Become a MacRumors Supporter for $50/year with no ads, ability to filter front page stories, and private forums.

sk1985

macrumors 6502
Jan 13, 2006
311
90
Is it 11” or 13”. Please post a photo (not a screenshot) of this forum, taken with low ambient light levels and at 25% brightness.
13 inch. In a room with the curtains down during daylight.

FYI photos look to have compression/gradient/banding that I’m not seeing in real life or on the photos on my phone. It’s not pixelated or that fuzzy in real life. Shot on my iPhone 15 pro max.
 

Attachments

  • IMG_1138.jpeg
    IMG_1138.jpeg
    352.8 KB · Views: 228
  • IMG_1136.jpeg
    IMG_1136.jpeg
    329.6 KB · Views: 173
Last edited:
  • Like
Reactions: IT Troll

excavate8603

macrumors newbie
May 15, 2024
4
4
Another data point on this. I am not suggesting that anyone is right or wrong or not seeing what they are seeing.


11" M1 Left, 11" M4 Right
Dark room, 25% brightness

At normal viewing distance I don't see any "graininess". If I zoom way in on this image I can see "grain" on both. 🤷‍♂️

View attachment 2391012

Zoomed way in (3x on iPhone 15 Pro)

As above, when zoomed way in (this time with optical zoom) I see "grain" on both (in the photograph). 🤷‍♂️


M1

View attachment 2391013


M4

View attachment 2391014



27" Studio Display 3x Zoom (iPhone 15 Pro)

Also, "grainy" in the photograph. 🤷‍♂️

View attachment 2391015


At this point I'm looking for a display I can photograph with my iPhone that doesn't have "grain" when zoomed in. I don't see any of this in normal usage. I need to get a magnifying glass to remove the camera from the equation, but I'm not invested enough in this to do that lol.
The iPhone camera's algorithm smears the noise, but you can still see the second picture of M4 has the worst noise.
 
  • Like
Reactions: jonnyb098

sk1985

macrumors 6502
Jan 13, 2006
311
90
I think there is evidence of a little grain, but certainly not as obvious as n the 11”.
Unfortunately all OLEDS struggle with grays, blurry text, and black crushing. You trade off some of LCD’s shortcomings for OLEDS.
 

zachchen1996

macrumors member
Nov 5, 2017
60
149
I have already gone through 2 different 13” M4 iPad Pros and both have grain on shades of gray at different brightness levels. I’m wondering if it’s a worthwhile endeavor to do exchanges until I find a “clean” unit or if the nature of this gran is just something I need to deal with and accept for this generation of iPad pros?
 

jonnyb098

macrumors 601
Nov 16, 2010
4,248
6,492
Michigan
Another data point on this. I am not suggesting that anyone is right or wrong or not seeing what they are seeing.


11" M1 Left, 11" M4 Right
Dark room, 25% brightness

At normal viewing distance I don't see any "graininess". If I zoom way in on this image I can see "grain" on both. 🤷‍♂️

View attachment 2391012

Zoomed way in (3x on iPhone 15 Pro)

As above, when zoomed way in (this time with optical zoom) I see "grain" on both (in the photograph). 🤷‍♂️


M1

View attachment 2391013


M4

View attachment 2391014



27" Studio Display 3x Zoom (iPhone 15 Pro)

Also, "grainy" in the photograph. 🤷‍♂️

View attachment 2391015


At this point I'm looking for a display I can photograph with my iPhone that doesn't have "grain" when zoomed in. I don't see any of this in normal usage. I need to get a magnifying glass to remove the camera from the equation, but I'm not invested enough in this to do that lol.
The grain is obvious between the M1 and M4 even from that image taken a few feet away and zooming in. It’s more and more obvious people who say they don’t have it just don’t notice it. It’s there and this could have all been solved if they went with a higher PPI. The iPhones went to over 400ppi because Apple knew this was an issue. But for iPads they seem to not give a ****. If apple start selling OLED MacBooks Pros at the current PPI , theyre gonna have noticable grain and piss a lot of people off who just spent $2-3k.

Just watch. The next M5 iPads will have a higher PPI. As will the OLED MacBooks that come in a year or so.
 
Last edited:

sk1985

macrumors 6502
Jan 13, 2006
311
90
The grain is obvious between the M1 and M4 even from that image taken a few feet away and zooming in. It’s more and more obvious people who say they don’t have it just don’t notice it. It’s there and this could have all been solved if they went with a higher PPI. The iPhones went to over 400ppi because Apple knew this was an issue. But for iPads they seem to not give a ****. If apple start selling OLED MacBooks Pros at the current PPI , theyre gonna have noticable grain and piss a lot of people off who just spent $2-3k.

Just watch. The next M5 iPads will have a higher PPI. As will the OLED MacBooks that come in a year or so.
I don’t think it’s a PPI issue entirely. I think the overall screen quality isn’t as nice as recent OLED iPhones. I’m betting the iPad has a fairly low bit panel as well…a spec apple does not publish.

I view the iPhones oled as the gold standard of oleds and I think iPad owners expected the same quality.
 

EugW

macrumors G5
Jun 18, 2017
14,877
12,854
Is there grain? Yes if I look very, very closely, and it may be a bit more prominent than with a typical LCD, but at my normal seating distance I don’t see it on my 11” M4.

Also, it looks like I will be less inclined to see it in the first place because I usually prefer using light mode over dark mode in the display preferences when I’m surfing. Furthermore, even if I use dark mode I generally still won’t see it because I don’t sit that close. I probably sit about 18” or so away from the screen, at least if it’s on the desk with my Magic Keyboard. Are some of you consistently viewing it from much closer than that, at say 12” or something like that?

I’m betting the iPad has a fairly low bit panel as well…a spec apple does not publish.
I’d be surprised if the OLED panel in the iPad Pro is anything other than 8-bit FRC. But I would not consider that a “low bit panel”. Most good quality wide colour HDR screens are 8-bit FRC.
 

jonnyb098

macrumors 601
Nov 16, 2010
4,248
6,492
Michigan
I don’t think it’s a PPI issue entirely. I think the overall screen quality isn’t as nice as recent OLED iPhones. I’m betting the iPad has a fairly low bit panel as well…a spec apple does not publish.

I view the iPhones oled as the gold standard of oleds and I think iPad owners expected the same quality.
As we should considering the massive price increase…
 

zachchen1996

macrumors member
Nov 5, 2017
60
149
I don’t need a magnifying glass to see it, I can notice it from normal viewing distances. People who don’t notice it just aren’t as sensitive to display abnormalities and should consider themselves very lucky. I also pick up on banding, vignetting, pink tinting, DSE, and any other panel uniformity issues very easily and I hate it lol. I wish I didn’t notice these things so easily.
 
  • Like
Reactions: IT Troll

sk1985

macrumors 6502
Jan 13, 2006
311
90
I don’t need a magnifying glass to see it, I can notice it from normal viewing distances. People who don’t notice it just aren’t as sensitive to display abnormalities and should consider themselves very lucky. I also pick up on banding, vignetting, pink tinting, DSE, and any other panel uniformity issues very easily and I hate it lol. I wish I didn’t notice these things so easily.
I’m very sensitive to display abnormalities like banding, uniformity, etc. I just think my m4 is totally normal when compared to other oled displays I’ve seen like tvs and computer monitors. It’s definitely not iPhone pro max nice but certainly not trash. I think people expected it to be iPhone nice and it’s just not. iPads aren’t made as nicely as iPhones or Macs. Never have been in my opinion. I found the jittery scrolling/refresh and excessive bloom of my m1 pro way more distracting.
 

zachchen1996

macrumors member
Nov 5, 2017
60
149
I’m very sensitive to display abnormalities like banding, uniformity, etc. I just think my m4 is totally normal when compared to other oled displays I’ve seen like tvs and computer monitors. It’s definitely not iPhone pro max nice but certainly not trash. I think people expected it to be iPhone nice and it’s just not. iPads aren’t made as nicely as iPhones or Macs. Never have been in my opinion. I found the jittery scrolling/refresh and excessive bloom of my m1 pro way more distracting.
This is my first iPad so it was just a surprise to me haha. It’s still a stunning display especially with high bit rate HDR material. I think I’ve made peace with the fact that the grain is inherent to the new iPad Pro models. I’ll take a bit of graininess over gray uniformity issues, pink tinting, and banding issues (like on LG WOLED TVs) any day! Also I could never go back to MiniLED (blooming is just far too distracting too me)
 

EugW

macrumors G5
Jun 18, 2017
14,877
12,854
This is my first iPad so it was just a surprise to me haha. It’s still a stunning display especially with high bit rate HDR material. I think I’ve made peace with the fact that the grain is inherent to the new iPad Pro models. I’ll take a bit of graininess over gray uniformity issues, pink tinting, and banding issues (like on LG WOLED TVs) any day! Also I could never go back to MiniLED (blooming is just far too distracting too me)
After my 2017 iPad Pro and after the mini-LED models came out, I decided to just wait until Apple went with OLED. I also find blooming very irritating.
 

zachchen1996

macrumors member
Nov 5, 2017
60
149
After my 2017 iPad Pro and after the mini-LED models came out, I decided to just wait until Apple went with OLED. I also find blooming very irritating.
Precisely, it made many high contrast videos unwatchable for me. That’s why I can’t do miniLED TVs as well, I notice even minimal amounts of blooming. No number of local dimming zones can beat per pixel control. That’s why I am a bit disappointed Apple is pausing their development on microLED displays for their products. Maybe QDEL or QD-PHOLED could be alternatives they go towards in the meantime.
 

zachchen1996

macrumors member
Nov 5, 2017
60
149
Just got my 3rd 13” M4 iPad Pro. Grain is still there but is less noticeable compared to my first 2 so I’m keeping this one. There’s grain on all the new iPad pros but there is definitely variance between units, a bit of a panel lottery.
 

pdoherty

macrumors 65816
Dec 30, 2014
1,491
1,736
I’m very sensitive to display abnormalities like banding, uniformity, etc. I just think my m4 is totally normal when compared to other oled displays I’ve seen like tvs and computer monitors. It’s definitely not iPhone pro max nice but certainly not trash. I think people expected it to be iPhone nice and it’s just not. iPads aren’t made as nicely as iPhones or Macs. Never have been in my opinion. I found the jittery scrolling/refresh and excessive bloom of my m1 pro way more distracting.
Huh? Why would the M1 miniLED pro have jittery scrolling or refresh?
 

jonnyb098

macrumors 601
Nov 16, 2010
4,248
6,492
Michigan
Huh? Why would the M1 miniLED pro have jittery scrolling or refresh?
I think he’s referring to the micro stutters that have been plaguing iOS animations for years. It’s just apples poor optimization. When the pro motion iPads first came out they were 100 percent consistently BUTTER smooth. But now there’s always random micro stutters. Even on the m4 , it’s just less noticeable because rather than optimize , Apple wants to throw processing power at the problem.
 
  • Like
Reactions: pdoherty

sk1985

macrumors 6502
Jan 13, 2006
311
90
I think he’s referring to the micro stutters that have been plaguing iOS animations for years. It’s just apples poor optimization. When the pro motion iPads first came out they were 100 percent consistently BUTTER smooth. But now there’s always random micro stutters. Even on the m4 , it’s just less noticeable because rather than optimize , Apple wants to throw processing power at the problem.
No it was more a slight delay in refreshing. Some people were more perceptive to it than others. I always found it distracting. Not quite as bad as ghosting....just not as smooth as I expected.

@3:30 second mark he Dave2d does a good job explaining it:
 
Last edited:

jonnyb098

macrumors 601
Nov 16, 2010
4,248
6,492
Michigan
No it was more a slight delay in refreshing. Some people were more perceptive to it than others. I always found it distracting. Not quite as bad as ghosting....just not as smooth as I expected.

@3:30 second mark he Dave2d does a good job explaining it:
The lack of rapid response time is what causes ghosting….
 

Fred Zed

macrumors 603
Aug 15, 2019
5,819
6,515
Upstate NY . Was FL.
This is what mine looks like like took a picture of it in a very dark setting at about 25 to 30% brightness, to the naked eye I cannot see anything whatsoever even if I’m in a very dark space I can only see it if I take a very close-up photo or if I use a magnifying glass other than that, I see absolutely nothing,
All I see is a dirty middle finger print 🤣
 
  • Haha
Reactions: iF34R
Register on MacRumors! This sidebar will go away, and you'll see fewer ads.