Has Apple lost it's magic? Is Amazon the new Apple?

[Internaut]

I really like the Fire HD, but unless you're happy to side load apps, it seems very limited. I find the browser that comes with the device quite inferior to Google's fast improving Chrome, and the first time I played with a HD, it had no maps, and the mapping applications in Amazon's App Store were none too compelling. Yet unlike my IPad Mini, I understand the Fire HD does actually come with a GPS receiver.

As for Amazon being the new Apple, pull the other one. Apple is a technology company, with a strong focus on the end user experience. Amazon is just a large, online supermarket, who wants sell you mobile cash registers, linked directly to their stores. Like many of the cheaper Androd devices, the Fire HD has clearly been thrown together with off the shelf components, compared to the iPad, which has clearly had some design into it.

In the UK, Amazon struggles to treat many of its employees like human beings. They've come into much criticism over the working conditions of their warehouse staff. Their German warehouse staff have recently been striking. Apple is no saint in this respect, but it does at least try to ensure its Chinese contractors run a clean ship.

 

[Fruit Cake]

Nonsense. The Kindle Fire HD is a complete lagfest when you use its default browser.

Personally, I'm completely spoiled by the iPad. Now when a friend shows me their fancy Windows Phone or Android device, I can't help but notice the wretched pixel-by-pixel rendering and non-responsiveness as they scroll through an app. Also the typography and color display on these devices. Yuck!

Having control of the hardware and the software with precise touch controls is a win win for Apple. Amazon has a long way to go before this can happen.

Suggest you avoid the iPad 3rd gen with its uneven whites or the iPad mini with its grainy 2010 LCD screen. For me 4th gen is where I'm starting to like the screen.

 

[Fruit Cake]

I really like the Fire HD, but unless you're happy to side load apps, it seems very limited. I find the browser that comes with the device quite inferior to Google's fast improving Chrome, and the first time I played with a HD, it had no maps, and the mapping applications in Amazon's App Store were none too compelling. Yet unlike my IPad Mini, I understand the Fire HD does actually come with a GPS receiver.

As for Amazon being the new Apple, pull the other one. Apple is a technology company, with a strong focus on the end user experience. Amazon is just a large, online supermarket, who wants sell you mobile cash registers, linked directly to their stores. Like many of the cheaper Androd devices, the Fire HD has clearly been thrown together with off the shelf components, compared to the iPad, which has clearly had some design into it.

In the UK, Amazon struggles to treat many of its employees like human beings. They've come into much criticism over the working conditions of their warehouse staff. Their German warehouse staff have recently been striking. Apple is no saint in this respect, but it does at least try to ensure its Chinese contractors run a clean ship.

The two complement each other. Amazon has the content and are willing to sell it to you no matter if you want to pay apple for an iPad and then download the app or go direct and buy the kindle fire. I think many here overlook why amazon and google make a $200 media consumption device. It isn't because they care about the consumer, it's because they want to sell you their service. Google want to profit from you with ads and you to use play store to buy content, amazon want to sell you stuff.

The $99 china tab makers just wanna make a buck and put some food on the table. Their business model is simply volume sales.

With apple your buying more of a device focused development rather then content driven. iTunes makes some money but it isn't apples biggest money maker, it's to give the users something to do with their shiny new devices. When you make a device with huge margins, you tend to skimp less on user experience, as you know you're still going to turn a healthy profit.

 

[beautifulcoder]

Suggest you avoid the iPad 3rd gen with its uneven whites or the iPad mini with its grainy 2010 LCD screen. For me 4th gen is where I'm starting to like the screen.

Totally agree on the iPad 3. If this had been my first experience with Apple I probably would have never looked back and gone somewhere else.

What's wrong with the mini? I like the iPad 2. It is not retina but the touch controls and responsiveness of the device more than make up for the "grainy" screen. To me, responsiveness and type facing are everything. I do have a problem when I put my finger on a device and it looks like it's computing the answer to the meaning of life.

----------

Slightly off topic, The company most similar to Apple I believe is Nintendo:

Totally agree! These two companies are both good at thinking outside the box without having one up the competition. It was so annoying to see this in the PC era, you sell one orange, I sell two oranges! Yea, real progress this is.

Too bad that Wii U is a real Dodo though. Really just sad.

 

[Brianstorm91]

I think the past few years have seen unprecedented growth in Apple's image and products, but there's only so far that you can go with such high momentum before your competition pick up the pace.

Maybe Apple aren't slowing, maybe they are. I do think their resistance to change can be a little stubborn sometimes. Either way, I think the competition is just starting to really knuckle down so we should see even better products from all parties

 

[Chupa Chupa]

All depends on who you ask and how they measure

Yes, that was my point. Cigar for you.

 

[ValSalva]

Nar, how do we really now he actually did plans devices for another 5 years. His condition was not very good for like a year before he pass. He didn't even go on stage for the 4s, as i remembered.

I don't know if this has already been mentioned here but Steve Jobs died the day after the iPhone 4S announcement.

 

[mortenandersen]

Please keep your politic views for yourself

I really like the Fire HD, but unless you're happy to side load apps, it seems very limited. I find the browser that comes with the device quite inferior to Google's fast improving Chrome, and the first time I played with a HD, it had no maps, and the mapping applications in Amazon's App Store were none too compelling. Yet unlike my IPad Mini, I understand the Fire HD does actually come with a GPS receiver.

As for Amazon being the new Apple, pull the other one. Apple is a technology company, with a strong focus on the end user experience. Amazon is just a large, online supermarket, who wants sell you mobile cash registers, linked directly to their stores. Like many of the cheaper Androd devices, the Fire HD has clearly been thrown together with off the shelf components, compared to the iPad, which has clearly had some design into it.

In the UK, Amazon struggles to treat many of its employees like human beings. They've come into much criticism over the working conditions of their warehouse staff. Their German warehouse staff have recently been striking. Apple is no saint in this respect, but it does at least try to ensure its Chinese contractors run a clean ship.

It's silly and hybris to think that anyone (or at least that many) is interested in your private leftwing political points of view.

Please spare us in a thread like this. Keep them in private. Or if you must: Use the Forum Wasteland for such private political opinions.

 

[Internaut]

It's silly and hybris to think that anyone (or at least that many) is interested in your private leftwing political points of view.

You might very well think that. I could not possibly comment.

Please spare us in a thread like this. Keep them in private. Or if you must: Use the Forum Wasteland for such private political opinions.

You reveal far more of your own political views, not to mention your character, than do I.

 

[Risco]

The majority of Android phones are throwaways, underpowered and run OS's up to 3 years old. iOS on the other hand has 93% running iOS6 and 69% of all web traffic. They are also making over £400 in profit for each iPhone 5 sold. They are releasing a monster new Mac Pro, with a damn cool design which Apple are known for. Then we have a totally redesigned iOS 7.

In the words of Phil Schiller - "Can't innovate, my ass!"

 

[Irishman]

The Android Market share is around 56% while the ios market share is around 39%

The Kindle fire is the most popular android platform. It accounts for 33% of android tablets. 59% of all the android market comes from the US, and the Kindle Fire HD accounts for over half of it.


HOWEVER, internet traffic was almost universally done by ios devices, with around 80%+ of the traffic, and the Kindle Fire HD in 2nd place, with around 10%+

All things indicate Android to take over from Apple in Q3 of 2013.



I got to admit, I have already moved on from an ipad and an iphone. I have a Kindle Fire HD and I love it, to be quite honest I like it more than my ipad. My phone is a windows phone that I plan on upgrading for a galaxy.


What are the opinions of fellow board members on this subject? How would you feel about an android dominated market space? Has any android device seemed tempting to you?

Please do not think I am trying to badmouth apple. Personally I don't care what people buy, if it does what you need it to do that's fine with me.

Quite anecdotal. Your bias is showing.

All things considered, there are compelling Android tablets, but the Kindle Fire HD is the least of them. Unless you're comfortable hacking the device, to say that it benefits from the Android ecosystem is a huge stretch. Amazon has designed it to be cut off from the Play store, only allowing its users access to the Amazon store.

As far as build quality and issues, more Kindle Fires get returned to be exchanged for iPads, iPad Minis, or proper Android tablets than any other tablet.

 

[Irishman]

I'm really just using one example, I'm not saying just because I like the kindle fire means it's going to dominate the market

Yes, you are. Blatantly.

 

[AppleRobert]

No. Yesterday at Best Buy, I was looking at the Note 8.0 and the BB employee stated SAMSUNG will be the next Apple.

Bet if I was looking at Ipads, of course he would of pushed Apple products.

----------

I own 2 Kindle Fire HD's as well as a couple of iPad's. I can tell you that the iPad smokes the Kindle Fire HD in every way. For starters the hardware is better on the iPad, the UI and OS is better on the iPad as well and the resale value is better for the iPad.

Don't get me wrong I love Amazon.com and i'm a Prime member and that's where the KF-HD shines. But Apple has the rest covered quite easily.

The Mini even smokes it. I use it far more than my Fire HD.

 

[charlituna]

Yes, that was my point. Cigar for you.

Only if its a blunt

 

[peterdevries]

Is Amazon the next Apple?

No, in order to find the next Apple you need to be looking at smaller organisations or start-ups that are currently developing new products or services and are not inhibited by large corporation strategies of protection of market shares and concentration on risk and cost.

Amazon is a market leader and is primarily focused on expansion of market share with existing product lines or through differentiation (adding new product lines to the store). Amazon, just like Apple, is only innovating incrementally. You should be looking for real disruptive new innovations.

Around 2000, Apple was consistently looking a generation beyond then-current technology to find out where the future was. The results are the iPhone and MacBook Air and later the Retina Macbook (although you might also call this borderline incremental / disruptive). Apple is now innovating most products incrementally. It will be interesting to see what Apple will do in the smart watch and TV segments, because there is some potential for disruptive innovation in those segments.

TL;DR: in order to find the next Apple, you need to look at where the venture capitalists are now investing heavily. It's the small companies that bring true disruptive technology. An example might be the Leap Motion.

 

[FrozenDarkness]

no, bezos is not the same as jobs, although both are visionaries. jobs was all about consumer electronics, bezos is all about services. IN that regard, bezos is a lot like bill gates to me actually, except better. no the next jobs is probably elon musk.

no but seriously, this topic is hilarious. if apple losing is magic is because they lost magic share, than i argue they never had magic. steve jobs never cared about market share, if he did, he would've priced iphone differently. i know this is an old topic, but it's just not logical.

if apple came out tomorrow and priced iphones at $300, I would put money down that they would have immense market share. so let's not act like we're making a valid topic right now.

 

[cdmoore74]

I'm watching a youtube documentary and responding to this post at the same time from my Note 10.1 that I got for $250. Having the ability to do 2 things at the same time is incredible. Don't be surprised when the second version of the Note 10.1 (rumored at 12 plus inches) comes out better than the iPad.
There are just too many options coming out from the Android camp. I expect apples tablet share to decrease even further.

 

[FrozenDarkness]

I'm watching a youtube documentary and responding to this post at the same time from my Note 10.1 that I got for $250. Having the ability to do 2 things at the same time is incredible. Don't be surprised when the second version of the Note 10.1 (rumored at 12 plus inches) comes out better than the iPad.
There are just too many options coming out from the Android camp. I expect apples tablet share to decrease even further.

i'd expect the rumored 12" ipad to share similar features, but really, who knows at this point.

 

[narutoninjakid]

No they seem like pretty different companies to me and they focus on different audiences

 

[JPNFRK7]

I never liked my Kindle Fire. The Amazon version of Android to me felt like there was no innovation. It was only there to work. I even tried rooting the thing and installing a Android ROM to see if I could make it better. It did but I was never happy with it and exchanged it for my iPad Mini. I love my mini and would not try another Android device.

My parents recently dumped their Android phones for iPhones and couldn't be happier that they did. Im happy because I dont have to get on their phone to try and figure things out for them anymore.

 

[ramm24]

Another "apple is doomed" thread. It's getting old and tiresome really.

 

[charlituna]

If the DOJ has their way, yes.

 

[Ladybug]

My main complaint with Amazon..and I do love my Prime. Is that 6 months after they sold me a Kindle Fire, they stopped supporting it. You had to buy a newer better model if you wanted a software update. An update they kept promising us would come. Silly me for buying into it. Apple has its faults too but I trust Apple way more than Amazon.

 

[Zerilos]

The Android Market share is around 56% while the ios market share is around 39%

The Kindle fire is the most popular android platform. It accounts for 33% of android tablets. 59% of all the android market comes from the US, and the Kindle Fire HD accounts for over half of it.


HOWEVER, internet traffic was almost universally done by ios devices, with around 80%+ of the traffic, and the Kindle Fire HD in 2nd place, with around 10%+

All things indicate Android to take over from Apple in Q3 of 2013.

What do you mean by an Android take over in Q3? In terms of total device sales, Android took over several years ago; in terms of profits Apple still has the lead. Q3 is expected to be a fairly poor quarter for Apple as many people are not purchasing any iOS device knowing that several are about to be released in a month or two. There are many indications that Q4 and Q1 2014 will be huge for Apple. Time will tell.

 

[HarryWarden]

Overall, the iPad in any of its new versions is far superior to the Kindle Fire HD in any of its versions. That said, the Kindle Fire HD seems geared to doing a few things and doing them well as opposed to being a laptop replacement like the iPad can be with all of its productivity apps and whatnot.

The Kindle Fire HD has far better speakers than the iPad (though I wonder how much one watches a movie on a tablet without using headphones but I have found use for the better speakers when showing other people stuff or watching a movie with another person) and the screen seems to be more uniform in quality vs. the various color problems that have plagued various iPads so the Kindle makes for a better player of movies and reader for books (especially the 8.9 version).

The Silk Internet Browser is godawful and one would hope Amazon has plans for significant improvements to it with the release of the next Fires this September. As for not supporting old Kindle Fires with updates, as far as I can tell, the updates Amazon does release usually offer very minor, negligible updates that don't affect the functionality in significant ways.