How many people really need M1 Pro or M1 Max

[aesc80]

As a developer, you realize when you need a beefier machine when you need to make changes to the code and feel pain every 15-30 minutes a small CPU + 16 GB of ram goes nano-chug,chug,chug on compilation and deployment then dies when you turn on the debugger.

 

[SpartaMAC]

Your question is about need, not want.?

Agreed that’s why I said I should of put that in my OP. Is it needed? I should have added would I like to have it.

 

[TiggrToo]

Huh? 32GB? RTX8000? Multiple of these? Or did you miss a 0? DGX Station comes with 320GB GPU memory? Or do you mean Apple only?

in 2018 you’d be lucky to pick one up for a shade less than $50,000

Nvidia Lowers DGX Station Pricing By 25%

Nvidia introduced a new Jump Start program for its DGX Station that lowers the introduction pricing by 25% for the first system purchased.

www.tomshardware.com

 

[GrumpyCoder]

Um

Well, you said “pro”, is it not pro? I’m running compute intense tasks on a $15M+ GPU cluster. End user sure doesn’t buy that, but for pro use, why not? $150k isn’t that bad in comparison. Or does that already qualify as Pro Max?

Besides, RTX8000 is $5500 with 48GB, so $11k with NVLink for two and 96GB shared memory.

 

[m1maverick]

Agreed that’s why I said I should of put that in my OP. Is it needed? I should have added would I like to have it.

What would have been the point? The thread title and the entirety of your original post speaks to need. What value would have adding want brought?

 

[PinkyMacGodess]

Um, if I pay for it, I need it. Whether I actually red-line it is another story...

 

[chumps]

Well, you said “pro”, is it not pro? I’m running compute intense tasks on a $15M+ GPU cluster. End user sure doesn’t buy that, but for pro use, why not? $150k isn’t that bad in comparison. Or does that already qualify as Pro Max?

Besides, RTX8000 is $5500 with 48GB, so $11k with NVLink for two and 96GB shared memory.

C'mon dude $150k for a puter is not bad? What in the world.

 

[ondioline]

I "need" more than 16GB of memory, the M1 was a no-go for that reason. You're an "IT Pro" and you can't think of a way to utilize it? Uh huh. Between Docker and CSP I can effortlessly use 64GB+ of memory. Hell I'm doing it right now:

 

[SpartaMAC]

I "need" more than 16GB of memory, the M1 was a no-go for that reason. You're an "IT Pro" and you can't think of a way to utilize it? Uh huh. Between Docker and CSP I can effortlessly use 64GB+ of memory. Hell I'm doing it right now:

View attachment 1870546

No my Intel MBP has 16G RAM. 8GB for win 10 VM. In my world 16GB more than enough. Yes. I said a small percentage of users need that power.

 

[TiggrToo]

Well, you said “pro”, is it not pro? I’m running compute intense tasks on a $15M+ GPU cluster. End user sure doesn’t buy that, but for pro use, why not? $150k isn’t that bad in comparison. Or does that already qualify as Pro Max?

Besides, RTX8000 is $5500 with 48GB, so $11k with NVLink for two and 96GB shared memory.

I’d call that ‘Enterprise’ level…

 

[chumps]

Everyone's 'needs' are different. If you are rendering a lot of 3D stuff there's no computer fast enough ever. You just pay for the hardware you can afford and offload the rest to cloud rendering as needed. The point is the M1 Pro/Max are are an interesting value proposition given the form factor, energy use, etc.

 

[rnizlek]

The only thing that truly falls into the 'need' category is a computer with more than 16 GB of RAM. I do tech consulting and web development on the side. On my late 2013 16" MacBook Pro I do run into performance limitations with only 16 GB of RAM. I'll have a few different browser windows open for testing/development, a Gmail window open, and a large PSD file or two that I've been given by the client with the site design. The ability to work faster means I can be more efficient with every project I take on. I ordered the 14" with 32 GB of memory. I occasionally also need to do some video work for a client who asks (but only a handful of times a year) so faster rendering will be nice for that. At the moment I do all that on a 2014 Dell with an upgraded video card, but it will be nice to use my Mac almost exclusively moving forward.

 

[GrumpyCoder]

in 2018 you’d be lucky to pick one up for a shade less than $50,000

Nvidia Lowers DGX Station Pricing By 25%

Nvidia introduced a new Jump Start program for its DGX Station that lowers the introduction pricing by 25% for the first system purchased.

www.tomshardware.com

Yes, but those were the V100 not the A100. They were limited to 256GB. Good price though. However, you can get a better deal from Dell In similar configurations. I’m running Dell precision with Xeon Platinum and RTX8000 under the desk. A100 and V100 in servers. But you are missing out on the cooling system, which is really great on the DGX systems. Plus some software like DriveSim from Nvidia requires Nvidia hardware. DriveSim requires two $500k boxes. Volvo is using it.

C'mon dude $150k for a puter is not bad? What in the world.

We’re still talking about pro as in professional usage, right? Then no, it isn’t bad. If you need the GPU performance, that’s what it costs. If you need 4TB of RAM for in memory DB systems, then you have to pay the price. If you’re into high quality video production and need a Alexa LF then you’re paying $100k for a camera and have to add lenses and accessories. It all depends on what you need and how much you make with it. In the end, this stuff pays for itself unless you bought expensive toys that you didn’t need in the first place. An no, I’m not saying every professional in any line of work needs these, but 32GB is by far not the limit. We will have to wait and see how far Apple is pushing when a full replacement for a MacPro in the $50k range arrives.

 

[GrumpyCoder]

I’d call that ‘Enterprise’ level…

Maybe, yes.

 

[Ev0d3vil]

I'm an occasional video/photo editor, I think this is not for me and I'm doing fine with the M1 MBA.

 

[AltecX]

I "need" more than 16GB of memory, the M1 was a no-go for that reason. You're an "IT Pro" and you can't think of a way to utilize it? Uh huh. Between Docker and CSP I can effortlessly use 64GB+ of memory. Hell I'm doing it right now:

View attachment 1870546

Not many in IT are using Clip Studio. Also I run everything remotely on a server. I don't run ANYTHING locally if I don't need to. Server hardware will always be faster than localy with MUCH more accessible RAM and storage space.

The only things I run locally are VS Code for scripting, a single VM of our standard PC image, and Office suite.

 

[chumps]

Yes, but those were the V100 not the A100. They were limited to 256GB. Good price though. However, you can get a better deal from Dell In similar configurations. I’m running Dell precision with Xeon Platinum and RTX8000 under the desk. A100 and V100 in servers. But you are missing out on the cooling system, which is really great on the DGX systems. Plus some software like DriveSim from Nvidia requires Nvidia hardware. DriveSim requires two $500k boxes. Volvo is using it.


We’re still talking about pro as in professional usage, right? Then no, it isn’t bad. If you need the GPU performance, that’s what it costs. If you need 4TB of RAM for in memory DB systems, then you have to pay the price. If you’re into high quality video production and need a Alexa LF then you’re paying $100k for a camera and have to add lenses and accessories. It all depends on what you need and how much you make with it. In the end, this stuff pays for itself unless you bought expensive toys that you didn’t need in the first place. An no, I’m not saying every professional in any line of work needs these, but 32GB is by far not the limit. We will have to wait and see how far Apple is pushing when a full replacement for a MacPro in the $50k range arrives.

Unless you are a studio nobody is thinking about DGX stuff. As mentioned above that is enterprise level. If you're sweating the cost of a $4k MacBook Pro M1 Max you are not looking at 5 figures for computer stuff. Apple Silicon Mac Pro wise yea it's going to be a lot more money but nowhere near enterprise level stuff. IDK why we are even arguing this point? It's not even apples and oranges this is like apples and kumquats or something.

There's a big difference between a solo 'pro's' needs and a server farm. Surely we can agree on this point.

 

[nightfox818]

Very few actually need it, but I blame Apple for not making a "lower end" model. People are tired of tripping over power cables and having to catch their laptop (speaking from experience), dongle life, and having the surface of the sun in their lap. I would have been very happy with a M1 revision that drove two external monitors. But getting function keys, mag safe, and a faster SoC is fine with me.

 

[chumps]

Very few actually need it, but I blame Apple for not making a "lower end" model. People are tired of tripping over power cables and having to catch their laptop (speaking from experience), dongle life, and having the surface of the sun in their lap. I would have been very happy with a M1 revision that drove two external monitors. But getting function keys, mag safe, and a faster SoC is fine with me.

Next year's Air and entry level MacBook Pro's based on M2 chips will have you covered.

 

[GrumpyCoder]

IDK why we are even arguing this point?

We’re not. You said pro GPU is around 32GB, I said it’s not. Thats all. And when a laptop/desktop is in the $6k to $7k range, then a $5k GPU isn’t really that far off. See it this way, if that allows you to make an additional $1k per month, it’s a no brainer. Within a year, 96GB in GPUs pay for itself. But of course with Apple it’s a moot point as they don’t support it. ?‍♂️

Edit: let me add this for fun. He bought it as an individual running his business for machine learning:

 

[chumps]

We’re not. You said pro GPU is around 32GB, I said it’s not. Thats all. And when a laptop/desktop is in the $6k to $7k range, then a $5k GPU isn’t really that far off. See it this way, if that allows you to make an additional $1k per month, it’s a no brainer. Within a year, 96GB in GPUs pay for itself. But of course with Apple it’s a moot point as they don’t support it. ?‍♂️

Edit: let me add this for fun. He bought it as an individual running his business for machine learning:

You are the one that mentioned the DGX. This is an order of magnitude increase in cost.

Yes 5K for a Pro GPU is reasonable.

I am saying, given the TDP and form factor of the new MacBooks nothing comes close. We'll see how the upcoming iMacs and Mac Pros fair. In general I am bullish. It really is moot anyway because I don't use Windows/Linux.

We are talking about $4K for a laptop w/ a fast CPU, mini-LED HDR display, etc., vs a standalone GPU costing $1K more w/ 16GB less VRAM. It's just not comparable.

 

[Eidorian]

It's a tax write off. Look at the people they showed off as Pro users in the presentation.

 

[ksj1]

I need to get rid of this fan noise from my Intel Macbooks. Not sure I need the power of the 16/64/1TB/Max I ordered, mainly because I like to check the news and such while unit tests are running, but my boss will be happy...

 

[jjcs]

The 13" Pro (or even air) is the config for the masses. Creative pros and devs often benefit from more, saving hours in compile time, being able to do some local compute instead of sending off to a cluster, or even just working at lower performance for more hours off the power cable.

It's really amusing to consider the group Apple considers "pros". Apparently, to them, HPC extends to just editing video and photos and maybe 3D animation for entertainment purposes. Definitely a change from the introduction of OS X.... where Apple pushed the Unix angle to interest scientific computing users.

 

[MBPM1]

First let me say I’ve been in IT/Telcom over 35 years. The processors Apple announced today are truly amazing. BUT… BUT… lets face it. How many people really need that much power in a laptop? Im an IT Pro and my Itel 2020 MacBook Pro and M1 Macbook air are sufficient. Really, think about it, what, aside from creative pros who needs that much power. Im disappointed a 14” MacBook Pro (M1) for the masses was not introduced today. Awesome technology for a very small percentage of users.

The other side of the argument is that you won't be able to get more for your MBP the longer you sit on it, so why not "trade-up" while you can still get some money back.

I bought the new MBP 16 today online, and like you, I don't need it, but I know that every day that goes by with my current 2019 MBP, the trade-in/resale value will continue to decline while the machine takes on more daily use. Having gone through many MBP's and Air's, it's pretty clear to me - they only have so much useful life.

I was able to trade-in my 2019 MBP online earlier for $1600, so I thought it's not gonna get much better and I took the plunge. But yes, your point is completely valid.