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Apple TV 4k 2022 playing Dolby Vision content as HDR10+ on Samsung TV
- Thread starter bigtallguy
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Be aware if you have problems the cable is not certified - no certification badge shown on listing. Manufacturer performance tests without certification can't be trusted.
I tried both and couldn't see any difference. I will have to find out what the difference is myself, lol.
From an article I quickly glanced over.
" The main difference between RGB and YCbCr444 is that RGB can display darker and brighter scenes better than YCbCr444."
and from a reddit post
"So, to answer your initial question, always use YCbCr when the content is Movie/TV/Broadcasts, always use RGB when the content is Games."
the whole reddit post
Kind of surprised there isn't more traction on this. I have never owned an Apple TV before, and mostly use Android products. I am almost positive the Apple TV is pulling DV and converting it on the fly to HDR10+.
I have a Chromecast with Google TV (I know, I know, wrong forum), and was trying to figure out if my Samsung TV from 2017 could do HDR10+. I was using my Xbox to compare the image quality, as well as the apps built into the TV. I used a Youtube HDR10+ video as an example to see if things visually looked different. My Samsung has the update to allow for HDR10+ but does not display that it is in HDR10+, it only shows HDR on the info settings, so the only way I can tell is trying to find a random app that shows HDR10+ (no luck there) or watching the same scene over and over on multiple devices.
The CGTV played the HDR10+ demo video on YouTube with more clarity and vibrancy than the Xbox. I then went to my YouTube library and clicked through a variety of videos, many saying they featured 4K with HDR. To my surprise, they were all bright more detailed then when played on the Xbox. Still couldn't figure out if it was a placebo effect. I went to the Apple TV+ app in the Samsung TV, went to play the latest Hunger Games and in the info it says 4K HDR. Right away I knew something was different. The image popped, characters were more detailed and things were bright. One of my biggest issues is that I know my TV can get pretty bright, but with HDR10 and the static data, the image was capping how bright things could get, leaving outdoor bright scenes muddy and sad, as if someone added a grey filter.
I purchased an Apple TV 4K 3rd gen. I went into the Apple TV library and was stunned watching a movie with localized dimming, more vibrant colors and overall a brighter image. Before anyone asks, yes I checked and set everything to the correct settings. I opened up Vudu and played a movie and was stunned...because again the color vibrancy was there, lighting changed from scene to scene and I could just visually tell it was different.
I went and Googled if Disney, Vudu or other services had HDR10+. Their websites did not state if they did.
Peacock, YouTube, Paramount+ all support HDR10+. Imagine my amazement when I went to Disney+ to watch Star Wars (which became my test film) and sure enough the image was popping, again. Comparing the image from Disney+ to my iTunes library, the image quality was the same. I check on Vudu as well and the image quality is the same. I check with Vudu on my Samsung TV app and the image quality tanks. After jumping around to all the apps on Apple TV 4K that have DV, I am almost 100% positive they are providing HDR10+ conversion from a DV metadata file.
I don't know this for certain. The Apple TV has a 4K HDR tab, and it has a ton of movies, and when you play them sometimes the description says HDR, sometimes it says Dolby Vision. Once, I had a movie say HDR10+. I have gone back to that movie and it has reverted to just stating HDR. Why? Why? Is someone manually updating these files one at a time?
As if things can't get any weirder, I noticed that all the Bond films are under the 4K HDR tab on Apple TV. They were not released in DV or HDR10. Upon watching Goldeneye and Goldfinger, they both visually pop. They are in 4K, and under the tab they say they are 4K but no mention of HDR. If they aren't HDR, why are they under that tab? Visually they look way better than I have normally seen them.
My settings are 4K SDR, match content match frame. No RGB. I tried a 4K HDMI cable, and some random old HDMI cable, both have the same visual quality.
Now is it just me? Clearly not since there is a thread about it. Is it my setup, or a placebo? Probably not.
My wife walked in while I was watching Moana. My toddler loves Moana. I have seen Moana 100 times in the last month. My wife looked at the screen, then looked at me, and asked if I bought Moana on Vudu or iTunes. I laughed and said, "no this is just Disney+." She was surprised because the image quality looks a lot better. I go to do some research on Moana. It has an HDR10 release on 4K, but Disney+ has a DV release that didn't make it to disc. The whole movie pops in better colors. This was the breaking point where I realized this wasn't just me, and it was definitely working.
As for the why, I have no idea. To say that all these companies have an HDR10+ grade of their films and they didn't release them or update them on other services? My assumption, Apple knows that the Apple TV 4K can play DV content in HDR10+, but isn't advertising because right now everyone assumes it's just the Apple TV library, and individuals know they might need to switch their libraries to Apple, hence higher sales on iTunes. I don't think they are hurting for money so that might not be the case. Or they don't want to upset Dolby? Or they just didn't think anyone would care?
Before anyone says HDR10+ isn't that great, or get OLED or something along those lines. I would. But my wife has repeatedly told me the TV we have is fine, and there is no reason to upgrade.
Also I think Disney+ is broadcasting lossless, or near lossless, as I am hearing things I didn't normally hear on their movies with the Google Chromecast. But that's a thread for another day.
I have a Chromecast with Google TV (I know, I know, wrong forum), and was trying to figure out if my Samsung TV from 2017 could do HDR10+. I was using my Xbox to compare the image quality, as well as the apps built into the TV. I used a Youtube HDR10+ video as an example to see if things visually looked different. My Samsung has the update to allow for HDR10+ but does not display that it is in HDR10+, it only shows HDR on the info settings, so the only way I can tell is trying to find a random app that shows HDR10+ (no luck there) or watching the same scene over and over on multiple devices.
The CGTV played the HDR10+ demo video on YouTube with more clarity and vibrancy than the Xbox. I then went to my YouTube library and clicked through a variety of videos, many saying they featured 4K with HDR. To my surprise, they were all bright more detailed then when played on the Xbox. Still couldn't figure out if it was a placebo effect. I went to the Apple TV+ app in the Samsung TV, went to play the latest Hunger Games and in the info it says 4K HDR. Right away I knew something was different. The image popped, characters were more detailed and things were bright. One of my biggest issues is that I know my TV can get pretty bright, but with HDR10 and the static data, the image was capping how bright things could get, leaving outdoor bright scenes muddy and sad, as if someone added a grey filter.
I purchased an Apple TV 4K 3rd gen. I went into the Apple TV library and was stunned watching a movie with localized dimming, more vibrant colors and overall a brighter image. Before anyone asks, yes I checked and set everything to the correct settings. I opened up Vudu and played a movie and was stunned...because again the color vibrancy was there, lighting changed from scene to scene and I could just visually tell it was different.
I went and Googled if Disney, Vudu or other services had HDR10+. Their websites did not state if they did.
Peacock, YouTube, Paramount+ all support HDR10+. Imagine my amazement when I went to Disney+ to watch Star Wars (which became my test film) and sure enough the image was popping, again. Comparing the image from Disney+ to my iTunes library, the image quality was the same. I check on Vudu as well and the image quality is the same. I check with Vudu on my Samsung TV app and the image quality tanks. After jumping around to all the apps on Apple TV 4K that have DV, I am almost 100% positive they are providing HDR10+ conversion from a DV metadata file.
I don't know this for certain. The Apple TV has a 4K HDR tab, and it has a ton of movies, and when you play them sometimes the description says HDR, sometimes it says Dolby Vision. Once, I had a movie say HDR10+. I have gone back to that movie and it has reverted to just stating HDR. Why? Why? Is someone manually updating these files one at a time?
As if things can't get any weirder, I noticed that all the Bond films are under the 4K HDR tab on Apple TV. They were not released in DV or HDR10. Upon watching Goldeneye and Goldfinger, they both visually pop. They are in 4K, and under the tab they say they are 4K but no mention of HDR. If they aren't HDR, why are they under that tab? Visually they look way better than I have normally seen them.
My settings are 4K SDR, match content match frame. No RGB. I tried a 4K HDMI cable, and some random old HDMI cable, both have the same visual quality.
Now is it just me? Clearly not since there is a thread about it. Is it my setup, or a placebo? Probably not.
My wife walked in while I was watching Moana. My toddler loves Moana. I have seen Moana 100 times in the last month. My wife looked at the screen, then looked at me, and asked if I bought Moana on Vudu or iTunes. I laughed and said, "no this is just Disney+." She was surprised because the image quality looks a lot better. I go to do some research on Moana. It has an HDR10 release on 4K, but Disney+ has a DV release that didn't make it to disc. The whole movie pops in better colors. This was the breaking point where I realized this wasn't just me, and it was definitely working.
As for the why, I have no idea. To say that all these companies have an HDR10+ grade of their films and they didn't release them or update them on other services? My assumption, Apple knows that the Apple TV 4K can play DV content in HDR10+, but isn't advertising because right now everyone assumes it's just the Apple TV library, and individuals know they might need to switch their libraries to Apple, hence higher sales on iTunes. I don't think they are hurting for money so that might not be the case. Or they don't want to upset Dolby? Or they just didn't think anyone would care?
Before anyone says HDR10+ isn't that great, or get OLED or something along those lines. I would. But my wife has repeatedly told me the TV we have is fine, and there is no reason to upgrade.
Also I think Disney+ is broadcasting lossless, or near lossless, as I am hearing things I didn't normally hear on their movies with the Google Chromecast. But that's a thread for another day.
According to this post it’s HDR10+ from source.
Most films are Dolby Vision which some also now have HDR10+ for Samsung users.
There’s always been quite a lot of HDR10 movies which in the past few weeks most are now available in HDR10+.
It all depends on where you’re looking as to what icon you may see, The Movies app will only show HDR for movies such as Die Hard, X-Men, The Greatest Showman whereas via the ATV app they’ll show as being HDR10+ via the store listing or when you use the search function.
They show in that section because that section includes all 4K titles regardless if they’re DV,HDR,HDR10+ or SDR.
All the pre Graig Bonds are currently 4KSDR.
As with all streaming services I know it is highly compressed, ~750 kbs audio and ~16 Mbps video. A 4k Blu-Ray can run over 100 Mbps.
Well. Here's a weird turn. I gave up my Xbox Series X after using HDR10+ on Apple TV. Very impressed. No looking back. I turned my Xbox on and downloaded the Witcher update. Clicked on Vudu to watch some Indiana Jones, and was surprised by the quality of the image. Jumped to different apps, and started to realize they were all pulling HDR10+ images. I ran through different scenes from 10 different movies and determined almost all of them were playing some converted Dolby Vision into an HDR10+ format, similar to what the Apple TV 4K was doing. My first thought was that all services updated their HDR content to be able to output into HDR10+ format when applicable.
Then things got weird. I put in a 4K disc and was stunned that the movie was playing in what looked like HDR10+. I put in multiple other discs and all of them had a better image quality, better brightness and overall what looked like metadata. My assumption is that the Xbox updated on 12/8 and included something that converts HDR10 and DV into HDR10+. I assume that the Apple TV 4K has similar conversion software. I understand maybe this is a placebo effect. My TV does not have the ability to say if it is playing in HDR10+, Samsung did not provide that in an update, just the ability to do HDR10+.
The only evidence I have is this. While on Apple TV looking for different movies, some said HDR, some said Dolby Vision. Normally this just said Dolby Vision. I thought that was weird. After looking long and hard I finally found a movie pop up saying that it played in HDR10+, which I believe means that the Xbox is outputting or has the capability to output in HDR10+ as well. Why Microsoft and Apple are using a conversion technique and not advertising is anyone's guess. Image below of HDR10+ option, which does not appear on my Ipad or my PC when looking at this film.
Apple TV HDR10+ Option
Then things got weird. I put in a 4K disc and was stunned that the movie was playing in what looked like HDR10+. I put in multiple other discs and all of them had a better image quality, better brightness and overall what looked like metadata. My assumption is that the Xbox updated on 12/8 and included something that converts HDR10 and DV into HDR10+. I assume that the Apple TV 4K has similar conversion software. I understand maybe this is a placebo effect. My TV does not have the ability to say if it is playing in HDR10+, Samsung did not provide that in an update, just the ability to do HDR10+.
The only evidence I have is this. While on Apple TV looking for different movies, some said HDR, some said Dolby Vision. Normally this just said Dolby Vision. I thought that was weird. After looking long and hard I finally found a movie pop up saying that it played in HDR10+, which I believe means that the Xbox is outputting or has the capability to output in HDR10+ as well. Why Microsoft and Apple are using a conversion technique and not advertising is anyone's guess. Image below of HDR10+ option, which does not appear on my Ipad or my PC when looking at this film.
Apple TV HDR10+ Option
I wouldn’t read too much into what you’re seeing on your Xbox, that’s just the ATV app showing what certain titles are now available in so doesn’t necessarily mean that’s what they’ll actually be playing out in. (I’m not familiar with Xbox so wouldn’t know if it’s even HDR10+ capable)
My Apple TV HD which is incapable of displaying said format and shows exactly the same via the ATV app as in your screenshot.
There’s also no conversion going on with iTunes movies or ATV+ content either as quite a lot of Dolby Vision titles are playing in HDR10+ from source.
That particular title as many others were originally listed as being 4KHDR, since the ATV4K 3rd Gen was released certain titles are now available in HDR10+ on compatible devices.
Here’s a list of just some of the former HDR titles that are now HDR10+
A Good Day To Die Hard
American Gangster
American Made
Apollo 11
Apollo 13
The Blues Brothers
Bohemian Rhapsody
Braveheart
Darkest Hour
Dawn of the Planet of the Apes
Die Hard
Die Hard 2
Die Hard with a Vengeance
Die Hard 4.0
Drive
Dr.Seuss’ How The Grinch Stole Christmas
Emma (2020)
Exodus: Gods and Kings
The Fast And The Furious
2 Fast 2 Furious
The Fast And The Furious: Tokyo Drift
Fast & Furious
Fast & Furious 5
Fast & Furious 6
Fast & Furious 7
Field of Dreams
Get Out
The Greatest Showman
Halloween (2018)
Harriet
The Hate U Give
Heat (1995)
Hellboy II The Golden Army
How To Train Your Dragon
How To Train Your Dragon 2
How To Train Your Dragon The Hidden World
Howard The Duck
The Hunt
The Huntsman Winters War
Jurassic Park
Jurassic Park The Lost World
Jurassic Park III
Jurassic World
Kingsman The Secret Service
Kingsman The Golden Circle
Licorice Pizza
Logan
Mamma Mia
The Martian
The Maze Runner
Maze Runner: The Scorch Trials
Minions
Morgan
The Mummy (1999)
The Mummy Returns
The Mummy Tomb of the Dragon Emperor
The Mummy (2017)
The Outfit
Pitch Perfect
Pitch Perfect 2
Pitch Perfect 3
Predator
Predators
The Purge (2013)
Rise of the Planet of the Apes
Robin Hood
Serenity
Shrek
Sicario
Smokey and the Bandit
Snow White and the Huntsman
Split (2017)
Spy
Terminator 2: Judgement Day
The Thing (1982)
To Kill a Mockingbird
War of the Planet of the Apes
X-Men
X-Men 2
X-Men The Last Stand
X-Men Days of Future Past
X-Men Days of Future Past - The Rogue Cut
Yesterday
Friends, I have a 2022 Sony Bravia X90K 120hz, this and that and this and that and Dolby Vision. I hooked up a 2021 Apple TV with Dolby Vision and the smart little thing won't stream anything in Dolby Vision on my Sony TV. "Enable Dolby Vision" or not, the Sony shows it in HDR10+ even when it's not mentioned anywhere this Sony model has HDR10+. The command "123" on the TV shows the information clearly. I stream mostly from Prime Video where some movies are clearly identified as being Dolby Vision and Dolby Atmos. As for YouTube and the multitude of small DolbyVision videos, none is showing in DV. As for the integrated apps, only the Prime Video app within Google TV streams in DV with Dolby Bright and Dolby Dark as options. YouTube, don't even think about it. I tried all the 4 HDMI ports of the TV (2 HDMI 2.0 and 2 others 2.1) with no DolbyVision from the ATV 4K 2021. I gave up. Not the first time Apple TV 4K makes me scratch my head. Reason why I did not buy the 2022 model. Knew it was not worth it. HDR10+ in any case. Or someone proves me wrong with my connexion...HDMI 2.1 cable from the ATV to the 2.1 port in TV (yes the one with eArc).
Absolutely no way you’re getting HDR10+, the 2021 model doesn’t even support it.
If your TV doesn’t even support it then just how are you determining that it’s streaming in HDR10+?
As for Prime Video, well currently it doesn’t actually support Dolby Vision via the Apple TV so the best you’ll get is HDR10.
I wonder if we ever are going to see Apple release firmware for 2nd gen Apple 4K TV to bring HDR10+. I have Samsung S95B. I do see that built in prime and ATV+ apps bring hdr10+. Even if I play DV content from Samsung's ATV+ the picture mode shows hdr10+. Of course the best I can get through my ATV on either app is only HDR10.
Just curious about it, when you play Foundation from Apple TV+ without an Apple TV, do you still get it in Atmos as we would expect? That's my main concern right now as Apple seems to have dropped Atmos content on the Apple TV+ pre-installed on all Samsung smart TVs forcing you to buy their Apple TV 4K in order to get the movies/series in Atmos.