would put it down to tough luck and thus lost your money because the seller will no longer deal with you?

If this happened to you lot there is no way you'd allow the seller to behave the way your telling the OP to behave. You lot would be demanding your money back.

that's hyper extreme western individualism for you. everyone hates their own neighbors and family here lol. why do you think the dating world is so rough?

 

[ArkSingularity]

People are saying the buyer could have done something to the laptop and thus as all sales are final it's basically a case of tough luck. Are people really suggesting this as a way forward, to ignore the buyer?

What about from the buyers perspective, he buys what he thinks is a fully functional machine and then withing hours/days it stops working. Now are you telling me if you was in this buyers shoes you would put it down to tough luck and thus lost your money because the seller will no longer deal with you?

If this happened to you lot there is no way you'd allow the seller to behave the way your telling the OP to behave. You lot would be demanding your money back.

The problem here is that some people will assume that if they can get away with something, that it must mean they have permission to do so. The "as is" sale is to protect the seller from customers who might otherwise buy something, break it accidentally, then claim that the seller sold it to them like this. Most buyers wouldn't do this, but if the buyer could do this without proving it and was able to demand a refund, it would put the seller at risk of being conned.

People try to do this even with warranties. I've lost count of how many times I've seen people break things and then try to get the warranty to cover it. I'll be wiling to bet that most consumers aren't dishonest, but there is no shortage of folks who will try to get away with something if they can (and if they see that there are no protections against it). Even the measures retailers are having to take to combat rising self-checkout theft is evidence for this, and although most of us don't steal at the self-checkout, all of us have to pay for it with rising costs that result.

It goes both ways. There is no shortage of sellers who will also try to con their buyers either. The folks who are trying to sell 2012 MacBook Pros for $500 and advertising them as "2022 OS" (or the folks selling "$700 minor water damage retina MacBook Pro, just needs a new keyboard") are just as bad.

 

[lostPod]

OP, did you do this as a private sale or through Swappa/eBay/etc.? I don't have much to say about your current situation, but I can tell you that next time I would go with Swappa. They monitor all transactions there and there's a lot more recourse for the seller in situations like yours.

I know that doesn't help you CURRENTLY, but just my 2c.

Swappa is great! I buy most of my devices on there and I have never had a problem *knock on wood*

 

[mw360]

I mean, a lot of things can happen in 15 min.. it was just so strange for me that a machine that was flawless for more then a year in my hands, all of sudden have an issue 15 min after I sold him to this guy, its just too strange.

How much time passed between him taking the laptop away and him bringing it back to you? You keep talking about 15 minutes, but the time it took for him to call doesn't matter. How long was it out of your sight?

 

[mw360]

This does not sound like a good situation. What would be the buyer's motive here? That's what I don't understand.

Surely, he didn't buy it, break it on purpose, and demand the refund just for kicks?

He could've accidentally broke it, but in 15 minutes of buying it?

It could just be a freak coincidence as well. One of those "1 in a million" things that almost never happens. Almost..

I wish you luck, OP

If its a scam, it would work like this..

1. Buyer checks the Mac OS has been fully wiped
1. Buyer takes device away and hands it straight to an accomplice close by
2. 15 mins later buyer calls to say it's faulty
3. Seller think's buyer can't possibly have interfered with it in 15 mins so agrees to meet up again
4. Buyer says, great, I can be back there in about an hour*
5. All this time the accomplice has been swapping out the motherboard from a faulty Mac
6. Buyer brings busted Mac to seller 1hr 15 mins after the sale
7. Seller thinks, 'but he only had it 15 mins before it broke'
8. Seller recognises the outer case, but has no way to recognise the internals (see 1.)
9. Seller caves, gives a refund and accepts a broken Mac.


*I think the OP hasn't said how long he was gone with it, unless I missed it. It's the crucial detail though.