Apple Pulls WhatsApp, Telegram, Signal, and Threads From App Store in China Following Order

[Abazigal]

Also, it's lifted straight out of the playbook of any totalitarian or surveillance state.

"Those who would give up essential Liberty, to purchase a little temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety."

Humans have a basic right to privacy. And yes, that means that there's a risk they'll engage in nefarious activity in private. Yet we as societies we tolerate that risk in order to maintain that basic right.

That is also one heavily-misused quote.

How The World Butchered Benjamin Franklin's Quote On Liberty Vs. Security | TechCrunch

One of America's favorite liberal phrases has been sent through the political spin machine and polished into a Frankenstein of sorts, thus rendering it

techcrunch.com

In that it refers not to the importance of freedom and privacy, but the paying of taxes apparently.

 

[I7guy]

True.

You and Apple claim it's fair.
The U.S. department of justices alleges it's not.

We can agree on that.

It’s fair because there isn’t any overall current ruling that says otherwise. Or is it Guilty until…

 

[frownface]

In a statement shared with several media outlets, Apple said China's national internet regulator ordered the removal of the apps from the App Store in the country due to unspecified "national security concerns." Apple said it is "obligated to follow the laws in the countries where we operate, even when we disagree."

Gotta love that. Any other country and they'd be taking matters to court.
China does it; and apple says "right away sir"

 

[Chuckeee]

Gotta love that. Any other country and they'd be taking matters to court.
China does it; and apple says "right away sir"

In many other countries, taking the matter to court would delay and potentially moderate or reverse the decision. That is NOT a viable alternative in Mainland China.

 

[MacHeritage]

Look at the crap Apple has been giving the EU for the past months/year over it's DMA (Digital Markets Act) requirements, they have moaned, complained, gone to court, still moaned and complained, rumoured to leave the EU if Apple was forced to comply with certain rulings and yet when China tells Apple to comply with it's rulings/law, Apple complies with nothing more than 'we comply with the law even if we disagree'. That is not exactly how Apple behaved with the EU was it. Just goes to show how important China is to Apple because when China say's 'jump' Apple replies with 'how High'. When the EU tells Apple to 'jump', Apple replies with 'F off, we'll see you in court'.

Apple has fought in court all over the place, including the only tech company to fight in FISA court that we are aware of. But this is China. Everything there is completely different and you don't have normal law and order there like the EU has. Dictators are like that and China is ruthless. You don't want to tick her off or you are going to have issues like you have never had before. And when that is where your manufacturing is...

They can do all of that in the EU and the EU is not going to cut them off, just for speaking up or going to court to try and stop it etc. Basic law and order protects them in the EU. But in China the government is the court and China does what it pleases, when it wants to.

 

[laptech]

That is obvious.

But I'm not sure it's much the legal opposition they're mounting in courts that some are perceiving as hypocritical. Because they're not only mounting legal challenges in courts. They publicly denounced the European Union and its Digital Markets Acts as "destroy(ing) the security of the iPhone".

They even went so far to implicitly link that to endangering the human right to privacy, as in their recent Complying with the Digital Markets Act pamphlet:

"At Apple, we believe privacy is a fundamental human right and we design our products and services with innovative technologies and techniques to protect our users’ privacy."

"Apple is deeply committed to upholding these core values in every single one of those places. That means finding a way to protect and preserve user security, privacy, and safety while following the law in every country where we do business."

"Dear Tim
Real emails received by Tim Cook about changes to iPhone in the European Union"

"Thank you for leading a company that puts customers first, no matter if it's in regards to their privacy, health, or human rights.
As an EU citizen, ... I will not be allowing sideloading on my devices"


👉 So yeah... where is Apple's comparable public response to non-backdoored end-to-end-encrypted messenger apps being censored elsewhere?

What you wrote shows the hypocrisy of Apple and the disgraceful behavior of Apple in that when the EU brings in a law that Apple feels affects the privacy of it's users, they go on a PR campaign complaining about how the EU is eroding privacy rights of it's citizens and makes a statement saying that privacy is a fundamental human right BUT yet when China does the same and has been doing the same it's citizens, all Apple does is release a statement saying 'They comply with the laws of the country'. Where is Apples condemnation of China's erosion of privacy and it's human rights for privacy? Apple was very happy to make their feelings known about privacy and human rights about the DMA law to the EU saying how wrong it is but when it comes to China they say nothing except they comply with the countries law.

The EU is the most progressive area of the world when it comes to privacy rights and human rights and yet Apple has the nerve to complain about the EU with regards to privacy in that it being a fundamental human right and yet they will not, to the point of refusing to do the same with China. If Apple believes privacy is a fundamental human right they why haven't they taken China to task for eroding the privacy rights of it's citizens. We know why they have not done so because they are in bed with China. They need the cheap Chinese labor so Apple can keep on making it's multibillion $$$ profits. This expression is 100% Apple when it comes to China 'Do not bite the hand that feeds you'.

 

[chmania]

They need the cheap Chinese labor so Apple can keep on making it's multibillion $$$ profits. This expression is 100% Apple when it comes to China 'Do not bite the hand that feeds you'.

Labour is not cheap in China, but China and the Chinese have higher abilities in technology. And, much higher understanding of technology. After all, it is a Chinese company makes the M chips (A chips too) for Apple. Taiwanese, some might shout, but the company is owned by Chinese (say Taiwanese Chinese, or Chinese living in Taiwan). Logic boards are made in mainland China, other chips, memory and such stuff too, the aluminium body too. It is the technological efficiency, not cheap labour.

Have a look in a computer shop (or is it arcade ) in China, or in Hong Kong, or even in Singapore, you'd be surprised what the Chinese can do!

 

[michaelsviews]

All about control

 

[AppliedMicro]

Labour is not cheap in China, but China and the Chinese have higher abilities in technology.

It's still relatively cheap compared to the U.S. or developed European countries.

That said, there is manufacturing expertise, experience and efficiency in China that can't easily be replicated in other countries, if Apple were to shift production elsewhere. Especially not at Apple's volume/scale.

 

[chmania]

It's still relatively cheap compared to the U.S. or developed European countries.

That is a problem of the US (and the EU), not China. The catchword "developed" of the so-called developed world is just to cover up their own mistakes and misgivings. If you've looked in (and at) Shanghai, you'd notice the meaning of "developed," what is not in the so-called West. Or, in a far inside Chinese city of a million or so.

The word cheap means what you can buy for the money you earn, and/or the value of the buying power of the currency, not GDP or some other terms coined by the US, EU or UK banking elite. And, also what the country gives you back, whatever the current gov't. There are two countries in the world with more than 1.4 billion inhabitants each, that develop so fast, none of the so-called West can catch up. They are also taking over the space, one has a space station already, the other will. The "West" would do anything to build a rift between those two countries, but the people and the governments there won't fall for that.

India is considered the largest democracy in the world, with more than 970 million voters. The general election will go on for 44 days, and they vote electronically. That's more than all the population of UK, EU, and all countries of North America!

Once, Tata was not allowed to have a shop by the British colonial powers (or bandits) in India, but today, Tata is Europe's leading steel producer! The old British Steel was rebranded as Tata Steel in 2010!

ARM was sold to Softbank group of Japan, and the Arm China was sold by SoftBank group to the Chinese, Arm China had publicly declared the independence from the its British "parent" in 2021. Now, even Arm China has another competitor in China, who'd design their own chips.

Cheap labour is just a catchword of the "West" to cover its misgivings.

 

[Skyscraperfan]

The EU wants to make the Apple ecosystem more open and give customers more rights. China wants to close the Apple ecosystem even more by banning even more apps than Apple does on its own. So the EU ist good in this regard, why China is evil.

Secretly Apple may even be glad that China bans three competitors of iMessage. If Apple did that on is own, there would be a lot of anger by customers. Now they can say "China made us do it".

 

[avz]

India is considered the largest democracy in the world, with more than 970 million voters.

I have a feeling that "exclusive capitalists" like Klaus Schwab really appreciate a casts system in India and social ratings system in China and would really like to project it onto the rest of the world.

 

[chmania]

I have a feeling that "exclusive capitalists" like Klaus Schwab really appreciate a casts system in India and social ratings system in China and would really like to project it onto the rest of the world.

As though there aren't any social caste/rating systems in the "West," just simply hidden under the cloak ...

 

[avz]

As though there aren't any social caste/rating systems in the "West," just simply hidden under the cloak ...

Not enough for the Klaus Schwab and Goebbels's grand kids. It is important to remember that the Third Reich has never actually capitulated, only Wehrmacht did.

 

[I7guy]

What you wrote shows the hypocrisy of Apple and the disgraceful behavior of Apple in that when the EU brings in a law that Apple feels affects the privacy of it's users, they go on a PR campaign complaining about how the EU is eroding privacy rights of it's citizens and makes a statement saying that privacy is a fundamental human right BUT yet when China does the same and has been doing the same it's citizens, all Apple does is release a statement saying 'They comply with the laws of the country'. Where is Apples condemnation of China's erosion of privacy and it's human rights for privacy? Apple was very happy to make their feelings known about privacy and human rights about the DMA law to the EU saying how wrong it is but when it comes to China they say nothing except they comply with the countries law.

The EU is the most progressive area of the world when it comes to privacy rights and human rights and yet Apple has the nerve to complain about the EU with regards to privacy in that it being a fundamental human right and yet they will not, to the point of refusing to do the same with China. If Apple believes privacy is a fundamental human right they why haven't they taken China to task for eroding the privacy rights of it's citizens. We know why they have not done so because they are in bed with China. They need the cheap Chinese labor so Apple can keep on making it's multibillion $$$ profits. This expression is 100% Apple when it comes to China 'Do not bite the hand that feeds you'.

Spin. Apple was never committed to not following lawful orders. There is quite the difference from removing an app against forcing open apples ecosystem - which if not done in a manner that can be controlled opens up the platform for illegal and immoral uses.

The great thing about the internet is we all can have our own opinions and then apple goes on it’s merry way.

 

[spicynujac]

Good to Know that signal works as expected

Signal requires your phone number (for NO reason) to message someone. That alone makes it compromised. I have heard that later updates no longer require a phone number but I do not trust the app.

Anyway, do you really think Whatsapp, etc. also in the ban list are really privacy friendly?

 

[MacFarmer]

Look at the crap Apple has been giving the EU for the past months/year over it's DMA (Digital Markets Act) requirements, they have moaned, complained, gone to court, still moaned and complained, rumoured to leave the EU if Apple was forced to comply with certain rulings and yet when China tells Apple to comply with it's rulings/law, Apple complies with nothing more than 'we comply with the law even if we disagree'. That is not exactly how Apple behaved with the EU was it. Just goes to show how important China is to Apple because when China say's 'jump' Apple replies with 'how High'. When the EU tells Apple to 'jump', Apple replies with 'F off, we'll see you in court'.

I think it goes to show that you have no idea how china is different from EU.