Apple TV 4k 2022 playing Dolby Vision content as HDR10+ on Samsung TV

[bigtallguy]

For context I have a 2020 Samsung 4K TV that is capable of playing HDR10+ and not Dolby Vision.

Maybe I'm missing something but it seems that the new Apple TV 4K 2022 is streaming movies from Apple TV+ or in my purchased library that are marked as Dolby Vision in HDR10+. Are these two HDR formats able to be converted to one another? I was under the impression that they weren't but yet if I click on a movie to stream that's listed as Dolby Vision and nothing mentioned about HDR10+...the TV will refresh and start playing in HDR10+.

In the past whenever I've tried to play Dolby Vision content on my Samsung TV it would revert down to standard HDR10.

 

[LtRoyalShrimp]

Maybe Apple converts DV to HDR10+ on the fly.

They do this for HDR -> DV.

 

[CaptainMarvel]

According to this digital trends review (scroll to 7.40)

The new Apple TV 4K 2022 does indeed convert Dolby vision to HDR10+.

 

[CaptainMarvel]

According to this digital trends review (scroll to 7.40)

The new Apple TV 4K 2022 does indeed convert Dolby vision to HDR10+.

Actually he doesn’t say convert. Perhaps he only meant if the content had both DV and Hdr10+?

 

[tiberria]

So, does it also convert the other way around and output video on Prime Video, etc. that is in HDR10+ but not Dolby Vision in Dolby Vision?

 

[Boardiesboi]

Samsung TV has HDR10+ and not Dolby Vision.

You’ll Never Get Dolby Vision on Samsung TVs. Here's Why

Dolby Vision is the leader in HDR (High Dynamic Range), but they’re not the only game in town. Surprisingly, not all television companies make products that will run Dolby Vision. ... <a title="You’ll Never Get Dolby Vision on Samsung TVs. Here’s Why" class="read-more"...

androidtvnews.com

 

[bigtallguy]

Samsung TV has HDR10+ and not Dolby Vision.

You’ll Never Get Dolby Vision on Samsung TVs. Here's Why

Dolby Vision is the leader in HDR (High Dynamic Range), but they’re not the only game in town. Surprisingly, not all television companies make products that will run Dolby Vision. ... <a title="You’ll Never Get Dolby Vision on Samsung TVs. Here’s Why" class="read-more"...

androidtvnews.com

That’s correct. I don’t expect my Samsung TV to play Dolby Vision content. What I’m curious about is that content that is marked as Dolby Vision is playing as HDR10+ and if Apple is doing some sort of conversion.

 

[DSTOFEL]

For context I have a 2020 Samsung 4K TV that is capable of playing HDR10+ and not Dolby Vision.

Maybe I'm missing something but it seems that the new Apple TV 4K 2022 is streaming movies from Apple TV+ or in my purchased library that are marked as Dolby Vision in HDR10+. Are these two HDR formats able to be converted to one another? I was under the impression that they weren't but yet if I click on a movie to stream that's listed as Dolby Vision and nothing mentioned about HDR10+...the TV will refresh and start playing in HDR10+.

In the past whenever I've tried to play Dolby Vision content on my Samsung TV it would revert down to standard HDR10.

Note: I edited this post on Nov 4th to correct obvious misunderstandings that I had in my original post. If I’m misstating anything, please let me know…I’m really trying to understand this all.

This particular topic has always been a confusing one for me and I’ve owned every version of the Apple TV. The screen shot below is from the 2021 4K ATV attached to my LG C2 4K TV (which is capable of Dolby Vision).

Seems to me there are 3 settings involved in the Video and Audio section as relates to this topic:

• The top row in the pic below (Enable Dolby Vision): This is a confusing row in that it only appears if you have a set capable of Dolby Vision & you’ve chosen not to set the “Format” setting to one of the options that enable/turn on Dolby Vision.
• The “Format” setting
• The “Match Content” setting

My understandings are as follows. This pertains to 4K TV‘s that support Dolby Vision and the 2021 4K ATV:

• If I set the ”format” to 4K SDR, and have “Match Content“ turned on for both dynamic range and frame rate (ie as I do in the picture below):
  • The home page (ie app listing) will be in 4K SDR
  • When I watch any content that is streamed in 4K Dolby Vision (ie the Crown on Netflix) it will switch to Dolby Vision and the content will be displayed in 4K Dolby Vision.
  • When I watch anything that is streamed in 4K SDR (ie various movies on Netflix and Prime Video) the content will be displayed in 4K SDR.
  • When I watch anything that is streamed in 4K HDR (ie various movies on Prime Video) it will switch to HDR (on my LG 4K OLED set) and the content will be displayed in 4K HDR.
  • When I watch anything that is streamed in 1080P (ie Network news shows and various HBO movies on my YouTube TV app) the content will be upscaled to 4K and will be displayed in 4K SDR.
  • When I watch anything streamed in non HD (ie various old sitcoms on my YouTube TV) the content will be upscaled to 4K and will be displayed in 4K SDR.
• If I set the “format” instead to 4K Dolby Vision and have the “Match Content” set the same as above:
  • As noted above: I no longer see the top row in the pic below. The one that says “Enable Dolby Vision”. I guess since I’m already “enabling it” by choosing it as the format…that would be redundant to also have this “notice”.
  • The home page (ie app listing) will be displayed in “4K Dolby Vision). I think 🤔
  • Other than this, the two settings behave exactly the same for the functions I’ve noted above (ie streaming content on Netflix, Prime Video or YouTube TV App will be displayed in the dynamic range and frame rate of the source content being streamed).

So, it seems on the surface at least that regardless of how you set the “format” setting (ie either 4K SDR or 4K Dolby Vision), as long as you turn on the “Match Content” settings for both dynamic range and frame rate, your streaming outcome (on Netflix and YouTube TV at least) will be the same….as described above.

I guess Apple TV gives us the option (under my use case) to set the format to 4K SDR (ie as I’ve done) and to also not “turn on” the two “Match Content“ settings (ie Dynamic Range and Frame Rate). In this case, when you streamed a 4K “Dolby Vision” show in Netflix, it would display in 4K SDR (instead of in Dolby Vision). Not sure why anyone would want to do that….but seems they’ve given us that option.

I guess also that Apple gives us the option to (under my use case) to set the format to 4K Dolby Vision and turn off “Match Content” for both dynamic range and frame rate to force everything you stream to be mapped to and displayed in Dolby Vision at the native frame rate of my TV. Not sure why anyone would want to do this either. I can imagine some unnatural colors and other artifacts depending on what the content is (ie from the mapping to Dolby Vision).

For Most of us, I’d imagine that if we have a 4K TV that’s capable of displaying in Dolly Vision that we’d want turn on the “Match Content” settings for both dynamic range and frame rate so that Dolby Vision, HDR or neither would kick in depending on the content being streamed. But then this leaves us with the 1 simple choice. Do we set the “format“ to 4K SDR or 4K Dolby Vision? I chose to set it to “4K SDR” so that any content that is not affected by the “Match Content“ settings (ie the home page for example) will display in 4K SDR and not be forced to display in Dolby Vision (ie the home screen app’s for one).

Can anyone see a reason why you would want to set the “format” to 4K Dolby Vision instead of 4K SDR when you‘re also enabling the “Match Content” settings?

What a confusing topic 😊. You’d think Apple could have explained this better…but I’ve yet to find any documentation from them that goes into the various nuances of these settings in the detail needed to really understand the optimum way to set them.
View attachment 2106131

There was a thread around how the the ”Format” setting in the Video section of ATV actually works in conjunction with the “Match Content” settings with respect to what dynamic range will be displayed for your content (ie Dolby Vision, HDR, SDR….and now with the new ATV HDR10+). I pasted my repy above (ie my understanding on how this works). I wonder if you might have your “Format“ set to HDR10+ on the new ATV but have “Match Content” set to “off” for match dynamic range?

 

[enigmatut]

From various interwebz skimming, my understanding is that content must be encoded with both Dolby Vision and HDR10+ for either format to be used. But it also seems that there are tools to easily support and include both in a piece of content. SO, what’s unclear is if Apple content marked as “Dolby Vision” is also encoded for and will play in HDR10+ (when new ATV is connected to a Samsung TV and the HDR10+ enabled setting is on, of course).
Some “iTunes Movies” content is marked as “HDR10+”, confusing me even more. As if perhaps there are now 3 levels of HDR content:

• “HDR” plays in HDR10 only, reverts to SDR if not supported on the TV (as unlikely as that is)
• ”HDR10+“ plays in HDR10+ if supported and reverts to HDR10 or SDR if not
• ”Dolby Vision” plays in DV is supported, then HDR10+, then HDR10, then SDR

??

The video linked above shows an example from the Prime app, and surfing around that doesn’t clearly indicate when a show has HDR10+ encoding, though there are various lists on sites that show which programming includes HDR10+ (such as Jack Ryan).
Ultimately I’m asking about labeling 😂

 

[helix21]

I’d be keen to see if indeed DV is converted to HDR10+, to benefit from the dynamic metadata. This alone would make me buy this Apple TV.

Can someone with one please check? An easy way to check on latest Samsung TVs is if you go into settings panel under ‘picture mode’ it will say what it is using. I can confirm that Apple TV+ content and movies on the built in app now play in HDR10+ because it says that under picture mode. Used to always previously say HDR.

Disney+ don‘t have any HDR10+ content, only DV. So if you play that, does it show up as HDR10+ under the TV? If so, and if apple is doing that conversion, it’s huge as Netflix and Disney+ are both HDR10 or DV only, not HDR10+

 

[AL2TEACH]

content that is marked as Dolby Vision is playing as HDR10+ and if Apple is doing some sort of conversion.

The way I think about it all is like audio or movie formats. A program like VLC will play many different formats. From what I've gathered(and it's not much)is that if a movie has Dolby Vision it will also have HDR10(+). There is no conversion to HDR10+. Now, I'm not the brightest light bulb in the store but that's the way I look at, minus all the other stuff about Samsung and Sony.

 

[CaptainMarvel]

I’d be keen to see if indeed DV is converted to HDR10+, to benefit from the dynamic metadata. This alone would make me buy this Apple TV.

Can someone with one please check? An easy way to check on latest Samsung TVs is if you go into settings panel under ‘picture mode’ it will say what it is using. I can confirm that Apple TV+ content and movies on the built in app now play in HDR10+ because it says that under picture mode. Used to always previously say HDR.

Disney+ don‘t have any HDR10+ content, only DV. So if you play that, does it show up as HDR10+ under the TV? If so, and if apple is doing that conversion, it’s huge as Netflix and Disney+ are both HDR10 or DV only, not HDR10+

I don’t have a Apple TV player. But on my Samsung s95b if I play avengers infinity war (DV) from Disney+ my picture mode says HDR. If I go into Apple TV+ and play anything eg foundation (which only mentions DV) my picture mode says HDR10+.

 

[CaptainMarvel]

Here is a Reddit thread asking the same question:

https://www.reddit.com/r/appletv/comments/ymldc6

 

[BlackJacques]

I’d be keen to see if indeed DV is converted to HDR10+, to benefit from the dynamic metadata. This alone would make me buy this Apple TV.

Can someone with one please check? An easy way to check on latest Samsung TVs is if you go into settings panel under ‘picture mode’ it will say what it is using. I can confirm that Apple TV+ content and movies on the built in app now play in HDR10+ because it says that under picture mode. Used to always previously say HDR.

Disney+ don‘t have any HDR10+ content, only DV. So if you play that, does it show up as HDR10+ under the TV? If so, and if apple is doing that conversion, it’s huge as Netflix and Disney+ are both HDR10 or DV only, not HDR10+

Exact same situation here. Inquiring minds want to know please (using Disney +).

 

[LostElric]

Exact same situation here. Inquiring minds want to know please (using Disney +).

Disney+ does not come up as HDR10+. I tried it with Andor and just got the standard HDR.

 

[SAMtheGAM]

I was watching "Seal Team" on the Paramount + app and got HDR10+

 

[BlackJacques]

Disney+ does not come up as HDR10+. I tried it with Andor and just got the standard HDR.

Thanks for the test. Disappointed with result, but I just saved some money.

 

[docal97]

I was watching "Seal Team" on the Paramount + app and got HDR10+

I tried that myself. The description states it uses Dolby Vision, but on the Samsung TV settings it displays HDR10+. I wish the Apple TV would just tell you what settings it is playing in(4k, HDR, HDR10+, DV, etc) in a straightforward manner without having to look on the TV for this information. And why if the show is set to use DV does it not use that?

 

[mavere]

And why if the show is set to use DV does it not use that?

Your Samsung does not support DV, so by definition the AppleTV cannot output DV or else you'll have problems. But we have no reliable information as to what the input stream is. I would hope, though, that Apple is re-mapping the highest quality input (DV) into the highest playable output (HDR10+).

We know from previous AppleTVs (with match range + DV on) and current MacBooks that Apple can freely re-map and adapt arbitrary color spaces and arbitrary dynamic range content: S/EDR <> HDR10 <> DV. So I don't think this is as novel an implementation as many are making it appear to be. I do agree that there should be a way to access debug data of 1) input format from the stream and 2) output format into the TV via HDMI.

Disney+ does not come up as HDR10+

If other apps can trigger HDR10+, this seems like something that is software controlled and can be fixed in a Disney app update imo.

 

[docal97]

Your Samsung does not support DV, so by definition the AppleTV cannot output DV or else you'll have problems. But we have no reliable information as to what the input stream is. I would hope, though, that Apple is re-mapping the highest quality input (DV) into the highest playable output (HDR10+).

We know from previous AppleTVs (with match range + DV on) and current MacBooks that Apple can freely re-map and adapt arbitrary color spaces and arbitrary dynamic range content: S/EDR <> HDR10 <> DV. So I don't think this is as novel an implementation as many are making it appear to be. I do agree that there should be a way to access debug data of 1) input format from the stream and 2) output format into the TV via HDMI.


If other apps can trigger HDR10+, this seems like something that is software controlled and can be fixed in a Disney app update imo.

Thanks, good summary and explanation. Surprised there is no 3rd party app or way to get the information you mention. Makes for more confusion, such as when HBO show shows it is in 4k, but when playing the Info states HD but the TV shows 3840….event tho all the settings are set to match content, and broadcast in 4k, etc.

 

[mallbritton]

Can someone with one please check? An easy way to check on latest Samsung TVs is if you go into settings panel under ‘picture mode’ it will say what it is using. I can confirm that Apple TV+ content and movies on the built in app now play in HDR10+ because it says that under picture mode. Used to always previously say HDR.

I must be doing something wrong since no matter what settings I change I can't get anything other than HDR to show. I even tried watching the latest ep of SEAL Team, as was mentioned lower down in this thread, and still just HDR. I viewed it in both the Paramount+ app and the Channel.

For reference I have the following settings:
Format: 4K HDR (HDR10+)
Use HDR10+: Enabled
Chroma: 4:2:2
Match Content: Range & Frame Rate ON.

 

[DSTOFEL]

We still don’t know the basics from the OP. On the Apple TV…in the Video/Audio section, what video “Format” do they have set and what “Match Content” setting do they have set for both dynamic range and Frame Rate (ie ”on” or “off”)? If they had the “Format set to 4K HDR 10+ and ”Match Content” for dynamic range set to “off”, I’d expect the resut to be that 4K content in Dolby Vision to be displayed in HDR10+. Let’s rule out the obvious first.

 

[bigtallguy]

We still don’t know the basics from the OP. On the Apple TV…in the Video/Audio section, what video “Format” do they have set and what “Match Content” setting do they have set for both dynamic range and Frame Rate (ie ”on” or “off”)? If they had the “Format set to 4K HDR 10+ and ”Match Content” for dynamic range set to “off”, I’d expect the resut to be that 4K content in Dolby Vision to be displayed in HDR10+. Let’s rule out the obvious first.

Format: 4K SDR or 4K HDR10+ (same results are happening on either format setting)
Match content: both dynamic range and frame rate set to on

 

[Love-hate 🍏 relationship]

i've never heard of conversions from dv to hdr10+ , so i presume apple has added hdr10+ in the movies that have been masterized like that , and just gives you the version that's best for your TV

what movies did you play in HDR10+ ? and how do you know it's in hdr10+ ?

now , if you were to name a movie that's only been released in dv and not hdr10+...that'd mean there's some conversion going on

 

[bigtallguy]

i've never heard of conversions from dv to hdr10+ , so i presume apple has added hdr10+ in the movies that have been masterized like that , and just gives you the version that's best for your TV

what movies did you play in HDR10+ ? and how do you know it's in hdr10+ ?

now , if you were to name a movie that's only been released in dv and not hdr10+...that'd mean there's some conversion going on

Just watched Top Gun Maverick last night from my Apple library where it was listed as Dolby Vision. Opening up the settings menu on my TV showed that it switched over to HDR10+ while playing. To my knowledge this was released in Dolby Vision and not HDR10+.

There are a few other threads right now in these forums where people have listed out quite a few movies that are showing Dolby Vision in the store but will play in HDR10+.