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Embracing Early Intel
- Thread starter MacFoxG4
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Early enough? Ignore the Mac Mini (although I count it as early anyway), I'm just using it to connect via screen sharing to the 17" MBP.
Yeah, that 17" MBP is connected to a 50" rear projection TV.
Awesome! The "Room of Requirements" 😍Early enough? Ignore the Mac Mini (although I count it as early anyway), I'm just using it to connect via screen sharing to the 17" MBP.
Yeah, that 17" MBP is connected to a 50" rear projection TV.
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Well, it's the garage and my space yes.
That particular section (where the Mini and MBP are) is the Gamemaster's area. Rolemaster, AD&D, etc. All the stuff that made me a pariah of polite society in the 80s, 90s and early to mid 00s…but that has major movie actors involved now.
But it's an absolute mess. We moved in 2.5 years ago and I still haven't gotten it cleaned up.
Too many Macs, LOL - I can relate
LOL. The idea is that if I have a group of gamers over, the Mini is the Mac I'm using to run a gaming session, while the MBP is going to be displaying maps and any other player stuff I want the players to see on the rear projection TV.Too many Macs, LOL - I can relate
Since I'm using the MBP mainly to support what I'm doing on the Mini I don't need it's main screen open, nor do I want to go through the hassle of making it not sleep in clamshell mode. So, it's unlatched but closed (so the monitor can fit over it) and set to never sleep (but allow the display to turn off).
Now, since the last time I had anyone over to game was in 2009 (I think) and the last time I used Skype to game was maybe (2016 or so) the likelihood of it happening is not very good - but I always cling to hope. Given the time to do so, I am as obsessed with fantasy roleplaying as I am with my Macs. That all started before computers for me and when my wife met me, I was gaming with a group for 6-7 hours on Saturdays and Sundays for years.
It's something I am eternally grateful to my wife for in that she never demanded I give it up.
But yeah, a majority of the Macs I have are set up in such a way as to support every aspect of the fantasy gaming I like to do.
How is the reliability on the early early MBPs in your experience? I've thought about picking up a 17 inch, just to have a semi modern 'PowerBook' about, but they seem to have problems galore.
I have an early 2008 MBP (thank you @bobesch) that does just fine. Periodically, I will check the lane width that the GPU is reporting. I'm told that the loss of lane width is an indicator of GPU problems. I got this Mac sometime in late 2017 I think (may have been 2018).
Right now it's handling Mojave real well (with the patcher). I've even converted the 500GB SSD I dropped in to APFS.
Honestly, a mixed bag for me. I've had two 2007 15" MBPs. One is currently sitting on top of my bookshelf because its GPU died a few years back, the other is the one you saw in the picture that's been working great. Granted, I tend to avoid laptops with dGPUs like the plague, and when I do have one, I treat them with kid gloves. I have MacsFanControl set on the 2007 to ramp the crap out of the fans to keep it cool. I can count the number of times I've fired up the GPU in my late 2008 on one hand; I run it off the 9400M only; I know the 9600M in it works fine because I test it every few months, but the risk doesn't seem worth it.
To be fair, I'm scarred from working in a computer repair shop right around when the GPU plague from 2008-2012 hit Macs and PCs alike; I've worked on too many HP DV series laptops to trust any laptop with a dGPU any more
Also, I don't use the 2007 for much other than writing and role-play, mostly because it's one of the machines hard-limited to 10.11.
I have a 2007 15" MBP with a revised GPU and it's been running great. Personally, I wouldn't touch a 2007/early-2008 MBP that has not had its GPU replaced/revised with a ten-foot pole. All my later MBPs lack discrete GPUs for good reason.
I have a 2006 17" MBP that works great, easily one of my favorite Macs. I do keep the fans ramped up with Macs fan control/smcfancontrol, otherwise it gets quite hot. The ATI X1600 also had issues with failures, overheating being a cause. It's not nearly as common as on the 2007/2008 models, but it can happen. I would recommend keeping the fans turned up and you should (hopefully) be good to go.
I have also heard that vertical lines can appear in the display after a time, which is possibly unrelated to GPU failure and is an issue with the panels themselves. I am unaware of issues with the 15" other than the aforementioned GPU failure.
I wouldn't mind getting a 2007, as it's the newest laptop that will run Tiger and gets up to El Capitan officially, but with how touchy the GPUs are it would have to be a really good deal.
I have also heard that vertical lines can appear in the display after a time, which is possibly unrelated to GPU failure and is an issue with the panels themselves. I am unaware of issues with the 15" other than the aforementioned GPU failure.
I wouldn't mind getting a 2007, as it's the newest laptop that will run Tiger and gets up to El Capitan officially, but with how touchy the GPUs are it would have to be a really good deal.
The early 2008 will unofficially run Tiger just fine and can go past EC - it's just as dangerous as the 2007 though.
Does sound work out of the box or do you need an external DAC? I have my 2008 20" iMac running Tiger, it works 100% other than no sound. I have to use an external DAC for it.
I don't have one to check but since the 2008 is identical to the 2007 save for the newer CPU and trackpad (which has just basic functionality in Tiger) it should.
I wonder if the 17s are more reliable, given the somewhat bigger chassis (so in theory more cooling). Perhaps blasting MacsFanControl is sufficient.Honestly, a mixed bag for me. I've had two 2007 15" MBPs. One is currently sitting on top of my bookshelf because its GPU died a few years back, the other is the one you saw in the picture that's been working great. Granted, I tend to avoid laptops with dGPUs like the plague, and when I do have one, I treat them with kid gloves. I have MacsFanControl set on the 2007 to ramp the crap out of the fans to keep it cool. I can count the number of times I've fired up the GPU in my late 2008 on one hand; I run it off the 9400M only; I know the 9600M in it works fine because I test it every few months, but the risk doesn't seem worth it.
To be fair, I'm scarred from working in a computer repair shop right around when the GPU plague from 2008-2012 hit Macs and PCs alike; I've worked on too many HP DV series laptops to trust any laptop with a dGPU any more
Also, I don't use the 2007 for much other than writing and role-play, mostly because it's one of the machines hard-limited to 10.11.
I’ve often wondered the same! I’d imagine that with more room inside, a better and more effective heat pipe system could be put in; whether that happened, I’ve never had a 17” to play with. I’ve always personally enjoyed small laptops - a 12” PowerBook got me through college, and most of my Intel machines have either been 11” or 13” (though I have been using that 2008 15” fairly regularly in my classroom this school year!), so the 17” systems have always been somewhat exotic to me
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Yep, more internal space and larger surface to spread the heat, that's how it feels compared to the 15" early-intel MBP.I’ve often wondered the same! I’d imagine that with more room inside, a better and more effective heat pipe system could be put in; whether that happened, I’ve never had a 17” to play with. I’ve always personally enjoyed small laptops - a 12” PowerBook got me through college, and most of my Intel machines have either been 11” or 13” (though I have been using that 2008 15” fairly regularly in my classroom this school year!), so the 17” systems have always been somewhat exotic to me
On recommendation of @eyoungren I'm happy use iStatMenus to monitor CPU/GPU activity, temperatures and fan speed and I also use it's advanced fan settings. It's pretty nice to see all setting at a glance in the menubar, given that the 17" screen has enough space to fit all in.
Nevertheless I always use an iLapStand at home and Just Mobile "Lazy Couch" for on the go, to keep both 15" and 17" MBP cool.
The early-2008 17" also seems to sport better subwoofers since the sound seems to me quite a little bit better compared to the 15" model. Due to it's 3 USB-port and an optional USB 3.0-PCExpressCard, there are also enough USB-ports to find a spare one to plug in the Twelve South BassJump subwoofer ...
The only drawback of the 17" is, that it won't fit into a lot of my bags.
You need a bigger bag.
Time was I could fit two 17" PowerBooks into my bag and then later on one 17" PB and one 17" MBP. The bag I have I got at Goodwill in 2001 I think. Originally, it was some sort of CableTV technician bag I think.
I like to use this backpack. Reminds me to old times, when the same model was my companion at high-school.You need a bigger bag.
Time was I could fit two 17" PowerBooks into my bag and then later on one 17" PB and one 17" MBP. The bag I have I got at Goodwill in 2001 I think. Originally, it was some sort of CableTV technician bag I think.
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But upholstering of the laptop-case is really insufficient and my bad habit to throw it onto the backseat of my car came out to be a shape-shifter to the MBP's Apple-Logo.
Now I know, what made them change the Apple-Logo in 2007!
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If anyone is interested in some custom software builds for Intel OS X 10.5 this would be the right place to look:
forums.macrumors.com
Some custom software builds for Mac OS X Leopard
I always found it a bit irritating how quickly 10.5 support was dropped by developers back when 10.6 hit the shelves, whereas its successor enjoyed support for a much longer period of time, so I've made a descision to take matters into my own hands by compiling some 10.5 compatible software...
forums.macrumors.com
In my own experience with the both 15" CD MBP 1,1 and the 15" C2D MBP 2,1, they're...okay machines. Their aesthetics simply blow the A1181's I have out of the water; IMHO their aluminum exteriors age well in a way that even the black A1181 doesn't.
The problem with the early Intel MacBook Pros (again IMHO) is there isn't really a definitively "safe" model that's reliably free of GPU issues, short of getting a 2008 Santa Rosa motherboard and replacing the GPU yourself with a chip from a revised production batch, like dosdude1. You're more likely to get a unit on the used market with a reliable GPU if you get one of the aforementioned A1150s or A1211s, since the Radeon Mobility X1600 didn't suffer from the same production problems as the 8600M GT. But then you run into the issue with the MacBook Pro's problematic cooling architecture, which effectively uses the entire case as a heatsink. It's for that reason that GPU failures due to overheating with the X1600 were not uncommon (but they weren't quite widespread enough to warrant a lot of negative attention).
In the end, I wouldn't recommend against getting an early MacBook Pro, as long as you're aware of the risks and issues, and as long as you're okay with it dying sooner rather than later.
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Interesting about the ATI failures. I never heard much about those failing but I was never into Macs around that time. They look like a fun project though.
Sorry for being nitpicky but A1150/A1151 are the Core Duos, the C2Ds being A1211/A1212.