Apples treatment of the Pro market.

[zioxide]

what "pro" market exactly? the prosumer market?

the line between the producers and consumers has been blurred. 90% of the people using the "pro apps" now are prosumers.

the real "professionals" (ie studios) use avid and they always have. final cut was never the most popular software for that arena.

 

[roadbloc]

I believe that answers your question.

No. It just proves my point that you think Apple are taking the right road. Pro users will disagree.

One thing I've never understood about you *LTD*. You are always saying that Joe Average and the general consumer don't participate in forums and online tech sites, so why are you always telling us users that are not supposedly Apple's priority/target audience that we are 'wrong' in what we think? Do you enjoy creating pointless arguments online? Maybe you should just go somewhere elsewhere and quit creating these pointless debates. After all, the average user doesn't hang around on forums, so it's gotta be them who actually use computers for more than Facebook and YouTube who are on here… you know, the more Pro end of the market that Apple is turning it's back on at the moment?

Your very own philosophy explains why many users on this are becoming increasingly frustrated with Apple and yet you continue to ram home your pro-apple message as though you are shocked in what we are saying. It is that, that leads me to believe you are a troll and you should just **** off elsewhere and stop winding everyone up for a reaction.

If this post amounts to a ban, then so be it.

 

[*LTD*]

No. It just proves my point that you think Apple are taking the right road. Pro users will disagree.

Pro users are free to disagree. They're also free to deny the reality of the situation.

Apple participates in profitable growth markets. The Pro market is well down on that list.

You have witnessed, as we all have, over the course of the last decade Apple's gradual move away from Pro users and toward consumers (and now pro-sumers.) Its a move that has benefited the largest segment of the market in the most substantial way. And during this time, what has this strategy done for Apple's bottom line? We all know. What has it done to win Apple the kind of mindshare that no none ever thought a tech company capable of? We all know. And it was totally unprecedented in Apple's entire history.

It's a simple question of opportunity and economics. Apple *can* address the Pro market (they have the ability to do go in almost any direction), but why bother?

Your very own philosophy explains why many users on this are becoming increasingly frustrated with Apple and yet you continue to ram home your pro-apple message as though you are shocked in what we are saying.

Most of the users on this site represent a small minority of Apple's market. The complaining and dissatisfaction they have with Apple (which isn't widespread enough to matter) can continue, but considering the source of it, all it really amounts to is a lot of grumbling in an echo chamber. The same people continue to be dissatisfied for the same reasons. Rinse, repeat.

Apple isn't going to alter their strategy when it's resulted (and continues to) in the most profound growth and success the company has ever seen - the sort of success that is otherwise almost unheard-of in the industry. It's obviously a wise strategy, and those who aren't served by it should seriously consider moving to another platform.

Now I don't know about you, but if my expectations are consistently unmet by a company whose focus and interest is opposed to them, to the point where I'm becoming "increasingly frustrated with Apple", I usually save my breath (and peace of mind) and move to a different platform, with my interest and attention moving along with it. You don't have to be a sage on a mountain to realize that there's probably something to be said for the path of least resistance.

 

[G4er?]

Oh, now there are "real" professionals? As opposed to the "sorta real" guys? You guys don't even know who the hell you are. The market segment you're in is not just niche, it's shrinking. Prosumers are muscling in.

You guys? I start my post clearly stating that I am not a professional. I only commented because I want a mid range mid sized Mac that offers some of the features that are only available on the Mac Pro.

Simple things like an easy to open case. A couple of ports on the front for ease of use. Internal room for a couple of hard drives AND an optical drive. And lets me choose my own monitor.

To me that would be a prosumer Mac. I consider the mini and the iMac consumer Macs. Consumers don't care that the mini and iMac need body shop tools like putty knives and suction cups to open the case since most of them will never even consider changing out a hard drive.

If someone like me (that openly states he is not a professional and does not need all the capacity of the Mac Pro) is holding out buying iDevices because a good prosumer desktop is not available, how would professionals feel if their Mac Pros weren't there?

To me it is a matter of principal. Apple computers brought me to the company. If Apple no longer has a computer that meets my needs why support Apple financially by purchasing the companies music players and cell phones? That would be sending the wrong message to Apple.

 

[*LTD*]

You guys? I start my post clearly stating that I am not a professional. I only commented because I want a mid range mid sized Mac that offers some of the features that are only available on the Mac Pro.

You're still asking for this? You and a few others have been beating this "headless, midrange Mac" thing that you can tinker with to death for three years now. Ever since those PsyStar clowns tried to make them for cheap in 2009 (and couldn't sell any.) Apple hasn't given one to you. How much longer before it sinks in that you're not going to get one? Apple already makes the Mini, and the only other headless desktop they make is already serving a shrinking niche market. And a lot of the tools that run on that Mac can also be run just fine on lower-end systems like an iMac.

You can dream up all sorts of potential products that Apple can make, but if they're obviously not in line with Apple's strategy, then all you've done is created a concept video for playback in your own head. Probably fun to talk about, but not much point in adding it to your expectations.

 

[sigamy]

I'm in the Tertiary education sector and we use dual booting Mac's. There are some apps that are PC only and some that are Mac only. Most of our students arrive as PC users and leave as Mac Nuts because we use Macs every day. However I could switch platforms quite easily if need be. If I stop using Macs (because of the lack of pro support) so will our students. These students go in the industry and have a big influence on what they adopt. That 5-10% just started eroding the 90%.

Please...

You are overstating the importance and size of this market. The 90% is made up of teenagers, housewives and normal people with iPhones and iPads. These people are not impacted by a halo effect around the Pro market.

if this was the case, why then, did Apple fall to under 3% market share in the late 90s and early 2000's when it was fully supporting the Pro market?

----------

You're still asking for this? You and a few others have been beating this "headless, midrange Mac" thing that you can tinker with to death for three years now.

Three years? More like 10. I remember calls for the headless iMac (xMac) after the iMac G4 was released.

Apple gave us the Mac mini, a nice machine but not what most wanted.

 

[gullySn0wCat]

I resent the dumbing down of software as well. In Lion, the user's Library folder is hidden.

Cmd+shift+g in Finder

~/

Not so hidden now ;-)

 

[roadbloc]

Cmd+shift+g in Finder

~/

Not so hidden now ;-)

Or even better, click on Go and then press alt/option. Library is there.

 

[MorphingDragon]

I say let Apple focus on consumer market and let the professional industry leaders decide what platform to release their products on. This will bring the highest quality workflow in the long run.

A similar business model employed by the enterprise market has been beneficial to companies like RedHat, Oracle and IBM. Concentrate on their little segment of their market and deliver a truly superior product. Microsoft lock-in is now a myth because of the aforementioned companies and OSS is now a multi-billion dollar business that is still growing.

 

[gullySn0wCat]

Or even better, click on Go and then press alt/option. Library is there.

Wow! That is COOL!

 

[AppleScruff1]

Most of the users on this site represent a small minority of Apple's market. The complaining and dissatisfaction they have with Apple (which isn't widespread enough to matter) can continue, but considering the source of it, all it really amounts to is a lot of grumbling in an echo chamber. The same people continue to be dissatisfied for the same reasons. Rinse, repeat.

Obviously you're the type of customer that Apple targets. For shame.

 

[johnhurley]

I resent the dumbing down of software as well. In Lion, the user's Library folder is hidden.

Probably done because so many people were doing bad things to themselves accidentally. The argument that they should not have bought an apple if they did not know to stay away from the library folder is kind of ... ugly.

Not hard to search and find how to unhide it right?

 

[vvswarup]

I resent the dumbing down of software as well. In Lion, the user's Library folder is hidden.

What you call "dumbed down software" may be "easy-to-use software" for others. There are some who don't care about messing around with the settings on the software and want to just use it to get things done.

----------

To be fair, it isn't hard at all to access it or unhide it. And it does prevent users who have no clue how to use a computer from deleting something they shouldn't.


So at one point it was important? Where have all the pros gone then? Have they just vanished in thin air? The pro market may not be as big as the 'prosumer' or consumer market and Apple may have shifted priorities, but pros still want to buy professional software. Apple were once regarded as a company that made some excellent, polished, professional products for the pro market. They've been rapidly loosing their place in the market for the past three to four years now.

If that is what they want, then so be it. And no doubt you will reply that it is what they want and its the best road to take and Apple is amazing by doing this and etc. But be aware that the many pros of this world will be more and more upset with Apple and you'll be seeing more and more of that image below on online forums.

There is no reason why Apple can't cater for many markets.

There actually is a reason why Apple can't cater to many markets. Each market has a different set of needs. Apple just can't be everything to everyone.

Also, Apple has a limited amount of resources. It's better to concentrate on a few products and do a good job of them than to do a bunch of different products and do an okay job of them.

 

[anubis]

As of a couple of months ago, the Apple Store where I live does not have a single Mac Pro on display. If that doesn't demonstrate Apple's abandonment of the Pro market, I don't know what does.

 

[gullySn0wCat]

FWIW I think the "hiding" of Library is an idiot test, if you are smart enough to find it, you are smart enough to change it's contents

 

[MacNut]

Basically Apple has forgotten about its true user base in exchange for soccer moms and teenagers who want shinny phones and iPads. Apple is not about the better user experience anymore, or the nerds that like to tinker. It is now about selling the most product even if the quality isn't as good or productive.

For Apple to drop the power user who kept the company afloat for the past 20 years is shameful. Apple has become everything they were against and is turning into Microsoft.

I preferred the smaller Apple that was a niche but had products that worked. Now that everyone loves Apple the uniqueness is gone and Apple is just another Sony.

 

[Bernard SG]

Basically Apple has forgotten about its true user base in exchange for soccer moms and teenagers who want shinny phones and iPads. Apple is not about the better user experience anymore, or the nerds that like to tinker. It is now about selling the most product even if the quality isn't as good or productive.

For Apple to drop the power user who kept the company afloat for the past 20 years is shameful. Apple has become everything they were against and is turning into Microsoft.

I preferred the smaller Apple that was a niche but had products that worked. Now that everyone loves Apple the uniqueness is gone and Apple is just another Sony.

Except that Apple almost died when its main clientele used to be that niche of 'nerds that like to tinker'.

When I think about it, what you guys are nostalgic about is actually the infamously disastrous Sculley-era Apple.

Oh, and you see all those devices in my signature? Well they DO work.

 

[MacNut]

Except that Apple almost died when its main clientele used to be that niche of 'nerds that like to tinker'.

When I think about it, what you guys are nostalgic about is actually the infamously disastrous Sculley-era Apple.

Oh, and you see all those devices in my signature? Well they DO work.

Sorry to disappoint but the 4S is riddled with issues that Apple still hasn't fixed. Quality control has gone down considerably in the past few years.

I don't want my OS to be dumbed down, I want it to look good yes and function but I won't want Apple to treat me like a child. Them turning into a hip consumer gadget company will do nothing to help the computer side of the business. The Pro's will leave and once Apple loses the top end of the market where will they be? Can the company survive as just a iPhone iPad seller?

 

[Bernard SG]

Can the company survive as just a iPhone iPad seller?

The short answer: yes.
The longer answer: f$&@# YESSS!

Sorry to disappoint but the 4S is riddled with issues that Apple still hasn't fixed. Quality control has gone down considerably in the past few years.

 

[MacNut]

The short answer: yes.
The longer answer: f$&@# YESSS!

I think you are nieve if you think that.

 

[phySi0]

So by the same argument, cars should come with a lock on the bonnet that only a mechanic has a key to?

No, because the bonnet is closed, but not locked.
Likewise, the library folder is closed, but not locked. People know you shouldn't open the bonnet, because it's clearly marked as such (it's closed, and we know that it's the internal workings of the car).
Computers aren't like this. Most people don't know how a computer works, but most people know about the internal combustion engine. People know how to operate folders, which is just enough to be able to delete important system files and the OS. By closing that or hiding it, it tells the user that it's part of the internal workings of the OS (or computer to novices) and not to be messed with. But for people who need to access it, the option is there. Just like the option is there for you to pop open your hood.

 

[Bernard SG]

No, because the bonnet is closed, but not locked.
Likewise, the library folder is closed, but not locked. People know you shouldn't open the bonnet, because it's clearly marked as such (it's closed, and we know that it's the internal workings of the car).
Computers aren't like this. Most people don't know how a computer works, but most people know about the internal combustion engine. People know how to operate folders, which is just enough to be able to delete important system files and the OS. By closing that or hiding it, it tells the user that it's part of the internal workings of the OS (or computer to novices) and not to be messed with. But for people who need to access it, the option is there. Just like the option is there for you to pop open your hood.

How dare you give a rational insight in this thread?

 

[chaosbunny]

When I started reading this site in 2003 it was all about the next iBook/PowerBook/iMac/PowerMac update, how much ram it was going to have and if it will be redesigned. Now the biggest headlines are about twitter integration in iOS. But sometimes the magic is still there, it's just hidden very well.

 

[guzhogi]

They're abandoning the pro market because a huge majority of their users these days are average consumers, it's not worth spending millions developing products for only like 5-10% of their users when they can use that money to create products the other 90% would buy.

Under that logic, why develop for Macs since 90% of the world uses Windows?

 

[*LTD*]

Under that logic, why develop for Macs since 90% of the world uses Windows?

The Mac ecosystem and the "Pro" market are two different things.