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TallManNY

macrumors 601
Nov 5, 2007
4,791
1,672
My friend's iPhone was really failing and he could upgrade so he went for S3 a month or so ago. He loves the bigger screen. Since it is plastic, it is light. And since it is thin it fits decently in his pocket. So right now, if you needed a phone, it would make sense to consider it.

But the iPhone 5 and iOS 6 together are going to push iPhone once more to the top of the heap. The longer screen will equalize some of the screen space advantages of Android phones and the LTE connection will equalize the speed advantage.

I'm upgrading from iPhone 4 as soon as I can. My iPhone 4 is in fine shape and causing no problems, but there is no reason not to use my subsidized upgrade right and get the newest iPhone. I really don't see any individual challenger to the iPhone until at least the end of the year. The some total of all androids will outsell the iPhone, but it is hardly a fair fight to compare dozens of products to basically 3 very iterative designs by the same company.
 

mattopotamus

macrumors G5
Jun 12, 2012
14,738
6,109
I think they could. I switched to a Galaxy S3 because ios6 is a joke to me. And the new I phone looks too similar to the 4.

I have to say this generation will be a turning point with Apple. They will probably lose this time, and regroup for something awesome next gen.

Ios and android are very similar both have lots of pros and cons. Don't let anyone fool you, android is almost as good as ios. Apple still has the best looking and feeling hardware.

I would put money on this being their best selling iphone to date. That seems to happen every single year. Visually the 4 and 4S were the exact same and it still was their best selling product, so to think a new phone that looks similar, but still very different will yield anything different is foolish.

LTE alone will really push current iphone users to upgrade as well as bring in some android users.
 

labman

macrumors 604
Jun 9, 2009
7,786
2
Mich near Detroit
yes eventually something will come along bigger, better, badder, faster this year next year 100 years from now. before you switch look how many threads there are I went android now I'm back.. when something is better I'll switch I love my iPhone but if somethings better well my loyalty is not that deep.. but it's not just about a bigger screen better camera the OS has allot to do with it and that's where Apple stays in the win colony.
 

randy98mtu

macrumors 65816
Mar 4, 2009
1,459
143
Put me in the camp too entrenched in the iTunes ecosystem to leave. When I consider the S3 (the only other phone that has gotten my attention since the original iPhone), I realize a few things about what I use my phone for.

- Phone
- Reading email
- Messaging, and 90% of that is through iMessage, so I don't have a text plan anymore.
- Camera
- iPod

When I use these criteria to compare devices, the choice is simple for me; iPhone. It has the best camera. Most of my friends are on iMessage. Phone and email are a wash. And I've got 6 years of play history in iTunes, playlists, etc that make it impossible to consider changing.

I would LOVE a revamped interface. I think the main thing that attracts me to the S3 is the large screen and widgets. I have jailbroken my 4, so I have widgets right now and I do like the refreshed look and UI. But at the end of the day, I want the best camera, iMessage and iPod. You could have the most mindblowing interface and device, but if I now have to pay another $20/mo for texting, or get all my friends/family to switch from what they are doing today on their iPhones, that is no good. Likewise if I have to go back to ground zero on my music setup... You get the idea.

In a way, I feel "stuck". But it's hardly a bad place to be stuck. I like what I see for the next phone. It's not earth shattering as I would like. I see nothing exciting about iOS6. But it has and does everything I want.
 

boomhower

macrumors 68000
Oct 21, 2011
1,570
56
Apple isn't going anywhere and the iPhone isn't losing stream. Sure, some people are dissatified and are leaving for Android but that is the minority. Let's put it in a little perspective. Last quater Apple made more off the iPhone alone than Microsoft did as a company in whole. Their going to be OK. They have more in the bank than a lot of major companies are even worth. They aren't going anywhere.
 

scaredpoet

macrumors 604
Apr 6, 2007
6,628
360
Now, with increasing competition, Android handsets have really taken off to the point that they've surpassed the iPhone in a number of key areas.
Behind multiple hardware manufacturers and some impressive software development by Google, I can actually say I'm a little jealous of phones like the Galaxy S3, HTC OneX, and some others.

These platitudes are great and all, and I know people like to spout them, but what specific "impressive software development" have you seen that you want? What good are "multiple hardware manufacturers" if at the end of the day, you will be buying a single phone?

You're looking for a faster processor... are you running BOINC on your phone that having a 2GHz mini-furnace will make things so much better? Is it worth having a wider screen if all of the apps on the platform aren't yet modified to take advantage of the different layout, leaving you with useless black bars on the sides?

As for phones making me jealous: I don't let hardware dictate my feelings. If a phone does something specific that will greatly improve something in my work or play, without wrecking all of the other things that my current device already does really well, then I will want it.

My question is whether or not Apple feels a greater sense of urgency with this upcoming keynote given that Google is gaining ground in a hurry.


We can already answer that question: the answer is no. Steve Jobs said it many times, and Tim Cook has been repeating the mantra: Apple is interested in making "the best products." And let's be clear, from Apple's viewpoint, "most" does not equal "best."

And, is Google really positioned to make Apple #2 in the mobile space, or will Apple respond with some major counter-punches?

Google HAS already done this, if you count market share in terms of OS platform. But... so what?

If Apple were truly concerned about market share, they would've either severely cheapened the Mac line, or dropped it entirely. If "most" equalled "best," then Apple's sub-10% marketshare in the desktop/laptop categories would've meant they were making pretty "lousy" products. But that just isn't the case... Apple makes millions of dollars in profit off Macs every quarter, and people who buy them, tend to love them.

While selling the most gadgets does wonders to Apple's stock price, I think people are seriously missing the point if they're biting their fingernails over the notion that Google is going to overtake Apple in adoption rate. You shouldn't buy something just because "most" people have it. You should buy something because it works and does what you need/want it to do, and does it exceedingly well.


Will you consider an Android device if the next iPhone is just "blah"?

No. I will consider an Android device when it does everything my iPhone does, and integrates so effortlessly with my other devices, in ways better than my current setup. OR if Apple screws the pooch so badly that it cripples the things I've grown accustomed to, and Android currently-stilted way of syncing and harmonizing ends up being less crummy.

But that would be a long, long way to fall.

And what does "blah" mean, anyway? How much faster does the CPU have to be... how many more cores? How big does the screen need to be for the next iPhone to not be "blah?"

I'm growing tired of people demanding that Apple "innovate" without laying out what they think "innovating" means.

I think I might. I don't buy a ton of apps and my music collection was mostly stolen in college years ago. The ecosystem is not as big of a "barrier to exit" as it may be for others.

The "barrier to exit" for me isn't about the expense of the apps (all in all, most of my apps are free, and the ones I paid for are pretty much in the sub-$2 category). For me, the barrier to exit is the loss of functionality. I've grown very accustomed to things working really seamlessly among my computers and devices, without having to spend a whole bunch of time MAKING them work this way. And for me a slightly faster CPU, or .5 inches of extra screen diameter just isn't enough to make me give that up.
 

Sedrick

macrumors 68030
Nov 10, 2010
2,596
26
They'll start to lose the 'race' as soon as people stop being excited about their 2 year re-design phone cycle. Will this happen anytime soon? Who knows. Apple could lose money for the next 10 years and still be in the race.
 

PatriotInvasion

macrumors 68000
Original poster
Jul 18, 2010
1,643
1,049
Boston, MA
And what does "blah" mean, anyway? How much faster does the CPU have to be... how many more cores? How big does the screen need to be for the next iPhone to not be "blah?"

I'm growing tired of people demanding that Apple "innovate" without laying out what they think "innovating" means.

"Blah" means more of the same amidst handsets that are attracting the interest of even the most dedicated Apple enthusiasts such as myself (see signature). As I stated, odds are greatly in favor of me getting the next iPhone and loving it just as much as I love my iMac/iPhone 4S set up now.

But, I think Apple's reluctance to address the two big points of Android differentiation - screen size and LTE, have finally begun to weigh on me. It looks like they'll be addressing that in a few weeks, but unveiling LTE as something new is a bit too late, and I'm not sure 176 extra pixels does much to change people's desire for a larger screen (especially since landscape screen height will remain exactly the same).
 

BaldiMac

macrumors G3
Jan 24, 2008
9,010
11,201
but unveiling LTE as something new is a bit too late

A bit too late for what?

and I'm not sure 176 extra pixels does much to change people's desire for a larger screen (especially since landscape screen height will remain exactly the same).

Maybe that's why it looks like the will be adding 112,640 extra pixels. :)
 

PatriotInvasion

macrumors 68000
Original poster
Jul 18, 2010
1,643
1,049
Boston, MA
A bit too late for what?



Maybe that's why it looks like the will be adding 112,640 extra pixels. :)

A bit too late to make it seem like an innovation. I live in Boston and we've had great LTE service from multiple carriers here for awhile.

And yes, it is 112,640 extra pixels...I just mean 176 pixels in height (or width in landscape)...you know what I mean. Changing the aspect ratio doesn't actually make the screen feel bigger...just taller (wider in landscape)
 

MacDawg

Moderator emeritus
Mar 20, 2004
19,823
4,504
"Between the Hedges"
A bit too late to make it seem like an innovation. I live in Boston and we've had great LTE service from multiple carriers here for awhile.

When the iPhone 4s came out, LTE was still not widespread, and certainly not enough to incorporate it in their phone when most people would be unable to use it

Now that it is available more widely, they will likely incorporate it
As far as I know, there is nothing "better" than LTE currently
So it would be hard to innovate beyond that
They are just using the best available for the most people

I am not looking for my iPhone to stay one or two steps ahead of Android at every turn
I am looking for a stable and consistent device with good battery and smooth experience in my work flow
 

PatriotInvasion

macrumors 68000
Original poster
Jul 18, 2010
1,643
1,049
Boston, MA
When the iPhone 4s came out, LTE was still not widespread, and certainly not enough to incorporate it in their phone when most people would be unable to use it

Now that it is available more widely, they will likely incorporate it
As far as I know, there is nothing "better" than LTE currently
So it would be hard to innovate beyond that
They are just using the best available for the most people

I am not looking for my iPhone to stay one or two steps ahead of Android at every turn
I am looking for a stable and consistent device with good battery and smooth experience in my work flow

Well, I'm sure my thirst for something new and improved will be quenched on September 12th. Probably just the result of 2 1/2 years of looking at largely the same thing (4 and 4S). I appreciate everyone's input.:)
 

BaldiMac

macrumors G3
Jan 24, 2008
9,010
11,201
A bit too late to make it seem like an innovation. I live in Boston and we've had great LTE service from multiple carriers here for awhile.

LTE is a standard. The innovation would be an implementation that respects size and battery life.

And yes, it is 112,640 extra pixels...I just mean 176 pixels in height (or width in landscape)...you know what I mean.

Hence, the smiley. You seemed to purposely misstate the pixel count to make a point. I tried to put it in perspective with the actual number.

Changing the aspect ratio doesn't actually make the screen feel bigger...just taller (wider in landscape)

I'm not sure how taller isn't bigger. I'm amazed at the number of times that I've seen this claim.
 

Tones2

macrumors 65816
Jan 8, 2009
1,471
0
After switching to the S3 and using it for 2 months, here's what I honestly think the iPhone does better:

1) Much better overall ecosystem - meaning a single source of system updates and purchases (iTunes), better apps , music and TV selection in iTunes. Upgrades available when released through Apple instead of waiting for carrier to release them 6 months later.

2) Definitely a bit smoother in scrolling and changing screens, although it's still pretty good in Android.

3) Much better looking icon shortcuts

4) Much lower audio latency from input to output - so you can run things like guitar amp simulators. Jelly Bean solves this problem for Android, but Jelly Bean is not available for the S3.

5) Better multimedia support in text messaging


However, to me that's really it. The huge advantages for Android are:

1) Huge 4.8" screen - Until you use a 4.8" for a SIGNIFICANT amount of time, you don't know how good it really is. Switching back to the iPhone seems like a toy. Rich screen colors and great black level - iPhone looks totally washed out by comparison.

2) MicroSDXC storage - You can have 32 GB and a 64 GB microsd card active at the same time AND swap cards if you need more room. Plus can get 128GB when it comes out. I can finally fit my entire music collection on the phone and still have plenty of room for apps. I no longer have to manage memory.

3) Replaceable battery - I can't tell you how much I missed this. Both the S3 and the iPhone 4S battery totally suck, but I can carry a spare battery with me for the S3 and swap it when i need to. So now I never have to worry about my battery anymore.

4) Workable USB - I can plug in additional flash drives (and have an additional 128 GB if I want on top of 32GB internal and 64GB microSD), external keyboards, gaming devices, etc. Everything works.

5) Very light and thin - Feels way better in my pocket than the iPhone 4S.

6) Widgets - I do use these all of the time. Live weather updates, trigger music players, facebook updates, etc. They do not significantly afect battery life.

7) Complete customization control in the OS. You can customize so much more in Android. You can get things like swipeable skinnable keyboards, live animated backgrounds, lots of lock screen options, etc.

8) LTE, NFC, Faster Processor -All things that the iPhone 5 will probably have, but the S3 has them now.

And a lot of other things. Yes, it really just matters what's important to each person (they are both good phones), but the S3 advantages to me far outweight the iPhone advantages. And a slightly faster taller 4" iPhone 5 with a new proprietary dock is not going to make any difference.
 
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Tones2

macrumors 65816
Jan 8, 2009
1,471
0
I'm not sure how taller isn't bigger. I'm amazed at the number of times that I've seen this claim.

It's not ENOUGH bigger. Plus I am 100% it will not scale old apps and you'll get a back bar acroos the top / bottom. Scaling to change aspect ratios by non-integer amounts will take too much processing power / battery life. So if this is true, for non-updated apps (the majority for a LONG time), it will not be any bigger.

----------

MacRumors added a new forum just for these posts!
https://forums.macrumors.com/forums/157/

I did not see that. Thanks.
 

irDigital0l

Guest
Dec 7, 2010
2,901
0
So, for years now, I've been an avid Apple fan. I've owned the black MacBook, 15" MacBook Pro, and my current 27" iMac. Along with those computers, I've owned the iPad 2, iPhone 3G, 3GS, 4, and now the 4S.

I've always felt like I was on the cutting edge of technology and had a leg up on every sucker out there with a crappy Dell spyware loaded computer and clunky Android device that was kinda, sorta like the iPhone, but not quite as good.

Now, with increasing competition, Android handsets have really taken off to the point that they've surpassed the iPhone in a number of key areas. Behind multiple hardware manufacturers and some impressive software development by Google, I can actually say I'm a little jealous of phones like the Galaxy S3, HTC OneX, and some others.

My question is whether or not Apple feels a greater sense of urgency with this upcoming keynote given that Google is gaining ground in a hurry. And, is Google really positioned to make Apple #2 in the mobile space, or will Apple respond with some major counter-punches? I'm sure there are threads like this, but looking for some fresh perspective. Will you consider an Android device if the next iPhone is just "blah"? I think I might. I don't buy a ton of apps and my music collection was mostly stolen in college years ago. The ecosystem is not as big of a "barrier to exit" as it may be for others.

And so could anyone else.
 

BaldiMac

macrumors G3
Jan 24, 2008
9,010
11,201
It's not ENOUGH bigger.

1) That's not what the poster I quoted said.
2) Enough bigger for what?

Plus I am 100% it will not scale old apps and you'll get a back bar acroos the top / bottom. Scaling to change aspect ratios by non-integer amounts will take too much processing power / battery life. So if this is true, for non-updated apps (the majority for a LONG time), it will not be any bigger.

I doubt Apple would resort to stretching out the app! :D

I'd bet on a simple recompile if anything to update an app that uses standard UI elements. Games and such with custom backgrounds would necessarily need to be redone to work with the new aspect ratio. But that would be true with any change to the screen size.
 

Mr Hill

macrumors 6502a
Apr 28, 2012
500
1
Charlotte, NC
iPhone nor Apple are losing steam anytime soon. I agree with what some others said above that this new iPhone will become the new best selling iPhone.

Android has come a long way, especially in the past 2yrs. The OS is a little more stable and some of the newer devices finally offer a smooth experience without much lag or delay like in the past.

I first got an iPhone back in 2008 with the 3G on AT&T and later after leaving them for T-Mobile (there was no AT&T 3G in the town I moved to at the time so I left), I got tired of edge speeds and experienced with several Android devices because I wanted 4G.

After using several of them (HTC G2, HTC Sensation, Galaxy S2, HTC One S, Galaxy S3, etc.) I always ended up going back to the iPhone.

1 - Battery Life - One common denominator in all of these Android handsets was that the battery life was inferior to whatever iPhone I had at the time. The Samsung ones were a little better than the HTC phones, but none of them could last the entire day like the iPhone. Android fans would say turn this off and turn that off, but then you're turning off many of the things that they claim make Android better than iOS. Use your GPS for a decent time on any of those handsets and the battery drains out very quickly.

2 - Smoothness - iOS has always been smooth and snappy. Switching between apps and screens was fast and easy. With Android there was always a delay or slight lag to everything. ICS has improved it but it's still not quite iOS smooth. Jellybean is supposed to address this finally but none of premium handsets have it yet

3 - Apps - Most of the apps that I use are common to both Android and iOS but it seems that the Android version of just about every app they share is either lacking in features or less stable than the iOS version. iOS also does have a few that I use that are not yet available on Android. As it stands iOS is still the primary platform for development.

4 - Updates/Support - If you go out and buy the newest iPhone then you're pretty much guaranteed to receive updates and support from Apple for at least the next 2 years minimum. With most Android handsets you might receive 1 software update, 2 in rare cases, throughout the entire life of the device. I shouldn't have to root a device that is barely a year old just to get a software update. It's not uncommon for your Android handset to be discontinued less than 1 year after it was released. Also for warranties and support you can walk into an Apple retail store and get face to face support or warranty exchanges on your device while with Android handsets you are required to do all your support over the phone or through carriers or third party insurance providers.

5 - Ecosystem - This one isn't a major issue for me since I've only actually purchased a few apps. It is convenient though. Been using iPods since 2005 and have my whole iTunes library of music very well organized playlists and all. Recently switched over from PC to Mac as well. When I got my HTC One S I noticed Android now has an app called Google Play Music that can sync your entire iTunes library to their cloud server and give you access to it from anywhere. This is a pretty nice feature but the it goes back to the apps. The music interface is a lot more clunky and laggy than the iOS music player.

6 - Backups/Restores - When you backup your iPhone and restore to a new one or to the same device, it restores everything on the iPhone and looks the exact same way that you left it. On my 4S I still have text messages dating back to 2008 from when I had my iPhone 3G. Upgrade to a new iPhone or get a replacement for any reason and you still have EVERYTHING. Game saves and all. As far as I know there is no equivalent type of backup for Android that save everything you had on the device, including they way you had your apps laid out. I can't count how many customers have come into my store pissed that their phone broke and they have to do a warranty exchange and realize that everything they had on their Android phone is gone and they will have to do it all again.

TL;DR
iOS just simply works. It gets the job done quickly and efficiently. 4" is a big enough screen for me. Those of you considering the switch to Android I encourage you to go ahead and try it. The novelty will wear off soon and you will be back.
 

Geckotek

macrumors G3
Jul 22, 2008
8,808
342
NYC
A bit too late to make it seem like an innovation. I live in Boston and we've had great LTE service from multiple carriers here for awhile.

And yes, it is 112,640 extra pixels...I just mean 176 pixels in height (or width in landscape)...you know what I mean. Changing the aspect ratio doesn't actually make the screen feel bigger...just taller (wider in landscape)

Why would it have ever been an innovation?? It was never an innovation from the perspective of a phone device. It was innovation from the wireless engineers that developed it. LTE is just another feature, nothing more. As usual, Apple let the technology mature until it fit their needs. If this surprises you and you want to be on the cutting edge, you're in the wrong place and need to move on to a flaky battery-sucking Android.

----------

1) Huge 4.8" screen

When are people going to get through their brains that "huge" and "mobile" are mutually exclusive terms?!?!? I don't carry a purse and don't plant to carry one anytime soon. I DO NOT WANT a HUGE phone. I want a MOBILE phone. The smaller it can be without making it too hart to operate, the better.
 

Tones2

macrumors 65816
Jan 8, 2009
1,471
0
2) Enough bigger for what?.

Most people's currently desireable size screen for video watching, internet browsing, etc.

I doubt Apple would resort to stretching out the app! :D

I'd bet on a simple recompile if anything to update an app that uses standard UI elements. Games and such with custom backgrounds would necessarily need to be redone to work with the new aspect ratio. But that would be true with any change to the screen size.

Apple would never stretch apps. That's my point.

A simple recompile MIGHT do it for very very simple apps assuming they designed the app without fixed positioning, but usually this would take at least some level of redesign, meaning then supporting 2 aspect ratios. XCode would have to be revised to support multiple aspect ratios, the same way that Android does now. So the developer would have to be an active developer willing to update that app for a new screen size initially, something maybe 50% of app developers would wind up doing.

If the app does NOT get recompiled / redeveloped, my guess is that Apple just puts black bars across the top and bottom, similar to how the iPad treats iPhone apps. Ugly and no real screen size advantage. This will apply to a LOT of apps. It'll takes YEARS for the majority of apps to support the new aspect ratio / screen size.

----------

When are people going to get through their brains that "huge" and "mobile" are mutually exclusive terms?!?!? I don't carry a purse and don't plant to carry one anytime soon. I DO NOT WANT a HUGE phone. I want a MOBILE phone. The smaller it can be without making it too hart to operate, the better.

When are people going to get through their brains that "huge" and "mobile" are NOT mutually exclusive terms. My S3 fits BETTER in my pocket than my iPhone does. Much lighter and thinner, and only sligtly bigger. IF YOU NEVER TRIED IT for an extended period, then you have no idea what you are talking about. :rolleyes:

If you think you need a purse then that's different issue. :D:p
 
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thecurryman

macrumors 6502
Jun 9, 2012
329
45
I think the reason why people are disappointed or complaining about screen size (the next iPhone being longer and not wider) is that most tasks that are done on the phone, use portrait mode which would benefit the most from being longer AND WIDER...for example: I'm in college, and all of my friends that have iPhones use the iPhone 80% of the time for texting (or imessaging)... The largest growing population of iPhone users is those less than 30 years of age! So how does making it longer improve texting? It doesn't at all! How does making it longer improve web browsing? Just because it's longer and vertically fits more info doesn't make it easier to read! If it wasn't for iMessages I'd have left iPhone long ago! If they just made the bezel smaller the phone would not only stay relatively the same demensions but the screen would be larger in BOTH directions!

And the op is right. There is a "race". The past 6 years apple has held the lead, but now the iPhone no matter how iconic or fluid it is, is being equivilized or surpassed by competitors! The iPhone 4 "stunne" the world. The next iPhone needs to "stun" the world! The real question is not if the new iPhone will sell really well it's first few months, but based on the apple tradition of keeping the look of the iPhone the same for 2 consecutive generations, can this phone with it's longer look and "features" continue to sell well for 2 years?
 

Geckotek

macrumors G3
Jul 22, 2008
8,808
342
NYC
When are people going to get through their brains that "huge" and "mobile" are NOT mutually exclusive terms. My S3 fits BETTER in my pocket than my iPhone does. Much lighter and thinner, and only sligtly bigger. IF YOU NEVER TRIED IT for an extended period, then you have no idea what you are talking about. :rolleyes:

If you think you need a purse then that's different issue. :D:p

But they are, the idea of something being mobile means it's easy to carry on my person at all times. The larger it is, the harder it is to carry....even just to hold in your hand for any length of time.

I dont need to try it for a long period of time, I have several friends who, after the newness and pride of owning a new device wore off, finally admitted to me that the screen is too big. They have issues reaching across the screen, they have issues doing things one-handed, they have issues fumbling with it, and they have issues placing it in some pockets.

Mobile devices should be shrinking, not getting larger. The day we have some sort of glasses mounted HUD (see Google glasses) will be the day I enjoy a larger display.
 
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