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No store here sells ultrasharps. That's my main problem in choosing I think ;). Why is it so hard to get a 24" standard gamut IPS monitor with only light anti glare coating in a 16:10 ratio and for a good price? I think with specials the u2314 wld end up costing about $150-200 more than the 2412m. Is it worth it? Are there any other good, affordable options?

In the UK, if you order online you have 7 days to change your mind and send it back. Is it the same in your country? If so do that. You will have to pay for shipping though (normally)
 
Now for software...

Well, I ordered the Dell u2413. It was on special and it seemed better in several ways - even if I do mainly run it in sRGB. Hopefully will get it tomorrow.
I'm not sure if I should start a new thread for this but in the meantime what would you advise as beginner software? I don't think I'm ready to subscribe to the adobe creative suite yet.
Adobe Elements? Lightroom? Appeture? Pixelmator?
Remember I have the 13" MacBook Pro retina which has 8 GB Ram and an integrated graphics card. My camera btw is a Canon 650 D - nothing flash (pardon the pun. :)) but it will take me a long while to outgrow it :).
 
It depends on what you want to do.

If you aren't planning on some serious photo manipulation I would recommend Lightroom. You can do a lot in LR - I shot a wedding for fun and edited about 100 photos (out of 1000) only using LR.
 
As I've said before I don't think it is very important at all. I think the wider color gamut is more important than hardware calibration. Unless you have a dozen or so computers that you will be plugging into the monitor. Then HW calibration would be easier than maintaining all those machines individually.

Absolutely false. Hardware calibration is a must. Five minutes on google will confirm this. Spend say $350 on a 24 inch IPS display and $100 on a Spyder4 express and you'll be very happy.

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Well, I ordered the Dell u2413. It was on special and it seemed better in several ways - even if I do mainly run it in sRGB. Hopefully will get it tomorrow.
I'm not sure if I should start a new thread for this but in the meantime what would you advise as beginner software? I don't think I'm ready to subscribe to the adobe creative suite yet.
Adobe Elements? Lightroom? Appeture? Pixelmator?
Remember I have the 13" MacBook Pro retina which has 8 GB Ram and an integrated graphics card. My camera btw is a Canon 650 D - nothing flash (pardon the pun. :)) but it will take me a long while to outgrow it :).

Aperture gets my vote. Many will argue it is in need of an update, perhaps that is true. A significant update is expected soon. Update or not, the application is intuitive, makes good use of screen real estate and delivers fantastic results. Lightroom is way too busy for my taste.
 
Absolutely false. Hardware calibration is a must. Five minutes on google will confirm this. Spend say $350 on a 24 inch IPS display and $100 on a Spyder4 express and you'll be very happy.[COLOR="

So hardware calibration of the monitor compared with software calibration of the graphics card makes a difference on Google? I don't understand why - unless you are using multiple monitors. :)
As discussed - you currently can't hardware calibrate a u2413 on a mac.
 
So hardware calibration of the monitor compared with software calibration of the graphics card makes a difference on Google? I don't understand why - unless you are using multiple monitors. :)
As discussed - you currently can't hardware calibrate a u2413 on a mac.

The differences between hardware and software calibration have become blurred during the course of this thread.

Software calibration typically means using an app to change the colours on the screen and then using your eyes to determine what is correct (Mac OS X has such an app built in) - System Preferences/Displays/Color tab/Calibrate. All I can say is that it is better than nothing...

Hardware calibration typically means using a hardware colorimeter such as a Color Munki, Spyder 4 etc. to calibrate the monitor, along with a compatible software app - far, far superior to the software/eye solution built into OS X and I would guess is what the majority of graphics pros around the world will use to calibrate their screens. Effectively this is a hardware+software solution and works on any computer+monitor combination (as long as the software is compatible with the OS). In this thread this has started to be called software calibration for comparison sakes with the built in hardware calibration in the Dell screen. So yes, you can hardware calibrate a u2413 on a Mac using this solution.

Another type of hardware calibration is the one found in the Dell monitor. This is built into the screen itself, so cannot be used to calibrate a different screen. This solution still requires a colorimeter, and as the Dell monitor demonstrates, the colorimeter must be compatible with the screen hardware too.

Hope that helps clear things up.



These are worth considering as alternatives to Photoshop, and are free or very cheap:
Gimp: http://gimp.lisanet.de/Website/Download.html
Pixelmator: search the Mac app store. It has great reviews and costs £10.49
I've never used either though, but they certainly look very good and have good reviews.
Photoshop Elements - affordable, but more expensive than the above programs. Although not identical, it will give you a reasonable grounding in the interface for the full version of Photoshop, should you ever upgrade to it.

Lightroom/Aperture
I prefer Aperture. As others have said, I prefer the user interface and you really can do a lot in the program - I do entire wedding edits using it, only going to Photoshop for heavy duty retouching (if required) or opening of closed eyes in a group shot! I'm guessing Aperture will be updated when the new Mac Pros are launched.

Lightroom is equally capable as Aperture (people will argue over which is the better program - I think they are both excellent so use the one you prefer using, and one or the other may have what you deem an essential feature which the other is missing - lens correction in Lightroom for example, which is something I don't use but some people use all the time), but I too find the interface less intuitive compared to Aperture.
 
The differences between hardware and software calibration have become blurred during the course of this thread.

Software calibration typically means using an app to change the colours on the screen and then using your eyes to determine what is correct (Mac OS X has such an app built in) - System Preferences/Displays/Color tab/Calibrate. All I can say is that it is better than nothing...

Hardware calibration typically means using a hardware colorimeter such as a Color Munki, Spyder 4 etc. to calibrate the monitor, along with a compatible software app - far, far superior to the software/eye solution built into OS X and I would guess is what the majority of graphics pros around the world will use to calibrate their screens. Effectively this is a hardware+software solution and works on any computer+monitor combination (as long as the software is compatible with the OS). In this thread this has started to be called software calibration for comparison sakes with the built in hardware calibration in the Dell screen. So yes, you can hardware calibrate a u2413 on a Mac using this solution.

Another type of hardware calibration is the one found in the Dell monitor. This is built into the screen itself, so cannot be used to calibrate a different screen. This solution still requires a colorimeter, and as the Dell monitor demonstrates, the colorimeter must be compatible with the screen hardware too.

Hope that helps clear things up.



These are worth considering as alternatives to Photoshop, and are free or very cheap:
Gimp: http://gimp.lisanet.de/Website/Download.html
Pixelmator: search the Mac app store. It has great reviews and costs £10.49
I've never used either though, but they certainly look very good and have good reviews.
Photoshop Elements - affordable, but more expensive than the above programs. Although not identical, it will give you a reasonable grounding in the interface for the full version of Photoshop, should you ever upgrade to it.

Lightroom/Aperture
I prefer Aperture. As others have said, I prefer the user interface and you really can do a lot in the program - I do entire wedding edits using it, only going to Photoshop for heavy duty retouching (if required) or opening of closed eyes in a group shot! I'm guessing Aperture will be updated when the new Mac Pros are launched.

Lightroom is equally capable as Aperture (people will argue over which is the better program - I think they are both excellent so use the one you prefer using, and one or the other may have what you deem an essential feature which the other is missing - lens correction in Lightroom for example, which is something I don't use but some people use all the time), but I too find the interface less intuitive compared to Aperture.

Thanks. This is very helpful on both counts :)
 
Absolutely false. Hardware calibration is a must. Five minutes on google will confirm this. Spend say $350 on a 24 inch IPS display and $100 on a Spyder4 express and you'll be very happy.

In terms of what the OP was referring to as hardware calibration it definitely is not false. Writergirl7 was continually talking about the difference between having the LUT on the monitor opposed to on the video card. And I stand by what I said. A monitor with a built in LUT and custom colorimeter isn't going to benefit most users. Particularly when the OP states that it will not work with her computer.

As for your last sentence I believe that I have said several times that a good colorimeter and wide gamut monitor is the way to go. In fact I spent $1000 on a 30" IPS display and $500 on the Spyder 4 Studio. ;)
 
As for your last sentence I believe that I have said several times that a good colorimeter and wide gamut monitor is the way to go. In fact I spent $1000 on a 30" IPS display and $500 on the Spyder 4 Studio. ;)

That's a waste of money for a beginner.
 
As for your last sentence I believe that I have said several times that a good colorimeter and wide gamut monitor is the way to go. In fact I spent $1000 on a 30" IPS display and $500 on the Spyder 4 Studio. ;)

Good for you.. but we are discussing the tools appropriate for a beginner.
 
That's a waste of money for a beginner.
I admit I'm no master, but seriously?

Good for you.. but we are discussing the tools appropriate for a beginner.
You obviously have not read my previous posts in this very thread. I repeatedly suggested that a monitor with built in LUT and custom colorimeter is not needed. The point of the line you quoted was simply that I chose a very similar path, even if on a slightly larger scale.

But thank you both for your snarky responses.
 
I admit I'm no master, but seriously?


You obviously have not read my previous posts in this very thread. I repeatedly suggested that a monitor with built in LUT and custom colorimeter is not needed. The point of the line you quoted was simply that I chose a very similar path, even if on a slightly larger scale.

But thank you both for your snarky responses.

You're welcome...

----------

This question tends to generate some interesting replies. :D

Aperture for excellent photo management and 99% of my editing needs. Pixelmator for that 1% of editing when I want to do something funky.

...Peter

Aperture gets my vote too. Very intuitive, great use of screen real estate and delivers wonderful results.
 
In terms of what the OP was referring to as hardware calibration it definitely is not false. Writergirl7 was continually talking about the difference between having the LUT on the monitor opposed to on the video card. And I stand by what I said. A monitor with a built in LUT and custom colorimeter isn't going to benefit most users. Particularly when the OP states that it will not work with her computer.

As for your last sentence I believe that I have said several times that a good colorimeter and wide gamut monitor is the way to go. In fact I spent $1000 on a 30" IPS display and $500 on the Spyder 4 Studio. ;)

Sounds like you have a good set up. From what I've read digital photography can be a bottomless pit for our$$ and we have to find a way to navigate that. I'm sure that the dell u2412m would have been fine but the 30% off on the u2413 was the decider for me. If I hate it I will send it back ;) but I think it will stand me in good stead for the next few years :). I will invest in the.suggested colorimeter too.. Just not this week ;)
 
backlight bleed

Okay - how much backlight bleed is 'acceptable'. It looks as if there is a fair bit in the bottom right of the screen. I took a photo but I'm not sure how to upload am image here.
 
Pictures of backlight bleed, don't tend to come out all that well. You can post a picture several ways, but the easiest is just to click on the manage attachment icon, and upload a jpeg.

As for what's acceptable, that's personal opinion. If you did get a bad one, just exchange it.
 
Pictures of backlight bleed, don't tend to come out all that well. You can post a picture several ways, but the easiest is just to click on the manage attachment icon, and upload a jpeg.

As for what's acceptable, that's personal opinion. If you did get a bad one, just exchange it.

I think I've managed to do it now...
 

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Display snobs may scoff but I've had good results from my Dell monitors. The 2408WFP died right before it's 3yr warranty ran out and they replaced it with the U2410. I think this would be a very good first monitor.
 
Facing similar decision ...

I am in similar boat as OP ... (well, he already pulled the trigger).

I have Dell U2412 and PA249Q on my scope ... They both provide 10bit LUT at comparable prices ... I was surprised to see that PA248Q is much cheaper, but then I realized it's only 8bit LUT (similar as Dell U2413 I believe).

Either monitor provides 100% sRGB coverage with more expensive models also covering 99% of Adobe gammut. I still wonder if "I" would see any difference.

Advantage of ASUS is, that it's available locally. Unfortunately, they do not have them on display to compare it in store ... I would have to buy both and compare them at home. Decisions.

I was also surprised to see lots of negative reviews for both expensive monitors. Not in terms performance, but rather QC. Number of stuck pixels and backlight bleed. Not really sure if this is really a concern or just small fraction of unhappy folks that post their bad experience on-line ...

I would like to hear from people who might have experience with both, Dell U2412 and ASUS PA249Q monitors ...

Thanks, R>
 
Please read my post from earlier, learn from the pros and learn it once and learn it right, no offence to all the helpful people here but its best it get your information from one good source and stick to that.
Should always save up for a high grade monitor its a waste time messing around on a low grade monitor that does not have even illumination and whatever monitor you end up with has to be hardware calibrated the first but essential step to a colour managed workflow.
This will be the best money you can spend as it will get your colour managed workflow all sorted out.
I have no connection with the Luminous Landscape other than being a satisfied customer.

http://store.luminous-landscape.com...in_page=product_info&cPath=26&products_id=281
 
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I am in similar boat as OP ... (well, he already pulled the trigger).

I have Dell U2412 and PA249Q on my scope ... They both provide 10bit LUT at comparable prices ... I was surprised to see that PA248Q is much cheaper, but then I realized it's only 8bit LUT (similar as Dell U2413 I believe).

Either monitor provides 100% sRGB coverage with more expensive models also covering 99% of Adobe gammut. I still wonder if "I" would see any difference.

Advantage of ASUS is, that it's available locally. Unfortunately, they do not have them on display to compare it in store ... I would have to buy both and compare them at home. Decisions.

I was also surprised to see lots of negative reviews for both expensive monitors. Not in terms performance, but rather QC. Number of stuck pixels and backlight bleed. Not really sure if this is really a concern or just small fraction of unhappy folks that post their bad experience on-line ...

I would like to hear from people who might have experience with both, Dell U2412 and ASUS PA249Q monitors ...

Thanks, R>

The u2013 is equivalent to the PA249Q. But Dell have specials that make the 2413 a lot cheaper than the Asus. The 2412m is the 8 bit monitor. My monitor had backlight bleed and Dell agreed I should send it back. They seem to be on the ball so I will get the replacement today and they will tell me how to send the first one back. The problem was with the panel and I think the Asus and the Dell use the same one but don't quote me on that :). So if there are QA issues the seller should sort it out. Hopefully.
It would be lovely to have the cash flow to buy an Eizo or NEC but I can't do this at this stage :)
 
Hope i did not come over as some Eizo Snob but have been through the learning curve( and still and will be always learning)
I have earned some of my income from Photography some which involved taking photos of very expensive hand made carpets and fabrics where colour accuracy was paramount and had to get a very accurate colour workflow organised.
Happy photography and enjoy your new monitor.
 
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