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Other Eye-strain while using iPhone X and up
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Even if they did there's a good chance TD would ruin the experience
LCD is no guarantee. I'll use my experience as an example.
For me: (OLED is not an option).
- iPhone 6 Plus - best computer screen i have ever used. But slow phone.
- iPhone 6S Plus - same as above but way faster. I use it today. Very nice.
- iphone 8 - ok, no trauma but certainly not as nice as the 6 plus models
- iphone 8 Plus - had to get rid of it. Gave me tachycardia eventually.
- iphone 11 - I could not use this iPhone at all
- iphone SE3 - FINE! on ios 18.7. Screen is no competitor to the 6 Plus series, but I can use it without physical trauma (I use iPhones as little as possible).
I tried going the refurbished route buying these SE3s, but struck out both times:they were duds. So I purchased new ones instead.
Yeah - its a sorry state of affairs, but at least I'll be set for the next decade. ha!
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Since i have the 17 pro my eyes are watery all the time. Didn’t have that with the 16 pro. Now i don’t know what to do,sell this try another 17 pro? Or go back to 16 pro but what if i get a screen and my eyes are ****ed again? Goddamnit apple. Only hope is a software update for the pwm setting that has it on all brightness levelS and see if that helps. And im gona get new glasses next week the current one is scratched to hell but dont think its because of that otherwise the 16 pro wouldnt be good for me.
Well at least you know what to do the next time you find an iPhone that works for you (this advice is for everyone on this thread) === never, never sell a workable iPhone to pay for a newer untested model.
Yep. The worst is,i dont know if it will be fine with another 16 pro. Seems like you have to have goooood luck with the panels on these things. I remember 16 pro was a samsung panel,my 17 pro is a samsung one aswell. If it doesnt get any better after ive got my new glasses i might sell it and try a 16 pro. Bummer as i like the 17 pro alot.
Refurbished phones and computers have all sorts of issues including transistor leakage from plain old age and use. So yeah, buying sealed is typically the safer route. The problem is the usable devices are at this point 3-5 years old. And the bigger problem is at a certain point we will all be stuck upgrading to a newer OS. At least with Macs you can do a DFU restore to try to get to an older version of MacOS. iPhones there’s no such way once Apple stops signing older OS.
As others have pointed out LCD Apple phones and computers (and even iPads) are actually worse in 2025 on certain OS. The amount of dithering that Apple is using to render these OS’s is very high and it’s a major concern moving forward. The good news is at least the iPhone SE and iPhone 11 don’t utilize FRC (which wasn’t true of some older iPhones) at the hardware level so you just have to worry about GPU dithering.
The few LCD computers and iPads that exist are the Airs (MiniLED iPads and MBP’s might as well be OLED because of the PWM) and they all have the Gray Color Flicker which is a strobe that is omnipresent even in recovery mode, and clearly hardware based. On top of that they use dithering and FRC on the laptops. Even the iMac and Studio Display utilize FRC and the Gray Color Flicker. These two flickers have been present for at least a decade, but they are less intense on the Intel Macs.
Jury is still out whether a lot of this is quality control failures or purposeful design. I suspect it’s a bit of both.
As someone pointed out on Reddit, Apple is going against their Human Interface Guidelines for product and OS design. Liquid Glass is a visual Accessibility nightmare. How on Earth we went from devices and software that is supposed to get out of your way so you can be productive to these ridiculous and intrusive designs is beyond me. Oh wait, it’s because they want the Apple ecosystem to turn into an entertainment system instead of productivity pro devices. Okay.
It’s unfortunate because Windows is such a sh** show that there really isn’t an alternative that is significantly better.
Thing is the iPhone 11 screen I got on really well with. I switched to the 13 Pro and at first it was a nightmare to use but gradually I was able to adjust the display settings until it was usable. But that was very much trial and error but it ended up being the iPhone I’ve used the longest. So sometimes first impressions don’t always pan out.
Yes - to a point. While the SE3 was introduced in 2022, my new unit was manufactured in Jan 2025. Then the SE3 model was discontinued in Feb 2025.
iPhone manufactured date can not be looked up directly (the stat isn't published) but the battery manufactured date can easily be found using CoconutBattery.
According to those who know more about this than I, batteries that are going into new iPhones are typically manufactured 3-4 weeks before the phone is assembled.
Yes - running old versions of ios cuz you're trapped on it with an old iPhone kinda sucks - but I'm familiar with it. Its not like anyone needs the most updated version of ios to run the basics : calendar, notes, photos, reminders, phone, email & messaging.
There’s a question as to whether they’re using newer screen tech on older phones and Macs that were manufactured in 2024/2025 in the case of Retina MacBooks (not Liquid Retina) and iPhones. You may want to open the newer iPhone SE to make sure it still works. I know the iPhone 13’s made in 2023 are way different than mine made in 2021.
I’m on iOS 15 and websites are starting to not work. They just load a blank page. Happened to my iMac on Mojave, too. So in addition to losing app access web access also starts to disappear. This is the problem as older iOS and MacOS are marked as insecure and everything stops working. Which is why it’s not viable to use a lot of these devices on older OS past 5 years.
As it relates to the SE specifically, it’s established certain versions of iOS introduce dithering so this in my mind is less about devices that don’t support newer OS but rather not wanting to upgrade because newer OS introduces dithering and kills battery life. Of course this could be solved by a Accessibility toggle to disable dithering and other features but we haven’t seen that on iPhones.
Out of curiosity, I checked the manufacturer of the display on my 16e. It's code G9Q -> Samsung?
Since I was already in the file, I searched for "PWM", and found a few items, including one named "AppleARMPWMBacklight", which is set to 0 🤔
Since I was already in the file, I searched for "PWM", and found a few items, including one named "AppleARMPWMBacklight", which is set to 0 🤔
Did you ever have trouble on the SE3 with earlier iOS versions? I could use SE2/SE3 all the way through 16.1.1. But after 16.1.1 I didn't seem to be able to use any Apple LCD products. My daily is a SE3 stuck on 16.1.1 but I don't think I've ever tried iOS 17 or 18 on one since I just figured they would make me sick. (iPhone 6 and 7 were perfect for me as well until a security update in February 2024 on iOS 15 ruined that one too)
I cannot tolerate any iPhone OLED either.
Can you share where you can buy sealed iPhone SEs still? Are there any 256gb ? Thanks.
Wow, I just noticed Apple no longer sells iPhone SE third-generation. Therefore there is no new LCD/flicker-free phone available from Apple.
I purchased my eBay new 64GB SE3 from this guy. Its was expensive but its legit and so is he. He's in Florida. He had 9 more on 10/4/25.
Going the refurbished route with 2 strikeouts traumatized me.
Iphone SE 3rd Generation 64gb Factory Unlocked Midnight SEALED 1 YEAR WARRANTY | eBay
===========
The SE3 was discontinued 2/19/25, so Apple no longer sells it. I found a couple brand new, unused (64GB) SE3 iphones in sealed boxes with 1 year Apple warranty on ebay and one on Swappa. Both from verified USA sellers. Manufactured dates on these 2 phones are Jan 2025 and Oct 2024.
Both have a 1 year Apple warranty which started when I activated the phone the first time.
The internet echo chamber has endless posts from people who don't know what they're talking about, stating that the standard 1 year apple warranty starts when the iPhone is purchased. THAT IS FALSE.
The warranty starts when the iPhone is first activated - not when its sold.
The only way you can get a 128GB SE3 now is buying a used or "refurbished" unit, and I struck out twice going refurbished. Refurbished? ha!. One of them had ghost touch disease. 256GB SE3s are very rare. Only option is refurbished or used.
There isn't much a refurbisher can do to an iPhone to keep it affordable.
Replace the lightning port? They'll never do that.
Replace the screen? They'll never do that.
Replace the home button? Not possible.
Replace the logic board? Never
All they can do is replace the battery with a cheapo aftermarket battery - and risk screwing up the iPhone in the process of opening it up. (which is likely why my refurbished unit had ghost touch disease).
I think the "refurbished" iPhone market is a scam. They are just wiping down the outsides really well on clean looking iPhones and reselling them. The ones with bad batteries get replacement cheapos - but the risk of messing up the iPhone in the process is high.
Beware of the ads on ebay offering "new" SE3 iphones in open boxes. Someone in China is gaming ebay with several different front companies - but all the ads and prices are virtually identical. If you look up the About info on all the sellers - they (he) are all in China ... because its one company.
If they were "new", they wouldn't be open boxes.
Here is something else...
The SE3 was available from Apple for 3 years. That's a long run.
The Pro Max iPhones are discontinued after only one year.
The SE3 was discontinued 5 months AFTER the iPhone 15 Pro Max was.
Sooo, the iPhone 15 Pro Max will hit Vintage (5 yrs) and Obsolete (7 yrs) designations roughly at the same time as the SE3 will, but parts availability for the SE3 will be enormously better since it was available for so much longer.
The SE3 was available from Apple for 3 years. That's a long run.
The Pro Max iPhones are discontinued after only one year.
The SE3 was discontinued 5 months AFTER the iPhone 15 Pro Max was.
Sooo, the iPhone 15 Pro Max will hit Vintage (5 yrs) and Obsolete (7 yrs) designations roughly at the same time as the SE3 will, but parts availability for the SE3 will be enormously better since it was available for so much longer.
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My return period has now expired.
I'm still happy with my iPhone 17 Pro Max, which isn't giving me any problems.
I'll be checking this thread a bit less now. Keeping my fingers crossed for all of you, though. 🙏
I'm still happy with my iPhone 17 Pro Max, which isn't giving me any problems.
I'll be checking this thread a bit less now. Keeping my fingers crossed for all of you, though. 🙏
C
I had a chance to play around with an iPhone 17 Pro Max last night and it didn’t cause as immediate or intense of a headache reaction as past Max iPhones especially, but it just didn’t feel comfortable to me. All I could note in my brief time was that the Pulse Smoothing setting seemed to make the display feel more uniform across brightness levels. I only noticed a hint of a migraine when I turned the iPhone sideways and tried to play the Sonic demo, which to be fair wasn’t all that intriguing. Oddly because the setting may not do anything at max brightness the screen seemed a touch brighter and more vibrant with it disabled, which may or may not be placebo. I left the demo not feeling super encouraged that these displays will be 100% or even 90% comfortable, but the reaction becomes less and less immediate each generation. These still feel like gradual tiny improvements, and it’s apparent that the Accessibility setting isn’t even close to being a step change in the technology.
Congrats @PwmMen, this setting was designed for people like you with PWM in their name…
I had a chance to play around with an iPhone 17 Pro Max last night and it didn’t cause as immediate or intense of a headache reaction as past Max iPhones especially, but it just didn’t feel comfortable to me. All I could note in my brief time was that the Pulse Smoothing setting seemed to make the display feel more uniform across brightness levels. I only noticed a hint of a migraine when I turned the iPhone sideways and tried to play the Sonic demo, which to be fair wasn’t all that intriguing. Oddly because the setting may not do anything at max brightness the screen seemed a touch brighter and more vibrant with it disabled, which may or may not be placebo. I left the demo not feeling super encouraged that these displays will be 100% or even 90% comfortable, but the reaction becomes less and less immediate each generation. These still feel like gradual tiny improvements, and it’s apparent that the Accessibility setting isn’t even close to being a step change in the technology.
I have a 256GB iPhone SE3 and a couple of 128GB SE3s (launch purchases) that I keep on monthly AppleCare+ for this reason.
I have an OLED iPhone now because I need the battery life but I've yet to actually use it for more than 10 minutes at a time. For long onscreen time, I'm usually on LCD-based iPads.
How will you get through a decade as all apps will eventually stop signing older iOS. Apple also won't support battery changes forever.
It took 3 days for my eyes to feel normal after returning the 17 Pro. Unlike previous years it wasn't eye muscle strain but the surface of my eyes felt sensitive
Now I'm just waiting on Amazon to have the TCL NXTPAPER 60 Ultra in stock.
Now I'm just waiting on Amazon to have the TCL NXTPAPER 60 Ultra in stock.
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By weening myself off iPhone. Just use the core apps.
I used an iPhone 6 Plus on iOS 9 until 2022. 8 years on the same OS.
I didn't upgrade it through the years because I knew, from past experience that the so called upgrades would ruin the phone.
After iOS updates ruined my 4S and then my 5, I learned my lesson the hard way so I never updated the 6+.
By then (2022) Safari was pretty much worthless for shopping and many apps were cut off - especially finance apps, but the core standard stock iOS apps still all worked fine. (Calendar, notes, reminders, messages, email, phone, camera).
I used my Mac instead for internet stuff.
As for battery life - its not an issue. My 11 year old 6 Plus still has its original battery and battery health is still at 95%. 2170 charge cycles.
Impossible you might say? Yes it is impossible if you charge the battery like Apple recommends, but I knew I was going to keep this phone for a really long time --- so I kept the charge level between 65% to 75% all those years.
Yeah it was tedious - but it worked. Luckily now its easy to create a iOS shortcut to turn a smart plug off & on at any battery level automatically.
Eventually I got a 8 Plus and then decided to upgrade the 6+ to iOS 12 to see what would happen - and to no surprise, iOS 12 obliterated it. It became so slow it was unbearable to use. Everything taking forever. Ridiculous.
But surprisingly, my 6S Plus on iOS 15 runs fine. So maybe the days of iOS upgrade carnage are behind us.
Sooo- I know this scenario with my new SE3 will play out again in the future as iOS inexorably marches forward - which is why I purchased a 2nd SE3.
I can't risk apple ruining my usable and fast SE3 with a new iOS version in the future (looking at you iOS 27), so I'll use my 2nd SE3 as a iOS tester and see how things go on it. That one is my guinea pig.
If I'm lucky, the SE3 will function fine on iOS 28 in a few years - and then I'll stick with that to the bitter end.
Maybe by then (8-9 years from now) there will be a new display technology to get us out of this OLED PWM hell.
Crossing my fingers