Are Microsoft ads are really hurting Apple?

[chaosbunny]

The Dell computer she did buy is also one of the finest examples of hardware design currently available in the Windows market IMO.

I agree with some of your other points, but this one makes me laugh. Afaik the Dell, like almost all laptops nowadays, don't even have the trackpad in the middle of the machine. Whoever came up with this unergonomical bs should be fired immediately.

I don't know about others, but when I use the trackpad I have my right hand there, and the left hand on the keyboard for shortcuts. I have tried it in stores and this layout is just horrible, both asthetically and in terms of usability.

 

[neiltc13]

I agree with some of your other points, but this one makes me laugh. Afaik the Dell, like almost all laptops nowadays, don't even have the trackpad in the middle of the machine. Whoever came up with this unergonomical bs should be fired immediately.

I don't know about others, but when I use the trackpad I have my right hand there, and the left hand on the keyboard for shortcuts. I have tried it in stores and this layout is just horrible, both asthetically and in terms of usability.

I think it all comes down to personal preference and what you're used to. Indeed, I bet that many of the people who don't use a MacBook would argue that the person who decided it should not have a proper button (or two) should be fired.

Anyway, my comment about design extends further than the trackpad. The Dell machine is mainly black with silver accents, while the MacBook is mainly silver with black accents. To me, the finest looking computer would be one which is all one colour, or close shades. So that's why I think that the black MacBook and previous generation MacBook Pro are probably some of the best looking machines ever - they got it right.

If Apple would ditch this hideous black plastic that is polluting almost all of their hardware I'd definitely argue that they are on top once again with design. Can you imagine how great a MacBook with a silver keyboard and silver display edge would look?

 

[chaosbunny]

Indeed, I bet that many of the people who don't use a MacBook would argue that the person who decided it should not have a proper button (or two) should be fired.

Maybe, but many people who use the larger trackpads and the 2-finger right-click think it's a way better system than putting 2 buttons under the trackpads were every effort to reach the second one results in a hurting finger anyway. Personal preference, yes, but I never understood what can possibly be the benefit of a non-centered trackpad to ANYONE.

I agree that the macbooks and iMacs would look better all silver, but I don't think they look bad now. The whole design is not matched by any pc laptop from a pure aesthetic point of view. I guess that's why they often use Macs in movies/TV shows.

As for the laptop hunter ads hurting apple, I doubt it, for reasons others have mentioned. They should have done the same thing with desktops, since that is were the iMac falls behind your regular quad-core/i7 tower much more in terms of price/performance.

 

[Melrose]

The only point being made in the M$ ads is price. Period.

For Mac users, that's a non-issue.

For PC peeps frustrated by crappy customer service, it's a non-issue.

The ads only work with people who lack any intermediate/advanced knowledge of computers (new or first-time buyers. Unfortunately that's a large number) and watch ads without doing their own investigating.

Keeping that customer group in mind, there two inherent problems with the ads. No. 1: They are very far removed from any "Windows" branding. I speak to people regularly who think that Google is the internet, that their Dell is the operating system, or that a Compaq is the internet. Taking Windows out of the ads helps in the short-term, when you 'think Vista' but long-term it hurts since people still get confused about an HP with Windows on it - will it work? Will it load my CD-ROM? Will it...? I remember when I got my first Windows machine, I hesitated horribly because I didn't know what Windows was ... I thought simply buying a Sony was all that mattered. I mean this as inoffensively as possible: It's amazing how stupid people are wen it comes to this stuff. And, No. 2: All they talk about is price. The ads do not address system specifications (unless you call "Does this have a good graphics card?" "Mm-hmm" talking specs). The ads actually do not answer any of the big questions new buyers are going to have w a computer.

Assuming that OSX is just as stable or reliable as any version of Windows, the customer service and better depreciation alone are worth the extra cost. Whether you like the Apple ads or not, they're very effective because they are heavily branded, and the tagline is "It just works." People see the Apple logo and they picture the brand and what it stands for. M$ is shooting themselves in the foot (feet) by taking 'Windows' out of it... then again, since Windows is different than HP or Dell (eg: two entirely separate companies) the ads would be needlessly confusing to new buyers if they tried to involve technical things. Ergo, since Mac users will predominantly stay with Mac and people pissed off with bad customer service or resale value, M$ was left with the only option and had their hands tied.

 

[atheros07]

I think it all comes down to personal preference and what you're used to. Indeed, I bet that many of the people who don't use a MacBook would argue that the person who decided it should not have a proper button (or two) should be fired.

If Apple would ditch this hideous black plastic that is polluting almost all of their hardware I'd definitely argue that they are on top once again with design. Can you imagine how great a MacBook with a silver keyboard and silver display edge would look?

This justifies the Dell having a better hardware design? People who continue to use PCs with tiny trackpads and two buttons can live happily ever in their own little world, but the MB/MBP buttonless trackpad is a huge improvement. I had a classmate who made fun of my new MBP ("just right-click.. oh wait.. you have a Mac, you don't have right-click. Haha"), but little does he know that my Mac two-finger tap/click makes it easier to right-click that him moving his thumb over to the right button.

I know people who've bought 13" Dell XPS, and it's a nice computer, but it in no way matches the sleekness and clean lines of the new MB/MBP. It's not distinctive at all.. it's just another glossy PC notebook.

There is also a massive misconception on this forum that Windows is somehow vastly inferior to OS X. I'm quite confident that this comes from either hyperbole spread here by other members or bad experiences in the past.

I used Windows exclusively up until 2 months ago. It's true that Windows is pretty stable now. I remember Windows 98 was an absolute disaster that I hated using from Day 1. On the other hand, XP rarely crashes. However, I agree with Apple's point that Macs on a day-to-day basis are generally speaking less frustrating to use than Windows. For example, one thing I do often in college is downloading lots of Word documents from a website, looking through them, and printing the ones I want. It's a pretty basic task, yet on the lab computers with Windows, it's just an immensely frustrating exercise, as the full-screen views and lack of an Expose-like feature makes it really difficult to know which document you're working with. I could feel my blood pressure rising. On the Mac, it's just easier to work with multiple documents and multiple tasks at once (which is why I never feel the need to use lab computers anymore).

 

[neiltc13]

I know people who've bought 13" Dell XPS, and it's a nice computer. It's not distinctive at all.. it's just another glossy PC notebook.

Just like the new MacBooks. Apple's only two remaining computers that are distinctive are the Mac mini and Mac Pro. The rest look like they could have been created by anyone.

I used Windows exclusively up until 2 months ago. It's true that Windows is pretty stable now. I remember Windows 98 was an absolute disaster that I hated using from Day 1. On the other hand, XP rarely crashes. However, I agree with Apple's point that Macs on a day-to-day basis are generally speaking less frustrating to use than Windows. For example, one thing I do often in college is downloading lots of Word documents from a website, looking through them, and printing the ones I want. It's a pretty basic task, yet on the lab computers with Windows, it's just an immensely frustrating exercise, as the full-screen views and lack of an Expose-like feature makes it really difficult to know which document you're working with. I could feel my blood pressure rising. On the Mac, it's just easier to work with multiple documents and multiple tasks at once (which is why I never feel the need to use lab computers anymore).

I think this is one area where Windows 7 improves things massively. I'm using it right now and it is so easy to switch to any of my open windows. I just hover my mouse down to the icon at the bottom and a menu appears showing a preview of the windows from that application. Mousing over any one of them fades the rest of the windows away so you can see that window with no distractions and clicking it brings it to the front. There is also now a "show desktop" button in the bottom right, again if you mouse over it all of the other windows disappear and you can click it to hide them all completely.

The "full screen views" are your own creation - no one forces you to press maximise, and if you're using a relatively high resolution monitor there is no need to.

 

[NATO]

Just like the new MacBooks. Apple's only two remaining computers that are distinctive are the Mac mini and Mac Pro. The rest look like they could have been created by anyone.

You say this, but in the flesh there's absolutely no comparison. I've yet to find someone who hasn't complimented it's looks when they've seen it.

 

[MWPULSE]

People who buy macs know very well what they cost and what PCs cost but they buy macs anyway. Even if this ad campaign is very efective at most it will keep people from switching, but the people who like macs will still buy macs.

Yup im a music student, there was no realistically feasible option but to but mac! windozee for music really isnt as brilliant as people make out. I have a macmini and macbook pro now. I love them, i would never be able to love a win machine in the same quantity. I really couldnt care less that its not top notch hardware inside (although they are still quite literally brilliant) or that its a bit of a price hike, i wanted a reliable music computer, and i have 2. so Im happy

 

[Melrose]

Just like the new MacBooks. Apple's only two remaining computers that are distinctive are the Mac mini and Mac Pro. The rest look like they could have been created by anyone.

That's doesn't really prove a point. I don't think those two look similar at all.

Apple makes their notebooks from aluminum. Say what you want about it not being necessary or no better than a PC casing, I'd still rather have solid aluminum than plastic.

 

[neiltc13]

You say this, but in the flesh there's absolutely no comparison. I've yet to find someone who hasn't complimented it's looks when they've seen it.

When I got mine out of the box I was truly disappointed. I had seen it in pictures but hoped that somehow it would be better in person. It isn't. It's ugly and doesn't look like the MacBook or iBook I had before. Those computers were special and distinctive, primarily because of their simplicity.

The problem for me is that there really is no reason whatsoever for the black to be there. They could easily make silver keys and make the display edge silver. It would not only look better but it would also look distinctive. There still isn't a company out there doing a decent job of making an all metallic PC case now that the last generation MacBook Pro is out of production.

Apple ditched its PowerBook with black and silver and everyone thought the all-metallic design looked better then. Why when we go back to the same ugly two-tone scheme does everyone suddenly like it again?

I'm not doubting the build quality. It is much better than the old MacBook, but the decision to make the design more complex seems completely bizarre. It was almost as if they changed things for the sake of changing things. Same goes for the iMac (the white one looked a lot better).

 

[ravenvii]

I've also been using Windows 7 extensively over the past couple of weeks. It's even more stable than Vista and has a few good ideas like Aero Peek and the new task bar. I wish I could say the same about Snow Leopard, which at the moment is looking like it is going to totally bomb when it hits the market. Why are Apple intending to charge customers to fix problems which it created by launching Leopard?

Why do you prefer to pay Microsoft $250+ to fix problems that they created with Vista, then?

 

[neiltc13]

Why do you prefer to pay Microsoft $250+ to fix problems that they created with Vista, then?

Microsoft solved the problems they created with Vista already. I believe it was a free update named Service Pack 1 that did most of the work.

 

[zap2]

Microsoft solved the problems they created with Vista already. I believe it was a free update named Service Pack 1 that did most of the work.

Hardly...Vista is still to "big" to run on a netbook. Thats what Snow Leopard is about, using hardware more effectively. Thats something I'm excited for!

 

[neiltc13]

Hardly...Vista is still to "big" to run on a netbook. Thats what Snow Leopard is about, using hardware more effectively. Thats something I'm excited for!

Well for one thing Apple doesn't currently offer a netbook. Also, demand for them is still incredibly small when you look at the entire computer market. When there's a reason to do this, I'm sure it will happen.

 

[.Andy]

I hope Apple are OK is there somewhere I can paypal them a donation?

 

[RainForRent]

My favorite ad was the latest one where the girl wanted a computer for video editing. Gonna smack herself in the face when she goes to get a job and they ask if she knows anything about FCP. D'oh! There is no MS equivalent.

 

[.Andy]

My favorite ad was the latest one where the girl wanted a computer for video editing. Gonna smack herself in the face when she goes to get a job and they ask if she knows anything about FCP. D'oh! There is no MS equivalent.

Wasn't the latest one about a law student?

 

[dsnort]

yup I go the exact computer I wanted and had $1000 left over.

I got the exact computer I wanted too.

Used it for three tears, then sold it for $800.

 

[xlii]

I've also been using Windows 7 extensively over the past couple of weeks. It's even more stable than Vista and has a few good ideas like Aero Peek and the new task bar. I wish I could say the same about Snow Leopard, which at the moment is looking like it is going to totally bomb when it hits the market. Why are Apple intending to charge customers to fix problems which it created by launching Leopard?

Neiltc13, I have to ask... what makes you think Snow Leopard will bomb when it hits the market? If it can give a speed bump to new and newish (9400 & 9600 gpu) machines then I think it would be a hugh success.

 

[hvfsl]

Well for one thing Apple doesn't currently offer a netbook. Also, demand for them is still incredibly small when you look at the entire computer market. When there's a reason to do this, I'm sure it will happen.

You sound you would be happier selling your Macs and getting a PC. Since Macs generally hold their valve quite well, you should be able to get faster PCs than the Macs you are replacing them with.

 

[ravenvii]

Microsoft solved the problems they created with Vista already. I believe it was a free update named Service Pack 1 that did most of the work.

There's also this little thing called the 10.5.7 update. In fact, there's 7 of those similar things. And they, I think, are... something called "free", also.

Those also fix many problems.

 

[Eidorian]

You sound you would be happier selling your Macs and getting a PC. Since Macs generally hold their valve quite well, you should be able to get faster PCs than the Macs you are replacing them with.

I tend to do that with individual components of my towers.

 

[MadMacxxx]

I so agree with you! I enjoy the lil microsoft adventures, microsoft really needed a big come back to apple(meaning the ads) the mac vs pc ads are getting a little old apple really need some fun adverts like the old iPod ones not just some man talking about the features. They need to be creative and fun.

yea the commercials are getting lame, they need to revise their TV ad campaign

 

[ethical]

There's also this little thing called the 10.5.7 update. In fact, there's 7 of those similar things. And they, I think, are... something called "free", also.

Those also fix many problems.

a new operating system that only offers speed boosts is a bit lame though. you want a physical difference that you can be excited about, and enjoy learning about..... not having to pay out £65 to see your MS Word document load faster.

Also, I agree, Apple need to start going down a new road with their adverts, the Mac Vs. PC thing is old now.

 

[MadMacxxx]

I've also been using Windows 7 extensively over the past couple of weeks. It's even more stable than Vista

You just discredited yourself.... even more stable then Vista? Sounds amazing