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MCAsan

macrumors 601
Jul 9, 2012
4,587
442
Atlanta
As a landscape and wildlife photographer, long primes or zooms was exactly what I was thinking about. Sony needs a good 100-400 or 200-400. It also need a first class 500 prime. Finding long glass is not a problem for the Nikon or Canon user....just for paying for it. ;)
 

kenoh

macrumors 604
Jul 18, 2008
6,507
10,850
Glasgow, UK
As a landscape and wildlife photographer, long primes or zooms was exactly what I was thinking about. Sony needs a good 100-400 or 200-400. It also need a first class 500 prime. Finding long glass is not a problem for the Nikon or Canon user....just for paying for it. ;)

Lol... You can go LEA-4 adapter and a Sony A mount up to 400 but it is Canikon money too. Yes though, the long end is a gap for now...
 

matt9013

macrumors 6502
Original poster
Oct 27, 2013
333
16
I want to be able to take pictures of people, wildlife (birds, deer, butterfly's, zoo animals etc) nothing major like bears, lions etc. plants and flowers.

Would a 16-50mm lens be good with a possible upgrade to a 55-210 lens down the road?
 

kenoh

macrumors 604
Jul 18, 2008
6,507
10,850
Glasgow, UK
I want to be able to take pictures of people, wildlife (birds, deer, butterfly's, zoo animals etc) nothing major like bears, lions etc. plants and flowers.

Would a 16-50mm lens be good with a possible upgrade to a 55-210 lens down the road?

The 55-210 is perfectly adequate but it is a little slow so some moving targets will alude you. Thing is, DSLR is still the best to capture fast motion but mirrorless is not far off now. For everything you want you should be fine with those two lenses fir the foreseeable...

At the point you out grow them, you will be likely looking to upgrade the camera too...
 

ChrisA

macrumors G5
Jan 5, 2006
12,919
2,172
Redondo Beach, California
The only think negative I can think about for Sony mirrorless....not a huge choice in lenses compared to Nikon, Canon, Fuji, or the M43 world. If you see the DxO Mark scores on camera bodies, Sony is the top of the heap these days.
Well, I hear you, but as a Sony user, every lens I need is available natively until I need 300mm or longer. The lens choice myth has long since gone away.

No, the lens selection DOES still mater. What makes it seem to have gone away is that so many beginners don't know what and f-stop is and see only focal length, see that many focal lengths are available and are happy.

But then some day you want an 80-200 f/2.8 zoom. The key spec here is f/2.8. You can buy a used Nikon f/2.8 for $600 but a Caon will set you back $2,000.00 Yes you can buy a used Canon but there are so few on the market that the prices are much higher. Saving on the cost of a high-end lens is more than the cost of a new mirrorless camera body.

One the difference is that Nikons can use very old lenses from the 1960's. Mostly you don't want to do that except if you are doing video

No, I'm not suggesting Nikon just saying to look at the full system. The LENS collection, if you get good ones will be worth fr more money than the camera body. You will upgrade the camera body and keep the lenses. Ages ago Kodak gave away cameras in order to sell film. It is almost like that with lenses. They should give away camera bodies.

I would not bring this up but you did say "WILDLIFE" which implies some very expensive lenses.

Back to bodies. The big reason you go with an SLR is because they are very fast handling. Shooting wildlife what makes the shoot is capturing some interesting behavior. That 1/2 second while your fully automated camera blinks LEDs and running motors pretty much means you lost the shoot. People shooting wildlife will pre-focus and set the exposure and wait, and wait and wait,..... then after waiting more they get the bird with the fish in its beak or whatever.

The SLR is for when your primary purpose for being there is photography. That means you have some images in your mind you want to create, if you can. The smaller cameras are for times when you did not plan to take pictures.
 

whodatrr

macrumors 6502a
Jan 12, 2004
672
494
Another Micro Four Thirds vote here.

Smaller, cheaper, and the quality of darn good. There are some great primes out there, for reasonable prices, if you look around a bit. These cameras take amazing shots!

Only thing that I don't get is why MFT isn't more popular? They're a hit among photo bugs, but you can't just walk into Best Buy and pick one up. Regardless, plenty of great places online to buy gear.

Was pretty heavily into Canon DSLRs a while back, bot sold all my stuff since moving to MFT. I just got tired of carrying a huge backpack full of big & heavy stuff around. YMMV.
 

ChrisA

macrumors G5
Jan 5, 2006
12,919
2,172
Redondo Beach, California
Would a 16-50mm lens be good with a possible upgrade to a 55-210 lens down the road?

What max f-stop on those lenses? A 35mm or 50mm is useful for some kinds of people shots but if the lens is only f/5.6 you are not going to be able to isolate the subject. You begin to gain this at f/2.8 but by f/1.8 you really have what you need.

For landscape shots the f/5.6 lens is perfect

What are the subjects? In what light are you shooing?

Many people start with the cheaper "kit lens", typically this is a 18-50mm f/5.6 that sells for $200 and then they go for EITHER a faster f/1.8 lens or a longer 200mm lens. Those getting the 200mm find it makes for some boring images and don't use it much. Subjects shot at a short distance in "innterresting" light tend to be more engaging so there 35mm f/1.8 would get used more.

Before you buy a lens think about what images you are after, draw them in pencil first.
 

matt9013

macrumors 6502
Original poster
Oct 27, 2013
333
16
What max f-stop on those lenses? A 35mm or 50mm is useful for some kinds of people shots but if the lens is only f/5.6 you are not going to be able to isolate the subject. You begin to gain this at f/2.8 but by f/1.8 you really have what you need.

For landscape shots the f/5.6 lens is perfect

What are the subjects? In what light are you shooing?

Many people start with the cheaper "kit lens", typically this is a 18-50mm f/5.6 that sells for $200 and then they go for EITHER a faster f/1.8 lens or a longer 200mm lens. Those getting the 200mm find it makes for some boring images and don't use it much. Subjects shot at a short distance in "innterresting" light tend to be more engaging so there 35mm f/1.8 would get used more.

Before you buy a lens think about what images you are after, draw them in pencil first.
The 16-50mm lens is the one that comes with the camera, can't find the f information. The 55-120 is f4.5-6.3.

I will mostly be shooting during the day either outdoors or indoors but with a lot of sunlight. Subjects will for the most part be people, pets (cats, dogs), birds, deer, wood creatures etc.
 

HDFan

Contributor
Jun 30, 2007
7,290
3,342
I have 2 DLSR's (Canon 6D and 7D) with an assortment of lenses (fisheye, 100-400) 1 bridge camera (Panasonic FZ-1000) as well as two Sony DSC-RX100's (the original one, and the latest iv). And of course my iPhone6s+. The 6D certainly takes great pictures, and the 7D with the 100-400 (used for the extra magnification on the 7D) did a great job in Africa. I also love the GPS tagging on the 6D.

The problem is their weight. The 6D weighs 26.7 ounces. With the 3.1 pound 100-400 lens you're talking 4.7 pounds. When you're on a non-photo centric safari there's no time to setup a tripod so you have to hold it by hand if you're not seated at the side of the jeep. Taking a movie of two giraffes play fighting holding this for several minutes becomes a significant problem. Since you have to put all of this in your carry-on even cutting back as much as I can I'm still at 21 pounds, 6 over the usual 15 pound airline limit. And it just wasn't fun. And it's very expensive.

I finally decided to switch to the FZ-1000.

It is much lighter,
Reaches to 400 (more than the Sony DSC-RX10 which only goes to 200)
It goes down to 25 mm, so I can quickly move to a landscape shot from a zoom quickly without having to change lenses.
It focuses extremely quickly (very useful when you're on a moving vehicle)
It takes 4K videos. This is mandatory for me now. Remember how old VHS tapes look now? In 5 (?) years it will be the same for 1080p
Much less expensive than a DSLR with the multiple lenses required (assuming you're sticking with the Camera vendor)
It has almost all of the same controls as my Canons, but is easier to use.

I used it in the Galapagos with wildlife and absolutely loved it. I wouldn't try wildlife photography with anything less than a 400. Even when you can get within a few feet of a bird or animal as you can there, if it is very small (such as a finch) I'm still using the zoom to fill the frame. I certainly miss the superior metal construction of the Canons, and I'm sure they are more dust and water resistant. But for me they aren't worth the hassle.

The DSC-RX100iv I use when we're moving and with luggage and backpack I don't want the weight and bulk of the FZ1000 around my neck and I need at least some zoom capability. For example in Japan taking a 4K movie at the train station as our bullet train pulled in, or a shot from the window as your plane takes off. It also is better in low light than the FZ1000.

And don't slight the iPhone. In low light, such as museums, it seems to do just as good a job as my 6D as long as you don't need to zoom or crop. And the 6s+ now has 4K. My ratio of shots is about 1/3 for each camera - FZ1000, DSC-RX100iv, and iPhone 6s+.

But my interest is more in capturing a travel moment.

The attached file was taken with the FZ1000. 1/2000 second, f4.0, iso 125. Even though I was about 3 feet from the bird I still was zoomed in at 146 mm. You want to get really close in so you can see the color of their eyes as that is often a significant feature. The blue came out well here I think.


Ecuador 2015.07.25-2015.08.10 P1030083.jpg
 
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kenoh

macrumors 604
Jul 18, 2008
6,507
10,850
Glasgow, UK
No, the lens selection DOES still mater. What makes it seem to have gone away is that so many beginners don't know what and f-stop is and see only focal length, see that many focal lengths are available and are happy.

But then some day you want an 80-200 f/2.8 zoom. The key spec here is f/2.8. You can buy a used Nikon f/2.8 for $600 but a Caon will set you back $2,000.00 Yes you can buy a used Canon but there are so few on the market that the prices are much higher. Saving on the cost of a high-end lens is more than the cost of a new mirrorless camera body.

One the difference is that Nikons can use very old lenses from the 1960's. Mostly you don't want to do that except if you are doing video

No, I'm not suggesting Nikon just saying to look at the full system. The LENS collection, if you get good ones will be worth fr more money than the camera body. You will upgrade the camera body and keep the lenses. Ages ago Kodak gave away cameras in order to sell film. It is almost like that with lenses. They should give away camera bodies.

I would not bring this up but you did say "WILDLIFE" which implies some very expensive lenses.

Back to bodies. The big reason you go with an SLR is because they are very fast handling. Shooting wildlife what makes the shoot is capturing some interesting behavior. That 1/2 second while your fully automated camera blinks LEDs and running motors pretty much means you lost the shoot. People shooting wildlife will pre-focus and set the exposure and wait, and wait and wait,..... then after waiting more they get the bird with the fish in its beak or whatever.

The SLR is for when your primary purpose for being there is photography. That means you have some images in your mind you want to create, if you can. The smaller cameras are for times when you did not plan to take pictures.

Lenses do matter but to are missing the context in which the point was made. This is the OPs imitial camera. They need to go through the journey we have been on and work out what they want to shoot before they go spending thousands on glass like we do.
 
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MCAsan

macrumors 601
Jul 9, 2012
4,587
442
Atlanta
The wife and I shoot landscapes and wildlife with our Olympus E-M1 bodies, 12-40 Pro, 40-150 Pro, and Panasonic 100-300. That is the kit we are taking to Kenya. Could we do better for the same size, weight, and cost....not likely. If size, weight, and cost are not an issue then a top of the line FF body from Sony, Nikon, or Canon makes sense plus a large heavy bag of glass.

Last year we were on a bird shoot and surrounded by Nikon and Canon FF bodies and lots of big long glass. Folks could no believe how we could shoot by selecting a point on the back screen. I just wish Olympus had already released the 300 Pro or Leica had released their announced 100-400. Either of those will likely do a lot to round out a M43 kit.
 

matt9013

macrumors 6502
Original poster
Oct 27, 2013
333
16
Went to the camera store today and was able to try out a lot of different camera's without any security blocks stopping me from really seeing how they handle. After trying out a few I finally choose the Canon Rebel SL1 camera. Really enjoying it so far and can't wait to really start using it.

Also picked up a Pixma Pro 100 printer.
 

matt9013

macrumors 6502
Original poster
Oct 27, 2013
333
16

Cool and a good choice to start - did you go for a Black Rapid strap? I'd still recommend them with any camera TBH...
No, I'm gonna wait awhile before I buy any accessories. Closer to Black Friday or the holidays. So far the Canon strap is doing a good job.
 

kenoh

macrumors 604
Jul 18, 2008
6,507
10,850
Glasgow, UK
No, I'm gonna wait awhile before I buy any accessories. Closer to Black Friday or the holidays. So far the Canon strap is doing a good job.

LOL!!! EVERY Friday is black friday when you are into photography!!!! welcome to the addiction friend...
 

robgendreau

macrumors 68040
Jul 13, 2008
3,471
339
You'll love the Canon. And BTW, I'd check out the Joby Ultrafit strap. I liked it MUCH better than the Black Rapid. Comes in different sizes, and for me it was much more secure hiking and scrambling than the Black Rapid, even with the clamps set on the Rapid. You can size and lock the camera in position with one setting rather than three. And it was bit cheaper.

Also, for anyone else shopping here, note that you can now get a weathersealed Pentax K-50 plus 18-55mm kit lens for $249 at samys.com via a rebate, and Pentax has a very good 300mm zoom that's also weatherproof for about $250. Great kit for birders or other outdoor enthusiasts. I was gonna try to sell my used K-50 but it's almost not worth it for me to compete with a price like that.
 

kenoh

macrumors 604
Jul 18, 2008
6,507
10,850
Glasgow, UK
I use a Peak Design Sling. Love it... easy to adjust from neck loop to over the shoulder quick draw. Easy to pop off and go strapless too.
 

matt9013

macrumors 6502
Original poster
Oct 27, 2013
333
16
Thanks for the suggestions, I'll look into those slings. A few questions though. Do you guys leave the lens on the whole time or do you guys take the lens off when the camera isn't being used?

Also for those who have Lightroom, is it a one time buy? If I buy Lightroom 6 on Amazon I get all future updates for free or will I have to buy Lightroom 7,8 etc?
 

simonsi

Contributor
Jan 3, 2014
4,851
735
Auckland
Leave the lens on unless it needs to come off, otherwise you are just going to allow more dust inside which you will then have to periodically get removed.
 
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kenoh

macrumors 604
Jul 18, 2008
6,507
10,850
Glasgow, UK
Thanks for the suggestions, I'll look into those slings. A few questions though. Do you guys leave the lens on the whole time or do you guys take the lens off when the camera isn't being used?

Also for those who have Lightroom, is it a one time buy? If I buy Lightroom 6 on Amazon I get all future updates for free or will I have to buy Lightroom 7,8 etc?

Lightroom 6 purchase now will require repurchase fir version 7,8 etc in the future. Theu are moving you to creative cloud though ideally which is £100 ish quid a year and you get photoshop and LR... Good value.

As for lens on camera.... Like your chest, you only want that open when absolutely necessary... Camera is the same. Leave the lens on, only change it when you need to to avoid dust getting in.
 

Apple fanboy

macrumors Ivy Bridge
Feb 21, 2012
57,004
56,027
Behind the Lens, UK
Thanks for the suggestions, I'll look into those slings. A few questions though. Do you guys leave the lens on the whole time or do you guys take the lens off when the camera isn't being used?

Also for those who have Lightroom, is it a one time buy? If I buy Lightroom 6 on Amazon I get all future updates for free or will I have to buy Lightroom 7,8 etc?
Lens only comes off when swapping for one of my others or cleaning.

If you buy LR 6 outright you can get an upgrade to the next version for less than the full version.
Also you don't have to upgrade each time. The difference between LR 5 and 6 is pretty small IMO.
 
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