The extra fan cooling in my experience is effective. The temperatures remain a lot lower. The Noctua fan I went for was very quiet.
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MP 1,1-5,1 Cooler Northbridge on The Mac Pro 5,1 Dual CPU
- Thread starter drolson
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73°C is still well within specs. These wounded banshees keep on running even after 14 years, so why worry?
These NBs are just running hot by design. When suspicious, I would check power supply first instead of messing around with aluminum foil.
If it ain’t broke, don’t fix it.
Too noisy. Cooler north bridge means all the other fans nearby aren’t cranking up. CPU temps and NB all stay lower.
It has been replaced by a 7,1 so your cautions are not needed anymore. The 5,1 is just too old.
you mean the PSU? I already unmounted it , cleaned it with canned air and replaced the psu fan… PSU temps are now 30-42 degrees. I think thats not the problem…
under normal working conditions cpuA and northbridge goes up to 75 degrees. so to cool it down to mid 60s I need to push the fans up into a rpm-range that for some reasons create a humming noise that I would like to eliminate because i want to use the cMP for studio purposes. since I just cleaned the whole cMP, replaced thermal paste on NB and both cpus, replaced all fans except both cpus, I guess its a problem with cpuA fan (bad bearing) and a missing cooling of the nb. my idea is to cool the nb with a fan or to use a contraption like the aluminium foil tape so that I don't have to push the intake and cpuA so hard.
of course if you have another idea I am curious to hear it… thanks.
thanks for the hint. iam still a electronics beginner: instead of using a sata to 12v converter you are taking 12v from dvd bay where you also placed the controller?
looks great - but to hard for my poor soldering skills etc.
for a 3 pin noctua nb fan (NF-A6x25 FLX seems to fit) I would need something more straight forward… I still have 3 pin controller that I would like to use adjust the fan. how can I connect it?
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I mean the caps inside the PSU might have been degraded, causing ripples and unstable voltages which might result in an hotter NB.
Why you want it to cool it down to 60 in the first place? Why mess with the fanspeed profile? If fan noise is acceptable at 75°C, I wouldn’t worry.
There’s a distinct sound difference between a bad bearing (humming sound) and a fast spinning fan (noisy sound). If bearing is bad, just replace the bad fan.
Regarding re-pasting the thermal paste, what method did you use? 75°C is quite hot for CPUa. What’s your CPUa voltage? What’s are the following temps: ambient, NB diode and NB heatsink?
yes, that's possible, but since others here experienced the same nb temps on a dual core I guess its normal…
but who knows. is there a other way to findout about the caps than opening the psu?
quietness has the highest priority atm. but not on all costs. in summer I don't need a heater under the table …
so I think its a good idea to keep the Mac a bit cooler using an extra fan etc … at least the northbridge.
when I run my cMP with system driven fans (while writing emails, watching YouTube etc. )these are the temps and rpms:
to get rid of the racing fan bug I tried airout2 - but it seems not to work.
so I use tg pro or Macs fan control to get pcie and psu fan under control.
sure
I bought arctic mx-6 and the consistence was pretty viscous. so I put something in the middle of the nb, put the heatsink on it and moved it a bit to spread the thermal paste on the nb.
when I said working conditions it actually meant a quite cpu intensive process. as you can see in the screenshot above my cpu temps are pretty low at "idle" but can get up t o 80 degrees under load. at least that what I see here so far.
for CpuA voltage stats app reports:
CPU IA 0.992 V
You can't reduce power (amount of heat which enters your room) by adding a fan. In fact, adding a fan which dissipates a few watts adds up to the amount of heat the macpro puts into your room. The problem is that you THINK it's a good idea to add an extra fan while the NB is just designed for operating temperatures of 5-104ºC.
Let me highlight the disadvantages of adding a fan:
- consuming additional power (read: additional heat)
- adding additional noise
- adding EMI to power lines and if you're unlucky the wires of the fan will cause interference with the delicate high-speed signals on the CPU board (source for causing all kind of weird issues).
- obstruction of natural airflow
There are several methods, the reason I'm asking is many people are spreading the paste which causes air to be trapped in between. See one of my posts a while ago in this topic with the video on how to apply paste. Anyway your dT is 9ºC which seems to be fine for 23ºC ambient.
Your CPU IA seems a bit low, but I don't have a lot of info on this (1.0-1.2 is what I see often). It's within specs though.
This is what I did to reduce power dissipation (thus reducing fan speed and amount of emitted heat):
- removed all old rotating HD's (they dissipate even when idle!)
- used 2x X5675 CPU (3,06GHz) instead of 2x X5690. For a marginal performance cost, you're saving up to 35 Watts per CPU max!
- todo: exhange my old HD7950 GPU (200W TDP) for RX6600 GPU (132W TDP), increasing performance and reducing power
very interesting! thanks for going into details.
if I understand you right, than a cooler system(higher fan rates) will result in a hotter psu because of the higher voltage draw? than @drolson s idea (first post in this thread) might be worth a try… because no extra energy is necessary.
on the other hand what if I use a splitter from the intake fan connector so it would run intake and the extra Northbridge fan… will the fans run at half speed or will it just double the voltage draw?
I will think about all that and what I need… a single cpu tray might be more than enough for me.
according to your recommendation to just run the cMP a bit hotter I made a test, with all fans running system driven, except intake wich I manually set to around 900 rpm (otherwise smc would set it to 600). that way I could run a pretty hefty session with my nortbridge and cpuA at 76 degree maximum and with low hum/noise level.
regarding cpuA: when I changed nb thermal paste I realised that 3 pins on cpuA socket were bent. from what I saw two pins were "reserved" and one "vss"… just in case it is related to what you asked for.
if I understand you right, than a cooler system(higher fan rates) will result in a hotter psu because of the higher voltage draw? than @drolson s idea (first post in this thread) might be worth a try… because no extra energy is necessary.
on the other hand what if I use a splitter from the intake fan connector so it would run intake and the extra Northbridge fan… will the fans run at half speed or will it just double the voltage draw?
I will think about all that and what I need… a single cpu tray might be more than enough for me.
according to your recommendation to just run the cMP a bit hotter I made a test, with all fans running system driven, except intake wich I manually set to around 900 rpm (otherwise smc would set it to 600). that way I could run a pretty hefty session with my nortbridge and cpuA at 76 degree maximum and with low hum/noise level.
regarding cpuA: when I changed nb thermal paste I realised that 3 pins on cpuA socket were bent. from what I saw two pins were "reserved" and one "vss"… just in case it is related to what you asked for.
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No, the faster fan, the faster the heat gets thrown into the room. If you don't want a 'heater' under your desk in the summer, there's nothing you can really do rather than choosing lower power components (single CPU, removing unnecesarry hardware).
In fact, a fan consumes energy as well which is translated into heat as well. The more you add, the faster fans, the more energy is produced.
Newer technologies (components based on shorter wavelength / nm) generally consume less power for the same achievement. So that's why current systems don't need larger PSU's to have better performance.
Again, what's the problem with the higher NB temperature? As long as you don't experience issues, I wouldn't modify anything.
If it ain't broke, don't fix it
Attachments
@jo666 All you need is a Sheet of A4 paper and scotch tape and Mac fans software.
I Posted my journey in thread 'Northbridge Temp'
https://forums.macrumors.com/threads/northbridge-temp.2216892/post-30814820
I Posted my journey in thread 'Northbridge Temp'
https://forums.macrumors.com/threads/northbridge-temp.2216892/post-30814820
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thanks @Sean__Wong , did you still use your origami solution ? is it save in terms of the heat?
and how much degrees improvement did you get on the nb by using it?
and how much degrees improvement did you get on the nb by using it?
Still using as is
I should 3d print one but I’m just lazy
I posted a full write up here with graphs of the temperature performance under full test load.
https://forums.macrumors.com/thread...he-mac-pro-5-1-dual-cpu.2173519/post-28510208
I also included a picture of my Mac fans settings for minimal noise.
https://forums.macrumors.com/thread...he-mac-pro-5-1-dual-cpu.2173519/post-28510350
My Mac runs 24/7/365 so my only warning is make sure Mac fans is set up to run without login as the Mac built in SMC Dan controller won’t know you’ve got an adaptation fitted.
Try it out it’s only a piece of A4.
If you need help folding It I’m due to do a clean and dust so I’ll post the fold lines if you need.
I should 3d print one but I’m just lazy
I posted a full write up here with graphs of the temperature performance under full test load.
https://forums.macrumors.com/thread...he-mac-pro-5-1-dual-cpu.2173519/post-28510208
I also included a picture of my Mac fans settings for minimal noise.
https://forums.macrumors.com/thread...he-mac-pro-5-1-dual-cpu.2173519/post-28510350
My Mac runs 24/7/365 so my only warning is make sure Mac fans is set up to run without login as the Mac built in SMC Dan controller won’t know you’ve got an adaptation fitted.
Try it out it’s only a piece of A4.
If you need help folding It I’m due to do a clean and dust so I’ll post the fold lines if you need.
thanks for the offer. since you already made one that works it would be great to see your fold lines…
did you use simple scotch tape or something special?
After re pasting my Northbridge and putting new pins in it still runs hot, 84c without any fan adjustments with istat. With fans ramped up a bit I can keep it around 68c.
it always ran hot, but I was expecting it to come down after re pasting it. Photo attached is with apple stock fan settings.
Attachments
What's the delta T (NB diode temp vs NB heatsink temp)?
Edit: Oops now I see the attachment.
You're delta T is way too high! Something went wrong with the paste / heatsink mount.
Should be around 10ºC, this is mine currently.
thanks for posting, seems like 74C is pretty normal for a dual CPU 5,1 even up to 80, so I don't think I am that far off. My Mac Pro does live in a open closet and with my fans up 15% its sits at 70C I may give it another re paste attempt but it has always run hot and I have not had issues.
Delta T is a measure for the heat conduction from the die (NB diode) to the heatsink. I realized the fan is on so that might cause a higher delta T.
NB is specc’d for 110°C max so if fans aren’t too noise, I wouldn’t worry.
NB is specc’d for 110°C max so if fans aren’t too noise, I wouldn’t worry.
I've been taking advantage of the knowledge on here for a long time, but had to post this. I have 2 true 5,1's in my shop and today re-did the NB heatsink on one of them using the pins and method from the House of Moth NB repasting video. The second Mac Pro still has the original pins and any thermal paste left. iStat menus is reporting the CPU's tdiode temps are within 1 degree (46/39) while the old Northbridge is 78 and the repasted is 73. Ambient is 32. I think I'll be repasting the old one soon. Thank you macrumors! and house of moth!
Owning a 3D printer and getting ready to print another in ABS, I thought that material would be safe to put inside the machine in case of high temps.
I had to modify the design to improve printability and then do some post-printing work still to improve the fitment of the fan.
the vanes are so that it can be printed with that face to the printbed without any supports
While still allowing air to pass over the top to the CPUA cooler
I found the fan did not fit with the shelf, so I had to cut it out and fixing the screws using the fan's own M3 nut recesses impossible to reach the heads from the rear - reversed them and used thread-locker to ensure they stay there.
in place on the tray.
view from the case-door side.
Fan off NB=76C
Fan on NB=59C
the fan was a cheap USB powered one in order that I could test it with the rear USB ports running the cable out through a PCI slot cover. because there's no speed control, it's running flat out and is too loud for my tolerance, so an internal powered noctua or similar will need to be found for me to keep this mod. Maybe even just the tunnel without the fan fitted would be a small benefit coupled with fan control to increase the intake/exhaust fans base speed.
Clean your Air Intake and Heat Sinks.
I use a Garden leaf blower now gets it done in 45 seconds.
Before and After !
I use a Garden leaf blower now gets it done in 45 seconds.
Before and After !
Unless the 12 cores are absolutely needed I think a single CPU 6 core machine is nicer.
Thats what I use a lot and my dual X5690 machine is put away in the original box. The dual CPU machine is too noisy. I also went the fan route to cool the northbridge better and managed cooler than 60c temps.
I took power from the SuperDrive bay (no drives there - removed them).
I did have an idea of trying to make a larger heatsink but never got around to it. Others have gone this route and it apparently works. Involves grafting the original to a third party one.
I won’t write the full details, you can find online and then interrogate that person.
Thats what I use a lot and my dual X5690 machine is put away in the original box. The dual CPU machine is too noisy. I also went the fan route to cool the northbridge better and managed cooler than 60c temps.
I took power from the SuperDrive bay (no drives there - removed them).
I did have an idea of trying to make a larger heatsink but never got around to it. Others have gone this route and it apparently works. Involves grafting the original to a third party one.
I won’t write the full details, you can find online and then interrogate that person.
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My Northbridge idles at 78c. I'm sure its idled at 78c since I bought the machine in 2009. Although there are fun projects to add fans and cooling solutions I doubt it's necessary.
Based on the power-on time of my oldest hard drive, I'd conservatively estimate my northbridge has been idling at 78c for 7 solid years of power on time.
Blow out the dust every so often. Repaste the Northbridge every 10 years or so. Probably all the maintenance you need to do.
Based on the power-on time of my oldest hard drive, I'd conservatively estimate my northbridge has been idling at 78c for 7 solid years of power on time.
Blow out the dust every so often. Repaste the Northbridge every 10 years or so. Probably all the maintenance you need to do.