I have posted what I believe are the answers to your questions above. If I am incorrect, I'n sure the experts will correct me.
Lou
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Frequently Asked Questions About NVIDIA PC (non-EFI) Graphics Cards
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I have posted what I believe are the answers to your questions above. If I am incorrect, I'n sure the experts will correct me.
Lou
A lot of questions so quote splitting for clarity.
Yes, if the card has 2 6-pin power connectors you are fine. Steer clear of cards that have one or more 8-pin power connectors, as they will draw more than the 225W supplied by the Mac Pro. Existing cables will work fine.
As discussed in the OP, boot screen (Apple logo) requires an EFI, so the screen will stay black until you get to the desktop if you are using a standard PC card. Both Fermi and Kepler generation cards should boot to the desktop just fine with Mountain Lion, though.
Correct, the latest NVIDIA web driver for 10.8.2 enables PCIe 2.0 speeds.
I believe 3-4 displays are supported on Kepler cards, pretty sure someone did a test and confirmed at least 3 displays worked. Fermi generation cards are still limited to 2 displays, though.
The card will work fine if you haven't made the OpenCL modifications, you just won't get any OpenCL acceleration. Normal 3D graphics stuff works just fine, including an accelerated desktop etc.
I believe the fixes are different for 10.7.5 and 10.8.2, MacVidCards laid out the steps for 10.8.2 in detail (links in the OP).
Yes, if the card has 2 6-pin power connectors you are fine. Steer clear of cards that have one or more 8-pin power connectors, as they will draw more than the 225W supplied by the Mac Pro. Existing cables will work fine.
As discussed in the OP, boot screen (Apple logo) requires an EFI, so the screen will stay black until you get to the desktop if you are using a standard PC card. Both Fermi and Kepler generation cards should boot to the desktop just fine with Mountain Lion, though.
Correct, the latest NVIDIA web driver for 10.8.2 enables PCIe 2.0 speeds.
I believe 3-4 displays are supported on Kepler cards, pretty sure someone did a test and confirmed at least 3 displays worked. Fermi generation cards are still limited to 2 displays, though.
The card will work fine if you haven't made the OpenCL modifications, you just won't get any OpenCL acceleration. Normal 3D graphics stuff works just fine, including an accelerated desktop etc.
I believe the fixes are different for 10.7.5 and 10.8.2, MacVidCards laid out the steps for 10.8.2 in detail (links in the OP).
Ok, GTX 570 securely embedded in 12-core MacPro. Was absolutely plug and play, with the latest card and CUDA drivers. Nice little speed up for sim times with TurbulenceFD in Cinema4D (varies depending on scene but at least 2-3x faster on the stuff I was playing with), and Octane Render works perfectly (won't work at all without a CUDA card). But most impressive was the 3D raytrace in After Effects which was unbelievably quick and smooth. With CPUs alone it was hard to navigate and slow to redraw.
OpenGL still a mixed bag with some weird redraw in LightWave, but largely unchanged (if perhaps a tad quicker) over the ATI HD5870.
This will keep me occupied until next year and the new Mac Pros - which I'm hoping will be absolute monsters. I might even treat myself and throw in a K5000
OpenGL still a mixed bag with some weird redraw in LightWave, but largely unchanged (if perhaps a tad quicker) over the ATI HD5870.
This will keep me occupied until next year and the new Mac Pros - which I'm hoping will be absolute monsters. I might even treat myself and throw in a K5000
but...
Ok, I am gonna buy the GTX 570 2560 MB EVGA.
Exactly this one:
http://www.pcgate.it/svga-evga-gtx570-2560mb025p31579kr-p-3643.html
So am I buying the right model?
Also... i know of MACVIDCARDS modified cards, but is there a GTX 570 2560
with real EFI inside?
I don't think so...
I need it on my MAC PRO 3.1 2008, i will upgrade to 10.7.
Ok, I am gonna buy the GTX 570 2560 MB EVGA.
Exactly this one:
http://www.pcgate.it/svga-evga-gtx570-2560mb025p31579kr-p-3643.html
So am I buying the right model?
Also... i know of MACVIDCARDS modified cards, but is there a GTX 570 2560
with real EFI inside?
I don't think so...
I need it on my MAC PRO 3.1 2008, i will upgrade to 10.7.
Thanks for the replies Flowrider and Asgorath, again much appreciated.
Ok so that's cleared up everything....well almost. I have one other small question.
If the Opencl operation is different for the latest update of Mountain Lion then I'm assuming it's going to be different again for say 10.8.3?
If this is the case then can it also be assumed that every time I run an OSX update I'm going to have to re-do the OpenCl patch, unless of course I don't worry about using OpenCL?
From what I've read Opencl is used to speed up Premiere and Photoshop but not AE. But then as far as I know CUDA also speeds up AE and Premiere and so I wouldn't be bothered about having OpenCl for them.
But as far as I've read Photoshop doesn't have any use with CUDA, it's all CL based? I find it strange that they don't have CUDA support across the board or is it just that CUDA can't be supported in PS?
It would just be nice to not have to worry about having to keep updating the 2gb limit....maybe I should just get a 1.5gb card?
Thanks again for your time.
Peter
Ok so that's cleared up everything....well almost. I have one other small question.
If the Opencl operation is different for the latest update of Mountain Lion then I'm assuming it's going to be different again for say 10.8.3?
If this is the case then can it also be assumed that every time I run an OSX update I'm going to have to re-do the OpenCl patch, unless of course I don't worry about using OpenCL?
From what I've read Opencl is used to speed up Premiere and Photoshop but not AE. But then as far as I know CUDA also speeds up AE and Premiere and so I wouldn't be bothered about having OpenCl for them.
But as far as I've read Photoshop doesn't have any use with CUDA, it's all CL based? I find it strange that they don't have CUDA support across the board or is it just that CUDA can't be supported in PS?
It would just be nice to not have to worry about having to keep updating the 2gb limit....maybe I should just get a 1.5gb card?
Thanks again for your time.
Peter
Ours is only one, the EFI is as "real" as it gets.
Works 100% like a "real" Mac card.
As far as OpenCl, since the K5000 will soon be out, I don't think Apple will keep this 2GB limit in. In fact 10.8.3 Beta doesn't seem to have it. K5000 has more than 2GB, I can't imagine that they can sell it at Mac store and keep it disabled from OpenCl.
You'll note that the highest RAM on a currently shipping card from Mac store is 2GB and the limit applies ABOVE that. As soon as they have a card with more than 2GB, they can't leave it in place.
"As soon as they have a card with more than 2GB, they can't leave it in place"
Great, looking forward to that day.
Great, looking forward to that day.
Since the 2GB thing is an Apple limitation, hopefully they'll remove it at some point. The first 10.8.3 seed builds are out, perhaps someone that has access to it and a card with more than 2GB of RAM can check to see if the hack is still needed?
You are basically correct though, until Apple removes the restriction we'll have to keep hacking the OpenCL framework to enable acceleration on cards with more than 2GB of RAM. Fingers crossed that it won't be too many more SU versions before this gets enabled by Apple.
The limited testing I did in 10.8.3 points to OpenCl fix not being needed anymore.
That being said, i have not specifically checked to see if it wrote a new OpenCl framework in.
I will check and post accordingly. But my initial thought is that in the 10.8.3 Beta I have, the OpenCl fix isn't needed anymore. What that means to a released "official" version is questionable, but this 2GB limit WILL disappear soon. Trust me.
That being said, i have not specifically checked to see if it wrote a new OpenCl framework in.
I will check and post accordingly. But my initial thought is that in the 10.8.3 Beta I have, the OpenCl fix isn't needed anymore. What that means to a released "official" version is questionable, but this 2GB limit WILL disappear soon. Trust me.
i just noticed that there is a driver update for CUDA when i went into system preferences--CUDA
the driver i have now is 5.0.36. it wants to update to 5.0.37
the setup is an 09 4,1 pro with an EVGA gtx570.
is that something i need to be updating? or should it be left alone as is?
the driver i have now is 5.0.36. it wants to update to 5.0.37
the setup is an 09 4,1 pro with an EVGA gtx570.
is that something i need to be updating? or should it be left alone as is?
You always want the latest driver. No reason to not upgrade both the graphics and CUDA drivers whenever they get updated.
Checking in to a) thank Asgorath et al for the invaluable info contained in this thread; without it I most likely wouldn’t have dared the jump into uncharted Nvidia waters. So, thanks a million, everybody!
And checking in to provide another data point. This past weekend I successfully installed a Geforce GTX 660 Ti in my Mac Pro 5,1 (quad 2.8) running OS X 10.8.2 and Nvidia’s 304.00.05f02 drivers. I tried a total of three cards to see which one I liked best:
No surprise that there’s no boot screen but I was a little disappointed that the machine won’t wake up from sleep, and I have to do a hard reboot in order to regain control of the box. That happened with all three cards on virgin OS installs, so I guess that isn’t entirely uncommon.
Since I rarely put my machine to sleep anyway that little boo-boo wasn’t enough to deter me from upgrading from my previous Radeon 5870 (original Apple upgrade kit, which never worked well with my dual Panasonic MultiSync displays anyway).
And checking in to provide another data point. This past weekend I successfully installed a Geforce GTX 660 Ti in my Mac Pro 5,1 (quad 2.8) running OS X 10.8.2 and Nvidia’s 304.00.05f02 drivers. I tried a total of three cards to see which one I liked best:
- An Nvidia brand GTX 660 Ti/2GB, sold for $349.99 at Best Buy.
- An EVGA GTX 660 Ti/2GB, manufactured for and also sold at my local Best Buy for $319.99 (the first one on the linked page, model # 02G-P4-4069-KB)
- An ASUS GTX660 TI/2GB (TI-DC2O-2GD5)
No surprise that there’s no boot screen but I was a little disappointed that the machine won’t wake up from sleep, and I have to do a hard reboot in order to regain control of the box. That happened with all three cards on virgin OS installs, so I guess that isn’t entirely uncommon.
Since I rarely put my machine to sleep anyway that little boo-boo wasn’t enough to deter me from upgrading from my previous Radeon 5870 (original Apple upgrade kit, which never worked well with my dual Panasonic MultiSync displays anyway).
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I regularly put my system to sleep, and it wakes up no problems at all. Can you try waking from sleep and then check the system log for any errors or other messages with "NVDA:" as a prefix?
Done. As before, the machine goes to sleep (drives spinning down), I wait for a minute, try to wake it, drives are spinning up but no video. I can SSH into the box (log in remotely) but it doesn't show up on my local network (AFP down, methinks).
After shutting it down and booting back up I see the following in system.log:
Code:
Dec 5 01:16:28 mac-pro kernel[0]: NVDA::setPowerState(0xffffff8022ac1800, 0 -> 2) timed out after 45398 ms
Dec 5 01:21:29 localhost kernel[0]: NVDAGK100HAL loaded and registered.Quick update on the GTX570 for those looking to jump on board. It's definitely noisier than the ATI HD5870, and gradually spins up under load (Octane render), so don't expect it to be whisper quiet while doing CUDA work. And, FWIW, this is a bog-standard PC card, plugged straight in with no EFI flash and so far, no major issues. I run off an SSD and have only one OS so the lack of any boot screen is a total non-issue.
Check these out, they'll keep the card cooler and are almost inaudible.
http://www.arctic.ac/en/p/cooling/vga/375/accelero-twin-turbo-ii.html?c=2182
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Not true in my case. My Radeon HD6870 was a Gigabyte model with it's three fan cooling cooling solution. It was very effective and quiet. I liked the design so well, that when I updated to a GTX570, I also got a Gigabyte 3 fan model. It's just as quiet and the cooling is just as effective.
Lou
Is there anything else before the "timed out" message? Can you print the last 10-20 lines before that one? But yeah, that message is definitely related.
Man I have to give you props you are one of the most patient people I've run into in a long time. I just can't do what you do answer questions with a genuine desire for people to "see the light". I just want to say THANKS you prove that my cynical derision for people is at times wrong.
Yeah thanks for the link I may have to invest cos the drone from this card is already getting to me!
I knew the second I fired up my 560ti that the stock cooler would have to go..
I just ordered a kit form the a gentlemen on OCN "Dwood" he makes brackets the fit a corsair H series to your graphics card. I did the zip tie mod and it was even quieter than the AC..
Thanks a lot for offering to help! While I know next to nothing about OS X's guts, I've tried to include everything from me putting the machine to sleep (01:15:26 ?), to the wake request (via keyboard, 01:15:42 ?), and my subsequent reboot vie remote login (01:17:42)
Code:
Dec 5 01:15:26 mac-pro.home WindowServer[115]: Created shield window 0x59c for display 0x28d9b2c0
Dec 5 01:15:26 mac-pro.home WindowServer[115]: Created shield window 0x59d for display 0x28d9b2c1
Dec 5 01:15:26 mac-pro.home WindowServer[115]: device_generate_desktop_screenshot: authw 0x0(0), shield 0x0(0)
Dec 5 01:15:26 mac-pro.home WindowServer[115]: device_generate_lock_screen_screenshot: authw 0x0(0), shield 0x0(0)
Dec 5 01:15:26 mac-pro.home WindowServer[115]: device_generate_desktop_screenshot: authw 0x0(0), shield 0x0(0)
Dec 5 01:15:26 mac-pro.home com.apple.time[11]: Next maintenance wake [Backup Interval]: <date: 0x7fb2cce0a810> Wed Dec 05 02:07:16 2012 EST (approx)
Dec 5 01:15:26 mac-pro.home com.apple.time[11]: Requesting maintenance wake [Backup Interval]: <date: 0x7fb2cce0a810> Wed Dec 05 02:07:16 2012 EST (approx)
Dec 5 01:15:27 mac-pro kernel[0]: AirPort_Brcm43xx::powerChange: System Sleep
Dec 5 01:15:28 mac-pro kernel[0]: Intel82574L::setLinkStatus - not active 1face001, 0
Dec 5 01:15:28 mac-pro kernel[0]: Intel82574L::setLinkStatus - not active 1face000, 0
Dec 5 01:15:42 mac-pro kernel[0]: Wake reason: EHC1
Dec 5 01:15:42 mac-pro kernel[0]: AirPort_Brcm43xx::powerChange: System Wake - Full Wake/ Dark Wake / Maintenance wake
Dec 5 01:15:42 mac-pro kernel[0]: AirPort_Brcm43xx::checkInterfacePowerState: Check _pwrOffThreadCall!
Dec 5 01:15:42 mac-pro kernel[0]: The USB device HubDevice (Port 1 of Hub at 0xfd000000) may have caused a wake by issuing a remote wakeup (2)
Dec 5 01:15:42 mac-pro kernel[0]: Intel82574L::setLinkStatus - not active 1face000, 0
Dec 5 01:15:42 mac-pro kernel[0]: Intel82574L::setLinkStatus - not active 1face001, 0
Dec 5 01:15:42 mac-pro kernel[0]: Previous Sleep Cause: 5
Dec 5 01:15:42 mac-pro.home configd[17]: network changed: v4(en0-:10.8.1.7) DNS- Proxy- SMB
Dec 5 01:15:42 mac-pro.local configd[17]: setting hostname to "mac-pro.local"
Dec 5 01:15:42 mac-pro.local SystemUIServer[160]: -[TCMPortMapper_Network networkDidChange:] NSConcreteNotification 0x7fcb38854c60 {name = State:/Network/Global/IPv4; object = <IXSCNotificationManager_Network: 0x7fcb35d44430>}
Dec 5 01:15:42 mac-pro.local awacsd[72]: InnerStore GetWakeInfoForZone: zero address for 136783625.members.btmm.icloud.com.
Dec 5 01:15:42 mac-pro.local awacsd[72]: KV HTTP 0
Dec 5 01:15:42 mac-pro kernel[0]: The USB device Keyboard Hub (Port 6 of Hub at 0xfd100000) may have caused a wake by issuing a remote wakeup (3)
Dec 5 01:15:42 mac-pro kernel[0]: Intel82574L::setLinkStatus - not active 1face000, 0
Dec 5 01:15:42 mac-pro kernel[0]: Intel82574L::setLinkStatus - not active 1face001, 0
Dec 5 01:15:42 mac-pro kernel[0]: The USB device Apple Keyboard (Port 2 of Hub at 0xfd160000) may have caused a wake by issuing a remote wakeup (3)
Dec 5 01:15:42 mac-pro kernel[0]: HID tickle 587 ms
Dec 5 01:15:42 mac-pro.local hidd[99]: MultitouchHID: device bootloaded
Dec 5 01:15:45 --- last message repeated 1 time ---
Dec 5 01:15:45 mac-pro kernel[0]: Ethernet [Intel82574L]: Link up on en0, 1-Gigabit, Full-duplex, No flow-control, Debug [796d,ac48,01e1,0200,c1e1,3800]
Dec 5 01:15:45 mac-pro kernel[0]: Intel82574L::setLinkStatus - active 1face000, a
Dec 5 01:15:45 mac-pro.local configd[17]: network changed: v4(en0+:10.8.1.7) DNS+ Proxy+ SMB
Dec 5 01:15:45 mac-pro.local SystemUIServer[160]: -[TCMPortMapper_Network networkDidChange:] NSConcreteNotification 0x7fcb388d1bb0 {name = State:/Network/Global/IPv4; object = <IXSCNotificationManager_Network: 0x7fcb35d44430>; userInfo = {
PrimaryInterface = en0;
PrimaryService = "52FF9F16-FFB3-4DA8-BC85-AE93088F0AA0";
Router = "10.8.1.1";
}}
Dec 5 01:15:45 mac-pro.local awacsd[72]: InnerStore GetWakeInfoForZone: zero address for 136783625.members.btmm.icloud.com.
Dec 5 01:15:45 mac-pro.home configd[17]: setting hostname to "mac-pro.home"
Dec 5 01:15:45 mac-pro.home awacsd[72]: InnerStore GetWakeInfoForZone: zero address for 136783625.members.btmm.icloud.com.
Dec 5 01:15:46 --- last message repeated 3 times ---
Dec 5 01:15:46 mac-pro.home com.apple.usbmuxd[81]: MuxNetworkInitiateConnect Client 0x100403080-usbmuxd/NULL requesting attach to 3fa47c27ba56e55562371792991d622f34d31b94:62078 failed, could not begin background connection attempt: -1
Dec 5 01:15:46 mac-pro.home com.apple.usbmuxd[81]: HandleUSBMuxConnect Client 0x100403080-usbmuxd/NULL MuxNetworkInitiateConnect failed
Dec 5 01:15:46 mac-pro.home usbmuxd[81]: AMDeviceConnect (thread 0x100696000): Could not connect to lockdown port (62078) on device 47 - 3fa47c27ba56e55562371792991d622f34d31b94: 0xe8000084.
Dec 5 01:15:46 mac-pro.home usbmuxd[81]: _AMDevicePreflightWorker (thread 0x100696000): Pair worker could not connect to lockdownd on device 47: 0xe8000084.
Dec 5 01:15:46 mac-pro.home com.apple.usbmuxd[81]: HandleDeviceAttachHelperCallback preflighting failed for WiFi device 0x2f-10.8.1.14:0: 0xe8000084. Ignoring device.
Dec 5 01:15:51 mac-pro kernel[0]: Intel82574L::timeoutHandler - no link - reset the chipset once 1face001, 0
Dec 5 01:15:51 mac-pro kernel[0]: Intel82574L::setLinkStatus - not active 1face001, 0
Dec 5 01:16:21 --- last message repeated 2 times ---
Dec 5 01:16:26 mac-pro.home sshd[8165]: Accepted keyboard-interactive/pam for pixelated from 10.8.1.3 port 49621 ssh2
Dec 5 01:16:26 mac-pro.home sshd[8165]: USER_PROCESS: 8171 ttys000
Dec 5 01:16:28 mac-pro kernel[0]: NVDA::setPowerState(0xffffff8022ac1800, 0 -> 2) timed out after 45398 ms
Dec 5 01:16:35 mac-pro.home sshd[8165]: DEAD_PROCESS: 8171 ttys000
Dec 5 01:16:35 mac-pro.home sshd[8171]: Received disconnect from 10.8.1.3: 11: disconnected by user
Dec 5 01:16:43 mac-pro.home sshd[8176]: Accepted keyboard-interactive/pam for pixelated from 10.8.1.3 port 49622 ssh2
Dec 5 01:16:43 mac-pro.home sshd[8176]: USER_PROCESS: 8179 ttys000
Dec 5 01:17:42 mac-pro.home sudo[8186]: pixelated : TTY=ttys000 ; PWD=/Users/pixelated ; USER=root ; COMMAND=/sbin/reboot
Dec 5 01:17:42 mac-pro.home reboot[8190]: rebooted by pixelatedWas hatt'n das mit 'Hohn' zu tun? Er hatte freundlicherweise angeboten zu helfen und nach allen Nvidia-bezogenen Einträgen im Systemlog gefragt. Genau die habe ich dann auch gepostet. Woran mir hier die 'Augen aufgehen' sollen würde mich dann doch interessieren.
Ich habe ein Deutsche frau, ich bin nicht Deutsch. Ich können verstehen deutsch aber technisches deutsche nicht.
Ah, my mistake. Here's the English version, then: "I am curious as to why I and/or my post deserved to be regarded with 'cynical derision'? Asgorath was friendly enough to offer his assistance and asked me to post Nvidia-related log entries, which is precisely what I did. What 'light' is it that I am not seeing here?"
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