Beeper Mini on Continued Outages: 'It's Super Annoying That Apple is Penalizing Their Own Customers'

[scorpio vega]

If enough people vote the right way, yes. (That is if they can really vote)

they can and as we see with social issues, they do.

So you trust apple to do what they say? I know I don't. (I agree about the second part of your sentence though)

I do. I trust apple more than google.

I honestly had no idea just how much control google had until this beeper thing and i started perusing subs on reddit about android in general. And browsers and i was disgusted.

I have a new macbook pro now but i am already dropping Edge (which i love) on my windows products and i am looking at all google alternatives because ugh google disgusts me.

A lot here seem to trust we will get RCS, and even next year. I don't. I don't see myself getting a new iPhone at all right now, but not implementing RCS is definitely a point in android's favor.

Give me a foldable iPhone, RCS, and minimum brightness control for my AWU2, then I'll probably buy an iPhone 16 Pro.

Android can keep foldables.

 

[cgs1xx]

Oh come on, the developpers must have known all along that they wouldn’t get away with this app…
Android users with iMessage envy can just get iPhones 🤷🏻

 

[Kal Madda]

Oh come on, the developpers must have known all along that they wouldn’t get away with this app…
Android users with iMessage envy can just get iPhones 🤷🏻

Exactly. They leech off another company’s software, services, and server space without said company’s permission, and they expect the other company won’t put an end to it? It didn’t take an expert to realize that was never going to work. If your business model is based on unauthorized use of another company’s software, then it’s not really a tenable business model…

 

[bobcomer]

I just honestly don’t understand this level of cynicism.

Maybe it's an age thing, and I've had more experience with corporations because of that.

I'm just as surprised everyone isn't as much a cynic when it comes to large corporations. It's all about making more money and how, they'll do anything, even lie, to do it.

 

[scorpio vega]

I'm just as surprised everyone isn't as much a cynic when it comes to large corporations. It's all about making more money and how, they'll do anything, even lie, to do it.

I worry more about shady governments than Apple not giving Android users blue bubbles.

If I worry about Corporation, I'd worry about Google literally controlling the web than Apple not allowing sideloading.

 

[bobcomer]

I do. I trust apple more than google.

I don't trust either one. Or any large corporation for that matter.

I honestly had no idea just how much control google had until this beeper thing and i started perusing subs on reddit about android in general. And browsers and i was disgusted.

Apple has just as much control over what they make, maybe even more as on an android phone you can change a lot, even de-google it. Not to mention Apple pays google for search, so you get it all with Apple.

I have a new macbook pro now but i am already dropping Edge (which i love) on my windows products and i am looking at all google alternatives because ugh google disgusts me.

I hate Edge, but I use Chrome, I can use a product I don't trust.(necessary evil) I also use firefox if chrome fails at something.

Android can keep foldables.

Apple will eventually make one, they sell well enough.

 

[spazzcat]

So you trust apple to do what they say? I know I don't. (I agree about the second part of your sentence though)

iOS 18 is already in development. They most likely have started working on RCS, so they announced it was coming.

 

[Kal Madda]

Maybe it's an age thing, and I've had more experience with corporations because of that.

I'm just as surprised everyone isn't as much a cynic when it comes to large corporations. It's all about making more money and how, they'll do anything, even lie, to do it.

I’m not going to tell you what to be cynical about, but I do think that this would be a rather silly thing for them to lie about. If they didn’t intend on doing it, why would they make a public announcement that they will be doing it? It’s not like this is even required by the DMA, this is outside of that issue. I don’t see any clear business reason for them to lie about this either. Adding RCS support to the Messages app won’t make any big difference in Apple’s business model or profits. Lying about this and letting the tech press talk about Apple’s imminent inclusion of RCS, just for Apple to admit they lied a year later would be bad PR for Apple, it would be a worse outcome for them then adding RCS, especially since they didn’t have to promise RCS in the first place. So I don’t see any reason to assume this is a lie. And again, every year when they announce new iOS, iPadOS, and macOS features, I don’t see a bunch of people saying “you can’t say that feature will come, Apple could be lying about it.” Like, every year, they say certain features will come to their OSes, and sure enough, they do. At the end of the day, if you want to be skeptical of it, that’s fine, I just really don’t understand what the logical explanation for Apple purposefully bringing up a topic to lie about would be.

 

[TechAndOSWorld]

Exactly. The only people using this service are freeloaders.

well, thanks for calling people like me freeloaders. I guess paying Apple for Macs and services like iCloud+ isn't enough. if I don't want to keep track of two separate conversations (iMessage on my Macs and SMS on my P6a), then I'm a freeloader.

 

[Kal Madda]

well, thanks for calling people like me freeloaders. I guess paying Apple for Macs and services like iCloud+ isn't enough. if I don't want to keep track of two separate conversations (iMessage on my Macs and SMS on my P6a), then I'm a freeloader.

The other guys comment is a bit strong on the ad hominem for my taste, but I think what he was meaning is that the app itself is freeloading on Apple’s system, so anyone using the app is by extension also part of that freeloading. That is actually true. It doesn’t matter what Apple devices you may or may not own, if you’re using an app that’s freeloading on Apple’s software and services in violation of those services terms of use, then that is still freeloading. Case in point, if I use some app that illegally acquires access to Prime Video, and I use that bootleg app instead of the official Prime app, even if I subscribe to Prime, I’m still involved in using bootleg software to illegally access the content when I’m not using the official Prime Video app or site.

 

[TechAndOSWorld]

The other guys comment is a bit strong on the ad hominem for my taste, but I think what he was meaning is that the app itself is freeloading on Apple’s system, so anyone using the app is by extension also part of that freeloading. That is actually true. It doesn’t matter what Apple devices you may or may not own, if you’re using an app that’s freeloading on Apple’s software and services in violation of those services terms of use, then that is still freeloading.

other people here said it's free if you have an Apple product, but not free for everyone as a public service. I understand that as iMessage being included in price of Apple products. And if that's the case, I already paid that price multiple times. So I feel like people like me shouldn't be called names just because we want to make our lives easier.

I'm not commenting on Beeper Mini itself, and I think that offering it as a subscription service is kinda scummy.

 

[Kal Madda]

other people here said it's free if you have an Apple product, but not free for everyone as a public service. I understand that as iMessage being included in price of Apple products. And if that's the case, I already paid that price multiple times. So I feel like people like me shouldn't be called names just because we want to make our lives easier.

I'm not commenting on Beeper Mini itself, and I think that offering it as a subscription service is kinda scummy.

But iMessage is a service designed specifically for Apple devices, using it on other platforms violates the terms of use, and using an app that illegally gains access to this service is still wrong. I don’t agree with name-calling people, but I do think that it is accurate to say that people using a software that freeloads on a service are engaged in freeloading.

 

[5232152]

You don’t see Google’s search engine as a monopoly (even though it basically has a stranglehold on the majority of the search engine market), but iMessage, which makes up a much smaller portion of it’s market is somehow a monopoly? This makes no sense, there are plenty of iMessage alternatives as well, so it isn’t a monopoly either…

Does Apple allow me to not use Messenger as my primary standard messenger system? Nah.

 

[Kal Madda]

Does Apple allow me to not use Messenger as my primary standard messenger system? Nah.

You mean Apple’s Messages app, not Messenger, which is owned by FaceBook… Second, you don’t really need to use any “set as default” setting, you just choose to hide the Apple Messages app away and use your messaging app of choice as your “primary standard messenger system”. Lots of people do it just fine… A “set as default” setting wouldn’t really change anything with the way the system works, it doesn’t really make sense.

 

[TechAndOSWorld]

A “set as default” setting wouldn’t really change anything with the way the system works, it doesn’t really make sense.

But on Android, you can (or at least could in the past) set Messenger as your default messages app, even for receiving and sending SMS. Not sure if that's what the post above was trying to say, and if using Messenger for SMS is something I'd do. But you do get the option to combine your platform of choice with standard messaging.

 

[Kal Madda]

But on Android, you can (or at least could in the past) set Messenger as your default messages app, even for receiving and sending SMS. Not sure if that's what the post above was trying to say, and if using Messenger for SMS is something I'd do. But you do get the option to combine your platform of choice with standard messaging.

I don’t think FaceBook Messenger supports SMS on iOS. They could, there’s no system limitation preventing them to, and if they did, you could just hide the Apple Messages app and just use Messenger as your go to. It doesn’t require a “set as default” setting to do this. With browsers, it makes a bit more sense, since you open links from other apps, and then it automatically opens your default browser. But there’s no such advantage to “set as default” for messaging apps, you just hide one and keep the other front and center where you want to use it. 🤷🏼‍♂️

 

[bobcomer]

But on Android, you can (or at least could in the past) set Messenger

You still can.

 

[bcortens]

I don’t think FaceBook Messenger supports SMS on iOS. They could, there’s no system limitation preventing them to, and if they did, you could just hide the Apple Messages app and just use Messenger as your go to. It doesn’t require a “set as default” setting to do this. With browsers, it makes a bit more sense, since you open links from other apps, and then it automatically opens your default browser. But there’s no such advantage to “set as default” for messaging apps, you just hide one and keep the other front and center where you want to use it. 🤷🏼‍♂️

I think the only disadvantage of this is that tapping the notification for an SMS might still open Messages. You could of course disable notifications for messages and that would solve that problem but it is an extra step that would be solved by default apps. Just to be clear I do think Apple should allow users to change default apps.

 

[Kal Madda]

I think the only disadvantage of this is that tapping the notification for an SMS might still open Messages. You could of course disable notifications for messages and that would solve that problem but it is an extra step that would be solved by default apps. Just to be clear I do think Apple should allow users to change default apps.

I don’t think it would be bad if Apple added settings to change default messaging apps, I just think it wouldn’t make much difference because literally the only thing I can think of is notifications, and like you pointed out, you could just disable notifications for Apple’s Messages app. And my main point was that it’s currently doable without “set as default” settings.

 

[Any name]

And next year, you will get that, but Apple has to patch these holes because anyone could exploit them.

It’s a real pity that Apple lacks the resources to hire security experts by themselves and has to rely on external talent for audit purposes

 

[dk001]

Why is the onus on Apple to make the lives of their competitor's customers easier?

That questions shows the gap many here fail to consider: security and privacy.
By not helping to establish a standard, Apple is forcing its user base to use an unsecured, technically unsafe method of communication by default anytime the messaging communicates to a non-Apple device.

I would much prefer to have my default messaging have the 24/7 ability to use E2EE.

 

[dk001]

It is not a replacement for SMS.MMS. RCS runs at the user data layer just like ALL other messaging apps. It still falls back to SMS when necessary. In order for RCS to replace SMS it has to be adopted and supported by the carrier at the same privileged data layer used by SMS (tower signaling channel or some other process in todays architecture).

You really should read up on RCS.

 

[bgillander]

That questions shows the gap many here fail to consider: security and privacy.
By not helping to establish a standard, Apple is forcing its user base to use an unsecured, technically unsafe method of communication by default anytime the messaging communicates to a non-Apple device.

I would much prefer to have my default messaging have the 24/7 ability to use E2EE.

Many of us consider it, but really don’t have much concern about SMS security, as we don’t use it for anything where we care about security, as I won’t text my Android devices with anything I am concerned about and don’t have an interesting enough life that my conversations with others involve anything I worry about. Routing messages through a third party app that uses a loophole to piggyback on another system really seems like the worst idea for anyone that is truly concerned about security, though, so I don’t understand any security argument for Beeper Mini.

Apple already said they are adding RCS so I am fine waiting to see what exactly they add. I realize that I am an Apple customer for my Apple devices, but I am not an Apple customer for my non-Apple devices, so I have no expectation for them to make my non-Apple experience better. These days, considering the direction iPad OS is going on my iPad mini, I’m just wishing they would just stop making my Apple experience worse and still let me turn off multi-window, as it is not what I want on an iPad mini, as the controls are terribly placed for the smaller screen. iMessage security outside the Apple ecosystem is not really on my own wish-list, but I understand your concern and hope (and won’t be surprised if) they do address it.

 

[spazzcat]

It’s a real pity that Apple lacks the resources to hire security experts by themselves and has to rely on external talent for audit purposes

Every company has a channel for third parties to report bugs.

 

[I7guy]

That questions shows the gap many here fail to consider: security and privacy.
By not helping to establish a standard, Apple is forcing its user base to use an unsecured, technically unsafe method of communication by default anytime the messaging communicates to a non-Apple device.

I would much prefer to have my default messaging have the 24/7 ability to use E2EE.

Then hopefully apple locks this down so third parties can’t make use of the protocol even if it’s reverse engineered.