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Other Apple is last to the foldables market in the US.
- Thread starter 257Loner
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Are foldable phones gaining any traction? Doesn't look like it, neither from my personal observations nor in the media.
Is there a compelling sales story? Not seeing it.
Is the tech mature? Apparently not.
Is Apple losing market share due to not offering this kind of thing? No.
So...
Maybe they'll eventually sell such a thing once some of the above questions have different responses.
Is there a compelling sales story? Not seeing it.
Is the tech mature? Apparently not.
Is Apple losing market share due to not offering this kind of thing? No.
So...
Maybe they'll eventually sell such a thing once some of the above questions have different responses.
The Fold4 has substantially less screen area than the iPad… mini! Apple is the company that self-cannibalize themselves the most, but the fact that they don’t want to build worse products is never an option.
Foldables can be useful, but they have many practical issues that don’t make them feasible in the foreseeable future. Screen is frequently mentioned, but a major one is dimensions.
When phones achieved peak thinness (around 2014) we were in the range of 6-7 mm. Now we’re around 8-9 mm (with sharper edges, on top of that), and customers seem to like the upsides vs downsides of slightly higher thickness. I’d say we’re already close to thickness limit: remember that the original iPhone was 11.6 mm, with a much smaller display, which offsets it.
It’s just impossible to find a good value balance for folded/unfolded thickness. 8/16mm (assuming perfect fold) and it’s a wild device when folded. 6/12mm and it will have very poor battery life, structural issues, bad cameras… and still very thick when folded!
So we have to wait for significant improvements in different areas before we can have a non-compromised foldable. And even then, the question will be whether the foldable factor brings enough value, or we can make even better 8mm phones with that improved technology.
When phones achieved peak thinness (around 2014) we were in the range of 6-7 mm. Now we’re around 8-9 mm (with sharper edges, on top of that), and customers seem to like the upsides vs downsides of slightly higher thickness. I’d say we’re already close to thickness limit: remember that the original iPhone was 11.6 mm, with a much smaller display, which offsets it.
It’s just impossible to find a good value balance for folded/unfolded thickness. 8/16mm (assuming perfect fold) and it’s a wild device when folded. 6/12mm and it will have very poor battery life, structural issues, bad cameras… and still very thick when folded!
So we have to wait for significant improvements in different areas before we can have a non-compromised foldable. And even then, the question will be whether the foldable factor brings enough value, or we can make even better 8mm phones with that improved technology.
And I thought you were just happy to see me.
I see two scenarios how this foldable saga will play out.
Being pointless, the whole concept will fade away after the hype.
Or… foldables will become a thing and Apple will then launch it’s foldable, which will be much better than competition.
What would really be embarrasing for Apple is to release a product just because those other companies have released theirs. That would be dissapointing frankly. What I expect from Apple is finished products that solve real problems and offer great user experience.
Being pointless, the whole concept will fade away after the hype.
Or… foldables will become a thing and Apple will then launch it’s foldable, which will be much better than competition.
What would really be embarrasing for Apple is to release a product just because those other companies have released theirs. That would be dissapointing frankly. What I expect from Apple is finished products that solve real problems and offer great user experience.
Indeed. In fact, all of the Apple devices I had/have over the past 13 years were/are surprisingly good.
Regardless of the brand, there’s no way I’m spending $1500-$2000 or more on a foldable smartphone if I can get an even bigger display through some cutting edge VR or AR solution.
Yes, foldables are pretty cool and have gotten much better as we’ve seen the tech progress.
But I’m pretty sure Apple is betting everything on being the first company to offer something that’s far less reliant on plastic-ey displays and hinges that will be worn down within a few years.
Apple can easily copy the rest of the industry and put out a foldable in the next 3-5-10 years if Apple’s VR/AR solution fails miserably.
But if Apple can make either of its goggles or glasses work and deliver something that’s as market leading as iPads or Apple Watch then we might just be looking at the future of personal computers and smartphones.
Foldables is just a way to do a bigger display on a smaller device, or giving you a better 2-in-1 smartphone and tablet combo.
But it’s not like it’s the best smartphone or the best tablet. It’s a high tech combo and compromise of the two.
Let’s just wait and see what Apple will do with AR/VR before we start.
Considering how conservative Cook is about moving into new product categories, I’d be very surprised if Apple VR/AR is a dud.
Yes, foldables are pretty cool and have gotten much better as we’ve seen the tech progress.
But I’m pretty sure Apple is betting everything on being the first company to offer something that’s far less reliant on plastic-ey displays and hinges that will be worn down within a few years.
Apple can easily copy the rest of the industry and put out a foldable in the next 3-5-10 years if Apple’s VR/AR solution fails miserably.
But if Apple can make either of its goggles or glasses work and deliver something that’s as market leading as iPads or Apple Watch then we might just be looking at the future of personal computers and smartphones.
Foldables is just a way to do a bigger display on a smaller device, or giving you a better 2-in-1 smartphone and tablet combo.
But it’s not like it’s the best smartphone or the best tablet. It’s a high tech combo and compromise of the two.
Let’s just wait and see what Apple will do with AR/VR before we start.
Considering how conservative Cook is about moving into new product categories, I’d be very surprised if Apple VR/AR is a dud.
Pretty much.
But almost every time, the first to do it right.
At that point, it's Apple being copied.
Especially if you end up being the last man standing.
Oh you think chinese nowadays have money for this sort of discretionary spending? They will more likely get a domestic brand and go with it than spending more than a foldable phone. Phablet was a thing when iPhone was small. But now, more and more older people just want a phone that works as, surprise, a phone.
From what I seen from their most recent tv productions they use foldable that downsized into half to fit in pockets better not that anyone needs the opposite like Samsung wants to market. (Larger smartphone) So that example is more aligned to a minimum phone that just works as you suggested.
I have a friend that has the Galaxy Z Flip 4, she loved that it was pocketable, but it started developing issues where it would reboot every time she opened it. She went to her carrier and found out that it was a common issue and the phone itself is past the warranty date, so she ended up going back to her Note 9 and using it instead. Until they can get the technology bug free, I wouldn't want to spend big money to be their beta tester. But then I'm still waiting for them to come out with a screen that doesn't give me massive headaches and eye strain.
Outside of the tech world, the average consumer could care less.
Plus the idea of a foldable phone just screams easy to break, with little other benefits.
There is no mass market for this.
Plus the idea of a foldable phone just screams easy to break, with little other benefits.
There is no mass market for this.
I'm not expecting foldables to go mainstream any more than phablets went mainstream. Surprisingly, phablets did go mainstream in the Chinese market, but not everyone wanted the largest smartphone.
Cleverly, folding phones fold the largest screen you can fit in your pocket, often come with cover screens for quick access, and contain a battery in each half of the device, so there are fewer compromises than one might expect. Still, they are as weighty as phablets, and yet some still prefer them. The foldable is the true phablet or phone-tablet since it folds an iPad mini-size display into a smartphone that fits in your pocket.
People are discussing questions like these on MacRumors about another new product with an imminent reveal from Apple, the AR/VR headset. Apparently, none of those concerns are stopping Apple introducing their own headset.
And here come all the, “Apple is usually last so they can do it better” arguments.
This place is like whiny teenagers when you tell them their favorite band or sports team isn’t the best in the world.
Was the OP incorrect? Is apple not the last to the foldable market wether you are interested in one or not?
This place is like whiny teenagers when you tell them their favorite band or sports team isn’t the best in the world.
Was the OP incorrect? Is apple not the last to the foldable market wether you are interested in one or not?
This whole thread is a non-issue.
I had a foldable in 2008 and I'm certainly not going back.
First of all, they're too thick.
Second, when the iPhone came out, I immediately saw the advantage of NOT having to unfold anything every time you use your phone.
And third, of course a foldable screen is more prone to breaking. iOS is already as buggy as it can get - I don't want to add any other failure opportunities on my phone.
I had a foldable in 2008 and I'm certainly not going back.
First of all, they're too thick.
Second, when the iPhone came out, I immediately saw the advantage of NOT having to unfold anything every time you use your phone.
And third, of course a foldable screen is more prone to breaking. iOS is already as buggy as it can get - I don't want to add any other failure opportunities on my phone.
Those arguments have already been made.
Is that not the OP?
Because OP has been told that their 'favorite band or sports teams isn't the best in the world,' OP complains and wants Apple to make foldable phones. Because that would mean Apple is making a 'cool' phone again.
You're ignoring the bit about the OP saying Apple should be embarrassed, just so you can be right about OP's thread title.
Yes, OP is correct. Apple is last. But then OP goes on to complain about Apple being last.
So is OP right, or is OP a whiny teenager?
Personally have no interest in a foldable. If I have the choice between a foldable and a normal candy bar style phone, give me normal. I wasn’t even a fan of flips when they were of the non smart variety.
This thread should have ended with this post honestly.
I loved the idea of foldables until I got to use them and realised they seem to complicate things that were never complicated before and create issues where issues never existed.
1. Outer screens tend to be too narrow (e.g. Z Fold)
2. The inner screens are incredibly fragile (even a fingernail can bring it to and end).
3. IP68 protection is basically a no-go
4. Expensive to repair
5. Battery life not up to par with the likes of 13 Pro Max, 14 Plus, 14 Pro Max, Pixel 7 Pro and S23 Ultra.
6. User interface and apps now needing to account for all sorts of weird aspect ratios, I am absolutely horrified by how certain popular apps like Instagram looks on some Foldables main/inner screens, you can tell that no effort is even being put in to try fix this.
Those are just 6 things off the top of my head, but each time I watch a review or a foldable or try it out I cringe a little at how much work and unnecessary complication they bring for a minimal benefit.
They are novel devices and I am glad they are helping to pay for the R&D around flexible display tech, but I have my doubts about foldable smartphones sticking around, I think the likes of Samsung may push on as they have the resources to, but I believe other manufacturers will eventually drop the idea and focus on other aspects (camera, UI, Display, Battery life and overall ecosystem) of their devices.
I stand to be corrected though, maybe much like they revived the Touchscreen smartphone and made it the new standard maybe Apple can do the same for foldables.