Other Eye-strain while using iPhone X and up

[MICHAELSD]

Yep! I agree 100% that it would undercut their more expensive models. I’d still buy it if it were 5.5” with the bezels like the 8+ I have, but an a14 and maybe 4gb ram. And I need 128gb

Despite the rumors it seems more likely to be the old 5.5” design, as that would fit into the current lineup. It is possible we’ll also see a new 6.1” LCD phone at a higher price point. I’d take a look at it and I think the old Plus design is still popular, but at that size I’d rather have no bezels at all.

In other news I found a buyer for my 8+ since the trade-in window expired but mild migraines still pop up during and after using the 12 Pro Max most of the time. I’m the type of person who loves this phone enough to go against logic and keep it, but I think it’d be more responsible to get rid of it if I could only bring myself to reset it and return it tomorrow.

 

[MICHAELSD]

For anybody that comes into this thread and is confused about what we’re talking about, I took a slo-mo video to better demonstrate the PWM flickering on iPhone 12 Pro Max:

 

[tonybarnaby]

Despite the rumors it seems more likely to be the old 5.5” design, as that would fit into the current lineup. It is possible we’ll also see a new 6.1” LCD phone at a higher price point. I’d take a look at it and I think the old Plus design is still popular, but at that size I’d rather have no bezels at all.

In other news I found a buyer for my 8+ since the trade-in window expired but mild migraines still pop up during and after using the 12 Pro Max most of the time. I’m the type of person who loves this phone enough to go against logic and keep it, but I think it’d be more responsible to get rid of it if I could only bring myself to reset it and return it tomorrow.

How much are 8+ going for? I’m seeing about $300

 

[MICHAELSD]

How much are 8+ going for? I’m seeing about $300

That’s about right. Honestly the Apple trade-in is better since it’s $210 + it saves sales tax and hassle.

If I sell it for $300 I end up paying $30 in fees (under eBay’s new in-house payment processing, otherwise it’d be an extra $9 for PayPal) + $20 for insured shipping. The net is about $25 more, but it’s additional effort and hassle especially if there’s an issue with the shipping or the buyer is unhappy. Apple’s trade-in values are strong and mostly fair across all of its products.

 

[tonybarnaby]

That’s about right. Honestly the Apple trade-in is better since it’s $210 + it saves sales tax and hassle.

If I sell it for $300 I end up paying $30 in fees (under eBay’s new in-house payment processing, otherwise it’d be an extra $9 for PayPal) + $20 for insured shipping. The net is about $25 more, but it’s additional effort and hassle especially if there’s an issue with the shipping or the buyer is unhappy. Apple’s trade-in values are strong and mostly fair across all of its products.

Yep. I took the $210 for my kids 8+ when I got her an 11. I’ve sold tons of phones on swappa and it is just a bother on a phone worth ~$300

 

[tonybarnaby]

Michael, did you decide for sure to keep the phone?

 

[MICHAELSD]

Michael, did you decide for sure to keep the phone?

Honestly I’m torn. I still get light migraines even as I’m typing this, but I’ve been admittedly enjoying this phone probably more than anything I’ve purchased in the past few years. It’s absolutely fantastic in every way imaginable; unfortunately, there’s no getting around the PWM flickering.

I already know from iPhone X that there’s no sense holding out hope that Apple will release a software update that will improve the experience. I’d gladly keep this phone for 2-3 years, and I used to upgrade annually, if the display didn’t flicker. It’s that good, and such a massive jump from what’s come before it.

Side note: I feel like researching PWM has become a sort of hobby for us as we wait every year for an advancement that eliminates it completely. I’m just not sure how much longer we’ll be waiting, or if we’ll even see a flicker-free OLED display on an iPhone.

 

[tonybarnaby]

Honestly I’m torn. I still get light migraines even as I’m typing this, but I’ve been admittedly enjoying this phone probably more than anything I’ve purchased in the past few years. It’s absolutely fantastic in every way imaginable; unfortunately, there’s no getting around the PWM flickering.

I already know from iPhone X that there’s no sense holding out hope that Apple will release a software update that will improve the experience. I’d gladly keep this phone for 2-3 years, and I used to upgrade annually, if the display didn’t flicker. It’s that good, and such a massive jump from what’s come before it.

Side note: I feel like researching PWM has become a sort of hobby for us as we wait every year for an advancement that eliminates it completely. I’m just not sure how much longer we’ll be waiting, or if we’ll even see a flicker-free OLED display on an iPhone.

Isn’t it past the 14 day return period?

 

[MICHAELSD]

Isn’t it past the 14 day return period?

I have a label printed out and the return is still active. Technically shipping labels will scan for at least a month and they should accept it once it reaches the returns center, but I should decide by the end of the week.

 

[tonybarnaby]

I have a label printed out and the return is still active. Technically shipping labels will scan for at least a month and they should accept it once it reaches the returns center, but I should decide by the end of the week.

I’m not so sure that’s how it works. I think if you returned it in 3 weeks it would be denied, but it’s just an assumption. If you sell your 8+ you’ll really have to make a hard decision and could be forced to keep the 12, even with the headaches.

 

[MICHAELSD]

I’m not so sure that’s how it works. I think if you returned it in 3 weeks it would be denied, but it’s just an assumption. If you sell your 8+ you’ll really have to make a hard decision and could be forced to keep the 12, even with the headaches.

From past experience I don’t think it will be an issue. Thankfully Apple is great with returns, and from what I’ve seen on Reddit and other forums I don’t think they’ll make anyone suffer from PWM-induced symptoms.

I think the value of the feedback I’ve provided on forums like this well exceeds the value of the phone, and while it’s better for a consumer to keep it they’ll just end up refurbishing it — and this phone has no damage whatsoever since I’m extremely careful.

This would be so much simpler if they had a setting in Accessibility or gave us a brightness level with no flickering. I could work with either of those options. I should probably emphasize that I don’t want to return this phone and would gladly keep it if I didn’t get migraines/headaches from it.

My day with this phone basically involves waking up with a light migraine/tension headache, then picking up the phone about an hour later and getting light migraines though it’s become more mild the longer I use it. The more time I spend on this phone the more I’m able to use it for longer periods although I can’t rule out migraines or tension headaches. Even if I do stay on it for multiple hours, and typically I do adjust to the point it’s comfortable but not symptom-free, I usually deal with headaches afterwards. I even found if I stay off the phone for an hour or two then look at a notification or use it for a minute I’ll typically get migraines for at least five minutes after.

I should also stress that I didn’t experience any migraines prior to the first time I powered on iPhone X, and if I didn’t have iPhone 12 Pro Max I’d only experience migraines infrequently.

Still, I think it was worth trying this year since I did hear about a more finely tuned brightness controller on iPhone 12 and some users that were sensitive in the past reporting no issues. It is an improvement over iPhone X, just not enough until there’s no flicker or a high enough rate where migraines aren’t even a consideration.

I think I’ve come to my senses and realized that I should return it for my health. Even if I were to fully adjust to it, what have I accomplished? Technology should work for the consumer, not the other way around.

 

[tonybarnaby]

I feel for you, Michael. You sound like an addict who knows what to do, but just can’t quite do it. I mean zero offense by that. Few people have spent as much time looking into pwm as us, and it’s very hard to pry that phone out of your hands. I think it’s safe to say the phone bothers you, and it’s going to be a daily struggle. I hope something comes out soon where none of us are left out, or are forced to endure eye strain and headaches in order to enjoy it. I’d honestly settle for the se plus if it doesn’t bother my head. That would be 5 years of use, and by 2026 there has got to be an end to pwm.

 

[The.Glorious.Son]

I feel for you, Michael. You sound like an addict who knows what to do, but just can’t quite do it. I mean zero offense by that. Few people have spent as much time looking into pwm as us, and it’s very hard to pry that phone out of your hands. I think it’s safe to say the phone bothers you, and it’s going to be a daily struggle. I hope something comes out soon where none of us are left out, or are forced to endure eye strain and headaches in order to enjoy it. I’d honestly settle for the se plus if it doesn’t bother my head. That would be 5 years of use, and by 2026 there has got to be an end to pwm.

Love your response. I don’t post in here nearly as much as others, but I peruse these pwm threads more than any other. Since the 3G I was an annual adopter on launch day. All the way through the 8 Plus as I didn’t like the size or aspect ratio of the X. The XS Max, 11 Pro Max and 12 Pro Max solved that and the 12 Pro Max was the most beloved purchase I’ve made. It’s everything I could personally want in a phone, and my phone is my one vice. It’s my tool for nearly everything. But there is simply no way I could justify experiencing symptoms every day in order to use it. Further, I refuse to pay $1400+ for a phone that I have to try and tweak 10 things just to reduce a headache or eye strain. I couldn’t even enjoy the beautiful screen due to adjusting white points and True Tone and all that jazz.

My 11 gives me zero issues and so I’ll hold onto it as long as I must. It sucks when you’re used to having the latest greatest, money isn’t the issue, and the availability is present....yet to still not be able to use it. But in the end for me, it’s just not worth the time, headaches (literally and figuratively), and stress.

 

[tonybarnaby]

iPhone SE Plus images, specs and prices have been leaked

iPhone SE Plus images, specs and prices have been leaked. Beautiful images of the device as well as details about it, have appeared online.

www.google.com

Take this leak with a huge grain of salt, but it claims the se plus will be amoled.

Check out the possible specs for a rumored 6.1-inch Apple iPhone SE Plus

A Twitter tipster has disseminated a tweet with rumored specs for a Plus version of the iPhone that includes a 6.1-inch LCD display and possibly the 5nm A14 Bionic chipset.

www.google.com

This link says lcd, which I tend to believe for the SE name

 

[tonybarnaby]

I hate how secretive the speculation is on the chance of an se plus. I’m in need of a new phone, but I’ll hold on for the se plus if it exists. If not, I’m better off buying the se 2020 and trying to adapt to the small size. If pwm didn’t exist, I’d have the 12 pro max and be content. As it is, I have to jump thru hoops and hope apple makes a phone I can use. Anyone else a buyer if the se plus launches in April at $499 for 64gb? I’d pay the $549 (or whatever) for the 128gb and wait out the pwm era

 

[AJAAY]

I hate how secretive the speculation is on the chance of an se plus. I’m in need of a new phone, but I’ll hold on for the se plus if it exists. If not, I’m better off buying the se 2020 and trying to adapt to the small size. If pwm didn’t exist, I’d have the 12 pro max and be content. As it is, I have to jump thru hoops and hope apple makes a phone I can use. Anyone else a buyer if the se plus launches in April at $499 for 64gb? I’d pay the $549 (or whatever) for the 128gb and wait out the pwm era

6.1 inch LCD screen. Touch ID only? I'd snatch it up in a heartbeat.

 

[Roadstar]

6.1 inch LCD screen. Touch ID only? I'd snatch it up in a heartbeat.

Same here, even if it costs the same as the OLED/FaceID ones.

 

[TechLord]

I'm sorry for people who suffer from this. I am pretty relieved I don't; I've given away my 11 so I don't know what I'd do if I couldn't use my 12. I hope the rumour's of the SE Plus in a 6.1 inch form factor come true. Here's hoping to Microled displays on the iPhone one day.

 

[tonybarnaby]

6.1 inch LCD screen. Touch ID only? I'd snatch it up in a heartbeat.

I just don’t see this being realistic. If a 6.1” lcd se plus existed, I think it would totally cannibalize the 11. I feel like the se plus is going to be a 5.5” lcd in the 6/7/8+ shell. Either way, I’ll grab it if it doesn’t give me the odd headache the 11 lcd inexplicably does.

 

[TechLord]

I just don’t see this being realistic. If a 6.1” lcd se plus existed, I think it would totally cannibalize the 11. I feel like the se plus is going to be a 5.5” lcd in the 6/7/8+ shell. Either way, I’ll grab it if it doesn’t give me the odd headache the 11 lcd inexplicably does.

That form factor made sense for the SE since the 8 was still being manufactured; the SE plus likely won't be around till 2022. Can't see them bringing back that archaic form factor. Pretty reliable leakers like ming chi kuo have alluded to a 6.1 inch model. It would make sense for them to bring it out in 2022, by then the XR will be discontinued and they could discontinue the 11 just like they did with the 8 when the SE came out.

 

[tonybarnaby]

That form factor made sense for the SE since the 8 was still being manufactured; the SE plus likely won't be around till 2022. Can't see them bringing back that archaic form factor. Pretty reliable leakers like ming chi kuo have alluded to a 6.1 inch model. It would make sense for them to bring it out in 2022, by then the XR will be discontinued and they could discontinue the 11 just like they did with the 8 when the SE came out.

Kuo and others have stated second half of 2021. The latest rumors I have read say it’ll be announced in April

 

[TechLord]

Kuo and others have stated second half of 2021. The latest rumors I have read say it’ll be announced in April

Interesting, perhaps it will come out with the 13s. It would surprise me if it came out in the Spring because it would indeed then cannibalize the iPhone 11 which is still selling pretty well. I think Prosser says 2022 now but he has a mixed record.

 

[tonybarnaby]

Interesting, perhaps it will come out with the 13s. It would surprise me if it came out in the Spring because it would indeed then cannibalize the iPhone 11 which is still selling pretty well. I think Prosser says 2022 now but he has a mixed record.

It’s amazing to me that there is so much uncertainty and secrecy about a phone like this. It’s intended market are people who want a new “cheap” iPhone. This isn’t something ground breaking, so why all the secrecy about it? At this point in time we don’t even know IF it will launch. I’ve heard it’ll be 5.5” lcd, 6.1” lcd and 6.1” oled. I think oled is way off base, but 5.5 or 6.1 lcd both sound reasonable. Just dumb how secretive tech companies are.

 

[B710049732]

I recommended put an eye protection mask on the phone, and if necessary, you can wear anti-blue glasses. The most important thing is not to stare at the phone all the time. I believe it can reduce eye pain.

 

[Roadstar]

I recommended put an eye protection mask on the phone, and if necessary, you can wear anti-blue glasses. The most important thing is not to stare at the phone all the time. I believe it can reduce eye pain.

Anti-blue glasses do nothing about PWM flicker. I wish they did, as that would allow me to use phones with heavy PWM, but despite wearing that kind of glasses since 2015 I still get headache rather quickly on phones with low-frequency PWM.