Apple wants $600 for 1TB SSD while Samsung's 1TB m.2 sells for $229

[LeeW]

The two systems have different target markets.

Maybe, if you compare what we have had in the past they are different but that does not mean they will be going forward.

Just suppose they go down the route of a modular design comprising of stackable slabs for:

CPU
Memory
Storage
GPU
Audio

Starting at a relatively low price, say $899 you get an i3 CPU slab, Memory and Storage slabs similar to the current Mini lineup.

But wait, want good audio or a GPU, that will be another $299 for the audio slab and $599 for the GPU slab.

Want a 'Pro' setup, sure, an i9 slab, 128GB memory slab, 6TB SSD (3 slabs), Vega whatever GPU slab and so on, that will a Pro $5,999 thanks.

What's the point of the mini?

I mean speculation but what I have described has Apple written all over it and the ability to keep you locked in by purchasing new or replacing existing slabs is a winner for the bottom line.

 

[pl1984]

Maybe, if you compare what we have had in the past they are different but that does not mean they will be going forward.

Just suppose they go down the route of a modular design comprising of stackable slabs for:

CPU
Memory
Storage
GPU
Audio

Starting at a relatively low price, say $899 you get an i3 CPU slab, Memory and Storage slabs similar to the current Mini lineup.

But wait, want good audio or a GPU, that will be another $299 for the audio slab and $599 for the GPU slab.

Want a 'Pro' setup, sure, an i9 slab, 128GB memory slab, 6TB SSD (3 slabs), Vega whatever GPU slab and so on, that will a Pro $5,999 thanks.

What's the point of the mini?

I mean speculation but what I have described has Apple written all over it and the ability to keep you locked in by purchasing new or replacing existing slabs is a winner for the bottom line.

The Mini would be a lower cost system for people who do not need the theoretical capabilities of the Modular Mac Pro. The Mini is a great system with its, IMO, only flaw being the non-upgradable SSD. Despite its very nice specifications I wouldn't consider it a Mac Pro replacement.

 

[Cashmonee]

Maybe, if you compare what we have had in the past they are different but that does not mean they will be going forward.

Just suppose they go down the route of a modular design comprising of stackable slabs for:

CPU
Memory
Storage
GPU
Audio

Starting at a relatively low price, say $899 you get an i3 CPU slab, Memory and Storage slabs similar to the current Mini lineup.

But wait, want good audio or a GPU, that will be another $299 for the audio slab and $599 for the GPU slab.

Want a 'Pro' setup, sure, an i9 slab, 128GB memory slab, 6TB SSD (3 slabs), Vega whatever GPU slab and so on, that will a Pro $5,999 thanks.

What's the point of the mini?

I mean speculation but what I have described has Apple written all over it and the ability to keep you locked in by purchasing new or replacing existing slabs is a winner for the bottom line.

I think that would be pretty cool, but there is no way it happens. These will be Xeon machines with a starting price near the iMac Pro and will easily climb north of $10,000. The Mac Pro will not be for people interested in a Mac mini. Not even close. The only people that will buy a Mac Pro are people that make serious money with it and fools that have far too much money to spend on a computer they browse the internet with and run benchmarks on.

EDIT: Also, I think when Apple said modular, they were referring to going back to a case similar to the cheese grater. Something that allowed easy and quick swapping of GPUs, storage, RAM. Not necessarily that it will have pieces attached.

 

[Ploki]

I suspect the Mac Pro is going to be a machine that most people only dream about. The pricing on that is likely to be eye-watering. I suspect it will start at $4000 ($1000 below the iMac Pro), and very quickly ramp up from there. The speed of the i7 mini makes it even more likely that the Pro will be a machine not intended for even a power user, but rather a true professional user who sees it as making them money, not costing them money.

Most likely.
However most of these professionals already left apple...
I'm left wondering who is the target demographic for the Mac Pro.

I'd say audio professionals, but their needs are not nearly as large as needs of video designers + a lot also have DSP... and renderfarms can be done cheaper.

iMac Pro is unsuitable for audio because nobody wants two fans blowing in their face.
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I think that would be pretty cool, but there is no way it happens. These will be Xeon machines with a starting price near the iMac Pro and will easily climb north of $10,000. The Mac Pro will not be for people interested in a Mac mini. Not even close. The only people that will buy a Mac Pro are people that make serious money with it and fools that have far too much money to spend on a computer they browse the internet with and run benchmarks on.

EDIT: Also, I think when Apple said modular, they were referring to going back to a case similar to the cheese grater. Something that allowed easy and quick swapping of GPUs, storage, RAM. Not necessarily that it will have pieces attached.

I had the cheesegrater 2008! for Audio.
A lot of people in audio that I know right now are buying the 2012 12-core Mac Pro's.

I'd never consider a mac mini before this year, but CPU (most vital for audio) is okay, so is the form factor which you dont need a whole machine room for to have a silent studio.
It's gonna be overkill for Audio professionals, and Video professionals left the ecosystem when FCPX 10.0 was terrible and 2013 Mac Pro was terrible.

 

[LeeW]

I think when Apple said modular, they were referring to going back to a case similar to the cheese grater. Something that allowed easy and quick swapping of GPUs, storage, RAM.

In my view, Apple has been very careful on all their devices for enough generations now that there is no way, absolutely none that they will give that level of control back to a user.

With the most expensive devices for those pro users, Apple wants to ensure they spend with them, not with a 3rd party.


But we will see in time what they come up with.

 

[Cashmonee]

In my view, Apple has been very careful on all their devices for enough generations now that there is no way, absolutely none that they will give that level of control back to a user.

With the most expensive devices for those pro users, Apple wants to ensure they spend with them, not with a 3rd party.


But we will see in time what they come up with.

I agree with you. I am just not sure what they would mean by modular otherwise. Also, if you think about what professionals want, the cheese grater is it. People that the Mac Pro is targeted at go through hard drives like candy. They want to be able to quickly and easily change things out. If Apple does not cater to that, I do not think they will gain back the pros they lost with the trash can. From the article several months back, Apple seemed to be hinting they were looking at something more in line with the cheese grater, but I agree that seems way out of character.

Also, I thought more about your stacking minis idea. To me this is an amazing idea. You buy the base mini you want with RAM slots that are accessible. Then if you want more storage, add another mini slab. GPU? Mini slab. They'll never do it, but that would really entice me to stay/go back to the Mac universe.

 

[Ploki]

I agree with you. I am just not sure what they would mean by modular otherwise. Also, if you think about what professionals want, the cheese grater is it. People that the Mac Pro is targeted at go through hard drives like candy. They want to be able to quickly and easily change things out. If Apple does not cater to that, I do not think they will gain back the pros they lost with the trash can. From the article several months back, Apple seemed to be hinting they were looking at something more in line with the cheese grater, but I agree that seems way out of character.

Also, I thought more about your stacking minis idea. To me this is an amazing idea. You buy the base mini you want with RAM slots that are accessible. Then if you want more storage, add another mini slab. GPU? Mini slab. They'll never do it, but that would really entice me to stay/go back to the Mac universe.

I don't really think pros want cheesegrater anymore. The "pro" sector branched out with their own specific needs that wasn't that different 12 years ago when cheese grater came out.
Video *exploded* in storage and GPU requirements.
Audio only has additional CPU needs (and not all that huge). GPU is unecessary. Back in 2009 when OpenCL was announced, audio guys were dreaming of running plugins on their GPUs... That didn't happen.
Coding, photography, illustration...
Different needs. No "one size fits all", not even in peripheral connections.

 

[philipma1957]

I built multiple 2012 quad core mac mini audio machines for 3 guys. Total of 5 five units. All had a 500gb ssd and 1tb hdd.
I upgraded them to a pair of 2tb micron ssd's last year. They can still use them. They don't need good graphics at all. But the new mac mini is a fail for them. Why is that? soldered in ssd that is why.
I will be building them dell optiplex 7060 micro with 32gb ram 1 tb pcie and a 4tb samsung sata ssd's.

Lots of audio guys made due with the 2012 quad core mini and some big ssd's this freaking 2018 mini model is a down grade for them in terms of internal storage 2x 2tb ssd = a 4tb worth of ssd 2012 mini. and it could do 8tb of samsung ssd sata.

this one just has 1 internal drive max of 2tb.

so 2tb of pcie ssd 2018 mini unchangeable
8tb of sata ssd 2012 mini could be upgraded if they make bigger ssds.

 

[LeeW]

They'll never do it

Look at what HP did with the Elite Slice, If Apple did that there is no way out for those that jump in, it would be a cash cow for them.

The cornerstone of every macOS device is macOS itself. If you want that OS and don't want a Hackintosh you have no option other than to buy a mac in whatever form. If Apple came along tomorrow and said "macOS is now available for $250 and you can install it on any hardware you want", their hardware sales would drop by more than 50%.

They know people want the software and will stump up the cost for the device as a result. They also know that a socketed CPU and/or SSD would affect sales too much, that is why I believe hell will freeze over before they give in and allow it to happen.

Sure they gave us socketed RAM in the new Mini but made it difficult for a lot of people to do it. Those that have, you better put the original ram back in before you need to get a warranty repair and try to make it look like you have not opened it. I am waiting for the threads "Apple refused a warranty repair as I replaced the RAM myself and they said that is why it's faulty". They are coming!

The 2017 iMac pro does not even allow you to replace the RAM for such an expensive device, an option available on previous generations of iMac that have the same form factor. Appreciate the internals are different, but still, the option is not there.

 

[pl1984]

The cornerstone of every macOS device is macOS itself. If you want that OS and don't want a Hackintosh you have no option other than to buy a mac in whatever form. If Apple came along tomorrow and said "macOS is now available for $250 and you can install it on any hardware you want", their hardware sales would drop by more than 50%.

Given how Apple allowed the Mac product line to stagnate for as long as they did one could make a reasoned argument they not that interested in Mac sales anymore. The idea to license macOS to select manufactures makes a lot of sense. It's not like the 90's when Apple was dependent on Mac sales.

 

[Ploki]

Given how Apple allowed the Mac product line to stagnate for as long as they did one could make a reasoned argument they not that interested in Mac sales anymore. The idea to license macOS to select manufactures makes a lot of sense. It's not like the 90's when Apple was dependent on Mac sales.

I really hope this doesn't happen to be frank

 

[pl1984]

I really hope this doesn't happen to be frank

Why is that?

 

[LeeW]

It's not like the 90's when Apple was dependent on Mac sales.

True, although they still do well from them. If you own a Mac you are way more likely to own two more of their devices. If you own one non-Mac device your next purchase is likely to be another Apple device.

I would rather have a Dell XPS 13 with macOS on it than any MB/MBA/MBP with macOS.

 

[Partron22]

Now that cell phone sales are stagnating, we may see Apple shift a few resources back to the Mac lineup.

 

[pl1984]

Now that cell phone sales are stagnating, we may see Apple shift a few resources back to the Mac lineup.

Maybe we already have

 

[Ploki]

Why is that?

first, i really like(d) their hardware.
second, all the mess that happens when you open your OS to hardware... ugh

I'd prefer something like this:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Macintosh_clone

 

[pl1984]

first, i really like(d) their hardware.
second, all the mess that happens when you open your OS to hardware... ugh

It's the "liked" part which is the reasoning behind my suggestion. Apple hardware is nice but, until recently, it was neglected. If Apple isn't very interested in the Mac business they should just license the OS to other manufacturers. It doesn't have to be all manufacturers, a select few would be acceptable.

 

[Ploki]

It's the "liked" part which is the reasoning behind my suggestion. Apple hardware is nice but, until recently, it was neglected. If Apple isn't very interested in the Mac business they should just license the OS to other manufacturers. It doesn't have to be all manufacturers, a select few would be acceptable.

ah yes, kinda like the Macintosh clone from yesteryear. Licensed HP Z6 running macOS. Yummy

 

[philipma1957]

It's the "liked" part which is the reasoning behind my suggestion. Apple hardware is nice but, until recently, it was neglected. If Apple isn't very interested in the Mac business they should just license the OS to other manufacturers. It doesn't have to be all manufacturers, a select few would be acceptable.

I would so love my dell optiplex 7060 micro to have a legit MacOs option it would be a perfect computer for my needs.

I would send mr cook a check right now.

Put Mojave on the internal sata ssd
Keep window 10 on the nvme m.2 ssd
Have a boot option button.
Bliss for me.

 

[user_xyz]

Look it up on iFixit's teardown page.
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View attachment 804934

I hope Toshiba is as rock solid as Samsung.

 

[Phrequensi]

The Corsair MP510 has more endurance and it is cheaper than the Samsung EVO.

That thing is smoking.
Can I stick that in a Mac Pro 6,1?