Got a tip for us?
Let us know
Become a MacRumors Supporter for $50/year with no ads, ability to filter front page stories, and private forums.
Dell's 2015 XPS 13 - A Real MBA Challenger
- Thread starter rittchard
- Start date
- Sort by reaction score
Thanks for the completely worthless input to this thread. Did you even read the original post where I discussed the use case?
I know, I know, don't feed the troll lol.
- - -
Anyway, this is not meant to be a "Mac OS vs Windows" discussion, it's a look at new hardware and design. Now obviously the real comparison doesn't begin until we see what Apple offers with its MBA update (that presumably also uses Broadwell). At that point there will be a more fair comparison.
However as it stands at this moment, for essentially the same price (again comparing the non-touch screen), this is a hardware design that has higher (~60% more pixels) resolution, significantly (~25%) longer battery life and (~12%) less weight. The glass trackpad and build quality seem to be getting good reviews. So it very much is a *hardware* challenger to the current MBA design.
It Still has a crappy touch pad, keyboard, CPU, poor display color/color temperature accuracy, abysmal reliability like all windoze ultracrapbooks. It's not even in a league to be considered as a challenger.
----------
You have absolutely no idea what you're talking about on either the PC or Mac side. If you think Macs and OS X are perfect, you must have never read any posts here.
My 2011 MBA still runs perfectly without issues whatsoever! Never had problems with OS X updates at all. Never overheats and never lags nor slow down, even when running 5 1080p flash videos simultaneously! Windoze is already slow as molasses out of the box and even just after clean install windoze updates. That's my experience whenever I use Windoze laptops.
XPS 13 looks nice but I'm sort of leaning towards the new 3rd gen Thinkpad X1 carbon since they have top notch keyboard and I prefer the workflow ergonomics of touchpoint nub over touchpad since it doesn't require moving hands from home keys. They're also durable with my ~2008 Thinkpad x61s still running great with Windows 8.1 Pro. Unfortunately, a lot of professional software like OrCAD, Pro/Engineer, Inventor, SolidWorks, etc. only run on Windows so Macbook Air isn't an option along with the pixelated low resolution.
Nope, you can buy the signature edition from microsoft store, and actually a clean fresh windows install without the add-ons is pretty good.
This is my next laptop! I have a 4+ year old Dell Vostro V130 (All aluminum, it was a beautiful laptop, and still running!). Once Windows 10 is released I am getting me this one. AMAZING design, well done dell!
XPS 15 hasn't been updated just yet. It might get the same treatment.
I too wish the new XPS 13 has a 16GB option in this era...would have essentially made it perfect. We'll see about the XPS 15.
If Apple doesn't release a new Macbook Air w/ a retina level screen (not the portless 12") then I might seriously consider one of these myself.
I already moved back to a custom built PC for my desktop machine as I simply couldn't get the GPU horsepower needed from either the iMac or Mac Pro. Apple portables and iphone/ipad is all I have left. While I LOVE Mac OS and all my apps I've picked up over the past ~8-9 years, being stuck between two ecosystems really sucks.
Edit: Looks like the XPS 15 did get updated, just not available for sale. Definitely did NOT get the same treatment but a 4K screen option. Oh well.
Last edited:
If that's truly the case, then Windows laptops have lost the one valid advantage they had over Mac laptops: the ability to install any OS, including a clean version or open source version, that you like. For the longest time, tight vertical integration was a sticking point for a lot of people who had issues with Macs. Now apparently, Windows laptops are "just as bad."
This would also seem to mean that the manufacturer would have to customize every version of Windows going forward for that model for it to be "optimal." What if I wanted to upgrade to Windows 10 (which, if I were stuck on Windows 8.x, I'd defintiely want to do ASAP)? I would hope that any windows laptop I buy today, less than a year out for Windows 10, would be able to run it without losing features or functionality.
Last edited:
^ no Thats not true.I have installed fresh win7 on acer and it increased in speed and battery time
Of course it'll increase in battery life. You have less background programs running so CPU tends to stay longer in the power saving state. Also, since there's less programs zapping unnecessary CPU load, your primary programs will run faster. This is easily seen by running benchmark programs.
----------
You always clean install Windows. It's just a lot harder compared to previous years since you have the UEFI, secure boot, GPT style partition which is a lot harder to deal with compared to legacy BIOS and MBR partition style.
Manufacturers still provide drivers, but my greatest gripe is they're bundled with crap and are so buggy that it made switch to Macs which works perfectly in my case. Perfectly working and blazing fast machine out of the box. Nobody would want to clean install Windows on a brand new laptop just to get the long battery life and speedy experience that it should've been if it weren't for OEMs putting loads of crap in those laptops.
Like it or not, this is the reality of maximizing power efficiency and system stability. It's not to say that you can't install a generic Windows installation, but rather that you won't get the optimal experience, which frankly has long been the case; it's only now that the tight integration offers real improvements for average users (great battery life, fast startup, reliable sleep, etc). For years if you pieced together your own machine there was the possibility of all sorts of low-level things not working perfectly.
Seriously. With phones and tablets getting bigger, I see no need for 13" small laptops. You are going to need a bag anyway. I would rather take a 17" MacBook Air. My phone is 5.5" and my tablet 10". Hate the small screen on my 13" Air and 13" rMBP (my girlfriends). Even my 2007 MBP 15" was better.
Disagree. Intel is integrating more and more into the CPU and chipset--graphics, sound, all your ports (SATA, USB, Thunderbolt), etc. Motherboards don't have much else on them these days. And of course Windows has optimal support for these common chips.
If anything, a clean install of Windows will better support a modern system than it would have 5 years ago.
I saw this at a store the other day. I expected to like it, but didn't. Immediately noticeable is the strange, carbon-fiberish pattern they put on the keyboard/trackpad tray. It seemed cheap to me. The screen on the one I saw was matte and had a "sparkly" effect when looking at solid areas of white. It reminded me of flat-panel screens from 10 years ago. Instead of four feet, it has two long "bars" on the bottom which makes it feel weird when you're holding it and makes the laptop seem thicker than it is. The two-tone design (metal on the outside, black plastic on the inside) makes it look thicker than it is too, in my opinion.
Too bad, based on all the glowing reviews I thought Dell had really hit this one out of the park, but I was extremely underwhelmed.
If you say so. But when it's clear that what's coming straight from Dell, Lenovo, and Microsoft themselves is hardware that is ever more tightly integrated into the software, I'll trust the people actually responsible for performing these integrations...
Why is it that even with bog-simple Intel processors in them, devices like the Surface Pro receive specialized firmware updates that often greatly improve the efficiency of core components of the device?
My point is that Dell, Lenovo, etc. aren't making tightly integrated hardware. They're slapping some Intel chips on a motherboard, for the most part.
Not sure which firmware updates you're talking about exactly, but firmware isn't the OS. You can install and use firmware updates independently of which OS you're running: original Windows, stock Windows, even Linux. So that's not relevant to the conversation of whether or not it's smart to run stock Windows vs. whatever came on the machine.
This is not the case with the Surface Pro. Microsoft ships firmware updates as part of the Windows Update process that actually requires flashing the low level hardware of the device.
http://blogs.technet.com/b/surface/...es-to-get-more-from-your-surface-devices.aspx
----------
If you have ever attempted to rebuild a stock Lenovo image from a generic Windows install, you'd know that it's not trivial. Lenovo and Dell, just like Microsoft, have their own system drivers that greatly improve the battery life, startup and shutdown times as well as the reliability of actions like sleep. Even getting these installed properly after the fact is not easy at times because even with access to the drivers from their support sites, one driver may depend on another, and not function properly if not installed in a specific order.
First, they didn't put a "strange, carbon-fiberish pattern" anywhere. The computer is made of carbon fiber. They left it exposed as a design element. Have you ever seen the real thing before? You criticize the carbon fiber for looking "cheap", the feet on the bottom for not being like Apple's, and my personal favorite, the matte display for looking like... a matte display. It sounds like you were nitpicking it because you were looking for reasons not to like it.
Okay, but my point is that as long as you can get this firmware on your device, then which OS you're running is irrelevant. And I assume you can get these firmware updates from Windows update using a stock version of Windows just as easily as whatever Microsoft installs at the factory.
(BTW -- firmware is the stuff that you flash onto your low-level hardware, so we are actually talking about the same thing.)
What's misleading is the Gizmodo article of course mentions the high-res screen, but neglects to mention that it's not available at that $800 price—you have to pay $1299. At that price you're getting a worse processor and graphics performance for a lighter body and higher-rez screen; it's a competitor to the rMBP, not an Air.
It is interesting, though, because I presume Apple will eventually go to carbon fiber over aluminum as they reach the limits of thinness without sacrificing durability. (Either that, or they go back to titanium and don't paint it this time or something?)
Wait for the retina Macbook Air.... don't make any decisions until it's out.
(in the same vein, unless you need it, don't get the current MBA. It's pretty long in the tooth by now....)
Otherwise if you need it now, then feel free to choose whatever laptop suits your needs.
(in the same vein, unless you need it, don't get the current MBA. It's pretty long in the tooth by now....)
Otherwise if you need it now, then feel free to choose whatever laptop suits your needs.
No, I did want to like it. Maybe my expectations were too high from the reviews or I expected it to be more Apple-like because of this thread.
I didn't know the inside was actual carbon fiber. That's pretty cool, I guess. It still looked and felt like cheap plastic with a distracting pattern to me.
I noticed the feet on the bottom because when I picked up the laptop, I couldn't find a comfortable way to grip it. I assumed the store had installed some kind of anti-theft device on the bottom and turned it over to realize that the feet extended for the entire width of the laptop, in a position where I couldn't quite use them as handholds to hold the laptop when it was closed. So in addition to looking odd (to me), I also don't like the practicality.
As for the matte display, I don't have anything against the idea of matte displays. I use one with my desktop computer all day. The display on the Dell I saw had a more pronounced "sparkle" effect than my desktop display, which reminded me of much older monitors. Although now that I think about it, it might have been a version of the laptop with a touch display (if those exist)... I know adding a touch panel to a laptop display is often criticized for lowering the image quality, and particularly adding the sparkle effect.
I have dealt with this with Dell for years (decades...). The basic functionality isn't a problem; it's often better with a clean install. What gets difficult is the hardware-related utilities that Dell installs, such as the software that implements various hardware button functionality and software that implements Dell battery charging functions. I have sometimes had a lot of trouble getting the right version of these to work with the hardware and software on a given computer.
I will say this: Dell has stolen a march on Apple with this design.
Here's hoping the MBA12 has a border on it like that thing. It would be awesome.
The Dell XPS13 may look great, but it missing the selling point that brought me to the MBA: the magsafe power jack.